Does anyone know what makes a “flutter attack” happen? As I seem to be in flutter much of the time at present, when an “attack” happens or feels like it will, and I am forced to stop everything and sit or lie down, what brings that horrible flush of sudden overwhelming symptoms on - given that it can’t be the usual flutter as that’s there always? And why does whatever happened take so long to settle?
Also - sorry for all these questions - does anyone else get the massive amount of gassiness and burping that I did after the two attacks?
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Ppiman
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My layman’s understanding is that a rogue signal, usually in the right atrium, starts a circuit which causes very rapid beats in the atria - up to 360bpm I read somewhere.
One of the conditions for starting this flutter circuit is the effect which an anti-arrhythmic drug like Flecainide can have in prolonging the cardiac cycle - read that somewhere too. Otherwise, AFlutter seems to exist simply because it can.
Beta blockers can slow the heart’s response to these rapid atrial beats - typically by a ratio of 3:1, so that the heart rate is around 110 to 130bpm.
Burping, wind and weeing seem to accompany a stressed heart - the vagus nerve is involved with gut response and the stressed heart releases an enzyme which causes copious weeing to rid the body of salt. Absolutely charming, isn’t it? 😄. In my case, AF was also accompanied by diarrhea.
The good news is that AFlutter ablation has a high success rate - typically 98%.
Thanks for such an informative reply. My experience today - just a few days after my second “flare” and five days after first starting bisoprolol - shows me how exercise will trigger mine.
I was so pleased with actually having a heart rate of 70-80 for much of the day. It’s been around a hundred since leaving hospital on Tuesday. My BP was low but I felt much more like my old self. Then, mid afternoon I went with my wife to meet my young grandson and his mum - a bit of an uphill walk on the return. Well, that was that. I felt the symptoms bubbling up and I had to go really slowly or I knew I’d be sitting panting on someone’s garden wall. The exercise triggered my heart rate back briefly to 145 but mostly to 105 or so with burping and slight chest pains. Doh! Three hours on and it’s still the same and I feel fragile.
Somewhere on this site, there are some very good links to articles by Dr Sanjay Gupta about AF and the Vagus nerve, it certainly resonated with me. He posts videos on YouTube and he has a Facebook page , which I think is either York Cardiology or Dr Sanjay Gupta ( He’s a Cardiologist based in York) The link to AF and excessive weeing alone made a connection, which prior to being diagnosed with AF and treated was part of my symptoms which my GP had overlooked . Hope that may help, there are lots of good people here who have great info
Hi - thanks for the information. I haven’t found the articles yet, but have seen a couple of Dr. Gupta’s videos. I’ll look out for more.
I wasn’t sure whether the weeing was being brought on by the 5mg bisoprolol.
I really wish that I knew what I’d happening with my heart as, whatever it is, it seems to have worsened. A month ago after my first bout with this (which my GP and I wrongly put down to my hiatus hernia not my heart...), I recovered far better than this time.
After the last event, a week ago, I still can’t do much without the feeling another will happen. I suppose the coming echo-cardiogram and 24 hour ECG will reveal more.
I’m off to my GP at midday so might get to know more then.
Yes, coping with it is somewhat frustrating, but liveable. I guess I just had to accept my limitations at the time. Fine doing everyday things but the dogs had to get used to repeated pauses going uphill. Fine on the flat but within a steady but not fast pace.
I just had to learn to pace myself in all physical activities.
At present, I couldn’t do much walking even. Once I overdo it, I have hours of feeling poorly. I just hope things improve after the cardioversion planned for a month’s time.
This is such good information as I suffer with svt and during and after an attack I wee constantly but also get diarrhoea .I had ablation last October but sadly I still have my attacks not as strong and debilitating but it still scares me to the bone when it happens.Im having a couple a week at the mo so I’m living quite anxiously waiting for the next one to happen.Wishing you well😊
I’ve had ectopics all my adult life, worse at times than others. I’ve managed well and they haven’t bothered me all that much. The atrial flutter, though, is of a different order. I know that emotion and anxiety are deep parts of my reaction, but, at present, I can’t do much physical exercise at all. A short walk up an incline yesterday pushed me close to having to sit down.
I feel for you! Life isn’t always easy. I know many people suffer appallingly so I shouldn’t complain but it is lack of knowledge, lack of control and fear that make this so debilitating.
For SVT, a Valsalva manoeuvre is very often successful. I always try one if my heart races with a regular beat for longer than a few minutes.
If you have any other heart condition, do check with your doc before trying the manoeuvre as it puts pressure on the heart’s vessels. Sadly, it doesn’t work for AF or ectopics, as far as I can tell. Here’s a link:
I read about this refinement to the manoeuvre - it basically involves raising your legs (or getting someone to do it whilst you relax) at the finish of the manoeuvre.
You could try yoga--there's research to say it helps (it helps me), and it feels good. Lots of free yoga videos (all levels) on the Internet (I'm a fan of Yoga with Adrien). For research see for example
Good luck! This whole thing is a pain, and I wish there were simple, definitive answers. The poking and prodding doesn't help. For me, processed sugar (and I love my Nutty bars!) and lack of sleep (funny, though b/c heart wakes me up) also awaken the stampede.
I feel your pain...my episodes start with irregulat beats and that awful flush that goes through my body and there’s no rhyme or reason, and nothing helps, just have to endure. The feeling can last for an hour or more...All the testing tells me my irregular beats are not dangerous, even though you feel doom. Mine could be worse, that’s my consolation.
Hi - you’ve described my experiences perfectly (indeed, apart from calling them an “attack”, I’ve used the word “flush”, too - it’s a nicer word!).
I felt one coming on yesterday walking up a slight incline but kept it at bay.
My GP this morning upped my dose of bisoprolol to 7.5mg as my heart rate was staying over 100. I’m currently feeling unusually listless having had no side effects much until now - hanging out the washing just now made my arms ache like crazy. I’m hopeful that a slower heart will make me feel better, though.
The word "flush" is a very good description. Its as though someone has poured a hot liquid down into my stomach, then feel as if have to take very deep breaths, folliwed by the usual very fast erratic heart beats, shaking, & endless trips to the loo.
After effects are very debilitating - weariness, the anxious "what if this happens again" exhaustion & gastric problems.
You are not alone af/paf affect us all in different ways.
One of the worse things is when it happens after a perfectly normal stress free day
Yes exactly so - my extra symptom (atrial flutter is supposed to be the cause) is the “fear of impending doom”. It’s just terrible.
I’ve had several panic attacks in my life and that’s what I first thought this was, somehow caused by my hiatus hernia. I’m not now sure that my so-called panic attacks of old weren’t an arrhythmia but I’ll never know.
I certainly now have worse or at least much longer lasting symptoms as it’s taking ages for me to recover, whereas recovery when I was younger was quick.
It does help to hear how others are experiencing these symptoms and dealing with them. I wish there was an answer so my grown children won’t have to suffer when they’re older like I have, as they all get the irregular beats too. I had many panic attacks in my early teen years through my 20s and 30s, a few in my 40s. I count my blessings, as I don’t have AFib (yet), I have no other symptoms other than the ‘beats’ episodes and the awful feelings that accompany them, and I have no restrictions. I eat a healthy mostly vegetarian diet and stay fairly active. Best wishes to you all.
I’ve just got back from seeing a cardiologist / electrophysiologist who told me he suspects that my “panic” syndrome, something that started after a bout of proper flu with 104C fever, thirty years ago or so (a diagnosis that was tenaciously hooked into by my several GPs over the years...), was more likely my undetected heart dysrhythmias.
Thanks - my mind is easier than it’s been, even though I think the cause will remain a mystery. What’s done is done and I’m stuck with it until the cardioversion or ablation. The tablets certainly aren’t doing a great deal and I seem to be in permanent flutter.
That must really be bothersome.....my arrhythmias scare me but I haven’t had one last more than a few seconds at a time since I was diagnosed with coronary artery disease and put on meds, for which I am grateful...that episode lasted more than 10 min and was so awful.. I have days where they come on so often, after eating, laying down, wake me up at night, but it has settled now for over a month. .Hope you feel more like yourself soon Piman.
Thanks for your kind words. It is undoubtedly life changing at present as there's such a limit on what I can do, and a great fear of overdoing things. My hope is that the scan I had yesterday shows nothing else to be wrong and that the planned ablation can go ahead, be a success and be long lasting.
I have a question. I have Afib but hasn’t really been a problem since my ablation in May of 17. I ended up with flutter. They took me off amiorderone and put me on my metoprolol only to regulate heart rate. Said he didn’t think another ablation would work since Ive had three over the last 10 years. Last two didn’t work. First one was pretty good for 5 years. I was put on 200 mg of metoprolol hoping to get my rate under 100. That worked. Then for the last few months I have had a heart rate in the 50s. Then to day. Boom. It was back. Today it has stayed in resting rate of 120-125. My question. Is that dangerous! I am 67 Never had bp issues until the last few years. Has any one stayed in a high bpm. Is it dangerous for my heart. I know u don’t have my heart but I don’t have a valve problem or anything else. I’m over this. I started this stuff in my 20swith svt. Then pvcs for ever then a few years later Afib. Just anxious. It usually bounces around and never hardly stays at a high rate. Thank you so much. Sandy
Hi. I think your GP is the best person to ask. I have persistent atrial flutter and my heart rate was 104bpm for many days but is now often much lower at about 77bpm. Your rate of 120bpm could be NSR but in tachycardia or be a ventricular rate in ratio with a higher atrial rate caused by fibrillation or flutter. Do you know which?
Thank you Ppiman for your information. The funny thing is when I took my second dose of metoprolol last night, my heart rate starting going down, then this morning my rate was in the 60s and took my next dose. Stayed in the 60s most of the day. Then late afternoon. Started bouncing around 70s. 80s. 90s. 106. Now it’s 10pm. I take my second dose aT 10:30 pm. My rate is 120s. I think it is flutter. Don’t see my EP for a month or so. Scary.
Scary is the right word, eh? My flutter seems to be a fraction of 300 or so, a half, third, quarter and so on, i.e. ~150, ~100, ~75, jumping between them without any slow progression caused by exercise of relaxation. Just now, for example, my rate has been 75 for half an hour, but just went to 104. The daily 7.5mg bisoprolol seems to have affected this downwards, but just a little.
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