Breathless on bending down

[Fluffybee]

Not sure if anyone here can help me but whenever I need to bend down and either do laces up, put trainer socks on etc I breathless when I stand up ?

I have micro vascular angina and coronary artery spasms?

[Chappychap]

Are you overweight?

The reason I ask is that although I wasn't obese, I definitely used to be overweight. And I too would be a little breathless after bending over to tie my laces. But now that I've lost the excess weight that's no longer the case.

The reason I've since found out is that, when bent over, excess fat around the waist and abdomen pushes up on the lungs and prevents proper breathing. I wasn't conscious of it at the time, but apparently lung capacity can be reduced by more than half. For people who are genuinely obese then tieing laces is effectively like doing it while holding your breath!

[Fluffybee in reply to Chappychap]

No I’m not I’ve normal BMI !!!

[Milkfairy Heart Star in reply to Fluffybee]

Hi Fluffybee

I now sit down to tie my shoe laces.

It could be your medication. All the medication dilates the blood vessels to try and prevent the vasospasms so dizziness and breathless can be an issue if you bend over.

I have to be really careful when I am doing yoga. I have to very slowly raise my head up.

[Fluffybee in reply to Milkfairy]

Thank you,

Do you also have the same problem when you bend over or just being cautious?

I think I may take up yoga to relax you must feel really good afterwards with all the stretching, maybe Pilates?

😀

[Milkfairy Heart Star in reply to Fluffybee]

A little bit.

I love yoga as it helps with stamina as well as balance and flexibility.

The breathing techniques are really helpful I have alot of pain. It keeps me calm.

🧘‍♀️

[gilreid1 in reply to Chappychap]

Your a brave man asking that 😂😂😂

[Fluffybee in reply to gilreid1]

Agreed !!! Thanks

[Tessie28 in reply to Chappychap]

Interesting. One thing I thought when I went for my AVR is that lots of patients would be really overweight. They weren't but like me quite a few a stone or two over. So now I am prediabetic and cholestrol is an issue. Luckily weight had started to come off so going the right way. Tried on a 'school' skirt as in teaching! last night and it fell off me! Hey way to go.

have the best day possible all, going to do my rehab exercises now.x

[HenryTudor]

I reckon it’s not unusual and it sounds logical that your lungs are scrunched up when you bend over. I’ve lost weight, now down to normal, and find this happens to me.

[Fluffybee in reply to HenryTudor]

It does make sense doesn’t it, well done on your weight loss, sorry this happened to you despite doing so well, luckily I don’t have a weight problem but this has noticeably become a problem, like Milkfairy said it could well be the meds etc

Thanks for your reply

[Sunshinebrew]

I get breathless bending down too and im slightly overweight though not obese. I have noticed more breathlessness when weeding in the garden bending over than when I'm upright pruning. I do sometimes get a little dizzy when I get up which I think is the medication. I also do yoga carefully to avoid lightheadedness and particularly enjoy the breathing and meditation so calming.

[ph5019 in reply to Sunshinebrew]

Hi, l am like sunshine,

[Becksagogo]

Fluffy bee, I am the same. Mine started after my last valve replacement. If anything, I am underweight and I too think my meds could be responsible. I also have very low blood pressure.

[Fazerboy]

I had svt (fast heart rate causing breathlessness) and I found that bending down to tie laces or pick something up off the floor triggered the svt. I used to bend my knees to sort of squat instead to avoid it. I also found that lying on my back would reset my hr. I had an ablation and I don’t get svt now.

Just a thought.

[Just-Wanna-Run]

I have the exact same problem when I bend down to put the cats food on the ground. I too have MVA. It feels like my heart is being crushed and it takes my breath away. I also have pectis excavatum. My GP thinks its just my sternum pushing inwards as it only happens when my arms are straight in front of me. It also happens if I lie in bed on my side with my arms straight out.

[hf54]

Have you put on any weight in recent times. This is a very important question, because putting on weight and being overweight are two different things. You have stated clearly that you’re not overweight and your body mass index is good but in recent times have you put on More than 750g I ask this because one of the classic symptoms of heart failure is water retention. The manner and way the water is retained may be different than the water retention many women commonly experience so I wouldn’t just dismiss it out of hand. With my own condition heart Failure when I retained water it made my body incredibly stiff and the first onset of this I noticed was when I was bending down or putting my socks on etc .If your appetite has decreased or simply you eat less through choice But you have had an increase in weight more than half a kilo, it has to be coming from somewhere.

[Sunnie2day in reply to hf54]

Good points. I have recurrent pericarditis (plus a few other heart conditions - HF not one of those) and one of my first 'uh-oh' warnings is bendopnea tying my shoes or putting the cat dinner bowl down. In my case it is always fluid retention and a warning I'm retaining too much fluid.

[hf54 in reply to Sunnie2day]

hi sunnie interesting as it is to do with hypertension according to theCardiologistin my case. Interesting to note how different peoples conditionsHave different reasons.

[Sunnie2day in reply to hf54]

When my GP noticed it she was convinced I was in heart failure. The cardiac nurse was convinced as well. I think the cardiac nurse was disappointed when the echo 'only' showed pericardial effusion. No-one mentioned hypertension as my BP is well normal.

It is interesting how many different causes of bendopnea there are. It's only been recognised as a diagnostic tool the past few years and most people presenting with the condition do go on to be diagnosed as having HF. But it can be indicative of several conditions.

[Ukuleleman]

I’m 72. I’ve used velcro fastening shoes, which are excellent, and a sock putter oner as I can’t reach my toes and my beloved won’t always assist. I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia about four years before heart failure.

[Denva in reply to Ukuleleman]

Gosh I too have fibromyalgia. Now add heart disease it is like my fibromyalgia is on steroids.

[Andrew1966]

Hi, I think it might be good for you to look up 'Bendopea' it is about when you bend and your heart has to adjust due to movement of fluid making it harder to breathe, good luck Andrew

[Fluffybee in reply to Andrew1966]

I’ve never heard of that before, I’ll have a look, thank you for replying

[Dickydon]

Exactly the same happens to me and it was worse before I had a pacemaker fitted two years ago. My heart rate would drop to 30bpm doing anything like lacing up my boots or bending over or anything physical like climbing a few steps which rendered me helpless until I came around and I don’t have weight problems either. I’ve known the fattiest of people but they we never breathless just doing simple physical things on observation over the years; smokers too some of them.

However, mine is the result of my aortic & mitral valve leakages. Open heart surgery has been postponed due to the virus problem taking over everything and the fact I can cope with the problem rather than have my chest opened up with 8hrs surgery to have the two valves replaced.

[dunestar]

I get this as well. As others have said it may be the medication. But also I've noticed that when I'm bending over I don't breath properly. When I'm consciously aware of my breathing when I'm bending over I do better.

[Jeans1234]

It's the medication, what are you on?

[Fluffybee in reply to Jeans1234]

Amlodipine 10mg, Atorvastatin 40mg, Bisoprolol 2.5mg, Isosprbide mononitrate and GTN spray ?

[Milkfairy Heart Star in reply to Fluffybee]

Hi Fluffybee

Do you know why you have been prescribed beta blockers?

They are not usually advised for people with vasospastic angina.

This advice is in the NICE guidelines for the treatment of stable angina.

bnf.nice.org.uk/treatment-s...

When you finally get to see your Cardiologist I suggest you discuss this issue with them.

It maybe the reason why you are experiencing more symptoms at the moment.

[Fluffybee in reply to Milkfairy]

I’m not sure actually, I don’t have high blood pressure I’ve always been within normal limits, when I was taken into hospital late December 19, they then said I had angina and had to wait for tests, then prescribed me the meds I’m now on apart from Viazam which I’ve now changed.

Ive had the ultrasound, which showed up my heart not squeezing properly or getting the blood supply through correctly, ecg abnormal with several things showing up but angiogram completely clear.

When I was in the ambulance, each time I had chest pain it showed up on the ECG.

I’ve only spoken to a different consultant once on the phone since, now got an appointment in just under 2 weeks again a phone consultation but with my cardiologist this time,all the last one did was to change ‘Viazam’ to Amlodipine as he said it’s better for what he called the old fashioned name ‘prinzmetal angina’ and it has improved quite a lot.?

[Milkfairy Heart Star in reply to Fluffybee]

Amlodipine is a calcium channel blocker and the usual treatment for vasospastic angina.

I am on both Diltiaziem and Amlodipine.

I would ask the Cardiologist if you need to be on a beta blocker and be given an alternative if necessary.

I spent 5 days in CCU after being prescribed beta blockers as it made my vasospastic angina much much worse.

[Fluffybee in reply to Milkfairy]

Blimey!!!!!!!!! So sorry to hear that 🤗

Like you say it could well be what’s not helping at all, I just cannot wait for this consultation, sound weird but got so many questions, feel so unwell sometimes, as I know we all do, I know it’s going to take time to get meds sorted etc and get to be the best I can.

My list is getting longer and longer for him 🥴

Thank you as ever for your advice.

[Ringoutwildbells in reply to Fluffybee]

Amlodipine is used for a variety of reasons; often to treat high blood pressure but also because it is a calcium channel blocker.

In a person with “normal” BP it may cause low BP, a symptom of which can be dizziness. If you have MVA, you may have to accept that the Amlodipine which you need for its calcium channel blocker abilities may give you low BP which you adjust for by before big extra careful when you get up, move around etc.

I am recently diagnosed with MVA, and couldn’t understand why I was put on Anlodipine when I had normal BP, until they explained they weren’t using it to treat BP but the MVA. I do have a tendency to get dizzy, but I manage it by being aware and getting up etc carefully.

[Jeans1234 in reply to Fluffybee]

I was on 2.5mg bisoprolol, and was constantly breathless and especially when bending down and doing inclines. I halved dose to 1.25mg and no longer have problem when bending and I feel much better.

[Annie-blue]

Yes happens to me too. I have aortic stenosis (severe) and am otherwise healthy and not overweight or on any medication. It's not major, just something I notice now I'm aware of the AS.

[leakeadea]

I experience the exact same thing👍.

I have MVA/Cardiac Syndrome X. My heart rates and oxygen saturations drop when I'm doing anything bending over, even when seated and then afterwards my heart rate flies up, to increase my oxygen levels.

I have Antiphospholipid Syndrome and have sustained damage to my heart, lungs and kidneys due to blood clots and micro clots. I have to take blood thinners and keep my INR above 4.0, otherwise my blood will be very sticky and produce clots.

My MVA and spasms are always acutely worse when my blood becomes too sticky because the sticky blood can't get into the micro blood vessels in my heart. When this happens my symptoms, even when not bending over are so much worse and when bending, or after I've been bending I can be very close to passing out.

This had been happening to me for years before I finally got a diagnosis and found out why it happens. 🙄

[Fluffybee]

Hi Leakeadea

I also have antiphospholipid syndrome, I cannot remember my last levels, I wonder if that’s linked in any way, probably just coincidence, thanks for your reply, thought I was going crazy, thanks to everyone who posted, really helps 😊

[Milkfairy Heart Star]

Hi Fluffybee

Antiphospholipid syndrome (APS) or Hughes syndrome is linked to microvascular angina.

I was tested for APS but I don't have it.

aps-support.org.uk/about-ap...

Are you seeing a haematologist or Rhuematolgist ?

Again I suggest you discuss your APS with your Cardiologist and ask them to liaise with the person treating your APS.

Often patients with APS are prescribed aspirin or clopidogrel

[Fluffybee in reply to Milkfairy]

I am seeing a rheumatologist, but don’t think the two have been linked at all.

I have also got a problem with my liver that’s just been picked up, gamma GT high, I’ve had a few tests but they’re now thinking it could be the little vessels causing the abnormality.

I’m starting to think this can affect my whole body, but I think you may have posted something on here before about that ?

[Milkfairy Heart Star in reply to Fluffybee]

Yes,

There is growing evidence to show that Microvascular dysfunction and vasospastic angina are whole body disorders .

'Peripheral small vessel disease'

academic.oup.com/eurheartj/...

Has your Rheumatologist performed a nail capillaroscopy the test for Raynaud's phenomenon ?

There is a very knowledgeable Rheumatologist at St Thomas' hospital who knows about both MVA and APS.

I can message his name to you.

[Fluffybee in reply to Milkfairy]

Yes please, and thank you for the information

[Milkfairy Heart Star]

In a simple answer no.

My understanding is that

Dr Natasha Campbell McBride's work is about the gut flora and how this effects individuals.

'gut and psychology syndrome'

GAPS

' The GAPS diet theory says that eliminating certain foods, such as grains and sugars, can help people treat conditions that affect the brain, such as autism and dyslexia.'

Interestingly a Psychiatrist Prof Edward Bullmore has a theory that mental health issues maybe related to inflammatory processes.

He has published 'The inflamed mind'

[Sootycat]

I get that, but in my case probably because I am the size of an elephant with a tummy the size of a hippopotamus !

[Fluffybee in reply to Sootycat]

I’m sure you’re not, you seem to lovely to be described like that 🤗

[Themcgeevers]

I am obviously sorry that you feel this but I am also so reassured to read a post about it I have mva and had 2 mi’s i am not overweight but I am a carer fir my husband the main problem I have is breathlessness and a cough when brr we bring to put his socks or shoes on or move his feet/legs i really struggle with this . Interestingly another post says about laying on side causing problem anything that closes my chest cavity seems to cause discomfort and breathlessness . Hope you soon find ways to manage it .