Anyone with dna fragmentation actually give birth and conceive?

[Melrey]

My hubby has poor motility and dna fragmentation and I have read about ICSI macs and picsi and micro tesa but never read stories of people actually conceiving with dna fragmentation. Anyone have a success story and if so what did you do?

[Hidden]

Not yet, no....we have had terrible results. I am trying with a sperm donor in two weeks to see if that makes a difference...xx

[Peony85]

We haven’t either... but did IMSI our last cycle right after getting the results and got our best quality yet and one in the freezer and will do an FET soon. My husband has been taking supplements so hoping that will help too if we have to do another one. We’re also off to finally see a urologist who is an expert in DNA fragmentation so hopefully will get some answers then too 🤞

[Melrey in reply to Peony85]

That’s fab news and fingers crossed for the frozen transfer. Can I ask did you have more then one hit blastocyst? We haven’t even had one yet so I’m desperate our next cycle gets us to day 5!

[Peony85 in reply to Melrey]

On my last cycle where we did IMSI, we had 3 reach blast (from 14 fertilized) - all top quality. We put back 2 and froze 1. Since then we’ve done an EndomeTRIO test and learned that my microbiome is completely not what it is supposed to be so on antibiotics now and then will start probiotics before retesting to see if that gets sorted and my uterus has become hospitable!

The cycle prior, when we did conventional IVF, we had one fair quality blast put back which didn’t take and nothing to freeze. Our first cycle, before I started supplements, was a complete wash with nothing making it past day 3 and hence no transfer.

We started off “unexplained” as I had high AMH and hubby had normal semen parameters from the original test... but we have learned more with the tests after each round. First round our consultant said was due to egg quality as apparently this is what drives development for the first couple of days. Then we had much better development through day 3 for the second round but lots of attrition afterwards which is what led to the DNA fragmentation test. And then 2 failed transfers including one with 2 top quality is what led to EndomeTRIO... so now I feel like I finally have some answers and for us it’s probably down to the combination of egg quality, sperm DNA fragmentation, and the microbiome... hoping that’s it!!

Will let you know if I learn anything interesting from the urologist today!

[Peony85 in reply to Melrey]

Just back from the urologist with hubby... it was eye opening and gave us so much hope. As a next step we are doing more tests to understand the underlying cause of the fragmentation. He gave us reassurance underlying issues can be addressed. Sharing a few of these in case helpful... three things he mentioned were heat (due to varicocele), inflammation (due to infection), and oxidation. He also mentioned single vs double stranded breaks in the DNA and that single stranded breaks can result from those 3 things but double tend to happen when the sperm are created so different approach to addressing. In any event... a lot to absorb but it did make me feel like we have things we can do to improve. What was super interesting was he took a look at my EMMA test results and was able to see that I have a high proportion of bacteria that cause inflammation... so good chance that my poor EMMA test result and hubby’s DNA fragmentation may be related. Anyway just wanted to share as it really opened my eyes and made me feel so much better about what we can do and then see if we can get the improvement prior to the next cycle.

[Melrey in reply to Peony85]

So pleased you felt encouraged by the meeting and thanks so much for the feedback from your appointment. We are trying to book to see a urologist also.

Keep me posted and best of luck xxx

[Peony85 in reply to Melrey]

Thanks will do... wishing you the best of luck as well xx

[PaulaDag in reply to Peony85]

Hi, Can you recommend a urologist who is an expert in DNA frag? My partners results has just come back poor dna frag xx

[Peony85 in reply to PaulaDag]

We were with Jonathan Ramsay

[PaulaDag in reply to Peony85]

Thanks. Do you know what dose of Impryl we should buy? Or any other supplements that will help x

[Peony85 in reply to PaulaDag]

We didn’t use Impryl. We used Proxeed for my hubby. We also added some additional vitamins from the book It Starts With the Egg which has a section one perm quality - Vit C, E, Ubiquinol, Omega 3. I can’t remember the doses off hand I’m afraid but there’s a chapter on it in the book.

[PaulaDag in reply to Peony85]

OK thanks. I've ordered Proxeed plus for him. And will dig out the book as i have it somewhere. Thanks

[Jm82]

HI, my partners results came back at 59% back from a test done in June, he's been told to take proxeed and we are just waiting on the results from a 2nd test to see if there is any improvement. He hardly drinks at all and has never smoked so we don't really know what else to try.

We had Icsi on our 1st cycle before we knew about this we got 7 viable embryos, had 4 transfers and 2 tests were negative and had 2 missed miscarriages.

Not sure what our options are if no improvement.

Good luck xx

[Missl73 in reply to Jm82]

My husband was 57% (although it's steadily come down over the past 12 months with the changes we've made), it was 44% when we did our most recent cycle (although the high damage number dropped a lot and low damage number increased from 6% to 27%). Heat can be a major factor in DNA fragmentation, has your partner been checked for varicocele? My DH also sat with an ice pack on his balls for 30 minutes a day and it really helped.

We saw a urologist who specialises in male infertility and on his recommendation we switched to IMSI and saw dramatically improved results, 100% fertilisation and 100% made it to day 5 blast. I'm currently 9 weeks pregnant from that cycle and still have high quality blasts in the freezer. I would recommend IMSI instead of ICSI, or more extreme I know in many cases mTESE can be used to take sperm directly from the testicles which usually cuts DNA fragmentation by more than half. You definitely have options so keep the faith xxx

[Jm82 in reply to Missl73]

Thanks so much for your reply and massive congratulations, until today I have been so down about the results but this has given me hope it can happen. We got our 2nd test results back today and it's decreased to 31% which I know is still poor but I'm feeling more positive. We are going back for an appointment on Thursday so I will def ask them about imsi. Thankyou and congrats again hope the rest of your pregnancy goes smoothly xx

[Missl73 in reply to Jm82]

That's a fantastic change you should be really pleased, I'm sure it will make a difference! Good luck I hope that your next cycle is successful I have my fingers crossed for you xx

[Jm82 in reply to Missl73]

Thankyou xx

[Melrey]

Thanks for sharing and I’m so sorry to hear about the miscarriages.

Please can you keep me posted if the fragmentation test shows lower results because if so I will get my hubby to start that supplement.

Best of luck x

[Jm82 in reply to Melrey]

Hi, just to let you know we today got our results back from the clinic and my partners results have reduced from 59% to 31% in the 3 months since he had the last test done. He was put on proxeed (brought on Amazon) a high dose of vitamin c and e and selenium. We have an appointment on Thursday with the consultant to see if we can proceed on to round 3 or if there's anything else we need to do prior. The result is still in the fair to poor bracket but i can't believe how much it had improved so I'm hopeful 😊Xx

[Melrey in reply to Jm82]

That’s such wonderful news to hear. Proxeed it is! Amazon shopping here I come. Keep in touch x

[Hidden]

I'm currently 10w after ICSI from an mTESE. My husband has non obstructive azoospermia, which is one of the worst diagnoses for male fertility. They found 20 individual sperm on the day, and I'm pregnant from the transfer of one 5 day blast, and 3 more were good quality for freezing. They were all very abnormal in shape, and no idea about DNA frag as far too few to test. We had done aggressive diet, supplementation and lifestyle changes for over 4 months in advance (no alcohol/caffeine; no baths/saunas; no exercise that raises core body temp; super healthy diet; recommended supplements). I'm sure this made a difference. Hope this gives you some hope!

[Melrey in reply to Hidden]

So pleased for you guys. Thanks so much for sharing. It really does give hope xxx

[Strawberry17]

We've had two rounds of ICSI and two early miscarriages so we're moving onto donor sperm with our next round. My husband has severely high DNA fragmentation though. Best of luck to you xx

[Shirazlover2013]

Hiya, yes we have a 4y/o son conceived naturally after 14mths, our little miracle!! However in the 39mths of trying since we’ve done 3 ICSI rounds with very little success in terms of quality or quantity of embryos. We’re about to go for round 4 trying IMSI this time. We did dna fragmentation after 2nd round and it came back at the top of the normal range (26 or 29% can’t remember the specifics but it was literally the last number before we moved bracket) but our IVF consultant seemed to think this was ok results to keep trying ICSI. Urologist also diagnosed a severe varicocele but didn’t recommend embolisation at this stage. I should mention that nothing has changed (bar our ageing) since we conceived our son, if anything we live a cleaner less boozy lifestyle now and we’ve both been on loads of supplements for 2+ yrs now (fertilix for him). So we are none the wiser as to why or how to work around this issue either sorry 🤷‍♀️

[Missl73]

Switching to IMSI made a huge difference for us so hopefully it will for you too. If his varicocele is not being embolised I would recommend a cool pack on the balls for 30 minutes a day as the damage from varicocele comes from being too hot so countering this could be helpful (my DH did both cool pack and had varicocele embolised) xx

[Shirazlover2013 in reply to Missl73]

Your post above was what inspired me to go for IMSI! Congratulations on your pregnancy and fabulous last round results!! 🤞we can get some improvement and success like you.

[Core]

How did you know to get a dna test for sperm? Did doctors recommend it?xx

[Melrey in reply to Core]

Well after our embryos stopped growing day 3 I was advised this is really rare so researched why it can happen and dna frag came up. So I booked a test and unfortunately that came back with bad news. Xx

[Jjf86]

Hi we’re did you get the dna frag test, just finished are 1st cycle of ICSI 7 eggs fertilised but none made it past day 3, fertility unit said this is uncommon to happen as they would of expected at least one to male blast, I have severe oligospermia for the reason of ICSI,

[Melrey in reply to Jjf86]

I’m so sorry to hear that you had exactly the same problem as us. It’s so upsetting and shocking isn’t it.

It will take a lil while to sink in and digest but you’re not alone. There is a whole community of people going through the same problems.

Keep strong and support each other. X

[Missl73]

You can self-refer to have the test done here examenlab.com/for-men/the-t... this is the test my DH had xx

[Canadawaterchick]

We followed a strict diet, ALOT of supplements including proxeed which you’ve read blow and more high anti oxidant supplements. Good organic food also which is critical! BFP will come and so will the baby. We had ICSI but only after 4 months of solid improvements xx

[Melrey in reply to Canadawaterchick]

Did Icsi work for u guys? X

[Canadawaterchick in reply to Melrey]

Yes Melrey it did work for us but it’s critical to ensure you have a good solid supplement, health and lifestyle factor sorted before hand for 4 months, we had a nutritionist who helped with it all from supps to diet xx

[Melrey in reply to Canadawaterchick]

I’m sooo pleased for u guys! That’s amazing news! Fear not we are on hundreds of pills and the diet is pretty must rabbit food! Thanks for ur inspiring message xxx