I enjoy beer and cider a great deal. I even make my own. I’ve asked my naturopath about alcohol and he gave the standard answer that it’s better to avoid alcohol altogether but a couple of week would do no harm. What’s the opinion here about alcohol? I’m always going back and forth between toeing the line with my diet and exercise and having a f*ck it attitude that I have what is most likely a terminal disease and I’m going to eat/drink and do what I want while I still can. The exercise part isn’t difficult. I enjoy exercise - running, swimming, and weights. And I generally have a good diet but there are times when I have cravings and it’s hard to deny myself.
Alcohol?: I enjoy beer and cider a... - Advanced Prostate...
Alcohol?
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fireandice123
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My onc when pressed, admitted that a glass of wine with dinner or an afternoon beer (singular) would be OK> Makes life more enjoyable when I can hit the local brewery for fish and chips and a nice barrel aged stout every week or so. Yes fish and chips may not be the most favorable diet idem, but as you say " need to have a life". The rest of the week, it's sticking to a restricted diet, but still hard not to gain weight after prostatectomy and orchiectomy. Zero Testosterone is a hard life.
Know what you mean about gaining weight. I find it nearly impossible not to gain weight while being on Lupron.
My beer of choice is a nice hoppy unfiltered New England IPA. I enjoy a good stout now and then as well.
I avoided alcohol when first diagnosed. But after a year I had a glass of wine with dinner (not every night). I also have a bottle of good German beer when dinning out.
"I’m always going back and forth between toeing the line with my diet and exercise and having a f*ck it attitude"
Tell me about it! I have a yo-yo for a brain.
The problem for some is that one drink often leads to three+ (not just to two) and so then it becomes perhaps better to just abstain. Kind of like Lay's chips... forget about eating just one, is one BAG quite enough?
A single good IPA and I find it easy to stop at one beer, but if I happen onto a pretty good bottle of wine, am I going to stop at one small glass? Not generally.
The good news is that almost all studies show that LIMITED alcohol intake is not associated with any significantly increased mortality or PC progression. In fact, I believe at least one study reported BETTER outcomes for men drinking very "modest" amounts of red wine.
The question when having just one glass is: how big is your glass?
I would avoid alcohol apart for a few a week. Alcohol and decrease in oxygen are not great for cancer - they help it grow.
I went to a talk by an astrophysicist (Paul Davies) a few years ago and what he said made sense. Cancer is a disease across all species (plants and animals) and started when we were in the primordial ooze when most species used carbon dioxide and a sugar molecule to grow and survive. He suggested we don't have either in our diet especially when we have cancer.
From this article: themonthly.com.au/issue/201...
Another therapy idea to come from the atavism theory also harks back a century, to the work of Otto Warburg, a Nobel Prize–winning physician. Normal human cells use oxygen to generate energy, but cancer often switches to fermentation, a low-oxygen, high-glucose process. It is less energy-efficient, but good for making biomass. Warburg discovered that cancer will switch to fermentation even in the presence of normal oxygen levels. It is tempting to speculate that, in reverting to an ancestral form, cancer is reprising a lifestyle adapted to the state of planet Earth at the time when multicellular organisms first evolved. And geologists have determined that before a billion years ago there was indeed far less free oxygen in the atmosphere. Some researchers have used this insight to advocate the application of hyperbaric oxygen therapy combined with a low-glucose diet to stymie the Warburg effect and slow the cancer.
Happy reading - my partner is an exercise machine but ramped up his aerobic exercise even more - had Stage IV prostate cancer diagnosed Dev 2018 and has been undetectable for 12 months now (he had all the treatments - surgery, ADT, radio and chemo) but nothing now apart from lots exercises, minimal alcohol and a chocolate reduction (but not elimination) from his diet.
Good luck to everyone - you are all in my thoughts.
See a real oncologist instead of a naturopath. There is no evidence that moderate alcohol use is harmful. Enjoy your life!
I love a juicy New England IPA, often wash it down with a shot of Bourbon, Cheers!
Bet ya find that the Pappy Van W tickles those taste buds JUST RIGHT???? 😋
Unfortunately, the local mega liquor store rotates managers frequently, the best I can do now is reserving a few bottles of Henry McKenna 10 year old bourbon at $49.99.
One bottle of red wine/night. Occasional cold beer.
Nal, I got a bit lost in your monologue. Do u think red wine is a plus or a minus?
+++++
A small glass of Red Wine in evening with loved ones and with a zen, philosophical mindset does not only provide Resveratrol but also boost on immune defenses due to relaxation. One additional benefit is that it brings semblance of normalcy in home where all our family members are constantly worrying about our wellbeing.
EXCESSIVE alcohol (1) Increase side effects of Lupron/Eligard on the liver.
(2) Increases Estrogen level in body causing more Gynecomastia. (Although may help with bone strength. ) (3) Family dysfunction and potential of wife/Girlfriend saying "Bye Bye".
(4) Lupron ADT weakens bones and alcoholics when drunk tend to fall ...if they fall fracture is more likely. (5) Beer Belly can get even bigger.
So, ONE small drink of Red Wine(20 ml) a day is my upper limit.
I have ben on lupron 4 yrs..and i being of irish persuation have to drink...i no longer drink for breakfast, and lunch maybe a beer......but soup of the day with dinner is always .irish whisky.....slaentja' enjoy life...🥃☘
Try being Scotch Irish. I drink all the time, but I'm pissed off at how much it costs.
Eat right, exercise, and drink moderately!
Hello firedance123,
Naturally he would 👀. Do you really want to give up every pleasure you have when you are staring at this ?
I have two double whiskey's every night and I enjoy them, there has been no reaction to dreaded demon drink from my treatment standpoint. Oh I forgot, also a gluten free lager.
From my own standpoint, I could give up meat, I could give up eggs, I could give up dairy products, in fact I could give up everything and where is the proof that any of it would have made the slightest difference.
It's your choice, not there's.
Cheers !
Phil
amen!!!!! As though something , cancer or other, will not be our undoing? I did see a PBS blurb some years ago comparing longevity between a large group of vegetarian 7th Day Adventists and another group of Adventists with "normal" diets.....longevity difference was very substantial!!!!! Repeatable.....I have no idea!!! Did make me wonder..before having that dish of ice cream??? One of the vegetatians was a still practicing MD in his 90s!!
Great
A little Tulamore Dew? I'll drink to that 🙂🥃
I'll join you Bob,
I've given up on the Mediterranean diet, too much plastic in my fish, oh and Rocket Salad, served with salmonella, em tasty 😋😂
Phil
Had to google Rocket Salad. Thought maybe it was something to do with musk melon.
Monte1111
Musk you say that in public !
I heard that someone just bought one and a half billion musk melons. A cantaloupe is now $250 a pound. Can this have a happy ending?
It's a deal!
Hi and thanks for such an interesting post and comments. The liver is a hard working organ for folks who have endured radiation and ADT like us. We are G8/G9 and were given a poor prognosis if we continued eating and drinking like we did in our 20’s and 30’s. So we stopped drinking and changed our diet to a Mediterranean diet 90% of the time with the occasional diversion ( chocolate and ice cream). We have achieved NED two years ago and PSA has remained at less than 0.02 for the past 3 years. We are happy! Booze is a drug which we can happily do without. And the big bonus is a lot of clarity and bucks in the bank to spend on what we love. Good outcomes to you.
I can only speak from our experience. My husband with PC 5 years and me with two different breast cancers. The only thing for sure is that no one REALLY knows how long your journey will be. For the years (G-d willing) that you have left, fight your cancer and fight it hard...but in the meantime...ENJOY EVERY MINUTE YOU HAVE!!! Drink the beer and cider, eat the foods you love and do the things that make your heart sing!
Your husband must worship you.
in reply to Justcallmeamy
Well said Amy!
Don’t deny yourself! My opinion. ❤️
On that note...I had read somewhere that cannabinoids may inhibit the processing of medicines in the liver. And like y’all, I take a lot of medicines. I wanted to see if CBD would lessen my crushing anxiety without having to resort to pills.
I enjoy a couple of single malts or a
glass of wine each day. My oncologist is OK with this.
Yeah Tallguy2, excellent taste, I wish you well and your oncologist.
Phil
I'll drink to that!
HiI usually drink beer ,french wine and Vodka but in occasion matter ,now covid19 i drink less.
Alcohol should be moderated because the lever can get damage.
Enjoy we live 1 live.
George
A little vodka before you replied? Enjoy.
I gave up alcohol and went on a very strict diet for a little over 2 years. I was 100% determined to beat the odds and be cancer free (mind over matter). I was so serious about it that I was unhappy. But I finally came to terms with my condition and decided to live with PCa rather than over-stress about beating it. Now I’ve struck a balance and enjoy life much more. I think that the stress caused by giving up the things that are familiar from life prior to PCa is worse than giving up the very things that are enjoyed (good or bad).So now I “listen” to my body, it is very clear to me when I should not have a drink etc...because my body now communicates it very clearly. For example, I’m currently going through chemo, during this time, I really have no desire for alcohol, but when it’s finished, I may or may not want a bourbon or some crazy rum drink by the pool.
I say enjoy your life. It’s too short not too.
fireandice123 in reply to
Yes, striking a balance is the key I think, not only in fighting cancer but with life in general.
I went from COMPLETE abstention (for about 3 years) to a glass of red wine with dinner daily in the last 6 months.
I MIGHT have a beer when we buy some for special company - but I don't buy any alcohol or stock any on a consistent basis (other than the wine).
I check any herbals or medications etc for negative interactions with alcohol and my doctors are aware of my consumption. I have not been warned or advised to STOP the wine glass - so I enjoy the glass of red and will sip on a single glass for an hour or more and LUV it.
I admit to having a problem with alcohol in the past but I also have the wisdom and discipline to say NO and limit my consumption. I've learned that my discipline makes that guilt free glass something to look forward to and II make sure I don't BUY and stock any alcohol to remove any temptation.
I have read that the ONLY 'category' of humans on the planet that actually benefit from alcohol are females past the age of 50 - that's it !
I suspect that like other things in life that are potentially bad for you - moderation is the phrase to recall -> 'guilt free consumption' ....
Cheers !
The Lupron has pretty much made me a 70 year old female. Glad I'm benefiting!
Watch out for the HI heels and the 'gropers' !
On friday i had my luprolide inj. And they gave me eligard instead of lupron.. it says to avoid alchohol....well i tried to avoid getting cancer....fk cancer lets all toast to that whatever your pleasure....Happy St. Patrick ....from irish in texas ...b.w☘ slaentja'
Good on you Boywonder 56,
St Patrick's day here is great, they reduce the whiskey down to a truly amazing price. Much better than Christmas 😆.
But I must point out, that I drink in moderation, that's when they let me in, of course.
Phil
15 year old Scotch is my choice. I enjoy it and it doesn't take a bottle to relax me. I think at this point in my life and for what we are made to endure with this decease its more than deserved. Leo
I had a horrible dx should have been gone by now and beaten 2 life expectancy’s from my docs. I have undetectable PSA and no advancement on my disease for like 3 yes now. I have a drink, rum and diet, or a beer almost every night. I exercise 3x a week and am very active, although very very worn out at the end of every day, especially for a 55 yr old. But I’m not willing to give up everything good and fun in my life. And so far, aces.
Dr. Charles "Snuffy" Myers always when I ask about lg drinking whiskey or alcohol said why not..... not verbatim. He drinks often. Diagnosed 11/2003. Stage 4 Gleason 4+3. Remission since around 2012 to present. Happy trails 😉 Keep a check on your liver.
I was astonished when my Dr. said "Your liver is ok, but you may have a problem with your prostate. " The only time I had ever heard prostate mentioned before was in jokes, or supplement advertising. The jokes make me cringe now.
in reply to erjlg3
“Often “ wow! 😂❤️
Very funny. I wonder if Home Depot has pine boxes on sale.
Et tu, Brute?Beware the Ides of March....
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
Monday 03/15/2021 11:17 PM DST
The Ides of March was yesterday. I made it. Beware the Police of March. That's tomorrow: St. Patrick's Day. Are there any snakes in NYC? I mean there's lots of rats to eat. Or did the rats eat the snakes? Can a chicken make it across the road? So many questions, so little time.
No problem with the police in NYC..... Our great mayor Bill de Blasio is a magician and was able to handcuff the Police when it came to fighting crime. All the snakes here are the New York City council members, who passed politically correct laws...The rats are all the people who vote for this idiots into power positions. Well you gotta be chicken to cross the roads here. In fact NYC is the only city in the world where when you're crossing a one way street you have to look both ways......
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
Tuesday 03/16/2021 6:42 PM DST
Watch out for the drones! Look up! Look up!
I don't worry about the drones it's the clones I worry about....
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
Tuesday 03/16/2021 8:01 PM DST
You must be talking about the republicrats and the democans. Talk about clones. There should be a lottery that picks the president. Those with hyphens in their name excluded, of course. No one over the age of 65 need apply!!! Match 5 numbers and you get NYC. Sorry.
Nope those Dems and Reps are clowns not clones.............
We don't need a president we need a benevolent Dictator....
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
Wednesday 03/17/2021 5:17 PM DST
Is that you, me, or someone we know?
Now your talking
Well well SPEEDYX.... nice to see you stepped out of the shadows to second my motion....."Kaliber for Dickator"
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
Wednesday 03/17/2021 6:42 PM DST
Been so busy!!!...think he will accept....he was never a good speller!
I think he has to..... he doen't know how to spell "no".....
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
Wednesday 03/17/2021 6:54 PM DST
Giggle, giggle. Do I know you sir?
Much better than the Harrisburg drunk tank.
It's Robin I'm worried about.
Hey fireandice! Alittle beer and cider is ok. Almost anything once in awhile is OK. Daily drinking , is no bueno for us . I smoke weed instead. I think it’s the high sugar in alcohol that’s not good .. I’ve lost my taste for drinking , more than once in a great while. Most of Us humans can enjoy a social drink . Just don’t climb into the bottle. I’m sure happy not to be a practicing alcoholic.. I cant take the hang overs anymore . I used to be a binge drinker . I wanted to get hammered. I liked the fine scotch . It wasn’t for the taste of it . I did my time drinking. Good luck . Moderation .
monte1111 in reply to
Hi Scott! I'm in a bottle and it's smoky in here. Wonder what j-o-h-n does with the bottles? I was gonna say a couple of months and we'll be melting, then remembered you moved to Prescott. Hoping you are all doing well! Monte
in reply to monte1111
Today is a good day . What more can one ask for ?
Great post. Hope you get to sit on the throne. I didn't mean that as a pun. I'm sure I didn't.
At least a 13. I was legendary.
I can just see Mel Brooks and j-o-h-n on stage together, in tights, kicking up their heels and dodging tomatoes. And j-o-h-n screaming "Who threw the rock?"
I know three recovering alcoholics who haven't touched a DROP in over 30 years...one has never had a prostate issue; one had a RP 20 years ago and is doing fine; the other had an RP 10 years ago and is now dead from cancer....so what can we conclude - IF ANYTHING??? I too found Jesus (metaphorically speaking) after my diagnosis but I soon realized that I enjoy alcohol way too much to become so strict about it; I enjoy wine, beer, a good scotch - never in excess - so why not? I'm going to die sooner or later from something and no amount of abstinence from anything is going to change that. My mother started smoking at 8 yrs of age (seriously!) and didn't stop until I took her cigarettes away at age 88 for fear of her burning down the house due to her dementia; she smoked 3 packs per day and never had a lung issue of any kind! She finally succumbed to Covid at age 98...I rest my case....,cheers, bud!!
Actually j-o-h-n's ex-wife had a bazooka. Kinda like the Blues Brothers.
The good old days, when the only thing we had to worry about was farting.
It’s so the Priest can park his bike 🤭
Pasties ....
I take a simple tack. First, I hear you, believe me. My thought is that, when I’m truly terminal (I’m not) or close to it, or near whatever my personal red line may be, I’ll eat dessert first. I’ll do some other things, too. If, however, I still had my prostate (I don’t), I know alcohol (black pepper, caffeine, carbonated beverages, etc.) are long-recognized irritants. Who decides?
No wonder I'm so irritated.
What is this? The blind leading the blind?
Absolutely! I think HU has a forum for A$$holes.
w.w.w.//j-o-h-n
My ex-wife told me to go out and get something to make her look sexy........ so I got drunk....
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
j-o-h-n Monday 03/15/2021 11:12 PM DST
Kai su, teknon (Και συ τεκνων),
Brutus "You too, my son, will have a taste of power"
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
j-o-h-n Monday 03/15/2021 11:22 PM DST
Here’s a fairly large study published a couple of years’ ago. Enjoy! :-
Study by Matthew Stenger
Posted: 5/16/2019 12:04:32 PM
Last Updated: 8/13/2019 5:17:07 PM
Cancer-free men who consumed vs did not consume alcohol had a slightly reduced risk of developing lethal prostate cancer.
Among patients with prostate cancer, red wine intake was associated with lower risk of lethal disease.
As reported by Downer et al in the Journal of Clinical Oncology, findings from the Health Professionals Follow-up Study indicate that moderate alcohol consumption is safe for patients with prostate cancer.
Study Details
The prospective cohort study used data from the Health Professionals Follow-up Study from 1986 to 2012. Analysis of alcohol intake among men at risk of prostate cancer included 47,568 men without cancer and 5,182 men diagnosed with nonmetastatic prostate cancer during follow-up.
Alcohol and Risk
Men without cancer who drank any vs no alcohol had reduced risk of developing lethal prostate cancer during follow-up (hazard ratio [HR] = 0.84, 95% confidence interval [CI] = 0.71–0.99), with no dose-response relationship being observed. Total alcohol intake among patients with prostate cancer was not associated with progression to lethal prostate cancer (HR = 0.99 for any vs none, 95% CI = 0.57–1.72); red wine intake was associated with a lower risk of progression to lethal disease (HR for any vs none = 0.50, 95% CI = 0.29–0.86). Intake of 15–30 g per day of total alcohol after prostate cancer diagnosis was associated with lower risk of death vs no intake (HR = 0.71, 95% CI = 0.50–1.00), as was any vs no red wine intake (HR = 0.74, 95% CI = 0.57–0.97; P trend = .007).
The investigators concluded, “Cancer-free men who consumed alcohol had a slightly lower risk of lethal prostate cancer compared with abstainers. Among men with prostate cancer, red wine was associated with a lower risk of progression to lethal disease. These observed associations merit additional study but provide assurance that moderate alcohol consumption is safe for patients with prostate cancer.”
Mary K. Downer, PhD, SM, of Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, is the corresponding author for the Journal of Clinical Oncology article.
Disclosure: The study was supported by the Prostate Cancer Foundation and National Cancer Institute grants. For full disclosures of the study authors, visit jco.ascopubs.org.
The content in this post has not been reviewed by the American Society of Clinical Oncology, Inc. (ASCO®) and does not necessarily reflect the ideas and opinions of ASCO®.
I'm sure you meant round of alcohol. Your Thanksgivings must have been a blast.
Give j-o-h-n a stripper's pole. You would be amazed. Or something.
Gotta go. FedEx is here.
I refused the packaged. The driver was very unhappy. His van really stunk.
Pretty good s c h t i c k Monte. Got to love the humor in here amidst the tragedy
Everything I know I learned from j-o-h-n. I came here, and come here for knowledge. There has been tragedy after tragedy after tragedy on this forum. And the tragedies are not going to stop. I have walked away at times, but have always come back. There are those who don't like the one liners or the potty jokes. And there are those who do. It isn't required reading. We are all here learning from some of the greatest minds we've ever come across. None of us want to be the next tragedy. I'd rather be the butt of someone's joke. Giggle, giggle.
I echo those sentiments...i tried a pc support group but it was mostly doc doing a hard sell on the latest and greatest procedure . Those of us with apc are really after qol and if that requires a STIFF drink or a FAT joint....so be it....i got here by drawing a f'd up hand...i enjoy the science that is available...and t.a. is unwaivering in his guidance. I have always had "a kids attitude" my wife Says im a 12 year old.
That said im grown up in my approach to my apc . But am probably limiting my approach to my current regime...spending my life saving chasing a cure is not me....i'd rather blow it on the grandaughter her smile is my best medicine....b.w.
My qof does require a STIFF drink, FAT joint, j-o-h-n and MONGOLIAN BEEF. I am on the hunt right now. I actually noticed my first symptoms playing Texas Hold'em on the 4th of July 2016. Granddaughters are special. I have spent many hours at THE MALL where keeping up with my Granddaughter was difficult. Before the Covid. She has become a young lady. She still doesn't know and I don't see any reason to tell here. Her smile is my best medicine....m.h.
Wow...i had biopsy../ dx.aug 2016...but had symptoms...blood in semen for while b4 new sumin was up but denile....longest river...hope we continue in group for looooong time...
Hope we all just float down the Nile. Where ever it's going, we're going it's way. Guess we can all do a little paddling once in a while.
You no why the creator made alchohol......so the irish wouldnt take over the world..... the girlfriend used to have a little Irish in her and then I got on Lupron
forget about it… no alcohol is best 12 years out.
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