Vibrating Gloves (Tass)

[PD-dev]

Edit:

Oops, I intended to reply to this thread but accidentally opened up a new one, sorry.

healthunlocked.com/cure-par......

Hi,

I'm working on one too for the last 2mo and I'm glad to find like-minded here.

My path was quite similar.

First iteration:

Build a HW FFT acquisition system based on

Esp32, ADXL345

Second iteration:

Build a ERM prototype

Esp8266, 4x ERM micro motors, DRV8833, battery poered, silicone cast finger attachments

Results: ERM are too broad in spectrum. Too high amplitude. Fingers get numb. Pattern is working and flexibly configurably

Third iteration:

LRA with 240Hz, ESP8266, DRV2605

Current status: waiting for delivery of the manufacturer (self designed pcb), 1-2d until arrival

Cheers M

[Farooqji]

Wishing you a successful completion

[park_bear]

ERM?

[PD-dev in reply to park_bear]

Eccentric Rotating Mass

[PD-dev]

V2 will look a lot cleaner

[NuroMod]

Hi , when you say ' EMR too broad in spectrum ' - please elaborate. And a) How did you drive the ERM ? b) At what voltage c) a constant voltage drive e.g. @ 5V ? d) How did you mount the ERMs on the finger ? e) Mounting of all 4 x ERMS on the hand e.g. glove or ?? f) At what frequency was the drive ? Thanks.

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

A) Esp8266, DRV8833 via PWM

B, C) tested between 3.3VDC and 5VDC(out of spec), as said via PWM

D, E) With the mentioned silicone fingers. During testing I have it mounted in foam for damping

F) PWM was at 250Hz, 2/3 Duty. But keep in mind: f_PWM != f_Vibration. So I kept adjusting V to get the spectrum right. This also showed, that compared to a novafon it was all over the place.

Note: I experimented with a Novafon @100Hz, 45min sessions which improved motor symptoms notably.

Cheers M

[PD-dev in reply to PD-dev]

To give you an idea This is a novafon

Novafon

[PD-dev in reply to PD-dev]

This is an ERM. it's not tuned right now. But should show what I mean

ERM

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

That explains it. Thanks, Are you going to tune the ERM ? Done it? and if so, results ?

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

Well you can shift the spectrum. But you wouldn't narrow it. So that's pointless IMHO. Better focus on LRA

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

ordered...waiting for parts..

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

Which ones did you pick? How are you driving them? Drv2605? Any ideas on measuring success objectively?

[PD-dev in reply to PD-dev]

As expected, tests today confirmed this

Lra

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

How is your testing / trials progressing >

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

Very good . Tested the two devices today for 1h and the patient was able to type 10 fingers after 45min. The devices were still attached while he did BTW..

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

Great stuff !!! Kindly clarify - what was the patient's condition e.g. typing, motor control, finger movement, which fingers, dexterity etc prior to the 45min session? i.e. before and after datum comparison. Any side effects ? When PWP was typing - was the vibrations switched off ? Thanks.

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

Right now I'm focusing more on getting the devices to work properly so I don't have hard numbers on this yet.

However, Patient was not able to type due to stiffness and shaking in the left arm at all since 1 Jan. The patient is an early onset 40yo 4y diagnosed. No other symptoms (dementia etc)

First time he reported lightheadedness., not this time though.

The actors were on and attached while typing

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

Excuse my ignorance, can you please explain how and what u used to measure the plots as shown ? - this is a great way to gauge the potential effect in advance and hopefully - fine tuning ( how ? ) can be a viable alternative. Thanks again.

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

That's a FFT of the 3d movement with a gyro such as the ADXL345

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

Hi, thanks for reply. a) So even with low voltage /PWM signal - the vibrations were ' very broad ' ? b) Which part of the body did you test the novafon with the vibration therapy ? c) tested on person with Parkinson's ? d) Pls expand on " improved motor symptoms " ? - many thanks.

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

A) yes

B) left hand fingertips as indicated by tass

C) Tested with a patient with early onset 3y diagnosed

D) left hand could move fingers slowly and strong shaking. With ERM setup numbness. Compared to the novafon experiment which enabled to type 10 fingers afterwards with no shaking

[PDWarrior1900]

wow! keep up the great work and please keep us informed

[PD-dev]

Thanks for sharing.

The criteria are mostly targeted at long term impact. I was thinking of objective type short term ( before/after use) such as amplitude shaking of body parts.

Any chance you did research on what impact the acceleration/force/amplitude of the motor has? Tass was referring to "moderate" if I remember correctly. It would be great to have this backed with data.

Thanks

[PD-dev]

I'm also wondering whether bone transducers can be used, due to their bandwidth

soundimports.eu/de/dayton-a...

[PD-dev]

You are right, they are immediate, my bad.What I actually meant is hard numbers. The glass and writing are interpreted by your brain which tells you good or bad.

Having AI interpret it would in your case remove bias, but in the end it comes down to measuring the shakiness of the hand, right?

[PD-dev]

You're right with everything you say. Still, I'm wondering whether shakiness over time wouldn't be a good indicator as most experience that symptom. I applied this type of analysis to rotary equipment (motor, turbine, compressor..) in the past with great success to predict failures weeks ahead

[PD-dev]

Third iteration:

Result: LRA show as expected a sharp spike at claimed resonance. Vibration don't cause numbness. Self-designed driver works as expected. HW rev2 planned to fix a pnp issue.

First poc for wearable vibration monitoring done (battery poered) incl real-time aggregation + viz on a computer to record "shakiness over time" as kpi for project success

Fourth iteration:

Planned: Integration of all 4 drivers with the control board + integrated batteries with charger. First glove design. Inter glove sync via wifi. First enclosure design

Cheers M

[Farooqji]

a.aliexpress.com/_mtcoKmW

How is this?

[PD-dev in reply to Farooqji]

Thanks! Have you tried it?

[Farooqji in reply to PD-dev]

No. Just came across this and thought it is ready made and would serve the same purpose

[PD-dev in reply to Farooqji]

I see. Two thoughts on the gloves. 1) it's not vibrating. So a cheaper alternative would be a home depot gardening glove

2) I see the same issue I'm facing right now, which is: keeping the actuator in place. Slight changes in positioning would change the mechanical connection between the skin and the device

[PD-dev]

I just saw the attached image. Who has put it together?

Do you know whether any other locations on the body have similar effects?

[PD-dev]

Just a quick update

Fourth iteration:

Planned: Integration of all 4 drivers with the control board + integrated batteries with charger. First glove design. Inter glove sync via wifi. First enclosure design

Change in plan, no integration of the drivers. Glove design finished. Turned out to be very similar to the original. I'm working on sync between the gloves. Autodiscovery of additional sensors is working. Config interface via browser is working. It's battery powered with a planned runtime of 4h. (Untested)

Cheers M

Glovesv1

[PD-dev in reply to PD-dev]

Update: Finished the right hand.

I'm not really satisfied with the velcro fingertips as they prevent that the vibration is applied as punctual as possible. I understood from the paper, that this is crucial, right?

So back to CAD.

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

What type of actuators are you using ? I believe positional accuracy is important - target.

[PD-dev in reply to NuroMod]

240Hz LRAs.

Do you know of anyone who applied this technique to other parts of the body?

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

CUE1 uses the same principle. charconeurotech.com/what-is...

[Fenderpicker]

Hi PD-dev,

Looks like you have had some success, congratulations! I appreciate all of the updates. Do you have a repository where we could view the code you are using for the controller?

[PD-dev]

I didn't make up my mind yet whether or not to release it as OSS. I used parts of code of one of my commercial products which is soon to be launched. So I would need to either refactor or make it OSS too 🤔

If there is enough interest and willingness to contribute, I will consider this.

[Fenderpicker]

That is fair, just seems that the goal of this forum is to exchange ideas and try to help those that can't afford/do not have the opportunity to participate in the trial, so i thought i would ask.

Thank you for what you have shared so far.

[PD-dev in reply to Fenderpicker]

I'll do whatever I can to share, I promise

[PD-dev]

Did th parts arrive?

[NuroMod in reply to PD-dev]

Still no sign ...🥺🥺

[Rafiki2]

Hi PD-Dev,

I may have missed a posting, but have you thought of starting to sell your version of the vibrating gloves? I'm sure that you would have huge demand for them and perhaps, if some PWP cannot afford them, there would be others that could afford to pay for more than just one pair so as to make them available to those that cannot. I would be happy to do so.

Keep up the good work and glad your wife is benefitting from your hard work. I would love to do the same for my wife.

[PD-dev in reply to Rafiki2]

I am thinking about a small kit if there is interest. Selling it as a full device would require much overhead to deal with.Just PN me

Cheers

[Funnygirl64 in reply to PD-dev]

I would like to purchase the gloves are you selling them please

[JakeMax]

Morning, PD-Dev, how are things progressing? I’m 5 and a half years in and would love to find a way to get the gloves made.

Thanks for your assistance.

[John_morris71 in reply to JakeMax]

FYI

healthunlocked.com/cure-par...

[JakeMax in reply to John_morris71]

Thank you John. The info is greatly appreciated.

Has your wife made any further progress in reversing her symptoms?

[John_morris71 in reply to JakeMax]

My mom has PD not wife). Hoping to have the vibrating gloves that is being discussed on the board.

[PD-dev]

The first driver boards arrived 👍

First batch

[TactileDesign]

Hello! thanks for this info. Could you please provide another update on your progress?