Warfarin and Quinine Anyone had issues?

[Offcut]

I am now on extra tablets Quinine but it does state that they can affect warfarin as well as the heart rate. Does anyone have any issues with the mix.

I have got them as I have been getting nightly cramps in the legs and feet.

Be Well

[michou]

I have never of heard of this - where did you read about this? I keep a bottle of tonic by my bed for night cramps in legs and have a good slug whenever I get a cramp - it works within a few minutes and I am on anti coagulants and beta blockers. I think that is better than taking nightly quinine (for some reason I think to do with eyesight quinine is banned by the american FDA). It does mean that I have to wait until I get the cramps but I feel happier that way. I hope there is no contra indications with quinine as I certainly could not cope with cramps without it - mind you alcohol, even a small glass of wine is often responsible for giving me cramps but I persevere!

[Offcut in reply to michou]

Never give up the wine after all that effort they went to to make it

It states in the leaflet not to use with warfarin and some heart tablets it appears it can change the clotting process quite a lot. It also states not to use with tinitus which I have but I do not how that works?

My warfarin is not being very stable at the moment and I cannot pin down what it is. I have a very bland diet with the same foods each week. My gout flared up which has not helped any of this?

[Hidden in reply to Offcut]

Chat with docs or pharmacist or INR clinic

[Offcut in reply to Hidden]

Will do on monday when they are open? I do have an INR test on Tuesday anyway.

[Polski in reply to Offcut]

Patrick Holford in his book 'Good Medicine' has a chapter on gout, and it is mentioned in some of his other books. He recommends foods to eat and avoid and some basic supplements to take. You may find it interesting.

[Offcut in reply to Polski]

mushrooms are my killer food I do not eat them at all now

[ovannie in reply to michou]

I too have cramps/spasms in my feet, calves and rib cage...I went online and researched non-medicinal remedies as I take warfarin and have asthma....PICKLE JUICE is the answer!!! Athletes use it and so many folks swear by it...Well, I drank two oz before bed and VIOLA! No cramps!!! I used bread and butter juice (for the taste), but dill can be used too...I'm now going to eat more pickles with my meals....Vinegar is the real answer, but it's hard to drink it straight so the juice is the answer for the majority of cramp/spasm victims...Up to two oz won't hurt even if you must watch salt intake....Thank God for Google...

[Polski in reply to ovannie]

Fascinating! Organic cider vinegar is recommended for many things - perhaps this is another one. Many of the foods we eat cause an overall state of acidity in the body as a whole (regardless of whether the food itself is acidic), which is not the way the body was designed to be. Perhaps the vinegar in pickles is doing a similar thing - making the body less acid. (Organic cider vinegar is recommended because it is the most effective kind to get the less-acidic effect)

[lixaian in reply to michou]

Morning micjhou

You are right about the USA FDA being banned. up until 2 years ago I was exceptionally fit training 3 x a day. I pulled a muscle and usually I just run it off. My daughter was concerned and made me see my GP first time in 35 years. He prescribed quinine Sulphate. I took my first dose at 7pm that evening by midnight I was delirious. For the next 4 days I was in extreme pain as if my whole body had cramp, I ended up in A&E . I had lots of tests including MRI. some days later traveling to a meeting a Dr from my surgery called me and asked where I was. She said I must turn round and go to rage emergency day centre. When I arrived there were medical staff waiting for me. I was wired up like a robot, a mask put on my face to measure my oxygen and put von a running machine. after this my blood was taken, blood pressure and pulse too. when this was finished the lead Dr said the reason you are here is because you have a large blood clot in your leg and 2 in your lungs. some 3 days later I was called to the hospital for a consultation with a cancer specialist, He advised me that I have Chronic Hodgkin's Lymphoma nodes cancer but as I appear so fit and well he envisaged no treatment in the short term except he put me on Eliquis Apixaban5mg twice daily. Later from my consultant I received a copy of a letter he had sent to my GP advising him the catalyst that had caused my cancer was quinine Sulphate. My daughter wanted to sue the NHS but I said no as my GP gave me this medication with the best of intentions not maliciously. The side affects of my Eliquis Apixaban were not too bad, itching every where, but the worse was the occasional numbness in my fingers and tingling and it became a little painful to touch any thing. So I am now on Lixiana Edoxaban which is slightly better. My daughter researched Quinine Sulphate and found it is banned in several countries, further more a USA Olympics athlete when running would;d drink copious amounts of bottled water. She had a baby who was constantly fitting, on investigation it was found that the bottles water the athlete was drinking contained quinine! Last year a nurse that visits my site was speaking to me and I asked here about quinine sulphate, she replied " please don't mention that drug to me" it has caused me problems" Note: I am not medically trained or anything, this is just my experience and I am note really experienced in being ill having had a long life of good health and not requiring the services of a GP , we all respond to medication in different ways but I have learnt to challenge my GP or anyone that is prescribing medication to me. GPs do their best but like all of us in our careers we make mistakes.

Good luck keep safe. Just has a thought, when training my soldiers if any of them were wimping out I would ask if they were in pain, if they replied "Yes Sir" I would say " That's good if you feel pain it shows you are alive, get moving. Sorry army humour.

[JaneFinn]

Hi offcut, sorry I've no experience of this. But hope you can get some great advice from the medical professionals - do let us know!

I think you know this info already, but in case it helps anyone, Nice guidelines do give cautions in the use of quinine for people with AF or other heart conditions:

evidence.nhs.uk/formulary/b...

And also here's the link for the contrainducation of quinine with warfarin:

evidence.nhs.uk/formulary/b...

(I'm now wondering if that only applies to quinine tablets, or if the quinine in my favourite tipple of (gin and) tonic is a no no!)

[Offcut in reply to JaneFinn]

I would think the tablets as the quinine in tonic is there but not concentrated?

Thanks for the links.

[yorkie]

Hi. I have been on warfarin & quinine for about 5 years. I only take the quinine when I get cramp usually in the middle of the night. Within about ten to fifteen minutes the cramp is a lot easier. 28 tablets can last me up to two years. Hope this helps.

[Offcut in reply to yorkie]

I was told to take them every day. I was getting cramp every day even in the day. My INR this time was 3.9 So it seems to have done something to it. I should be 3.0 ideal but before I was down to 2.0 so quite a rise this time? I do have multi conditions that are not helping any of this