afib permanant on drugs for rate and symptoms

[tony5555]

Hi everyone,Im 52and ive had afib for around 5 years its going persistent now,has anyone been in permanent afib for many years and just take something for rate control and symptoms, is this something which you can live with?

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Of course every one is different, therefore AF effects folk differently. We often hear that persistent/permanent AF is easier to live with because it removes the fear, anxiety and anticipation of an episode occurring. Often the body adapts an the symptoms less troublesome but it is important to take medication to ensure the heart is performing within acceptable limits. If the heart rate is not controlled then more serious heart conditions can occur and once persistent, it is generally thought that other treatments such as ablation is less likely to be successful or more attempts are necessary to help control symptoms. Provided it is controlled, many go on to lead relatively normal normal lives and it is said AF doesn’t shorten life but side effects from medication are often similar to the symptoms of AF and can be equally unpleasant. If any one is considering having an a ablation to control symptoms, possibly better sooner than later but that is only my personal view.

[Hidden]

Try this if you can - works for lots of folks. . . .

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After 9 years of trying different foods and logging EVERYTHING I ate, I found sugar (and to a lesser degree, salt – i.e. dehydration) was triggering my Afib. Doctors don't want to hear this - there is no money in telling patients to eat less sugar. Each person has a different sugar threshold - and it changes as you get older, so you need to count every gram of sugar you eat every day (including natural sugars in fruits, etc.). My tolerance level was 190 grams of sugar per day 8 years ago, 85 grams a year and a half ago, and 60 grams today, so AFIB episodes are more frequent and last longer (this is why all doctors agree that afib gets worse as you get older). If you keep your intake of sugar below your threshold level your AFIB will not happen again (easier said than done of course). It's not the food - it's the sugar (or salt - see below) IN the food that's causing your problems. Try it and you will see - should only take you 1 or 2 months of trial-and-error to find your threshold level. And for the record - ALL sugars are treated the same (honey, refined, agave, natural sugars in fruits, etc.). I successfully triggered AFIB by eating a bunch of plums and peaches one day just to test it out. In addition, I have noticed that moderate (afternoon) exercise (7-mile bike ride or 5-mile hike in the park) often puts my Afib heart back in to normal rhythm a couple hours later. Don’t know why – perhaps you burn off the excess sugars in your blood/muscles or sweat out excess salt?? I also found that strenuous exercise does no good – perhaps you make yourself dehydrated??

I'm pretty sure that Afib is caused by a gland(s) - like the Pancreas, Thyroid (sends signals to the heart to increase speed or strength of beat), Adrenal Gland (sends signals to increase heart rate), Sympathetic Nerve (increases heart rate) or Vagus Nerve (decreases heart rate), Hypothalamus Gland or others - or an organ that, in our old age, is not working well anymore and excess sugar or dehydration is causing them to send mixed signals to the heart - for example telling the heart to beat fast and slow at the same time - which causes it to skip beats, etc. I can't prove that (and neither can my doctors), but I have a very strong suspicion that that is the root cause of our Afib problems. I am working on this with a Nutritionist and hope to get some definitive proof in a few months.

Also, in addition to sugar, if you are dehydrated - this will trigger AFIB as well. It seems (but I have no proof of this) that a little uptick of salt in your blood is being treated the same as an uptick of sugar - both cause AFIB episodes. (I’m not a doctor – it may be the sugar in your muscles/organs and not in your blood, don’t know). In any case you have to keep hydrated, and not eat too much salt. The root problem is that our bodies are not processing sugar/salt properly and no doctor knows why, but the AFIB seems to be a symptom of this and not the primary problem, but medicine is not advanced enough to know the core reason that causes AFIB at this time. You can have a healthy heart and still have Afib – something inside us is triggering it when we eat too much sugar or get (even a little) dehydrated. Find out the core reason for this and you will be a millionaire and make the cover of Time Magazine! Good luck! - Rick Hyer

PS – there is a study backing up this data you can view at:

https//cardiab.biomedcentral.com/a...

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I have always thought all Afib patients have a similar problem happening within our bodies that is causing our afib problems. After 17 years of watching my afib come and go, and logging everything I eat, I am pretty sure our hearts are fine but we have a problem with a gland(s) or an organ(s). For example:

1). The Sympathetic Nerve INCREASES the heart rate.

2). The Vagus Nerve DECREASES the heart rate.

3). The Adrenal Gland INCREASES the heart rate (with adrenaline), heightens

anxiety.

4). The Thyroid Gland both DECREASES and INCREASES the heart rate, and

heart strength.

5). The Hypothalamus Gland produces hormones directing other glands to do

stuff.

6). The Pancreas processes sugar, which cause other glands to do different

things.

7). To further complicate the situation, when one gland stops working, sometimes another gland will try to pick up the slack.

Plus - there are lots more glands in the body, plus don't forget the organs, which (some) also influence the heart rate, for example:

Medulla in Brain: Heart rate can be increased or decreased by impulses brought to

the SAN or AVN by nerves originating in the medulla oblongata of the brain.

The endocrine system of gland processing is complex – it’s a wonder it works at all.

For a neat picture/information on all the glands, check out this URL: (Ctrl and click):

images.search.yahoo.com/sea...

Medications, chemicals, foods etc. can all cause our glands and organs to mis-fire. For me, sugar (and dehydration) are causing some gland(s) or organ(s) in my body to mis-fire, sending mixed signals to the heart - for example, telling the heart to beat fast and slow at the same time. This would explain why a healthy heart sometimes beats abnormally. It also explains why my heart afibs when I eat too much sugar, because the heart does NOT use sugar to contract (uses fatty acids) so obviously sugar/dehydration is causing something to misfire which in turn is directing the heart to afib. In our old age, I suspect a gland or organ is not working as it used to, causing afib or other heart palpitations. Unfortunately doctors and researchers don't know what it is (yet). In the meantime we will have to listen to our bodies VERY closely to see what is causing our problems and reduce or eliminate our afib by reducing what triggers it.

[terryw]

Hi tony5555. Flapjack's comment is a great summary. You need to answer some questions that I asked myself. Will my quality of life be better or worse in continuous AF? What should I be doing to minimise any risks? In my case keep the blood pressure and heart rate under control. The most difficult question is are there any latent risks that could arise, and that I could be addressing e.g. am I weakening my heart? I had an Echocardiogram over a year ago, and my intention is to repeat it every couple of years. TerryW

[Mugster]

Have you had/been offered a cardioversion or ablation? I was in persistent AF ,both procedures put me into NSR the difference was HUGE improvement in energy levels ability to walk for 3 miles without getting tired

[cuore]

If you are going persistent and get to persistent, you have a limited time period for a good success percentage for ablation. You might want to read this article that defines increasing rotor areas to ablate relative to the months in persistent:

afsymposium.com/library/201...

If you want to reach permanent afib the article is of no use to you. Once you are in persistent AF, one year will have to lapse to be labeled long standing persistent AF . The number of ablations required to get back to normal sinus rhythm is much higher for persistent AF , and the outcome is lower as well. Past one year AF is going to be very problematic. AF begets AF. The more you are in it, the more you will have, granted some get used to living in AF.

For me, I had a heavy chest, a lump in my throat, could hardly lift anything, had to pause going up hills and steps, and it didn't matter if I was on rate control or rhythm control drugs. I am so happy now to be nine months in sinus after three ablations, with the first starting at six months persistent. I did not want to live in AF.