Coronavirus.....how dangerous for Af'ers? - AF Association

AF Association
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Coronavirus.....how dangerous for Af'ers?

Wightbaby
Wightbaby

I don't usually worry about flu's etc., but due to all the media hype, I am beginning to wonder about the danger of C-virus to folks like us? Obviously information still seems rather sketchy....even the ages of fatalities do not seem to be mentioned......so it is unclear if it is the elderly with heart issues that are more at risk.....

This is just a muse....what are others thinking about the risk?

181 Replies
oldestnewest

Gawd knows!! I’m supposed to be flying to Faro end of March, just checking to see if my bus pass will work instead.....😉😳😂

Janith
Janith
in reply to FlapJack

Don’t go! I’m not going to Europe this year as we do each year ... my husband may not go as well.

Wightbaby
Wightbaby
in reply to FlapJack

Thanks for the chuckle!

BobD
BobDVolunteer

When you die, you die. Do everything to avoid obviously but flu kills 000s every year and look how many people avoid the flu jab.

I think it is a real concern. It is impossible to say how far reaching it will become before it naturally dies out. I am thankful we live in a rural, sparsely populated area not near large international airports. But, in this life, we can also get struck down by just tripping and hitting the ground wrong. I think as always, it’s best to try and stay healthy and not lie awake at night stressing over what we have no control over. I am not going to live life behind a mask but also not seeking out large crowds in enclosed areas to share germs with.

Samazeuilh
Samazeuilh
in reply to Hoski

If you live in a sparsely populated rural area then, yes, you will be safer. During the Plague during the Middle Ages, people who were able to do so stayed in the countryside to avoid infection.

Errr try my place in Central London. ! Full of international students from China and school kids from Italy last week. Not a mask to be seen except mine . I am staying inside a lot of the time . Well my Sticky blood syndrome is an autoimmune condition . I have sinus allergies . Last year I got deep lung infection due sinus drip . 2 types anti bots a steamer turmeric , Vit C mega 2 weeks to cough up phlegm . The A & E Dr told me to take a boots allergy tablet with Loratadine spec. To dry it up . In future . Unknowingly it drips at night. I have been on that since this began. It gets worse in Spring due hayfever -seeds pollens. Am on Xarelto blood thinner , 20 mg after a clot 2 years ago . I am taking natural supplements my Planet Organic consultant has told me are the best immune boosters . (Have done huge research in this and liposomal Vic C absorbed through mouth not stomach ). Raw garlic every day , ginger etc . I feel good now but cooped up. I got an infrared heat lamp 10 mins per day on chest as it increases oxygen in blood . It has cost me a lot ££. I had 1 hours normal house repair difficulty , life stress the other day and got the cold sweats , throat dries up voice cracks and then sleepy closed down feeling . The lamp warmed me up. However stress is my immediate immune trigger as usual. If I thought I had this virus I would be stressed as hell. I am planning to go in a 2 month hol to a farm in Aust . If I make the long haul flight unscathed . It’s meant to be . This already feels like my own lockdown to me . My lungs are my Achilles heal. Since a child . I would not feel this way if I lived in a rural or any less than central huge metrop City I must add. Even suburban would feel less threatening. ( which I previously loved now not ) My huge modern local hospital , when I had clot, had a corridor waiting queue of 2/3 hours , paramedics were very stressed .. Flu time ; lot of older, elderly and a M S patient.

Not encouraging if an epidemic . Won’t use the P word . The lack of masks bothers me. No , I don’t think anyone else ; non central city dwellers should worry this much . Would I fly to Eu or Asia no . (Although my flight change is in Singapore , where everyone wears masks and their the pet lap dogs. )

You are probably in one of the safest places!I feel like joining you!Oxford is bursting at the seams with Italians at the moment.

Hoski
Hoski
in reply to 10gingercats

Im in the middle of the US, in my older age Im loving on line grocery shopping, originally I started as I hate shopping. Now I think it is to my bennefit healthwise to shop from my recliner, lol.

Finvola
Finvola
in reply to Hoski

Same here Hoski!

Janith
Janith
in reply to Hoski

Have your necessities delivered.

ramkat
ramkat
in reply to Janith

Careful you guys, very possible that the virus could be delivered with your goodies. Take care.

Wightbaby
Wightbaby
in reply to ramkat

This is a good point!

Janith
Janith
in reply to ramkat

I wear gloves before l open anything delivered here including mail and spray things with my homemade antiseptic spray before touching ... l wear gloves to the gym and spray everything. Wash hands excessively throughout the day ... we have ordered masks but l won’t wear them unless things deteriorate. Not going to Europe this year.

The risk from Italians is not significantly greater than from any other nationality. There are a few hundred cases in Northern Italy (which are in any case locked

down by the police). So, the probability of catching coronavirus from an Italian is little different from catching it from, say, a Canadian, given the base rate in both cases is currently so low.

MAC909
MAC909
in reply to Samazeuilh

Its not about the nationality is about hotspots and people leaving that area Pre quarantine and heading around the world. The key difference between China and Italy is that it’s both easier for their nationals to leave and visitors go there.

Samazeuilh
Samazeuilh
in reply to MAC909

“Its not about the nationality is about hotspots and people leaving that area Pre quarantine and heading around the world. The key difference between China and Italy is that it’s both easier for their nationals to leave and visitors go there.”

I agree that it’s not about nationality- that’s why I said ‘The risk from Italians is not significantly greater than from any other nationality’. Your ‘hotspots’ claim is debatable. The European

Centre for Disease Prevention and Control notes that ‘...there is an increasing number of cases without a defined chain of transmission.’ It just isn’t possible to confidently assert that a new case must have a link with a hotspot. Once the virus is ensconced in a ‘new’ host country, e.g. the US, its subsequent growth will no longer be influenced very much by originary hotspots. In other words, if there are some cases of coronavirus being brought to the US from hotspots in China or Italy, these will very quickly be swamped by cases which are generated in the US itself. So the issue of avoiding people from particular hotspots doesn’t really arise- even if they are ‘escapees’ from hotspot; once the virus gets going most growth in the US will grow from US nationals.

Mrhermyl
Mrhermyl
in reply to Samazeuilh

Exactly ! How about S. Koreans, Chinese, Iranians are the main carriers here in my area of Canada.

From what medical specialists are stating: it is a flu variant. It might be good to get another flu shot, sleep well, and exercise daily. Don't buy N95 masks because there's a shortage. A surgical mask is fine. Wash hands often, use a hand sanitizer, start thinking about washing hands often, and do not put hands to mouth, lips, or nose. Stand back from anyone by a foot just in case. If you can work from home, start doing it.

Hoski
Hoski
in reply to Dawsonmackay

Here in the US, they are saying surgical masks are useless but advise wearing one if you are sick and go out.

Dawsonmackay
Dawsonmackay
in reply to Hoski

Yes, of course.

Samazeuilh
Samazeuilh
in reply to Hoski

I think that this is possibly because of a shortage of N95 masks and that the advice is flat out wrong. Why? Well, the experts say that masks confer little protection *from* the coronavirus but might render someone *with the virus* less contagious to others. But if this is the case then surely if everyone wore a mask in public the transmission rate would be greatly slowed down, i.e. people with the virus would be less likely to transmit it to others.

Most importantly do not touch your eyes! The eyes have so many blood vessels, and it’s the easiest access area for a virus being moist too!

It’s worth getting a flu shot (and a pneumonia shot) as infection with the coronavirus might make getting these illnesses *as well* more likely. However, WHO has said that they don’t per se confer any protection against coronavirus. I have to admit, I have ordered a few N95s. This is in just case I have to make a journey or attend a gathering when the coronavirus is at a high level.

Pneumonia vaccination is for bacterial pneumonia I think not viral. At the risk of sounding like a stuck record I think one of the best ways after hand hygiene and elementary social distancing is to have a very high level of vit D. I read on vitamindwiki ( a site devoted to vit d research ) that corona viruses enter cells by attatching to certain proteins on cell walls. One of these is diminished by vit D. There are umpteen studies that show a good level of vit D reduces the chance of getting respiratory viruses in general like colds and flu and mitigating the severity if one does get them. One of the stats coming out of China is that this virus is more lethal in men. Partly this is due to women having better immune systems ( dark side 80%of autoimmune disease is in women) but also there is a very large discrepancy in smoking rates between men and women. One also cannot discount the awful levels of air pollution in China and the weakening effect that has on lung and heart health.

Hoski
Hoski
in reply to Auriculaire

Good points

Interesting points. I mean that if one contacts coronavirus it is *perhaps* more likely that one is susceptible to bacterial pneumonia.

Yes - bacterial pneumonia and other chest infections can always take hold after viral respiratory infections.

I suggest 3,000 - 6,000 mg of vitamin C daily in divided doses.

Do read this as well..........http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n14.shtml

And high dose Vitamin C has been known to take care of pneumonia. Our integrative physician advised us to stockpile Liposomal Vitamin C and to take 3000 mg daily along with Sambucol to prevent all viruses. She advised that if we get it to up the dose of C to 1000 mg per hour and if hospitalized to demand IV Vitamin C.

Sadly, You Tube, Facebook and Google have taken down the studies.

The Netherlands shipped 50 tons of Vitamin C into China where a doctor is conducting trials of IV Vitamin C against Covid-19. You won't see it on the news media in the US, since it is bought and paid for by big pharma and they are trying to sell antiviral drugs and getting funding for a vaccine that will make them billions.

I wondered if out Flu jab gave any protection from this but it seems not to have been mentioned.

I don't know if you are located in the US or UK or elsewhere but here in the US, Dr. Oz said that getting another flu shot is better than not getting one. I tend to agree.

I'm in the UK and 20 odd miles away from the cases in Brighton. Some of our local schools have closed as pupils had been skiing in northern Italy. We also have several boarding schools that cater for Chinese and middle eastern pupils.

A Sars story. We were on holiday in Wales that year and on the Easter Sunday we were on a train from Cardiff to Merthyr Tydfil. The only other passengers were three Chinese ladies who we started to speak to. The ticket collector came round and joined in the conversation. They said that they had arrived at Heathrow yesterday and came straight on to Cardiff. Unfortunately they had to leave their other travelling companion in the hotel as she had developed flu like symptoms and was quite unwell.

On hearing this the ticket collector could not get away fast enough. A few days later I developed a bit of chest infection while I did initially think Sars I put it down to the dismal Welsh weather where it was only in the mid 50Fs and depressingly damp. We felt it all the more as we had travelled to Wales from Cheltenham where it had surprisingly for that time of year been 82F

Let's hope that you do not meet others suffering from Covid-19.

Very unlikely I should think as I don't get around much anymore.

Coco51
Coco51
in reply to seasider18

Apparently it does not as it's a different type of virus

Hi

It's actually a variant of the common cold virus and therefore a repeat flu vaccine would be of no additional benefit. Surgical masks are useless and I think your sound advice about handwashing etc offers the best protection although even that depends on everyone complying

Stay well

Kindest regards

That rational is still being debated since we are dealing with an evolving viral vector. As they say, stay tuned.

Interesting. I will indeed stay tuned

As I say I hope you are keeping well?

As you know and I say this with all seriousness, staying well is completely dependent on the news source! Here in the US, there's been a fight going on for the past three years, gov't vs. news... It's a plague unto itself. The one side wants to control the news (sounds like China and Iran) and the other side wants to proliferate studies, invoke preparedness etc. I guess who wins is who remains standing.

A variant of the common cold virus that like Sars comes from bats ?

Stand back at least 3 feet. The larger "droplets " drop to the floor at about 3 feet. 1 foot is insufficient .

Here's the deal - there is constant revision happening daily with COPVID-19. Just three days ago, the accepted norm was one foot, now three! This is why people all over are panicking, because truly this is an evolving paradigm which needs a vaccine.

It is an evolving situation , no question about it.

Why avoid buying a N95 mask if you can ? Are you a Dr ? I ask because I was advised by local G P SURGERY A 2 nd flu shot would do no more coverage than the current one I am covered by. No protection against Covid 19 . Shots do weaken one’s immune temporarily . ( is it one week? For me 48 hours sore arm lump

Slight fever) So I rethought that one .(I did ask) If sitting standing on crowded tubes, buses , shopping centres , and there is sneezing coughing, which will block the droplets entering eye nose mouth membranes . My dentist told me this, as why they wear them. Hand sanitizer better then nothing. Once inside home essential. before eating is vital . The

General population did wear them in UK during Spanish Influenza . Although Govt suppressed newspaper photos and alarm articles , to suppress panic ( Keep Calm Carry on . ). Only Spain did not suppress newspaper coverage due to regime at that time and open media at that time which is why it was called Spanish Influenza. Not “seen” elsewhere . I will Post link to the 25

Vintage Photos . 1918 population in masks. So some people lived through the global ‘epidemic ‘ millions died globally . Maybe masks helped . They were home made in many cases . I don’t understand the resistance . Is it fear ?

Read this report. I am not a physician just an avid reader.

nytimes.com/2020/02/29/heal...

Coco51
Coco51
in reply to Dawsonmackay

What about mobile phones? I have been watching people over the past week e.g. on public transport (as you do). Everyone sneezes into their hand grabs a handrail - adding their own bugs to the huge mixture of bugs already on it - and goes straight back on their phone. If they use hand gel and then pick up the phone again the sanitation is pretty useless. Same goes for hand washing. Our phones are unhygienic at the best of times.

Dawsonmackay
Dawsonmackay
in reply to Coco51

I guess that's just another area that will be addressed (hopefully).

Put it this way, for once I'm really glad I work from home. I am washing my hands thoroughly after going to the gym and shops and suchlike, what else can you do? I suspect we're at raised risk compared to a healthy 30-year-old, but all you can do is take precautions and try not to worry.

Hoski
Hoski
in reply to Eatsalottie

I agree

The risk is considerably lower for the young and healthy. See the table that I posted the link to above.

Thanks! Yes, sadly at 62 my risk is a bit up anyway. Going to do my best not to catch it.

Janith
Janith
in reply to Eatsalottie

I take a certain spray to the gym and wear those surgical gloves throughout ... remove them after walking out and toss them. I go daily and l will do this daily.

Eatsalottie
Eatsalottie
in reply to Janith

Good idea... I have surgical gloves, I will start using them.

Aqua_1
Aqua_1
in reply to Eatsalottie

Sorry ignore my comment. Just read yours and another members comments about surgical gloves!

Aqua_1
Aqua_1
in reply to Eatsalottie

Interesting you mention going to the gym. I've put off going as i am concerned about how clean the machines are. I rarely see people wipe them with an antibacterial wipe after they have finished their workouts.

Eatsalottie
Eatsalottie
in reply to Aqua_1

I'm sure they don't in my gym either, so I shall be taking some latex gloves or the hand sanitiser with me, or both...

I can imagine that a lung infection will be a challenge when combined with symptomatic AF, whether from flu virus or this one and the lack of detail regarding cases is probably to reduce panic. I plan to avoid crowded places if possible, get home deliveries rather than go to supermarkets and wash, wash wash my hands.

The stupid newspapers are not helping with headlines such as one in the Daily Mail, claiming that 10% of the UK population could end up in hospital. Right, that’s 6.6 million hospital beds filled - no problem.

Common sense and careful precautions are probably the best defence.

Samazeuilh
Samazeuilh
in reply to Finvola

The government’s worst case scenario involves 50 million people infected and 500 000 deaths. That’s a lot!

My father survived Spanish Flu when he was 20 and was the only one of six in the house to get it.

That must have been during World War 1. Apparently, the origin of the flu was Spain- it just acquired the name ‘Spanish flu’ because the Spaniards reported the cases of it freely whereas the British, Germans and others suppressed reports of it to maintain morale. The origin of the flu is believed, I think, to be China or the US.

The Spanish flu, unlike the coronavirus, affected young people particularly; it was particularly deadly.

It evidently originated in Kansas but my father caught it in Scotland.

In later years family mistakenly put some of his later health problems to it. He actually died of pneumonia when he was 63 after having ordinary flu. However he was not in good health due to worsening Parkinson's Disease.

Typo above: should have said “origin of the flu WASN’T Spain”.

I thought you meant that! That fact has just been on radio 4 pick of the week!

Coco51
Coco51
in reply to seasider18

Thats nice to hear! Thank you. I guess my grandparents (born in the 1880s) survived it too. They never mentioned it as far as I recall.

seasider18
seasider18
in reply to Coco51

No one on my mothers side of the family, parents and five children had it either.

From what I understand older people with heart disease (a-fib is an irregular HB not necessary HD) and or / a lung condition are most at risk.

This is just my opinion. The chances are it's media hype to some extent. Sorry to be a cynic - I accept 1 death is 1 to many.

Personally though I have no concerns at all about contacting the virus and having a-fib. I hope I'm right although time will tell. I think it's a very slim chance you will be affected.

Paul

The only information that I have come across is; Self isolate + hygiene being paramount. What I am wondering is; which pain killers are safest for us for Temperature/headache control in the event of ?

Hoski
Hoski
in reply to john6

Tylenol( acetaminophen) as long as you dont exceed daily dosage and your liver is healthy.

john6
john6
in reply to Hoski

Tylenol (Acetaminophen) is more commonly known as "Paracetamol" in the UK - thank you x

Well if it gets me and mother nature decides it's my time to leave this world, I can do nothing about it. Just hope I wouldn't suffer too much!

I've just had a surgical procedure and need to keep my head still, so not going out much anyway. The heavy rain and high winds have been enough to keep us, that reside in the UK, indoors a little more lately.

"Que sera, sera,

Whatever will be, will be

The future's not ours to see

Que sera, sera"

Love to everyone on here, hope you all remain coronavirus free.

Jean

You too!!

At the moment I think we just don’t know how this will work out. One of the best things to do, if you are living in a town or city, might be to try to arrange to have a place to stay in he countryside with friends or family if things got bad in the towns. A remote place woth low population density would be ideal. If you are not in public places, then the risk has got to be considerably lower I would have thought.

We are all going to die sooner or later, I would prefer later although I have had my alloted '3 score years and ten' and don't wish to appear greedy .

I guess I am a prime candidate for a swift exit if I catch the virus having asthma and symptomatic P-AF :-(

Being something of a recluse prefering my own company and that of my dog to other humans (grandchildren excepted) I am hoping that stands me in good stead .

seasider18
seasider18
in reply to doodle68

You will be going out a few times of day for the dog.

doodle68
doodle68
in reply to seasider18

....yes into the fields where there are no humans only sheep... :-)

seasider18
seasider18
in reply to doodle68

Not waterlogged with all this rain ?

My particular concern is continuity of supply of medication. In Australia, many (perhaps most) medications are imported. Interruptions to factory production and shipping may be of greater concern than the direct impact of the virus.

100h
100h
in reply to Aus19

Yes that's my worry too!

Mrhermyl
Mrhermyl
in reply to Aus19

Many of the medications are made in China and India as are vitamins !

Big mistake to let the basics of national security get away from Western nations.

seasider18
seasider18
in reply to Mrhermyl

Even medications made elsewhere often have some Chinese content in them.

Bloodredroses
Bloodredroses
in reply to Aus19

Crikey Cobber I had an escape to Far North Queensland Aust nearly booked. Now I think might be best stay close to my Central London mega Hospitals .

Rivaroxaban Xarelto I know for one is made in USA . Anti virals made where? Germany maybe? The closes to a vaccine I read was USA, big Pharma big research ( if a profit in it).

There is being mentioned one anti viral HIV drug being trialled to worst cases now. Has to be early on , I have read only . NB I am not a Dr or researcher .

Aus19
Aus19
in reply to Bloodredroses

Nah, nothing to worry about in the Deep North, Bloodredroses. The crocodiles will get you up there before any virus! Or the red-back spiders. Or the dingoes. Or the flesh-eating koalas.

They do say that elderly people with breathing problems are more susceptible to it. Still, only 1-2% of people who get it, die. So as long as you immune system is strong, there’s no need for concern.

Errrr Mr/Ms Bravemouth , a lot of us on here have autoimmune conditions . E g Sticky Blood Syndrome ASP Hughes Syndrome ....Stress even from going to dentist ( for which even a hygiene visit if on blood thinners can be bloody) or a badly leaking tap can make our immune “drop” to a cold sweat I am on £££ s worth of alternative /natural immune boosters and raw garlic ginger , a vampire 🧛‍♀️ might refuse me, however reading your reassuring non concerning statement has me breaking out to a cold sweat . It is not a mind anxiety situation btw, it can even be genetic to have immune compromising conditions .. and be on bloodthinners . This is the forum our immune club communicates on! Please be mindful . 😱

We need a cold snap to slow the virus. All this warmish weather and rain ( and more rain ....) is ideal for spreading it. Here in France out of 100 cases 86 of those are in hospital which would not be so with the flu. The fact it attacks the lungs and is extremely catching gives food for thought. Would be good if China could stop eating bats, pangolins and pretty much anything else non- human found on their markets! I think for Afibbers some problems could be caused by over the counter cold/flu meds which always provoked short episodes in my case before I switched to honey lemon and thyme.

Take care all!

According to a detailed article in the Economist which I browsed yesterday, the virus flourishes in cold weather and we need warmer weather!

Ah that's interesting. But here we haven't really had winter (snow , ice etc) yet. So I don't really understand why it is thriving 🤔

The only way of really knowing will be to see it's progress in places like sub Saharan Africa and Brazil. There seems to have been less spread in Singapore despite the population density there.

Aqua_1
Aqua_1
in reply to Samazeuilh

Yes i have read the same. I'm from Australia and i am concerned that this virus will 'flourish' over the next few months

It should have been cold in Wuhan at this time of year though today it is 15C/59F.

They are in hospital to isolate them not necessarily because they are very ill. The guy who picked it up in Singapore then passed it on skiing in Contamines before infecting people in Brighton did not get very ill at all. Even the elderly couple Abel on the Diamond Princess have posted on YouTube that they are making a good recovery. Are you in an affected area Lily? So far it has not got to the Limousin.

Mrhermyl
Mrhermyl
in reply to Lilypocket

Here in Canada we have about 20 cases. They report to the hospital as much as 9 days after arrival from places like China and Iran. They are checked out and sent home on the honor system to quarantine for 14 days.

I find this wrong. Are they to be trusted not to go out, not to receive visitors, not to talk to a neighbour ?

There appears to be no screening of any kind at the airport. No temperature checks etc.

Then our medical people are spending much of their time tracing people that may have been infected by the person that arrived and moved around the city.

Our PM is MIA 95% of the time.

Lily I agree natural and alternative are a great ‘alternative ‘ to take as well or instead of if not life threatening. I have read ‘they’ are hoping that with Spring and warmer weather will End this . Reporting Cold dry weather is favourable to spread of virus . I am not a scientist , is that due to the droplet spread nature of the virus ? How is spread in tropical countries? In Indonesia saying don’t have it, as they pray, and it’s tropical . (Seriously ) WHO World Health say they is more likely to underreporting or not st all to protect Bali’s Delicate Tourism, not recovered from volcano yet ) and no test kits or labs able to test . The truth is a very rare red diamond . ( even exist ) Social media is a help and a hindrance .

Maybe best get a bottle of smoothest finest scotch whisky . Medicinally mentally . Just stop worrying . I’m keeping my mask on for outside trips though. 💕

I'm not worrying I'm just pragmatic 😊 These mini epidemics will become more frequent with travel, drug resistance etc It's not my generation or older it is the young generation that will have this to face. But I'm an optimistic! X

*optimist ( my keyboard corrected it )

I completely understand these worries. With A fib and Asthma I usually catch everything going around . and so will be fairly susceptible. I plan to lie low with my dogs, parrot and husband. Good luck to us all...

Makes you wonder doesn't it

We have to be careful with compromised immune systems

I'm in South Africa, nobody wants to come here, not even the novel coronavirus !!!!!!!

Yes, every time I have thought about going to South Africa I eventually decided against it.

A South African friend says that when she goes back she always drives with a gun on her lap. Her young daughter had to go into hospital in Cape Town and she caught a nurse slipping a new needle into her pocket and taking out an old one to use.

Friends of my wife went for three months and said they had a great time and were only mugged four times.

It’s known that the risk of death from coronavirus is influenced by such things as age, comorbidities etc. See:

worldometers.info/coronavir...

Cardiovascular disease is listed; I would strongly suspect that AF makes cornonavirus a more dangerous proposition, but there are no studies on this that I am aware of.

I think most people who have died have been over 80 and those with compromised immune systems a few young people have died like the two doctors. I have had an injection for pneumonia. They are free on the national health.

Here in France one of the victims was in his early 6O's and not travelled anywhere

Yes I know but I said "most" people have been over 80 and some have not. Depends obviously on your immune system.

Yes. Anyway fingers crossed that we all manage to steer clear!

HiddenThis reply has been deleted
Surreychica_1
Surreychica_1
in reply to Hidden

You can go private if not. I am sure it would be worth it and it is a one off injection. It is a pity that it is in short supply especially for the most vulnerable such as people with heart disease. But if I had not been able to get it I would have paid for a private prescription.

My g pNNurse who administered the pneumonia told me 2 years protection . If my memory serves me correctly . A year without flu for 8 years has been good. My anti vacc friends shudder at the thought .

Bloodredroses
Bloodredroses
in reply to Hidden

1. Does this pneumonia shot which I have had with flu shot . (Yes was free to me , but I would have happily paid for it , like some non nhs dental treatments like implants and non metal caps .)

Actually help with this virus ?

Anybody medically trained actually know ?

2. The flu shot does not help,

,it can knockyour immune for a week in fact . For me 48 hours knocked out sore arm , lump on injection site 1 week.As has strains of flus in it ( VACCINE)

3 The actual cost of Flu and or pneumonia shots are what £10 . So what is that problem .?

( a UK thing for our American friends )

HiddenThis reply has been deleted
Bloodredroses
Bloodredroses
in reply to Hidden

Accurate at the time. Will check get back on that . accurate qualifier medical advise on if that pneumonia shot (2 years on normal )actually would give any protection to Covid19 please ??

Yes I should have specified , on NHS website

Flu shots are ‘UPTO ‘ £20 elderly if not free have paid £10 last year at some pharmacies .

Pneumonia is £70 .

Worth it for NORMAL flus.

I would love 💕 it if a medically qualified person could say that this shot only helps with mainstream secondary pneumonia OR ‘can help ‘ with the actual Covid 19 virus once in lungs? I would LOVE to hear it was true .

I was told at G P surgery , having a second flu shot 1 year or pneumonia shot 2 year within these protection periods does not give any different protection .

If it is please advise , (if you are qualified , I )will pay for second booster shots of both .

Simples.

Hidden
Hidden

Doesn't bother me 1 bit, it's a load of nonsense a few weeks time better weather it's all forgotten. The media makes things worst.

Lilypocket
Lilypocket
in reply to Hidden

I wish lol. The problem is it is extremely catching ( more than the flu) and spreads fast and specifically targets the lungs. I suppose if no action is taken and there is an epidemic people will blame their respective governments. So better to over react and be wrong perhaps? Take care 😊

Considering the population of the Wuhan area the percentage catching it seems quite low and most cases have been said to be mild.

Bloodredroses
Bloodredroses
in reply to Hidden

I like to read that, and I hope pray you will be proven right . Let’s have a malt whisky .

Seems like the biggest worry might be the panic people are feeling. With panic comes illogical actions. I’d say as long as we have our necessary meds, food and shelter we will probably be ok. How folks react is tough to gauge. Yes, I’d say weakened immune systems won’t help.

I wish you guys would stop saying that . We are the Autoimmune , immune compromised Club . This is our communication centre . Lol

It’s like Faulty Towers At Leary I am seeing funny side of you Basils .

Love your reference 😂" whatever you do don't mention weakened immune system - I mentioned it once ( actually wasn't me) and I think I got away with it" Loved that series!

Laughter is a good medicine .

Sorry typo . Was supposed to be “at least “ seeing funny side . No edit correct on here .

"even the ages of fatalities do not seem to be mentioned". There is an interesting chinese study that shows age and death correlation: github.com/cmrivers/ncov/bl...

Don't know if we're more at risk, but I would urge all over 60's to get a pneumonia vaccination as it's often this secondary infection to the lungs which finishes you off.

It's free to over 65's in the UK, but you can get it at most pharmacies.

£10 -£15 To all chemists clinics

Lilypocket
Lilypocket
in reply to tunybgur

That's interesting I didn't know there was a vaccination for pneumonia .x

Yup us oldies get it free ( and those immune suppressed lot , from our reg g p ) me.l

tunybgur
tunybgur
in reply to Lilypocket

There are two vaccines for pneumonia that protect against different types of the infection. PCV13 helps protect people from 13 of the most severe types of bacteria that cause pneumonia. PPSV23 protects against an additional 23 types of pneumonia bacteria.

I think the NHS vaccine is PPSV23.

Cost?

£20 flu

£70 pneumonia .

Only protects for normal yearly flus .

Waiting for qualified medical advise that this pneumonia actually protects against the Covid 19 virus or secondary lung infection from that . ?

Any qualified info on this ?

The pneumonia vaccine doesn't protect against the Coronavirus, however as with flu, it's often the secondary pneumonia that kills you off.

In any case it's probably worth getting the pneumonia jab as this is what often finishes us oldies off from lots of other initial infections which suppress our immune system, and then makes us more succeptable to pneumonia which is difficult to treat.

Limoncello
Limoncello
in reply to tunybgur

But can’t dodgy immune systems also react badly to vaccines? I know a few people who’ve been very ill after flu vaccines, one desperately ill after a flu and pneumonia vaccine, I’m 75 and never had a flu vaccine as I’ve had 3 episodes of thrombocytopaenia (platelets destroyed by auto-antibodies, so effectively haemophiliac) twice after a particular antibiotic - fortunately I’m ok with penicillin. And it’s 20 years since the last episode.

But I’ve always worried about the possibility of reacting to a vaccine. I have had a few bad chest episodes in the last three years, don’t know if they were just viruses or chest infection complications. I prefer to keep off antibiotics if possible.

However I am a bit worried about a trip to Italy at the beginning of April. There are six cases of Coronavirus so far in the region, though not in the small town we’re staying in.

I often have a cold straight after coming back from holiday (never on holiday touch wood) though I wonder if it’s the flight, London pollution and climate. I’ve coped so far, though feel that since the age of 70 my resistance is less.

The big shock has been developing AFib, which moved from intermittent to chronic, and a possible valve defect, and being prescribed Bisoprolol and Apixaban. No problem with Apixaban, but several with Bisoprolol, which doesn’t seem to have done anything for my heart rate, but still leaves me breathless on exertion. I can’t believe the person I’ve become in a couple of months, slopes I never noticed before, steps on the Underground leave me breathing heavily. Is it the AFib? Is it the Bisoprolol?

And biggest question of all, do I cancel my trip to Italy?

tunybgur
tunybgur
in reply to Limoncello

Tricky one, the way this virus is going it could be a completely different situation in April.

Bisoprolol is a beta blocker designed to slow the heart and reduce its workload. I also take bisoprolol 1.25mg and it doesn't affect my energy levels to a major degree, but bigger doses will certainly slow you down. The trick is to achieve to best balance for you.

Afib certainly robs me of energy when I'm in it, fortunately mine is controlled by flecainide at the moment, but on the occasions when afib breaks through it certainly slows me down and makes me feel pretty grim.

I can't comment on vaccine reactions, but it's well understood by the experts and these are the people you must discuss it with.

In your position I would discuss with my consultant about reducing bisoprolol and start the wheels moving to resolve the afib. Have you had cardioversion yet? It's very effective and quite safe, but often isn't a permanent fix, but it's a start.

There are several drugs which are also effective, and finally there's ablation.

If you do make the trip, there should be plenty of room on the plane....

Good luck

I understand your concern and rightly so, but the media is a far more dangerous resource than any virus or bacteria flying around. The media is the next most powerful body to the government as they work in tandem and seek to inform and twist agendas to the needs of the government and politically motivated editors.

I work in it right on the frontline as a TV News Cameraman and know how manipulative and left wing most media outlets operate. The written media is far worse than its tv counterpart and I would suggest to any sane free thinking person to avoid buying mainstream newspapers as they are more politically driven than giving you clean hard truthful fact news and often like this latest virus problem there is something darker going on that we’re not meant to know about but just follow the propaganda that’s is being fed to us buy the left wing forces that control the media.

Hidden
Hidden
in reply to Dickydon

Absolutely agree. The over reaction to this virus is a nonsense quite frankly. We now have the prospect of Interest rates going from nothing to... Well... nothing.. As if its going to make the slight bit of differance. We get news about some bloke in Surrey has got a runny nose. Sometimes I wonder how this generation would have coped in May 1940 when we really were in dire trouble.. Not very well I would suggest.

Sfhmgusa
Sfhmgusa
in reply to Hidden

If there is a major outbreak and there really is a 2% mortality with this illness it is a bit more than a runny nose. The total WW2 UK casualties military & civilian was a huge 450,000 people over 4-5 years The worst case Govt forecast for this outbreak (Stress worst case) is 500,000. so being reactive before it happens seems not to be a great over reaction

Hidden
Hidden
in reply to Sfhmgusa

Where's the evidence of 2% mortality rate? 500000 deaths in UK is alarmist claptrap.

Sfhmgusa
Sfhmgusa
in reply to Hidden

worldometers.info/coronavirus/ there are some useful statistics here that show higher mortality rates but quite correctly make the point that it is hopelessly too early to be sure of the death rate. the current actual evidence is higher than 2% but unreliable for a number of reasons. what appears to be uncontroversial is that the infectious potential is at least as "bad" as for seasonal flu, but the mortality seems significantly higher maybe 10 to 20 times higher. It would be a rather reckless government that disregarded the potential threat based on that combination

Dickydon
Dickydon
in reply to Hidden

spot on sir!

radagast58
radagast58
in reply to Dickydon

So where do we go for unbiased and politically neutral news?

Dickydon
Dickydon
in reply to radagast58

As I’ve worked in tv news for over 30yrs, as a cameraman and have been, seen, done, experienced more than most can only ever dream about and this I am eternally grateful for, for having the skills and ambition to be a news cameraman and witnessing some very big events that the world has ever seen. Filming from the worst possible dangerous places in the world, to the private palaces of Libya that were off limits to any public; to flying on middle eastern royal family’s private jumbos; to the sun and beauty of the Bahamas and Caribbean's and beyond.

The current batch of reliable and truthful journalism you will find in this current world climate is RT Russia Today’s global news and Al Jazeera, (English) as odd and hard as that sounds to the general public, those are your best sources of professional truthful television news.

Limoncello
Limoncello
in reply to Dickydon

Sorry, not RT. Funded by the Kremlin, how objective is that going to be? They slip all sorts of disinformation in among their news and opinion pieces. See how they cherry pick the Politico interview with Sadiq Khan to present him as a supporter of Bloomberg. Rubbish.

john6
john6
in reply to Dickydon

I just cannot help feeling that this virus came out of a lab! The speed of the Chinese reaction, ie 2 hospitals being built in next to no time, this after very few people being infected re their population is unbelievable. Taking into account the deaths every year from flu (around 500,000 ish) and not getting this reaction, it makes me wonder........what is it that they really know? P.S. Have not bought a newspaper in over 10 years, the propaganda is blatantly obvious.

Alessa69
Alessa69
in reply to john6

I had thought about the possibility off this being a “lab made virus” as well, would explain why China initially kept very quiet.

Am resigned to Che Sera, sea , as beloved is 83 with 6 Cardiac stents & spinal issues, I’m 17 years younger but have asthma , auto- immune disease and AFib ......Oh, and now the blasted low heart rate which has not been sorted out yet, awaiting results of test. Plus point1) all beloved 6 monthly checks have been done in last month !

Plus point 2) is we live in a fairly isolated area , but within a 10 mile drive of a large hospital.

Just about to do an on line shop now ......

Surreychica_1
Surreychica_1
in reply to john6

I do not care where it came from if it helps all the animals that are killed and eaten. I am more then happy to have a fright then to see all those wonderful animals in small cages and killed so inhumanly. What a terrible sight.

Goosebumps365
Goosebumps365
in reply to john6

Conspiracy Conspiracy.....I'm with you John. It may be fake news but they say there was a SARS/Ebola research facility within 300yds of where the outbreak in Wuhan was meant to have started. So that will likely be military then.

The current favourite epicentre for the start of the "Spanish flu" was supposed to have been a soldier training camp in the USA....yep you guessed it, military again.

And in the UK we have Porton Down!

I bet houses are cheap near Porton Down

I thought the Spanish Flu originated in China!!

Dickydon
Dickydon
in reply to john6

I agree entirely. Someone somewhere, has put an authorising signature to a document wherever it was, authorising the dispersing of this lab created virus.

🛑 Right On . Dicky! what is the something darker ? 2 major theories at present , both from source of condition .

seasider18
seasider18
in reply to Dickydon

Last week my ISA share portfolio went down by £18K. So far nothing like as bad as when the dot com bubble burst in 2000

Well we were goung to nip thru the Mont Blanc tunnel as it’s so close, for my birthday next week, but we’ve thought maybe it’s nit a good idea......apart from that As Jean Jeanie says...que sera sera........

I had pneumonia four years back and I know how rough you feel but I didn’t have this lurking in the background......I just saw in the Telegraph a piece about what if the virus takes hold and the uk has only five weeks of toilet rolls stocked!!!!!! Grin!

Auriculaire
Auriculaire
in reply to Morzine

Good job we kept the bidet in our bathroom.! One of the bonuses of old French houses!

A cheap plumbing part connection to pipe , hose and bidet spray head . We could all have one . Saves toilet paper cost . Plus a positional adjustment inclusion .

i’d love one of those. A doctor once told me though, that I was too fastidious down there. That area needs to have certain flora of bacteria in-order for that area to function properly and over washing and cleaning destroys that natural environment. Being overly clean (which I am) can cause problems in there the medics say! 😷

Chemical overuse destroys natural flora for women . Plain water not an issue, ask the French . Non?

Apparently Gwyneth Paltrow steam cleans her vagina

Finvola
Finvola
in reply to radagast58

😂 Ye gods, what a thought! 😂

Wightbaby
Wightbaby
in reply to Finvola

Gone slightly off subject here.....hilarious!!!

Hylda
Hylda
in reply to radagast58

Sounds painful 😂

Haha

I am concerned. I have had pneumonia four times in the last two/three years which was extremely unpleasant. I feel vulnerable to colds and 'flu, never mind Coronavirus. I am careful what I read, but I don't believe for one minute that governments, world-wide, have had an 'over reaction'.

So I plan to take precautions. Keep hands clean and avoid very crowded places and events. And hoping that it is contained.

Just out of interest Irene, have you had the flu and also the pneumonia jab?

Yes to both. I don't know if the jab alleviated the severity when I had pneumonia (community acquired according to my notes) but fortunately I haven't had 'flu in recent years.

My mum of 90 was persuaded to have Her first ever flu jab and.....went down with flu.

My Mum lived to 97 never having had a 'flu jab, never got 'flu in later years either, though I am not convinced it is the best option for me!

Well, I searched every supermarket and chemist in Andover today and none had any antibacterial gel on the shelves. I only wanted a bag sized bottle for work! Boots said they had been inundated with people booking in for pneumonia vaccines. I'm off to London next weekend so will improve my health by walking instead of using the underground.

I work with the Army so I'll start worrying when I hear they are being mobilised to help.

irene75359
irene75359
in reply to Pam296

I looked too, specifically for my daughter and son-in-law who both use public transport in London to travel to work. I was amazed in London; shelves are bare of disinfectants as well as hand gels. Fortunately I keep a couple of small bottles spare as I take anti-bacterial hand-gel with me when walking my dog!

As it's a virus, I'm not sure anti bacterial soap is any better than normal soap but willing to be persuaded otherwise

Dickydon
Dickydon
in reply to Pam296

That gel is really worthless. Some British Premier League Football clubs several years ago did trials and tests with hand gels and they proved only to be of use for upto 2-3 minutes after application, thus proving, they’re complete waste of money. The best you can buy is what surgeons use pre-operation called Hibiscrub, it lasts and is killing germs and bacteria for six hours. I got two 500ml bottles at home.

Aqua_1
Aqua_1
in reply to Dickydon

Dickydon, i don't think we gave Hibiscrub in Australia. I'm looking for an equivalent. Does Hibiscrub contain clorhexidine?

Dickydon
Dickydon
in reply to Aqua_1

Yes, it does.

Active ingredients:

Chlorhexidine gluconate 4.0% w/v

Aqua_1
Aqua_1
in reply to Dickydon

Thank you so much.

Toronto was particularly hard hit by the SARS virus, so I simply sheltered at home. (I have an auto-immune lung disease, and any respiratory illness could be the end of me, so I have to be extra careful.) So I am prepared to do the same for corona. It's even easier now, because you can get everything you need delivered from grocery stores, amazon or walmart, and do things like banking on the computer. During SARS I had the delivery guys leave my packages in the hallway, and I brought them in once the guys were gone -- and then I washed my hands right away. Same after I touched the mail. I bought a box of N95 masks then, just in case I was forced to go out for some reason, and I still have most of them. Fortunately I make a great living on the computer from home, and I always keep a lot of food on hand. Ill people need to always be prepared, you never know what might happen. Corona may only be the beginning. Don't panic, but be a good scout and always be prepared.

Hidden
Hidden
in reply to goldey

Masks are of no use whatsoever, don't take my word for it. All the medical experts say it. What does make sense is sensible things like washing your hands properly.

I am absolutely in agreement I have AF and am traveling to skavakia the end of March so need to know how at risk I am

Just thinking... has anyone read a theory that this bug has been around for a year or two?

I had exactly the Coronavirus symptoms a year ago. Dry cough, ok for 5 days, then a huge fever, awful cough, and pneumonia. Got better. Was given antibiotics, but not sure they helped, because normally if they work they take effect in 2 days. It took at least a week to feel better with this with lots of rest. Was breathless for a while after that.

And it wasn't classic flu. I have had that twice and it came on really quickly. No 5 day delay

Anyway my AF wasn't affected.

Right now I'm trying to be prepared. My husband & I both have history of symptomatic Afib. We both are very stable (although he has hx of heart failure and a pacemaker with some renal insufficiency). Since we are both on sotalol (which cannot be stopped, increased or decreased without careful monitoring) - having a store of the med in case of a supply disruption is critical. We are also on Eliquis but if all is unavailable keeping a reg rhythm is the MOST important to decrease risk of strokes etc. Good luck in this time of uncertainty!

I'm not overly concerned about it. Someone in the family has had some sort of cough/cold bug every few weeks since November. And we've survived.

Flu does the rounds every year, last year we had 3 cases on our surgical ward for the first time in as long as I can remember. The isolation procedures were placed on those specific paients and it didn't spread. I didn't see it as anything out of the ordinary.

I think a lot of the coverage about it, whilst it is a serious condition and has infected a lot of people, has been borderline hysterical at times. Which hasn't made getting sensible diluted information out there any easier.

Eat and drink your balanced diet, practise good hand hygiene, avoid mass gatherings if you must. That's all I'll be doing for now.

Well, l just voted! Soooooo many people omg ... l thought, out of all of these people, one has to HAVE IT! I wore my surgical gloves and kept my nose covered with the paper they gave us ... best l could do ... it’s premature to wear a mask. No one is wearing them and l spotted only one man wearing surgical gloves.

I like the masks. When I once worked in healthcare we met one on one with a Industrial Safety Hygienist who evaluated our face shape & selected the proper mask type/size. They put some sort of enclosed head piece (space suit like) over you while your mask was on. Then opened a bottle with a scent, slipped it inside & asked a number of times if you could smell anything.

So I gather if you put your mask on & smell a bottle of perfume say, your mask does not have a proper airtight seal. I don’t think they want the public wearing airtight seals without a Industrial Hygienist observing you for a while for safety, testing & adjustments. The masks were good for X number of hours only. Masks can give people a false sense of security when used incorrectly.

I think a similar protocol is followed for a number of trades as well. We were fitted mainly to work with tuberculosis patients. The rooms that these patients were in vented to the outdoors. The air inside each room did not recirculate inside the building. There were two separate double doors into each individual room (With stocked isolation carts with supplies outside each room).

As all these measures were reserved for patients triaged by licensed health care providers, I can understand why they say masks are not helpful to the general public. I just think it helps to be upfront as to why this is likely the case. Specialists fit you & train you in proper mask use beforehand.

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