Look at the global HCQ studies results. Digest the content.
"Global HCQ studies. PrEP, PEP, and early treatment studies show high effectiveness, while late treatment shows mixed results."
100% of early treatment including Post Exposure Prophylaxis studies are very positive.
Please refrain from politically biased comments.
HCQ combined with zinc can be used as an early treatment upon testing Covid positive (you have less than 5 days window from onset of symptoms) or be used as a prophylactic depending on your exposure risk proactively. It has a half-life of more than 40 days and stays in your system for about 3 months. Countless number of people have taken the drug for the prevention of Malaria before/while traveling. We already know that the most vulnerable people depend on it to treat lupus, RA, and other autoimmune diseases daily. As to the over-hyped cardiac complications libeled against the drug, see the following conclusion by the American Heart Association. There has been ZERO case of heart complications when taken in the outpatient setting.
"In the largest reported cohort of coronavirus disease 2019 patients to date treated with chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine±azithromycin, no instances of Torsade de pointes, or arrhythmogenic death were reported."
ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161...
If you're unsure of your zinc status (as most of us are since serum zinc test is not a reliable indicator) and if you're in the high risk category, you should look into supplementing zinc, possibly combine with quercetin as an alternate zinc ionophore as in HCQ especially if you don't have access to the drug. Zinc is harder to absorb in old age or diseased state.
"A recent study in a group of 102 elderly European people revealed that 44% of them had Zn deficiency and 20% had high Zn deficiency...Zn deficiency is quite common in elderly, frail people since they often avoid meats and other foods that contain this metal to avoid increasing blood cholesterol levels."
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl....
"The ubiquity and versatility of zinc in subcellular metabolism suggest that zinc deficiency may well result in a generalized impairment of many metabolic functions...the effects of dietary zinc restriction of growth and differentiation are manifest in the animal (mammalian) model (Chesters 1982) correctly alerts us to the special vulnerability to zinc deficiency of cells that are rapidly turning over, notably those of the immune system. However, other organs and systems that are not noted for rapid cell turnover, e.g., the central nervous system, are also vulnerable to zinc restriction...Hence the human nutrition scientist and clinician are faced with a potentially bewildering range of manifestations of zinc deficiency that are typically difficult to detect and confirm...zinc deficiency occurs even in circumstances where, at least superficially, intake of this micronutrient appears to be adequate."
academic.oup.com/jn/article...
"Interestingly, most of the risk groups described for COVID-19 are at the same time groups that were associated with zinc deficiency. zinc might prevent or attenuate those symptoms, as summarized in Figure 1, and thus should be regarded as promising cost-effective, globally available therapeutic approach for COVID-19 patients, for which minimal to no side effects are known...zinc deficiency potentially disturbs the innate immune response toward SARS-CoV2, enabling the virus to easily spread throughout the host without an adequate immune response."
frontiersin.org/articles/10...
So, here's the dilemma this thread and any conversation about hydroxychloroquine presents.
I readily acknowledge I am not competent to evaluate randomized, double blind, placebo controlled trials and I doubt there's more than a few on this forum who are -- which means we have no way of knowing whether or not the studies represented by your charts were performed in compliance with best practices.
That being our reality, on what basis should one/we make a decision and, more important, what decision are you presupposing we should make?
If I contracted Covid 19 and went to the VA hospital, I would not even consider telling those doctors how to treat me. I have complete, total faith in them. Likewise, I believe 99% of the PWP on this forum are not about to tell their doctors how to treat Covid 19. Therefore, we rely on our doctor's decisions and most of their decisions are based on information, protocols, guidelines and recommendations of the medical institutions that employ them and on the FDA, the CDC, and the WHO and a few universities that are in the forefront of this pandemic.
Secondly, even if they we were competent to evaluate these trials, no one on this forum is going to spend several hundred hours evaluating every Covid trial in order to instruct their doctors how to treat them.
In other words, I do not understand the purpose of trying to convince PWP on this forum that hydroxy chloroquine is a viable therapy for Covid 19 when 99% of the doctors and scientists that run the best medical institutions in this country disagree, i.e., what's the purpose of this thread?
I thought I was pretty clear of what you should do. You need to supplement zinc possibly with an aid of a zinc ionophore because the chances are you're deficient the older you are or in dyshomeostasis due to various illness, including PWP.
By the time you end up in hospital/ICU due to your covid illness symptoms, it may be already too late and you will need to depend on your Drs.
You need to be proactive to save your own lives during the current state of affair. The current worldwide empirical data absolutely supports it, and despite your claim myriad educated physicians do as well to treat themselves and their loved ones. Go through all the posted peer reviewed studies and see if any is missing related to Covid - they're valid data.
I would personally take the very safe <$20 hydroxychloroquine + zinc any day over an unproven and risky vaccine with less than a year of large-scale observation. As we've agreed in the past, I'd do everything possible to avoid ending up in an ICU given the extremely high mortality stat.
I am a hyperactive hypochondriac and, as such, I take zinc, but don't know enough about ionophores to take them. I thought chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine were themselves zinc ionophores and otherwise are mostly given to animals??
Look into the over-the-counter quercetin which I've mentioned on the post. I don't know what you mean by mostly given to animals?
use in animals
sciencedirect.com/topics/ag...
apparently, they are used for cattle and poultry for more efficient weight gain.
This is a better definition. Yes ionophores are not limited to zinc.
"Ionophores are lipid-soluble molecules, usually synthesized by microorganisms to transport ions through a lipid bilayer of cell membrane."
Are you now taking hydroxychloroquine?
No. I'm pretty sure I'm over covid and I took quercetin at the time to help recover. Check my past posts.
I'll go back and look at your past post. I did not know you had Covid. I'm sorry to hear that. Glad you seem to be over it. You must be pretty healthy?
I wasn't absolutely sure at the time, and no way to confirm with a reliable antibody test. I didn't have enough symptoms to get tested either but I was supplementing zinc, yet the cough was pretty tough to beat.
Millions have had covid19 (tested positive) and recovered without Hqx. Rescuema is one of even more millions who had a bug this year and didn't get tested but decided it was probably covid19 when it wasn't. The trials weren't double blind-you can rely on WHO and Fauci for that. The graphs show deaths per million but not cases per million. Compare Greece and Turkey (both with low cases per million) with new Zealand, south Korea, and Vietnam. Stopping disease spread stops deaths.
It always rains when the sidewalks are wet...
The harm in this is it promotes the myth that the virus is treatable, and the correct approach is to treat it effectively rather than prevent infection. Global evidence confirms this is dangerous nonsense that leads to hundred of thousands of deaths and overrun health care services.
To give just one example of why these studies don't support the conclusions rescuema is making take the first one in Marseille which I reported. 1061 cases, on average patients on hqx recovered a couple of days quicker. Maybe. Now that's a good thing. But nobody died. The worst case in the trial had a positive outcome by day 15. So that trial prevented zero covid19 deaths. At best it showed people who were going to recover anyway recovered a bit quicker.
If it had been anyone but you Marc I would have ignored this thread. Remember the harm is the idea that treatment is a preferable alternative to infection prevention. Bollocks!
You are entitled to your own continued incorrect beliefs and skip the tread as you suggest. Let people decide for themselves from the data. Yes nobody dying is the point, and I’ll take that 100% over the alternate stat. That’s how all studies are conducted, comparing stats, not excuses.
Stats : deaths per million (dpm), cases per million (cpm)
USA 478,14535
UK 680,4486
Sweden 568,7959
Ireland 357 , 5293
France 464 , 2878
Turkey 68, 2758
India 28 , 1307
Greece 20, 447
New Zealand 4,313
South Korea 6, 280
So - regardless of their Hqx use, countries where fewer people get infected, get fewer deaths. A very simple statistic
Of course - these are totals as of 2nd August. Whats happening now?
In last 7 days deaths per million (dpm), cases per million (cpm)
USA 22 , 1336
UK 7, 67
Sweden 1, 96
Ireland 1, 57
France 1, 82
Turkey 1, 69
India 3, 233
Greece 1, 42
New Zealand 0, 1
South Korea 0, 4
So looking at whats happening now (the last 7 days), countries with low infections have low deaths. Most countries, with or without HQX have similar low deaths per million
India is one of the below average "worst". In spite of alleged HQX use in your graphs. Because its infection rate is high.
The UK takes 2nd place.
In a class of its own is the USA. This isn't down to HQX - its down to 442599 new cases in the last 7 days, 13.36 per million
All people have to do is to look at the up to date data below. No point and waste of time skewing the data off the trend looking at a shorter time interval to support your misguided point, and I'm sure even the most stable nation's data would've looked worse at a certain point of virus development trajectory including S. Korea.
worldometers.info/coronavirus/
Of course less infection = less death, but what about those who're continuing to get infected despite the best measures? I personally have not had a single cold since 2013, and have not been exposed to anyone beside my partner when I got infected at my own home out of nowhere, which I assume came from a takeout meal. What about those continuing to die despite the economically damaging lockdown, wearing masks, and social distancing practices? You're surely aware that S. Korea controlled the covid without a lockdown? India is expanding its HCQ use and not all of the huge near 1.4 billion populace were using the prophylaxis, yet 29 death/mil pop is much better than most -
"A recent case-controlled study by ICMR has underlined the benefit of hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) as prophylaxis, showing that the sustained use of the anti-malaria drug along with the use of personal protective equipment (PPE) was associated with a significant decline in risk of Covid-19 infection rate by upto 80% among the healthcare workers."
health.economictimes.indiat...
"The idea that this is a dangerous drug is just silly, but if you ask the American people based on the media's coverage of it, that is kind of the state of play right now"
tribuneindia.com/news/natio...
The only way out of this virus is either you beat the virus or wait for a proven safe vaccine that won't be observed to be safe for possibly years. Anyone is welcome to self-isolate for years if they can manage. As noticed, this virus won't go away on its own and it is exceptionally infectious.
Why would anyone sane be so against taking beneficial Zinc along with its relatively SAFE ionophores compared to death and hospitalization?
"I'm sure even the most stable nation's data would've looked worse at a certain point of virus development trajectory including S. Korea........You're surely aware that S. Korea controlled the covid without a lockdown?"
This wasn't lockdown but I'm not sure US citizens would allow this. Sth Korea's response to Covid.
I think it's a good idea for you to rely on Fauci and the WHO. Their proclamations are all over the map and have been disproven.
I think you are p*****g in the wind as my uncouth partner might say MBA, So frustrating those who so blinded by their own point of view will not engage in discussion. The questions never get answered., instead it is more of the same.
I have learned over the years..... when one calls another person out by using the phrase, "You .....they are referring to themselves more than they are referring to the object of their criticism.
I would be very happy to say I would be p*****G in the wind but it doesnt make much sense in this context. I was agreeing with MBA not calling him out.
"Projection is a psychological defense mechanism in which individuals attribute characteristics they find unacceptable in themselves to another person. For example, a husband who has a hostile nature might attribute this hostility to his wife and say she has an anger management problem."
goodtherapy.org/blog/psychp...
"People who “feel inferior and have low self-esteem” can also fall into the habit of projecting their own feelings of not being good enough onto others, adds psychologist Michael Brustein, PsyD. He points to racism and homophobia as examples of this type of projection on a broader scale. On the other hand, people who can accept their failures and weaknesses — and who are comfortable reflecting on the good, bad, and ugly within — tend not to project."
healthline.com/health/proje...
Solution? Disengage judiciously and don't take the bait especially when proven toxic after plentiful encounters.
I am reposting this thread for those who may have missed it - Hydroxychloroquin-as-a-prophylaxis-for-sars-cov2-infection.
healthunlocked.com/parkinso...
The mechanism by which Hydroxychloroquin works is examined in the thread.
I found the information sufficiently interesting to add a regime of 500mg Quercetin and 15mg Zinc daily to my supplement regime which also includes Vitamin D & C. Quercetin like Hydroxychloroquin is a Zinc ionophore. Interestingly my sinus problems have disappeared.
Would have tried dosing recommendations of the Indian Council of Medical research, but Hydroxychloroquin - an over the counter drug here in Trinidad & Tobago - was put under ‘lock and key’ after a spike in demand when it was touted as a ‘game changer’ by the President of USA.
Quercetin benefits Parkinson's too. Though I'd take frequent breaks from regular supplementation as I believe it could be pretty harsh on the kidneys at higher dosage.
"When taking supplements/ powder, it is recommended not to take them for more than 3 months at a stretch. Take a break from its supplementation."
salubrainous.com/quercetin-...
Indeed 🌹
Unless tested it’s impossible to say if you had covid and consequently pointless to talk about effect treatments.
True, but that's not the point of this post. I could only make my educated guess given the persistent brutal cough that wouldn't go away for several weeks along with many odd symptoms that matched. It was no random cough but even if not covid, I got infected by something very contagious despite taking precautions while staying at home.
It certainly sounds unpleasant!
in a recent serological survey in Italy, that is based on the research of post-contagion antibodies, based on representative samples of the population with more than 60,000 people tested, it was found that the number of people who were in contact with the virus is six times more the positive test people. In the most affected areas it is 20%, still far from herd immunity. This brings the lethality rate, the ratio between the dead and the infected, to 2.5% which is quite high for now, but in my opinion it is falling. This should be of interest here. There is also a lot of information that can improve your precautions, for example the fact that the infection occurs mainly among family members, but can be avoided with the right precautions. IMO we avoid continually going from the dramatization of "we will all die" to the opposite "the virus is not there". the virus is there with a little common sense, we will emerge unscathed and and hopefully we will soon find a cure or a safe vaccine .
leave the dead in peace out of respect.
salute.gov.it/portale/nuovo...
istat.it/it/files//2020/08/...
I have read that 'herd immunity' will be at 20%, much lower than the 80% predicted. I have read it is already occuring in parts of Europe, where the virus has died out, and it is getting close to dying out in the U.S.
None of that is correct.
Bepo is referring to the observations such as below
“it is unlikely that lockdowns alone can explain the fact that infections have fallen in many regions after 20% of a population has been infected – something that, after all, happened in Stockholm and on cruise ships...This has led to speculation about whether a population can achieve some sort of immunity to the virus with as little as 20% infected – a proportion well below the widely accepted herd immunity threshold (60-70%).”
theconversation.com/coronav...
Pretty flimsy basis on which to state "I have read that 'herd immunity' will be at 20%".
The observations in that article are interesting (including the counter points they offer) but there's a lot about the virus that is simply not well understood at this time.
Absolutely correct that no one truly understands. All the speculations on herd immunity may not ever pan out as a solution given your antibodies may not last more than several months after all without conferred immunity and it may be similar to the flu where you”ll be susceptible to mutations all over again, rendering the vaccines much less effective.
certainly no one knows why but this is the way things are: the virus is almost disappearing here in Italy. Intensive care is empty and positive for the test does not mean sick. I am sorry for the scientists who still have not understood much, but after all if we move away from the observation of man to study mice, then we will understand everything about mice, lucky mice. IMHO it takes three or four conditions for a large contagion to occur in the population and that in the absence of one of these it is enough to reduce the contagion.
1.a population without antibodies and weakened immune system ,
2. a cold and humid and closed environmental condition that favors the persistence of the virus in the environment itself.
3.Many occasions of gathering
4.the presence of super spreader.
This last point could explain a lowering of the herd immunity threshold. All these conditions have their maximum at the end of winter when the cold and pollution have weakened the body. Just my theory without any pretense.
It seems the media is all over the place on Italy. It seems the viral loads are observed to be almost undetectable yet the PM recently ordered a lockdown extension. It must be tense over there.
absolutely not, the PM asked for an extension to full powers until October as this is foreseen only in case of emergency and for short periods from our establishment, but has promised that it will no longer implement any extended lockdown. The only remaining obligation is the mask in closed places and the ban on gathering. The discos remain closed only.
Ah I didn't see the latter part of him promising no more lock-down. I can't even make heads/tails with the media reporting biased info all over the place from where I am.
thanks for all the information. with all the media bias, people don't know who to believe. i don't know who made the decision in America that doctors are not supposed to treat with
HCQ and pharmacists are encouraged to not fill the drs Rx if they deem it not appropriate.
We cant stay in our caves forever while the economy continues to get ruined. '
The covid numbers reporting is so inaccurate who knows what's true.
Thanks for your post.
------------------------------------
Have you read the 2005 study, referenced in the link below, was done under Fauci's mgmt
It that concluded HCQ was a good treatment for covid? Here is a link to an interview with Dr Gold of the Frontline Drs Summit and she explains these. start at minute 45:36
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l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...
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There were studies done on HCQ that were retracted because they were false
-.
l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...
You’re very welcome. Yes I’m aware but I’m reluctant to judge the guy nor speculate on his true motives here. I’m afraid damaging decisions are being made by many influentials and not always in the best interest of what is truly best for the society as a whole. It is really unfortunate to witness how divisive we are to the point it seems nonsensical.
Sorry guys & girls - more COVID stuff.
Steven Hatfill, a veteran virologist and an adjunct assistant professor in two departments at the George Washington University Medical Center where he teaches mass casualty medicine, elaborates on “An Effective COVID Treatment the Media Continues to Besmirch”
The key arguments begins at the heading -
“So what is the real story on hydroxychloroquine? Here, briefly, is what we know:”
realclearpolitics.com/artic...
Yes it's a tragedy and that's when I lost faith seeing seemingly intelligent people could be so blinded by their biased agenda that they'll do anything in lieu of actually saving lives.
Anyone salient and truly scientific would've come to the same conclusion with the mounting evidences many months ago, yet the ridiculous censoring on platforms such as YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, and the fake media continues.
Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin: reservations continue about French trial and this treatment protocol
Vodobatinib 
Early PD Stage Clinical Trials / Treatment Options?
Practice Parameter: Neuroprotective strategies and alternative therapies for Parkinson disease (an evidence-based review)
Home Treatment For Covid + PWP
