During my early years living in England when I was around 7 to 9 years old I suffered numerous very severe bouts of asthma. Although the occurances of actual asthma rarely lasted for more than an hour or two, when I was often convinced that I was going to die from suffocation, it would take about a week for me to recover enough to feel fit enough to continue my schooling.I was a weak little boy who could not enjoy sports or anything that required a good set of lungs and I fell far behind on my learning.
In those days there were no treatments pharmaceutical treatments available, or least none that my parents were aware of.I did enhale steam from a pot of hot water though....gasping and spluttering beneath a hot wet towel that often felt more suffocating than the asthma.
Anyway, my poor mother finally found the perfect solution at our local hospital.Mrs.Hughs....avery beautiful middle agedd angel with her white hair swept back in a bun.She was a physiotherapist who gazed deeply into my tender and desperate eyes and told me sweetly that she was going to teach me how to breath correctly and control my asthma attacks.My eyes must have nearly popped out at that point....
I was treated for an hour two or three times a week for about three months and suddenly I needed no control over my asthma because it was gone completely.The treatment was over....no need to come back.From that point on I started a new life of aggressive exercise and activity and it continues until this day....
In fact I did not have any respitory problems at all for over twenty five years right up until I started to wheeze a little in Houston Texas on an extremely high polluion day.I left shortly afterwards and moved to the Rocky mountains of Colorado where I am still doing heavy duty backpacking and mountain climbing at the age of 57...in clean fresh mountain air...which obviously helps when I breath deeply on a particularly steep climb.
To me this physiotherapy treatment was a wonderful cure...simple, effective with no drugs and the emphasis on personal control.I will always be grateful to my mother and Mrs.Hughs for giving me a new life.
But...How come I never seem to read anything about this treatment on any Asthma web site either on a UK site or a USA site.....? Such a treatment should be well covered but it is rarely even mentioned and it makes me really mad.Your children deserve better,this treatment could work very well for them too....maybe not all, but certainly a substantial portion.
The nasty secret I suspect is that the huge pharmaceutical companies don't make any money from simple treatments like that and unfortunately even well intentioned researchers would be left with nothing to do if all patients turned away from drugs and found their own specialist physiotherapists....Health matters are big business after all.
So...I wonder how long this post is going to last...? Watch it to see how quickly the experts either repudiate it or belittle it or just make it disappear.Whatever ""they"" if ""they"" say anything about it,you can bet they'll tell you that the sufferers of this crippling disease MUST continue taking their drugs whatever other treatments they seek...A lifetime of drugs ? Not for me or Mrs. Hughs.
Interesting post-what was your initial treatment that the physio set you off with?
Another way of advertising Butekyo?
i would dispute physio as a cure more a way of helping with breathing tecqniques to help asthmatics cope with mild attacks?
Limey wrote:
""So...I wonder how long this post is going to last...? Watch it to see how quickly the experts either repudiate it or belittle it or just make it disappear.Whatever ""they"" if ""they"" say anything about it,you can bet they'll tell you that the sufferers of this crippling disease MUST continue taking their drugs whatever other treatments they seek...A lifetime of drugs ? Not for me or Mrs. Hughs.""
Methinks the Gentlemen doth protest too much...! Why did you add that coda to your post, Limey? Was it a challenge? Perhaps it's just to cover yourself for when the inevitable backlash starts, so that you can say ""I told you so""! Whatever the reason, that last paragraph has devalued your entire post. You KNOW that it's going to be refuted. So why bother in the first place?!
As we've said in relation to Buteyko, breathing techniques CAN help sufferers of mild(er) asthma, but for those members here who are on sub-cut infusions (I will at this point cite the details of a very good friend of mine, who at the last count was on sub-cut Bricanyl, 27 tablets daily and two nebs per evening as part of her treatment plan), does it seem even remotely likely that what you post is going to ""cure"" them?
And I'll take issue with the word ""cure"", if I may. Once you are symptom-free, can you stop using the techniques you have been taught? No? Then it's not a cure, it's a treatment. Unfortunately there is no cure for asthma.
Finally, I will say this: Do you think all the asthma sufferers on this board LIKE taking their meds? Do you think they're not interested in being both drug- and symptom-free? Yet do you think they're stupid people who will just blindly take whatever their doctor prescribes without checking all the options or questioning their treatment?
If you feel that the answer to any of the above questions is ""yes"", then the tone of your post can be explained. But that doesn't make it any more palatable, and shows a lack of judgement on your part.
Steve
(Moderator's hat on nearby table)
I do not think physio is a cure for asthma.However being taught breathing techniques by a physio can improve breathing. My step mum is a physio and always goes on at me to make sure i am breathing correctly - if there is such a way but she also insists that it will not cure the asthma but may make it more bearable. From my point of view having intensive physio whilst in hospital and out of hospital has taught me to pace myself alot better when walking and talking as i often ran out of steam and ended very wheezy.
Having physio has also helped with issues such as chest infection and using methods goven by the phsyio and using a flutter valve as directed by a physio have been very benficial.
What i am trying to say is that from my point of view a physio will not cure asthma but can help with bretahing techniques etc.
Olive
Hmmm, think we've been here before, calm controlled breathing induces a feeling of calmness and well being and is a useful coping technique for dealing with panic attacks and staying calm in an asthma attack BUT it is most definately NOT a cure for asthma. Calm controlled breathing will not widen airways narrowed by thick white sputum produced by a reaction to an allergy.
if you had to live with brittle asthma you would not intimate that physiotherapy was a cure. The hard fact is that for now and probably not in my lifetime there is no cure for asthma. I use calm controlled breathing as a relaxtion tool BUT and its a HUGE BUT it most certainly does not clear my tubes and stop me wheezing, my nebulised meds and oxygen do that. It took me quite some time to accept this and some scary admissions.
If you were a brittle asthmatic you would not mention cure and Physiotherapy in the same sentance. Asthma is a condition that can deterioate very quickly and needs medical intervention and drugs not breathing exercises unless you wish to put your life at risk. Lois
Am I the only one who reads posts about asthma cures by physiotherapy or butekyo and thinks Ok I will just bin the meds and breathe properly saving the NHS a fortune and whilst I am at it I let the RBH know. They have been looking for cure for years!
Limey, I spend half my life looking for cure and trying to work out if the optimum numbers of pills taken at the optimum time would make a difference. The other half trying to live a normal life and be proper mum to my 4 kids do you know how distressing posts like yours are? Don't you think we drive ourselves half insane wondering if there was anything we could do to have prevented the last attack. Don't you think we wonder if maybe had I done something tiny different my kids would not have had to watch the paramedics working on their mum.
Sorry for being so blunt but do you have any idea what it is like living with uncontrolled asthma?
Bex
Hi there
I don't ususally get involved in posts like this but I am particularly unhappy about the content in this one, especially the part where you state ""Your children deserve better""
As a mum who had no experience in dealing with asthma I was and still am to a certain extent desperate to find some miracle that is going to take the burden of my daughters asthma away from her.
There is nothing in the whole world worse than watching your child suffer while you feel helpless and inadequate as a parent. However like many others I have had to accept that there is no miracle cure. It's not nice and it's certainly difficult to accept but it's true. These boards have offered fantastic moral support at time and offer some great advice and I don't feel they should be used in the way that you have used them to provoke arguements. I agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion and also believe that sharing experiences of treatments can be beneficial to others but maybe it should be kept factual and realistical to avoid raising peoples hopes.There was a point last year when I would've sold my soul for a miracle cure but I think we've all got to realise that there is actually none and I think advertising physiotherapy as one is cruel in the sense that you are offering false hope to people who are desperate for one.
My daughter currently recieves physio for her asthma and I cannot praise it enough but only because it allows her to feel she has a small element of control during a mild exacerbation. A full blown asthma attack needs medical treatment and drugs. Without these drugs that you seem so against, my daughter wouldn't be here. That is factual and realistic.
Anne
this is clearly here just to stir trouble, as the original poster has not been back.
I agree that we need our medications and that to stop them would be dangerous. Lets let this thread fall away and not let it get to us. If we could wave a magic wand or do anything to fix ourselves we would, and so long as each of us knows that, who worries what others might think.
Sarah
Interestingly Limey was showing as online this afternoon but chose not to respond to the replies....... speaks volumes to me...enough said!
Sorry, Limey, our c**p filters are getting pretty good by now... you're going to have to do better than that.
Em H
Hello,
I had to post here, i would have done earlier but have just got home so have only just read it. These posts are starting to do my nut. Not the whole physio is a cure part of it but the whole, butyko can only help people with mild asthma, and physio can only help people with mild asthma. Does someone want to tell my lungs and my consultant that i only have mild asthma, cause seriouly we would love that. Just cause i am not on subcut, for reasons that i dont feel i have to go into and just cause butyko has helped to controll my breathing and i use physio to some extent daily does not mean i don't have severe asthma. Physio can be looked on in many ways. Kicking a football round, the park, walking to the toilet, breathing properly, saline nebs then coughing, Stretches. In fact the majority of asthmatics severe or otherwise will have physio if in hospital for asthma. I just had it for the last 2 weeks, and would be veyr weak without it. Butyko has helped controll my breathing, has no way cured it but helps me. I am just a bit fustrated and get to the point where i didn't want to try it and wouldn't talk about it in case people
judged me and if i had let the rule what i did then i would never have done it and wouldn'tbe getting the benifits. I am nopt saying it will benifit everyone, just don't knock it till you try it and if your not going to try it don't knock it.
This post is not meant to upset anyone, its just that i am so fustrated i couldn't keep quiet.
Hi Nutbug,
Sorry if you have been frustrated or upset by people's responses to this post.
I, for one, am certainly not knocking physio for a minute, for anyone with asthma. I think it is an essential (and probably underused) part of any asthma treatment. When I have been in ICU and ventilated, I have of course had daily physio both to try to clear my chest and to keep my joints moving - it would be no exaggeration to say that the physios have probably saved my life by doing this on several occasions. When I came out of ICU after my prolonged admission back in Feb - March, I had critical care myopathy and neuropathy to the point where I was entirely unable to move. My respiratory function was compromised to the point where I was too breathless to talk or eat. If it hadn't been for a lot of hard work from the physios, I would probably still be unable to walk at all. Most of my stay - at least 2 months out of the 3 1/2 months - was not because I needed medical care, once I was over the worst, but because I needed daily intensive physio. If I hadn't got it, I would probably still be in hospital, or in some care home somewhere. I have made a good recovery from being extremely unwell earlier this year, and that is largely down to the brilliant physios at Queens.
I have also used physio over the years to try to control my breathing, and to achieve a better pattern of breathing during acute attacks, expectorate sputum, etc. I have found this to be of some use. I do think it's important to do it under strict medical supervision; some forms of physio, including Buteyko, would be inappropriate for some people. I have certainly been warned that doing any form of physio, like Buteyko, that aims to raise CO2 levels could be dangerous for me, as my CO2 levels tend to be high during attacks anyway.
I think what people were objecting to in Limey's post, was the dogmatic statement that physiotherapy is a 'cure' for asthma, and that we are all suffering and taking drugs needlessly. Personally, I find this assertion very insulting - does anyone honestly think that we enjoy taking dozens of different medications, being in hospital several times a year, and often being unable to work? Does Limey not think that if there were even a 0.1% chance of getting our lives back we would not be jumping at it? I particularly dislike the way that Limey had said that 'your children deserve better' - I think that this is a very emotionally manipulative statement and I can imagine that it could very much upset someone who has children who suffer from severe asthma, as indeed it seems to have done.
I distrust Limey's motives, and have to wonder if he has a financial interest, particularly as he has given no detail what-so-ever about the nature of this miraculous physiotherapy regimen - presumably we are all supposed to post or PM requesting more details, at which point he will reveal that details can be found at.... etc etc. We have, after all, seen it too often here in the past.
I don't dispute at all that physio can be a very important - indeed vital - part of anyone's asthma regimen, and can be life-changing. I do dispute that it is a 'cure', and I do dispute Limey's motives in making this post.
Hope this makes at least my views a little clearer!
Em H
Em - What i was saying is i don't believe that physio is a cure for asthma but it definatly can aid recovery as you have put as well. I also have said the butyko is not for everyone, and if you have been advised against it then your right not to try it. I would never come on here and say, wow, everyone should do it its amazing. I have always said it has helped me, but isn't for everyone. I actually didn't realise its aim was to raise c02 levels, and it actually decreased mine, so maybe for different people it would work in different ways, i don't know. I'm no expert, in fact i just do as I'm told by my physio and trust her. I was fustrated more at when people have said in this thread and others in the past that butyko and physio only helps people with mild asthma, cause this isn't true. I wish more then anything in the world that i had mild asthma and that physio was a cure but no. Sorry if my post upset you i honestly didn't mean it to upset anyone, i just wanted people to know how things can affect people, as it did me.
Sorry, nutty
Don't worry, Nutty, you certainly didn't upset me - I was just concerned that I came across wrong in my blunt response to Limey!
As I say, I certainly am not against physio - in fact, I think it is vital for severe asthma and can be useful in all degrees of asthma - but I strongly object to it being referred to as a 'cure' for asthma. I only wish it were, but to say that it is could give false hope, which is really rather cruel.
Anyway, hope I didn't upset any of the regular board users
Em H
I just thought I would raise my head above the parapet again cos I thought it should be recorded that I have had 2 very nice PM's from Limey apologising for any upset etc.
Bex
Hi - I don't normally regularly post, but felt I ought to on this thread! As a musculoskeletal and respiratory outpatient physiotherapist, I obviously see a fair few asthmatics, however I would never say I could ""cure"" , asthma symptoms. Manage, assist and rehabilitate following an exacerbation, yes, but NOT cure. Physiotherapy does have a role in asthma management and rehabilitation both in the acute setting and the community. As previously mentioned in an earlier post, the service is underused as I believe there is sometimes a lack of understanding of what physiotherapy can offer. However I reiterate, we are never trained or believe we can cure asthma, just hopefully improve someones quality of life.
I'll address a few points that have been raised on this thread since I posted.
Em H - quite right regarding the use of the word ""cure"". Indeed, that and the whole preachy, ""I know better than the rest of you"" tone of the post was what I was really refuting.
Nutty - you are the perfect example of how board members (as a moderator, no less!) are not all closed-minded drug-taking sheep! I've used you as an example of a severe asthmatic who has been helped by non-drug treatments in the past; hope you don't mind! Likewise, you are also proof that, whilst physio/Buteyko can help, they don't suddenly render you drug-free.
Bex - I too had a couple of PMs. I though the first one was being sarcastic, but the second one proved I was wrong; it was a very nice apology for any upset that had been caused. I did ask Limey to post part of it in thread here to help diffuse the situation, but for whatever reason he has not done so.
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