Problems with stents: Hi everyone im... - British Heart Fou...

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Problems with stents

Mrpaul1971
Mrpaul1971

Hi everyone im paul, last may i had 2 stents put in, and ever since iv been having very bab chest pains, the hospital keep saying muscle spazam, but i never had pains before i had my stents , i just want to whats causing them, i dnt want to keep going threw life tjat nothing can be done,

54 Replies
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You might seek the support of a qualified instructor with the approval of your GP. It is possible that you lost muscle tone due to your op, and just exercising the chest for a minute, two or three times per week could alleviate the problem by regaining the functional capacity?

I do message my chest iv been doing that for ages, and nothing is getting rid of these pains,

Actively working your muscles is different. It necessitates the cells using resources that then have to be renewed. Think of 'use it, or lose it'.

Hi Paul. It’s good that you’re chasing up these chest pains and that they’re being monitored. It might take a while to get to the bottom of what’s wrong. Couple of random thoughts from me. Have they ruled out a gastric problem? Or could it be anxiety? The pains caused by stress are very real. What meds are you on?

Im on a lot of meds, i dont think anxiety or stress thats been ruled out, gastric was mentioned but not considered the problem, the way i see it everyone no's there body and i think its my angina, a couple of mths ago they found a blood clot on my heart that wouldnt cause the pain would it,

Hi. I think it would depend where the blood clot was. How did they/are they treating it? Does the pain go down when you use your GTN?

Sometimes it does sometimes it dosent, they put me on warfarin to thin my blood to try and get rid of it, but i have got to get this sorted, my kids worry when they see me curled up in pain,

GTN is pretty good at easing angina and just because it works sometimes doesn’t mean it is angina. I guess that’s why your docs are looking elsewhere. Are you on Lansoprazole to protect your stomach from the irritation caused by aspirin and any other meds? Do you take any meds for your pain when it comes on? I can imagine the distress that this is causing you and your family. Certainly needs to be resolved.

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to Mrpaul1971

Hello

I live with a type of angina due to vasospasms in my coronary blood vessels despite the fact I have no blockages in my coronary arteries.

It is also possible to have microvascular dysfunction causing microvascular angina and or vasospastic angina following stent insertion even coronary bypass surgery.

It is a under recognised and often overlooked.

This article maybe worth discussing with your Cardiology team.

acc.org/latest-in-cardiolog...

Deano_H
Deano_H
in reply to Milkfairy

Significant constriction of epicardial coronary arteries post-PCI may be related to increased activation of rho-kinase pathways. What does this mean in English ☝️

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to Deano_H

Rho kinase is involved in the normal function of cells including the endothelium which lines all the blood vessels.

In Japan they treat vasomotion disorders with Fasudil a Rho kinase inhibitor

There is no export license or license for it's use in the UK....perhaps I'll go and live in Japan

Deano_H
Deano_H
in reply to Milkfairy

My point is, in the article it states ‘ new’ rhokinase pathways suggesting a positive effect. I have heard a cardiologist suggest that opening up a blocked artery should always be done. However, this is obviously a contentious point.

Could it be possible that the pain is a regenerating pain.

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to Deano_H

It maybe the stent itself causing problems.

I have been advised that I must avoid developing any blockages as a stent could make my vasospastic angina worse.

You might be interested in this research published last year in the US. It's a very hot topic of debate within the Cardiology world

To stent or not ?

acc.org/latest-in-cardiolog...

I’m so far past the edges of my understanding here Deano - but I believe that abnormal activation of the Rho Kinase pathway can be caused by a range of cardio vascular events. This seems to be saying that stenting can cause this abnormal activation too (ie not good). But I’m way off piste and could be wrong.

I know Steve, it’s a tricky one, I’m sure someone on the forum will come up with a suitable explanation to the importance of Rho Kinase pathways.

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to NorthantsSteve

It makes my brain hurt too!

The endothelium is a very complex organ and any disturbance such as a cardiac event can upset the equilibrium of the Rho kinase pathway required to ensure the normal function the cells lining the blood vessels.

We need our endothelium to function properly. All those life style measures we are told to do are about protecting the function of this important organ.

What I would really like to know is why my microvascular endothelium stopped working properly!

Over to Deano....

Here's some bed time reading

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

It would seem to me that unblocking an artery is the obvious cure to a fairly obvious problem. Personally I take a lot of these "ideas" from the US with a very large grain of salt, there are an awful lot of quacks over there in my opinion.

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to lateguitarist

The Ischemia study was a large scale research which seems to show that stents are not necessarily more effective than medication in treating angina.

The research was published in the Ametican Journal of Cardiology not known for its quackery

acc.org/latest-in-cardiolog...

It is not just about blockages it is how well the blood flows.

Well, I am just a layman like you, but if my sink wasn't emptying very well the first thing I would do is unblock the pipe?

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to lateguitarist

Well the research is saying otherwise.

Blood vessels are not rigid like the pipe from your sink.

Blood vessels are made up of smooth muscles like the muscle in the intestines, bladder, urethra, uterus, bile and pancreatic duct.

These are all tubes which have a wave like motion. When they have an obstruction they contract and constrict more to try and push the obstruction out eg kidney or gall stone, stools, a baby etc

You get pain.

There is so much more to consider than the plumbing in Cardiology😊

Well, all I can say is that 50 odd years ago my father had what would very likely be exactly the same problem that I did 15 months ago. He suffered increasingly from Angina until he had an MI about 4 years after the initial problem which finished him off. After having 2 stents fitted I have now just completed my 50th park-run and came 4th in my age category (61). Now I understand drugs are probably better these days but I can't help getting the impression that this particular report is a mirror image of the "if it ain't broken don't fix it" adage. Like I say, it just seems like common sense to me. Are you suggesting that the arteries are trying to "push" the stent out?

I still believe that there are far too many medics in the US who tend to try and buck the trend a bit too much, I think it's their nature to be honest.

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to lateguitarist

The Ischemia study is a reputable long term study.

Many big studies are multinational taking place in different parts of the world by an international teams of researchers

Are you saying you only accept research carried out by researchers from outside the US?

Common sense while helpful doesn't always make good medicine.

30 years ago babies were put to sleep on their tummies.

Now through research which lead to the advice that newborn babies should be placed on their backs to sleep the Sudddn Infant death rate has thankfully dramatically fallen.

Great to hear that you are doing so well and I hope you continue to enjoy your runs.

No I am not saying that I would ignore researchers from the US, I am saying that in my opinion they sometimes tend to produce ideas that seem to go against most other research, and frankly I don't have a great impression of a lot of their medics. Look at the way Statins are handed out like sweets in the US, along with proponents of diets such as Keto and Carnivore. I think the baby sleeping was researched here? Maybe I am just a bit biased, I think there is an awful lot of c**p comes out of the US generally to be honest!

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to lateguitarist

You might find this article about the history of SIDS interesting.

Lots of individual researchers from different parts of the world painstakingly put the jigsaw puzzle together over many years.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

We will have to agree to disagree. Great having the discussion though😊

I am off to my Tai Chi class

Well, enjoy the class. I am sure there is valuable research done there, it just seems to me that something that has transformed my life, and also that of many thousands of others, should be brought into question as a procedure. I guess it is not quite so cut and dry as a solution in some cases, but certainly not all.

Deano_H
Deano_H
in reply to Milkfairy

Don’t worry if you don’t know the answer it’s fine 👍🏻

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to Deano_H

Cheeky 😂😉

Hi Paul - you are bound to feel frustrated having ongoing pain. Most of us expected that following stents this sort of issue wouldn't happen however there are many possible reasons. Have you any remaining narrowing in arteries and is pain reliever with GTN spray. Could it be angina (see att link) heart.org/en/health-topics/...

Try keeping a diary of when pain happens, for how long etc to further discuss with Cardiologist

Your not alone my friend

Mrpaul1971
Mrpaul1971
in reply to Deano_H

Hi mate, did you have problems or anything similar,

Deano_H
Deano_H
in reply to Mrpaul1971

Yes mate, all sorts of probs after I’ve had a stent. I’ve had test after test but nothing to indicate a problem. The latest guess from a consultant is that my cardiovascular system does not like the stent and that is what’s causing me pain. My advice, push for the tests etc because you need to know it’s nothing more serious

Like you i had couple stents. After i had various chest pain from dull aches to sharp stabbing. Two years later all but gone. I think its anxiety to some extent. I went to a&e twice, but nothing found, and im still here.

By all means check with dr, but it could be many muscles, gastro or such, or we just notice things more.

Your about to reach a year on and thats when you're free of Antiplatelet Therapy. That's when you are likely to be clear of most problems with the stents, and if you aint dead then start living again!

We have all been there, Paul!

I agree totally. After such an event we will be like cats on hot tin roofs for ages afterwards, and maybe always. The other day I thought I could feel "something" in the exact area where I know the stents are, due to the very definite area of pain I had when they were fitted, but I also occasionally feel pretty much the same thing in other areas of my chest. It is very likely that it is gastro or muscular, specially if one is exercising regularly and the wrong side of 60.

Like you say sometimes you just have to crack on.

Yep that's it again. Now where did i put my whisky?

Hi mrpaul1971, I went to see my consultant yesterday I left deflated him say it’s vasospasams and not ha and just get on with it, also explained I’m still getting discomfort told to relax as I’m stressed, I’m back to work phasing now doing 24 hours worked 18 hours over 3 days the pain was horrendous I had to rest and all I wanted to do is sleep don’t know what to do I hope you get yourself sorted

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to SANH65

Hi SANH65

I live with Vasospastic angina and I am sorry that you have had such an unhelpful response from your Cardiologist.

Their response I am afraid demonstrates their lack of understanding of vasospastic angina. Vasospasms can be very painful and I have encountered many Cardiologists who don't realise this.....until I tell them it feels like being in labour 😳

If you are still having symptoms some modification of your medication may well help.

Saying you have to get on with it is not appropriate compassionate care.

Ask for a second opinion if necessary.

A referral to a Pain Management Programme from your GP.

The BHF has this information about Vasospastic angina

bhf.org.uk/informationsuppo...

SANH65
SANH65
in reply to Milkfairy

Thank you for your response I am going to ask for a second opinion as I don’t want to get myself in a state which as you know doesn’t help recovery, I’ve got cardio rehab next week and have a chat with them will keep you posted

Hi Paul. Sorry to hear - You are obviously feeling a bit down - given your current situation. I had 2 stents on 17th Nov 2019 - I arrested, and was blue lighted in - i've not had any chest pain - so I'm feeling good about that. I'm on a cardiac rehab programme - so I'm not sure what sort of after care you're getting - suggest you chase up "what happens next" ... I wish you all the best going forward my friend...

Hi, I also had a stent put in my LAD in may and have been learning to live a a variety of chest feelings, most is put down to the meds and I assume that if you have had the stents fitted they had reason to fit them and that you will then be on antiplatlet for a year at least and a Statin and even though they say they rule out anxiety, the fact you are worried means there are anxieties and they are very real pains, I have had them and it takes a long time to get use to what has happened. How much are they advising you that this is meds causing the discomfort? the stents themselves do not hurt as I thought the same as the heart has no specific nerves to let you feel them, brusiong is possible and that can take a long time to heal across your chest and I am learning that the way I sleep causes chest pains where I sleep on my side and the muscles can cramp up. I am assuming they have run over ECGs and echocardiogram and if you feel its still a worry request an MRI or CT to rule out other issues. I think so many on this forum can relate to getting use to having stents fitted and the physiological impact and some time, however the percentages are getting less, than the stents have an issue or reblock. Good luck, we know what it's like, let us know what meds you are on.

If the heart has no specific nerves what do people who suffer a heart attack feel? I certainly had very real discomfort, bordering on pain when the stent was fitted?

Sorry, badly written, the arteries where the stent is fitted have no nerve and as such that is not what we fell from the advise I was given from my cardiologist, you can feel the bruising of the mussel outside is my understanding but that does settle, I am hoping that this forum is giving you food for thought at least, I know its helped me a lot. the best is process of illumination with the meds and you GP can help you with that.

Hi Paul, I would strongly advise that you seek a second opinion, I (having had two stents last August) had chest pains, that turned out to be mild Angina, before I had the stents fitted.

Prior to that and years before I was getting what I can only describe as fribulations, it was a sort of muscle spasm for all intense and purposes, and was definitely a sensation and NOT a pain.

Since having the stents fitted I have experienced the same SENSATION on less than a handful of occasions, it has not bothered me in the slightest as it is over as quick as it started. If yours is definitely a pain I would keep badgering them till you get a proper diagnosis.

Hope its soon sorted, take care, keep smiling.

I had only 2 occurrences of chest pain before being diagnosed with Angina, having 4 stents inserted and being dosed with many tablets each day. After the angioplasty I had nearly 6 months when I had almost continuous shooting pains in chest, shoulder blades and back which was a real worry. However more tests confirmed the pain was not caused by heart problems so different drugs and dosages were tried. The pains finally disappeared when the dose of Bisoprolol was eventually reduced to 1.25 mg, it seems I'm more sensitive to the effects of that drug than most of the general population. For the last 5 years I've been pain free.

We're all different and and respond to the treatment differently so I'm not suggesting that would solve your pain, however it appeared to solve problems for me.

Hope you are soon feeling better.

ok guys having read most of the replys on here a few things i do may help I too get twinges I have been given gaviscon for acid as well which wasnt very pleasant, but from the word get go i have used something called a kardia machine, which they give out in hospitals to do an ecg at home via your phone you can purchase this online for approx 90 pounds, with it you can forward readings via email to your consultant.

Also testing blood pressure with a monitor twice a week or when feeling unwell can also help.

i have a theory with my stent i believe that it being a foreign body in my system that it takes time to settle in. I had my event march 2019

my father had his main aortic valve replace with a metal valve in 1983 it lasted until 2015 during that time he had 2 stents also fitted, i remember the day well he felt like he had won the lottery.

So while i respect all research clearly also donating to BHF Research for years I also understand how far we have come and probably lot more in the future.

All of the methods i use stated above help when explaining to medics and also taking control back myself and i am sure we have all felt out of control at sometime during this process.

hope this helps take care all and well done we are Survivors xx

I had 2 stents put in and still was getting angina and I did my own research and figured that I might have heart spasms and asked my cardiologist to prescribe calcium channel blockers instead of my beta blockers...I started my ccb on Jan 8th and haven't had a spasm since then.

I now only take a blood thinner and calcium channel blocker(diltiazem)

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to eagle88

Good to hear you have a Cardiologist who is willing to listen!

Research is very helpful .

Beta blockers can make vasospasms worse and yes Diltiaziem can really help.

I hope you remain vasospasm free😊

eagle88
eagle88
in reply to Milkfairy

Thank You Milkfairy! Yes Am glad my cardiologist listens but you know they are the specialists and they should know better, we the patients shouldn't have to be doing all the research...I guess nowadays we just need the doctors for prescriptions only...😃

Milkfairy
MilkfairyHeart Star
in reply to eagle88

I would hope it is partnership of equal respect 😊

More than just dishing the tablets

I have a very good Prof of Cardiology who is a specialist in my condition.

I had 3 stents 18 months ago had bad chest pain for about 8 months I put it down to the radiation with being on the table for so long .O.K. now get a little now and then but I think it's indigestion . go to the gym with no problem

Hi mrpaul

I had 4x stents done after a heart attack in 2017 I had pain and discomfort in my chest for over a year so they did another angioplasty in March 2019 and found I had a partly collapsed stent and another blocked artery. But since the procedure that was stressful I've been ill and unable to work and in constant pain and fatigue. They can't find anything wrong with the heart so it could be fibromyalgia... I also had my stents tested via a electric cable that made the symptoms worse.

I had stents I sometimes get cramp in armpits or if I'm hunched on sofa

But if straighten eases it could be stating

What are yours exactly

L5621
L5621
in reply to L5621

I meant could be statins

I feel as if you d need ambulance on standby when and how to differentiate

Between the good and bad

Hi

We all have different issues and the pain could be for a variety of reasons. I am male 59 and had a 33mm stent put in 4 months ago for 90% block in LAD. I have two other branch blockages 40 and 60% not qualifying for stent yet.

I had quite bad pain in left centre chest for the past 4 months and have been back for tests including echo stress. Cardiologist says stent is flowing fine and on last visit admitted that in 0.5% of people the body doesn’t like the foreign body and suspects I am one of these.

The pain has been decreasing over the last few weeks and importantly exercise doesn’t increase it and no other symptoms indicating heart problems.

You just need to put trust in your specialist and have them run tests to ensure no blockage or fault with your stent then try and relax.

Good luck with it all. 😔

Also read a book by Caldwell B Esselstyn called how to prevent and reverse heart disease. I am following his advice to the letter and hoping To reverse the other blockages in time.

Hi Paul, I had a stent installed 20 months ago at Bedford Hospital. After 6 months I went to cardio care. I must say I had no after effects at all apart from breathlessness which I still suffer from. Cardio care was so supportive and the exercise routine not too taxing. I think doing the exercises helped me recover. Have been offered Cardio? if your still suffering pain go back to the cardio unit.

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