High dose Melatonin

[sjpoli46]

A research friend of mine told me about the benefits of taking 180mgs of Melatonin twice a day for cancer. Has anyone tried this and had success?

[16starsky]

I;ve been searching for this for the last two days. In the UK its banned ? Watched a video about this and says tablets no good. Trying to find somewhere reliable to get either powder or supps from. If anyone can enlighten me would be very grateful.I can only seem to find tablets at 3mg, 10mgs on Amazon /Ebay.

[sjpoli46 in reply to 16starsky]

I've found 60mg tablets on amazon...but still not sure whether it works.

[16starsky in reply to sjpoli46]

Are you in the US ? Ive looked on Amazon and found 60mgs, says out of stock, dont know if they will get them back in !!! I bet they cant ship them to us any more

[sjpoli46 in reply to 16starsky]

I live in Hawaii and I just ordered from Amazon 60mg tablets by Carefast in stock.

[Fred665 in reply to 16starsky]

Try “Wondrous Roots” in Keene NH USA

[Kentucky1 in reply to 16starsky]

I am able to get Melatonin Max 60mg capsules from Perfect Vitamin. I have been taking 120mg daily for about 2 years via recommendation of COC oncologist.

[sjpoli46 in reply to Kentucky1]

Has it helped?

[Kentucky1 in reply to sjpoli46]

I can't really say. Sleep has never been an issue, so in that arena it's a wash. The COC recommendation was that higher dose of 120mg supposedly has some effect on the formation of bone mets. My mets have improved since diagnosis, but I can't honestly attribute it to the melatonin. I've been on Lupron,Zytiga, and Prednisone since shortly after diagnosis in early 2019. I'm more likely to attribute my response to the ADT therapy than to melatonin.

[6357axbz]

Can your friend point to documentation, e.g., clinical trials, showing any benefits? If not what supports his assertion that this benefits advanced PCa patients?

[sjpoli46 in reply to 6357axbz]

I just watched this video on youtube where the Dr. cites a number of studies and results which are quite mind blowing. youtube.com/watch?v=Roh4IQX...(Not working as expected?)

[6357axbz in reply to sjpoli46]

Thanks

[spw1 in reply to sjpoli46]

Please post the title of this as the link did not work for me. Thanks

[pjoshea13]

The hormone melatonin is an unusual player in the endocrine system, in that it is secreted by the pineal gland in response to an external stimulus (nightfall, or, rather, darkness), and there is no feedback from target tissue. Instead, melatonin receptors cease to respond to it over time. With daylight, melatonin is cleared & the receptors become responsive for the next cycle. It seems to me to not be a good idea to take it twice daily.

I take 50 mg before bed. There are studies that have used 20 mg. I wouldn't take less than that. i hadn't heard of a 180 mg dose, but this site mentions it:

riordanclinic.org/wp-conten...

"Prevention: 180 mg about 30 minutes before

bedtime."

But note that the author, Frank Shallenberger, might not be a good guide:

faculty.uml.edu/sgallagher/...

-Patrick

[16starsky]

Thanks, dont think its available from Amazon at the present time for us in the UK. Its illegal here, so I dont hold out much hope.

Our nanny state, drives me round twist !

Cant get RSO oil either, dont know why Melatonin is illegal here ?

Will email Perfect Vitamins see If they will ship to us. But then it will probably get confiscated at customs !!!

[hansjd in reply to 16starsky]

In Australia you can buy only low dose melatonin over the counter, so I order it online from Life Extension (10 mg) from overseas. To be able to get this dose through customs, I approached my MO with 'evidence' of studies showing apparent beneficial effects for PC. Thankfully he had no problem with writing an authorisation for me to receive it, which I emailed to the company and which they include with each shipment so that Australia Border Force does't confiscate the medication. I take 30 mg each night, but am thinking of increasing it to 40 or 50 mg as Patrick takes. Maybe try a similar approach with your MO and see if you can access it that way. Cheers

[16starsky in reply to hansjd]

Must be joking, our OC dosn't even approve of Green Tea !

[Hidden in reply to 16starsky]

That’s crazy Kimx.

[kaptank]

That amount would be of no use. I use 2g a day. Much more is risky as toxicity is an issue at higher. But 2g a day is about the right dosage. The real use of this is to control sugar and insulin which are major factors for us. At that it is very good, at the high (not risky) dosage. It is worth getting a prescription. Major factors indicating its use for folks such as us are pre diabetic tendencies, overweight, insulin resistance, tendency to metabolic syndrome. Many practitioners have heard that it may be useful for PCa patients and will prescribe accordingly. It helps if you can point to one of the other uses

[kaptank in reply to kaptank]

Sorry. That response was a misunderstanding by me that we were talking about metformin. ADT brain at work. D'oh.

About melatonin, Perfect Vitamin have the 60mg tablets that Amazon sometimes has. Both sources have come through Australian customs, no problem for me. I did 60mg for about 6 months for sleep but find 20mg works just as well.

Melatonin is relatively safe and high doses should not be a problem but they may well be no more effective.

[Ausi]

This was a study published week which maybe of interest, a small study of Icelanders

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi...

Abstract

Introduction

Melatonin levels are partially driven by the parenchyma volume of the pineal gland. Low urinary levels of 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin have been associated with increased risk of advanced prostate cancer, but the relationship between pineal gland volume and composition and prostate cancer risk has not been examined.

Materials and Methods

We utilized data from 864 men from the AGES‐Reykjavik Study with complete pineal gland volumes and urinary 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin measurements. Pineal parenchyma, calcification, and cyst volumes were calculated from brain magnetic resonance imaging. Levels of 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin were assayed from prediagnostic urine samples. We calculated Pearson correlation coefficients between parenchyma volume and urinary 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin levels. We used Cox proportional hazards regression to calculate multivariable hazard ratios (HRs) and 95% confidence intervals (95% CIs) comparing prostate cancer risk across parenchyma volume tertiles and across categories factoring in parenchyma volume, gland composition, and urinary 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin level.

Results

Parenchyma volume was moderately correlated with urinary 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin level (r = .24; p < .01). There was no statistically significant association between parenchyma volume tertile and prostate cancer risk. Men with high parenchyma volume, pineal cysts and calcifications, and low urinary 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin levels had almost twice the risk of total prostate cancer as men with low parenchyma volume, no pineal calcifications or cysts, and low urinary 6‐sulfatoxymelatonin levels (HR: 1.98; 95% CI: 1.02, 3.84; p: .04).

Conclusions

Although parenchyma volume is not associated with prostate cancer risk, pineal gland composition and other circadian dynamics may influence risk for prostate cancer. Additional studies are needed to examine the interplay of pineal gland volume, composition, and melatonin levels on prostate cancer risk.

Can someone explain the conclusion!

[kaptank]

Hi, its me again. I have a recollection (remember I have terminal ADT brain) of someone posting here on HU that they used truckloads of melatonin (the dose comes from the note I made at the time) during docetaxel and escaped the side effects quite nicely. I think it may have been 180mg before bed. (but remember that ADT brain) Anyway, I can report no side effects from 60mg for about 6 months but 20mg eventually did just as well for sleep. It is an interesting molecule.

[RonnyBaby]

I find that 'amount' to be shocking and can't believe that someone made that claim.

You'd be a zombie at that dose - sorry but it strikes me as being ridiculous.

I've read that about 20 mg daily has shown some benefit, but even that claim is 'sketchy' because the evidence is 'suggestive', based on limited data / trials.

I've taken about 30 mg daily for a lengthy period of time due to my severe insomnia - it helps a bit - but I see no evidence it has slowed progression ....

[Stevecavill]

It seems pretty unlikely. Does your friend have any studies to point to? People “hear” things all the time. 99.9% of the time they are nonsense.

[NecessarilySo]

Found this, but I don't really understand. I like the two sentences: '''"the therapeutic effect of melatonin in metastatic prostate cancer has largely remained a mystery. " and, "Thus, melatonin is promising in the management of prostate cancer metastasis and deserves to undergo clinical investigations"

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/332...

Just as a side note I don't take melatonin although I have some 3mg pills in medicine cabinet. It seems to have no effect. Lately I have had more lucid dreams as my PC tumors seem to be shrinking to a near nonexistent situation due to ADT/heat/lycopenes. I wonder if deep sleep is beneficial to stage 4 PC control or is it the other way around?

[MateoBeach]

“A research friend of mine told me . . “ is not evidence, it is anecdote. Ask him to please provide you with links or references to peer reviewed research on this and share it with us too please.This must come before deciding whether and how to obtain such high doses

[rocket09]

I have been taking 40 mg per night ,20 at bedtime and 20 4 hrs +- later. It helps with sleep and if it prevents metatasis thats a bonus. Been at it for 3 years or so. So far so good.

[HerbieP]

Dr. Neil McKinny's book "Naturopathic Oncology" 4th pp 159-162 edition says for cancer they target 10 to 20 mg, to tolerance, at bedtime only. He also states "Melatonin is a balancer and stabilizer in all stages of solid tumours, it is very helpful in most cancers, not just hormone dependent types." He goes on to list numerous benefits including increases p53 expression, anti-oxidant in low doses, pro-oxidant in high doses, increases effectiveness of radiotherapy, increases response and survival with chemotherapy...I take it.

[Hidden in reply to HerbieP]

My Nat onco Dr Uzick prescribed me . 20 mgs before bed.

[Hidden in reply to HerbieP]

Yes. I think <5mg is antioxidant and greater than 20mg is pro-oxidant (two years ago I worked up the doses from a few NIH studies - I added a buffer). Interesting it might increase ca ions. One of the theories for how Hi Testosterone works.

Melatonin: a well-documented antioxidant with conditional pro-oxidant actions - PubMed

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/250...

Melatonin elevates intracellular free calcium in human platelets by inositol 1,4,5-trisphosphate independent mechanism - ScienceDirect

sciencedirect.com/science/a...

Antioxidant and Pro-Oxidant Activities of Melatonin in the Presence of Copper and Polyphenols In Vitro and In Vivo

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[Hidden]

Puritan's Pride online store has 10mg capsules.

[blms]

I take only a 2.5 mgs melatonin every nite sublingually. if I take 5, I am too tired the next day. it definitely helps you sleep as it is a neurotransmitter and tells your brain that it is time to sleep. It takes about 30 minutes. I don't know about this dosage you are talking about. I would say take it slow and work up to what works for you. FYI, Memorial Sloan Kettering has a great part of their site under supplements with contraindications, research for or against diseases and treatment, etc. Check it out. And yes they do suggest melatonin for longer life as well as l theanine. Both of which I really like. Theanine I take morning and evening daily on empty stomach with no drowsiness, etc.

[HerbieP in reply to blms]

mskcc.org/cancer-care/diagn... is the link to the site you mentioned so those of us with chemo brain can remember

😆

[blms]

Great! I hope you that’s some

Beneficial information

[Niso]

Hi, you can order meltonin powder from pure bulk, so as capsules and a machine that you can make your capsules in low cost,the product is high quality and recommended by integrative oncologist that I watched him on a video few days ago, You can search it out on YouTube "optimizing oxidation in the care of chronically patients "

This mo encourage his patients to take high dose meltonin up to 420 mg total a day.

180 mg in the morning and 240 mg around the day.

He mentioned 8 benefits from studys, including apoptosis, angiogenesis etc.

purebulk.com/products/melat...