good morning my friends, I do not know if it is appropriate to write this here, but I would ask you - like Timothy Garton Ash, - that if it comes to a second referendum, please consider staying . After worldwar two we ( not me in person but the European nations ) have build up Europe together. I do love your country, your input, your traditions, and though you will not be away after separating, it would feel differently and I would miss you.
Stay with us: good morning my friends, I do not... - PMRGCAuk
Stay with us
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Zofitmogelijk
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66 Replies
•
This is not the place for this type of post. However you could ask Nigel Farage for his opinion!
Marymon• in reply to
I agree with Pastit, although I appreciate the sentiment expressed, no politics, no religion please.
Thankyou that's lovely, you will probably find about 50% of us brits here agree with you. Perhaps if we had been properly informed before the referendum the result would have been different, who knows. We are still being fed " misinformation" and few of us are any the wiser even now. What a mess! ( polite version! )
I know, it is complicated, and the only thing we can do is listening and reading and trying to be wise.
'Stuff' happens and whichever way it goes..........we will still be here and mates.
Thank you Jinasc, that is important indeed.
Another referendum would damage democracy in this country,the leavers would be so angry because it is mostly remainers that want another referendum.The EU should have listened to David Cameron when he asked them for concessions,if they had listened there would not have been a referendum in the first place,we would still be in the EU.Whatever happens Jinasc is right,and our lives need not change ,l am sure it will all work out well in the end,it has too !
• in reply toGrants148
Hi Grants148, I totally agree with you. Cameron explained to them the problems that the UK was experiencing and asked for 3 things that if granted would have stopped all this nonsense. So essentially I ask, is the EU stuck in a beurocrocy that just doesn't work, or do you think it does work?
Voting is democratic. If a majority still want to leave in the light of all the new information since 2016, the result will be the same and it will be undeniable. So much has changed since 2016.
In general, how can we as an individual contribute to a better world, sometimes I feel so powerless. But maybe I stick too much to the seventies, with an optimism that was not quite real even then.
hi Yogabonnie, I hope you do not mind if I hold back my comment,since this is really foreign policy, which does not mean I understand you. Good luck
o room for misunderstanding, what I mean is, I understand your concern.
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer
Whether we stay or go - we are still in the same place geographically speaking - so we will still be travelling back and forth. Might be a bit more difficult, but we, the people, will remain friends! And there are no trade barriers nor backstops on this forum ❤️
Which is a very good thing to remind me of dear Dorset Lady no barriers for us. ♥️
I'm with you - I want us to stay part of the EU. So do my 18-year old twin grandchildren who were livid that they couldn't vote first time. I know this isn't really the place to express this, but I'm also certain that it was depression about the first disastrous referendum that first made me susceptible to PMR/GCA.
An anecdote: being barely 16 I was on my way with a friend to London, we are speaking 1959. Took the Hoek van Holland Harwich train/ferry. At the customs was stopped and asked if my parents agreed. They actually phoned them and after that we could cross the border. Good old times?
Here in Scotland the majority voted to stay in the EU, so we feel very sad that we are being dragged out against our will (especially because when we had our independence referendum in 2014, people were told "if you vote for independence you won't be able to stay in the EU" - so many people voted against Scottish independence thinking it was the only way to stay in the EU... but look where it has got us now!
Why is Theresa May encouraging board games at Christmas? Because she's trying to bring back Chequers.
Why was Theresa May sacked as nativity manager? Because she couldn’t run a stable government.
What does Donald Trump do after he pulls a cracker? Pays her off.
The US is doing better than ever.
Judging by my shares at the end of this week I am not sure that is going to be the case for much longer.
The last two yrs. have been great for me. Sorry things aren't working out for you.
Wait till next year and the US will have problems. U.K. is not too bad really. At least we can get free medical care.
It's not free. Your high taxes pay for your so-called free health care. The US economy is better than it's been in decades. Do you believe a little fairy pays for your health care???
Your health care is far from free. Who exactly do you believe pays for your health care?
Oh, I believe the UK is doing fine...never said it wasn't. You almost sound as if you wish the US problems. You have a nice day.
I definitely don’t wish the U.S. to have problems as it will affect me. Also I am so glad that people who cannot afford to pay for medical fees in U.K. and do not pay tax do not have to worry.
You never paid any taxes??? 🤔
It is a bit academic in my case as I normally DO pay for my medical expenses. At least my insurance does. However there are some poor people who would be worried stiff if they had medical problems and were unable to pay, luckily they do not have that problem in U.K.
Evidently you know little about US health care. Millions are on disability here that pays for their health care .......regardless of age.
I know, I have worked for US companies for over thirty years. You have just had that a Texan judge who says the Affordable Care Act's individual coverage mandate is unconstitutional and that the rest of the law therefore cannot stand. I just hope it gets reversed.
Not me!
Also, the so-called Affordable Heath Care is not affordable for most poor people as the co-pays are outrageously high. There is a great need for health care improvement on both sides of the pond.
That's something I believe we can both agree on.
Hope you are feeling better and Merry Christmas
Hi Aletta
Whatever the outcome of the Brexit negotiations, I'm sure we will all remain good friends here... 
Yes you are right about the forum and it means a lot to me
But for Europe I still have the wish....
If we stay in the EU we will have to join the Euro currency,they would also control our taxes eventually,and l wonder if a European army could mean national service being brought back.l have had most of my life and l feel very fortunate that it has been good in this country,l am not sure about the future but l think that young people should be very careful and make sure exactly what they are voting for if we have another referendum.
That is absolute rubbish - if a country doesn't want to join the Euro they don't apply. Most of the things you have been told by the Brexiters is similar rubbish. There are currently posts on social media saying similar things which are being put up by the Russian office of Reddit. If you want to believe Russian interference in the UK you believe it - but I do find it quite ironic that the extreme right of the Tory party wants the same as Putin would like.
Every country retains its autonomy for most things - and if there are to be changes they have a veto option. The UK has always had reputation for vetoing and it also has several opt-out clauses which mean things that apply to other countries won;t apply to them.
Several countries have an equivalent of national service in addition to their professional armies. But most of the young people use the time to do social work, working within the ambulance service, in care homes and a range of other services. They leave with a range of skills and knowledge they wouldn't have had without the year.
Half the problem in the UK is that too few know anything about how we live on this side of the channel. So are too ready to believe people feeding them untruths.
Sorry PMRPro, but it is Grants right to have an opinion. It won’t be everyones choice, but.......!
I wasn't denying her opinion - just correcting misapprehensions based on the lies told.
None of that is true, Grants.
In fact the Lisbon Treaty pretty much guarantees the opposite.
Scotland wants independence,but is being in the E U independence?
Yes, EU members elect representatives to the E.U. parliament and have a say in what happens. I wonder if Brexiteers ever contacted their reps to discuss their concerns.
• in reply toGrants148
Simple answer, NO
Hi Grant's I really hope all remains well in Schotland and the rest of Europe, and you are right in saying that young people must be very well informed if it comes to a referendum, 🍀
Well I’m Irish and I’ve been biting my tongue while reading through this post. I agree wholeheartedly with PMRpro. Our problem is that we are going to suffer from a problem which is not of our making. The border between us and Northern Ireland which has been completely open due to both being in the EU will become a serious problem. There is a serious threat to the peace process which is underwritten by the EU. Plus, there’s the problem of traveling to the continent using the UK land bridge, an issue for trucks delivering food in and out.
Before the referendum, it seems that there was no analysis done to examine the possible outcome; there was no Citizens’ Assembly (like we have) to see how different interest groups would be affected. As I see it, people voted for an idea based on guesswork. Now that a bit more is known about what’s likely to happen, I think another vote is necessary. Then if it’s passed, at least it’s an informed decision.
One other thing, perhaps more relevant to our usual topics, a friend of mine in the UK who has RA was told by her Rheumy just last week that the medication she is on is produced in Poland and there is no guarantee of supply post Brexit, he thinks the drugs issue is going to be very significant.
Anyway, that’s my tuppence worth!
Don't know about you, but I think before anyone is allowed to vote in a referendum they should have to sit an exam to prove they know the facts, not the rubbish gleaned from tabloid headlines. 😉🤣🤣
With you all the way Gerri. No-one thought about the Good Friday Agreement - and THAT makes a massive massive obstacle to just dropping out. I can't bear to think we will be back to the 70s.
What is happening is like a trial in court where half the jury is told the truth about the evidence, the other half the distortions and half-truths and lies that have been fed into the papers. I wouldn't want to be the poor sod on trial - and knowing the effects of the media, I wouldn't want to be on the jury either.
If only we could prospone brexit, and study ALL the consequences and after that form an opinion what to do next. But I am not at all a professional, and the subject I brought up. spontaneously is multifaceted. Even though a United Europe lies close to my heart I won't bring this subject up anymore on this forum. I don't want anyone to feel stressed, but to feel as good as possible.
What depresses me is watching and listening to the headlong descent by our so-called representatives into using utterly debased language, the yah-boo discourse of infants, and the rancorous, thoroughly nasty point-scoring, finger-pointing blame-games without presenting anything approaching workable, creative solutions, and then the disappearing into corners to hatch the latest back-stabbing plans. Not everyone is guilty of this behaviour but It didn't take long for naked personal ambition to make its appearance and now it's all about Who Will be Leader - for goodness sake form alliances, try for consensus on something, it wouldn't kill you to 'cross the floor', focus on solutions and recognise there has to be compromise and perhaps keep in mind that it's the country, not furthering your own ambitions, that is important here.
Rant (sort of) over. Bad for my BP! Apologies all round!
Sorry if l caused any affence to anyone,l think a lot of the political elite are trying to further their own ambitions,but perhaps that is all fake news too ! The trouble is that not enough thought was given to what would happen if Leave won the referendum.Millions of tax payers money was spent on a leaflet to try and influence the outcome in favour of remaining in the EU,and it still did not have much effect ,l think it was a question of sovereignty most of all and to say that leavers did not understand what they were voting for is very insulting .l am sure that eventually it will be made clear as to what is either true or false,we just have to wait and see.This is the season of peace and goodwill,we have to accept the views of others even if they are different to our own.
I have relatives in Northern Ireland,l am sure that Brexit will not happen if it were to be a danger to the Good Friday agreement.
I am sure that most decent people do care about the GFA.There is no way that they would want that to change.NI have benefitted by being in the EU,although they did vote against the Lisbon treaty and then were asked to vote again and the EU got the Vote they wanted.The same thing is happening here,another referendum is on the cards.l feel that things have got a lot worse here because of the EU,and they get a lot of money from us which Is needed here.They make it extremely hard to leave their undemocratic project and it is that control over us l and millions of others do not like.They did not listen to David Cameron when he asked for some concessions,l feel that we have been treated badly, by them.There is quite a lot of unrest in other European countries,l wonder why ! It is a self serving ‘ club ‘ and far too much money is spent on themselves .l shall obviously get a lot of flack for saying this,but it is a fact and not fake news.l have found this forum really helpful and there are lovely people that l feel l have got to know,l know that a lot of them will not like what l have said but that is how l feel,everything seems to be falling apart here,the prisons are packed with a lot of foreign criminals who we are unable to send back to their home countries because of EU rules .The cost of keeping them here is enormous.l think it depends on where you live in this country too,lovely rural areas are not as affected as large cities are.l can only say that l sincerely hope that N l will carry on as it is now,it is up to the government to make sure of that.Before l am reminded of the care workers and nurses who are much needed here who come from Europe,l hope that they will still be able to come and work here.l am sure that they will because l feel that we will never be allowed to leave the E U,so I would not worry about anything being any different.lf what l have said is inappropriate l will reluctantly leave this forum.l have formed my opinion of the EU over the last ten years or more and have only been influenced by what l see happening around me ,not by so called fake news.
Hello dear forum members, I just asked to delete the post, it was never ment to cause people stress, and even considering leaving the forum. The goal is to support each other. I did not foresee this. Let us go on helping each other in peace.
Leaving the EU would not make any difference to the friendship we feel towards the people of Europe Zofitmogelijk,l wish you a wonderful Christmas and may your new year be a lovely one.
Yes that is so true. Have a wonderful Christmas yourself with your beloved.
Sorry for such a rant Zofitmogelijk,I just wish it could all be sorted out,we have had over two and a half years of in fighting between our MP’s,l dread to think how history will depict them !
Don't feel sorry, this is bigger than us and I do sincerely hope we can find a solution to this and it must be hard to live in the UK now, when I watch BBC news it is a struggle. Time for me to go to sleep, it is later in Halland. Have a good night too.
I agree but fear that we are sailing helplessly into the rocks right now. Xx
For an unknown reason the post still is here, so I can answer. I shiver for what is happening around the managed no deal Brexit and please do know that my heart goes out for the people who suffer the consequences. May common sense win.
I know we are supposed to avoid politics but I do think that the uncertainty is unhelpful to everyone. Like you I hope that common sense prevails and compassion for the vulnerable is at the forefront of the conclusion.
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