Why has the Ivor Cummings post been r... - British Heart Fou...

British Heart Foundation

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Why has the Ivor Cummings post been removed. Are opinions different to bhf advice not allowed

fergusthegreat•

5 years ago•12 Replies

Why has the Ivor Cummings post been removed from the forum

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fergusthegreat

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MilkfairyHeart Star5 years ago

Because certain individuals on this forum are more interested in pushing their views in ways that underminds the ethos of the forum.

Every weekend the same individuals come and wreak havoc causing division and disharmony.

I have no objection to alternative views. I have myself challenged the 'orthodox' view.

I approached the BHF a few years ago to ask them to update the inaccurate information they had on the website about my condition....they did and I was the expert patient advisor to the updates. I provided them with robust research first.

If you consider the BHF should change their views I suggest you contact them yourself.

bhf.org.uk/how-you-can-help...

fergusthegreat5 years ago

Bit of an over reaction mate. I see no disharmony just an alternative view about the main cause of heart disease and the use of statins for people who have not been diagnosed with this disease.

By shutting this debate down it seems to me that the bhf do have something to hide and they know some of their information is incorrect.

Remember the advice about low fat and sugar... That's wrong and to some extent so is cholesterol

Lezzers5 years ago

Well said, completely agree

MilkfairyHeart Star5 years ago

Thank you for your reasoned eloquence.

ChicagoGirl19615 years ago

I keep my mind open to alternative points of view in all aspects of life. Regardless of the subject matter, be it heart disease, diabetes, or whatever the subject happens to be, I will consider the information sources available to me and reach my own conclusion. BHF is a wonderrful organization providing a wealth of information that has undoubtedly proven invaluable to many improving the health and wellbeing of countless individuals, however in my humble opinion, I personally have no greater advocate for my good health and well being than myself and will therefore remain open minded to alternative points of view that differ from that of my own.

fergusthegreat5 years ago

Sorry I thought this forum was a place for open debate.

Whilst it's great to offer support and reassurances that everything will be OK it is often not the case and I for one find this unhelpful.

I would rather hear from people who have had success with fighting their disease and how they did it in the hope that it would help me as its obvious by the increasing heart disease rates and repeat revasculation procedures that the current guidelines don't work for everyone.

Jils5 years ago

Can someone enlighten me please on the post that has been removed? Thanks xx

benjijen in reply to Jils5 years ago

If you google Ivor Cummins you can watch his video and hear his views

Bagrat5 years ago

My feeling is that on a forum peopled by the vulnerable and on the clutching at straws brigade the first rule is "first do no harm"

My views diverge from the BHF sometimes but they are just views so I tend not to air those here. Leaving no stone unturned is a patb so close to clutching at straws it requires expert guidance.

fergusthegreat5 years ago

Mate I'm not sure you can read. Where have I tried to force my opinion on others or does simply discussing other options count as forcing my opinion on them.

I am not a statin denier, christ sake I take them because I have heart disease and fully support there use in this patient population.

As for Ivor Cummings he seems purely to be suggesting that maybe insulin resistance caused by poor diet is a bigger risk factor for heart disease than cholesterol.

I have always had perfect cholesterol but a poor diet and developed heart disease so in my case maybe he has a point.

Surely I am not alone and trying to modify your diet to prevent the constant inflammation in your arteries is a good thing and something that will benefit a lot of people.

Why you want to stop this debate is beyond me

5 years ago

Perhaps we are all guilty of not understanding the customer base within this site, with members from all over the World. In the first instance, that can mean a huge disparity understanding and interpreting the English Language. As a former smoker, I used to say I really needed a fag - so to our US friends, that could be a problem, however innocent. Even our kitchen product Jif had to be changed to Cif as it upset a country with a different interpretation of Jif. There may well be those in the UK that do not believe Cif was a good choice!

Totally agree with the posts that this is a place of neutrality, a place where people can share, begin to understand their own frailties and hear of success stories that can be of such good content that they inspire and lift ones expectations of health and well being. On the other side of the coin, I cannot see how this place is the place to ask for advice of what would appear to be complicated medical matters that should be addressed through a medical team, be it hospital, BHF or the family doctor. Just because someone has been there, done that, does it give them the right to advise on critical medical matters. However, I do find it rather strange when folks belittle the very people that has made them well and decide not to take their medication, for whatever reason although I assume they did want the operation that fixed the problem? Just as religious group cannot give or accept blood - thats fine but don't comment on those that have no problem with it and we will not lament your passing prematurely due to your choices.

I do have a problem with Ivor Cummings, not so much his ideas, but that his ideas are marketed by himself, promoting his ideas for profit. My first observation would be whether the regime is recommended by the UK NHS or BHF and would guess that it is not. It appears to be targeted at the US market where acceptance of this type of selling "appears " to be different to ours here. Finally, the moral issue is, this is not a place to "promote" a product with vulnerable people who, for whatever reason may feel motivated to spend money they could well do with themselves. That is a big reason to have the post removed.

I have the same aversion to diets that require purchasing fresh food from them or enrolling into a regime of support - there are many free, NHS backed support for diets than need no money to be invested. The "Atkins" diet was a fad worked for some and not others and just like us all, we are all different and respond differently. Advice is great, dictatorial advice can be harmful.

First and foremost we are a support base for vulnerable people. A place where people understand how they feel and who can give coping skills in an encouraging manner Just because someone has got through an event, does not give them "A Hat" it does show they should have a high level of understanding and therefore in the first instance it is not a place for medical personnel or so called experts, just people with empathy and understanding!

Finally and with the greatest respects - you do not need Google to search the internet - any search engine will do. Google records where and who you are and will begin the bombardment of junk and potentially harmful emails. They are a multi billion enterprise that sells your data to anyone and since it is a US company does not have the rules we have on "Perceived Privacy" A PERSONAL REMARK based upon information readily available it is also why no one can uninstall Google from a mobile phone!

Helen_BHF5 years ago

Hi all, the original post was removed because it became impossible to manage - the flags of abuse went beyond a reasonable amount. Replies have also been stopped for this post in order to stop things escalating once again.

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