Ectopic Beats Don't, In Themselves Constitute Afib. Correct?

[willec49]

I am 5 weeks out from my first Cyroablation which apparently went well. Also, the migraines I reported here did, as others predicted, end after about two weeks, thank God. Since the ablation, I have some eptopics that I didn't have before ablation on the same dose of Flecainide I'm on now. I know Bob D told us to stay away from our Kardias for two months which I had faithfully obeyed. But today, I broke my "fast" and, in the period of 5 minutes, two Kardia readings said, "Possible Afib" and the other two, "Sinus Rhythm." I just found this rapid fluctuation of readings interesting. I know I am only one-third of the way into the 3-month Blanking Period. Any experience or observations on this phenomenon? Thank you.

[BobD Volunteer]

I always quote what Sabine Ernst, one of the top experimental EPs in London once said to me. "Ectopics beats are a good sign. They show the heart is unable to go into AF."

No they are not and never can be AF and look totally different on an ECG.

Just do the slow deep breathing trick. Do it every day anyway and keep practising till you can do it almost subconsciously. The slower the better. I'm not suggesting you try to be a free diver and hold your breath for 20 minutes but we all breath far too quickly most of the time.

[willec49 in reply to BobD]

Thanks, Bob. That perspective on ectopics is very comforting and reassuring. I know the breathing thing is very helpful. I've been doing the 4-7-8 breathing exercise for quite a while and know how effective it can be. All the best.

[KMRobbo]

I "developed " ectopic beats after Ablation but it was about 3 months after. I really noticed as I had arttcks lasting hours to days. I put the quotes round "developed" as everyone has ectopics, but less heart sensitive people dont notice them. The frequency is what makes them more obvious and more irritating. Once I had had them for a while and nothing bad happened I worried less and tried to ignore them. I found that a missed (extra) beat less than every 20 good beats were easy to ignore, those more frequent more difficult. At my 12 months post ablation review I mentioned them to my EP who was similarly not concerned so I really decided to ignore them then.Ectopics are like palpitations. Worrying makes them worse. So dont worry and focus on something else. They have NEVER stopped me doing anything ( except maybe sleeping when i was initially worried about them) Most of the time ignoring them works. I still get ectopics 4 years post ablation. I had a few hours I noticed on Tuesday this week but they did not last all day.

Also note, I get them when I get a bug ( as I write this I realise i have a bit of a cold/ flem which may have explained Tuesdays attack now I think about it! ) . So your attack could also be owing to something else other than your ablation??

Best wishes for your complete recovery!

[willec49 in reply to KMRobbo]

Thank you for sharing your experience with ectopics which, I have found, can refer to quite a range of coronary phenomena around heartbeats, rhythm, etc., such as missed beats, extra beats, etc. I wasn't aware of any ectopics before ablation. I was either in afib or not And, as I wrote here, I'm still early in my post-ablation experience. I'm glad to hear you have learned to ignore them and are living a healthy life.

[KMRobbo in reply to willec49]

I didn't have or notice ectopics prior to ablation. The " missed" beats are actually extra beats , just as the extra beat ( not generated from the sinus node) empties the the ventricle so the next sinus beat has nothing much to pump, so you do don't get much of a pressure wave and cant feel it. I understand this empty beat is what also causes the fluttery feeling.

[willec49]

When I was a child, I was told I had a “heart murmur” which I took to mean a missed beat. The doctor told me, “You’ll have it for your entire life. Later in life, during physical exams, doctors said they don’t detect it. Also, as you say here, I never felt anything so didn’t worry about it. Some say you can “grow out of” them.

[mjames1]

Hi,

Yes, ectopic beats and afib are different. But the only way you will know which you had is to analyze the ecg, or if not comfortable doing it yourself, then email it to your doctor or to one of Kardia's doctors for analysis. Unclear from your post how you came to the conclusion you have ectopics when the Kardia said "possible afib". Not that the Kardia is always right but it is most of the time.

Jim

[willec49 in reply to mjames1]

Thank you for your reply. I thought it was interesting that just having some ectopics wasn't analyzed by the Kardia as afib. The mere existence of ectopics didn't, in itself, constitute a diagnosis of afib. I took 4 Kardia measurements within 5 minutes. Two of them read "Possible Atrial Fibrillation" and two read "Sinus." Having ectopics does not mean someone is in afib. In fact, Bob D. here mentioned a famous EP who claims that ectopics keep you out of afib. It's all an educational experience for me.

[willec49]

Exactly. That was my question also. Apparently the mere existence of ectopics does not, in itself, constitute a diagnosis of afib whether one is using a Kardia or not. I have the 6-lead model and it diagnosed, in a small 5-minute period, two readings as "Possible afib" and two readings as "Sinus."

[mjames1]

Yes, ectopics and afib are two entirely different things. You can have multiple ectopics and not be in afib.

The only point I was making was that if your intent is to know whether it's afib or ectopics,

email the four ecgs to your doctor, or Kardia's doctors, or post them here for comments with the understanding that we are not doctors.

I think Bob said something different, but I"m sure he will correct me if I'm wrong.

Ectopics do not keep you out of afib. In fact, in my case and with many others, ectopics can trigger afib.

Perhaps the "good sign" meant that ectopics are a good sign because it means you're not in afib. And indeed, most of the time, ectopics are benign but again in some cases they can trigger afib as well as other arrythmia's

Jim

[willec49]

Those are great points. I will follow up on your recommendations. Thank you.