Am I the only one in the world who thinks his pca was caused by NON-MILITARY exposure to dioxin? As a young stupid homeowner I used Monsanto's weedkillers, first the 2,4-di and then the 2,4,5-trichloro products. Both apparently contained carcinogens including the dioxin being targeted for VA benefits. I can't blame anyone, I'm a chemist and should have known to handle carefully, but I did not. Anyone else out there who thinks this was his cause, too?
herb
My wife has always used Monsanto weedeater around yard, I always thought I caught it as a result of cleaning up a world class oil spill in my youth sometimes without protective gear, or else from my love of bacon.
I prefer homemade pasta sauce myself.
I do now too Joe.
Joe, can you explain your reply? It's unclear to me.
herb
Sorry Herb,
Monsanto also grows tomatoes that you may buy at the market. I live in New Jersey. Tons, I mean tons, of tomatoes are grown here. We make homemade sauce from them. The best in the world, Jersey Tomatoes.
Joe
And, they sell their own bottled and canned products. We don't buy them.
Joe,
I'm in northern nJ. I may be an anomaly-i don't like tomatoes...and I'm sick to death of hearing about Joisey tomatoes! Presumably Monsanto is involved with many things. In my email I never accused them of doing anything nefarious (at least not ~45 years ago). I was merely stating observations and asking for others. Why it got people off-track escapes me.
herb
Herb,
I'm sorry brother. I've seen the Monsanto label since I was a kid. Food first, that's how they started. Seeds, then plants, then Herb-icides. Then anti-Herb-icides.
Sorry Herb. I feel like a heel, Joe.
you got that right brother. We moved to central Texas 10 years ago, and I am still on the hunt for a decent tomato. My family had a farm when I was growing up near St Michaels MD, and they grew tomatoes like the Jersey tomato. I never realized until we moved to Texas that you cannot buy good tomatoes down here, or I would have never taken the transfer.
I doubt that you are the only one in the world.
You are entitled to your opinion. The government's stand on exposure to dioxin during the Vietnam war and different diseases is that "it is likely as not" that it was the cause of many diseases in Vietnam War GI's (like me) later in life. In other words they can neither prove nor disprove it so they give the benefit of the doubt to GI's.
It all started with statistical anomalies years ago whereby many Vietnam vets developed diseases that should not have developed in the population at that particular age.
Unfortunately many of them did not survive to protest your "hypothesis". I am one of the fortunate who is still alive and kicking after treatment of this disease seven years ago and thus my opinion on your "hypothesis".
I spent my time in Nam, and ended up with PCA, and other diseases associated with Agent Orange disease.
Van, First, thank you for serving and I am sorry you are still paying the price for serving our country. I do hope you have worked with VA to get help and financial aid you deserve.
herb
Yep. The VA hospital here in Durham is very good and the VA administration in Winston-Salem is also very good. I applied for the disability and it was approved in 2 hours. I was at a VA sponsored meeting where they brought in the administrators from the VA, and the DAV to help vets apply for their disability. I've been on 100% disability for the last 16 months. I have been very lucky.
I believe mine was caused by a vasectomy as I had that 2 years before diagnosis and that's when my issues started.
Paul, If I recall correctly, the latest studies do NOT show a cause/effect for vasectomy and pca. As guys are writing in, there are many causes...and many cases that have no known relationship to anything! As Joel said, PCa existed before industrialization. I think they recently found an Egyptian mummy with prostate problem.
herb
Are you sure you had sufficient exposure to be able to support this claim?
Not sure, of course. All I can say is that I wiped out all the broadleaf foliage in my garden, lawn, etc. Stupid kid, I thought it knew which were bad broadleaves! Really. It's just that the time was right, early '60s.
While I got a few snide remarks (I don't know why), I do wonder if exposure by commercial and residential use was more, less or about same as military use.
herb
I often wonder, I fear that all the manmade chemical poisons in the environment combined with my youthful careless activities and lack of self advocacies and self health care concerns have contributed to my demise. if I knew then what I know now I would have done things different, but in light of what I know now, I really fear for our kids and the environment, we must protect our water and air at all costs and stop poisoning our food.
why do we tolerate it? I don't know,
Let's not forget that prostate cancer existed long before the Industrial Age .
Beermaker: thanks for your reply. You had no choice and no control. I was a bit older (now 81), a "trained chemist", and I shoulda knowd better!! I don't know if there have been any private legal action against Monsanto and others about this. As the guys say, however, it would be very hard to prove a connection--particularly in the case of chemists who work(ed) with various chemicals.
herb
This is a FWIW post. I have advanced PCa. I was diagnosed at age 65, had a radical prostatectomy shortly thereafter at age 66. I am now 71 and doing ok on ADT.
Absolutely no family history anywhere of cancer, with the exception of a cousin. He worked with nasty chemicals as a computer service engineer. So did I. But to the point of the OP, I too have been exposed to 2-4-D and 2-4 5-T. As a child, my father would take me along as a spotter of poison ivy at our summer camp. There was a lot of it. He used a combo of the 2 chemicals in a tank sprayer. We spent several days each summer spraying both our place and helping neighbors who could not do the work. So I had a pretty heavy exposure to two possible cancer causing agents.
I have wondered for some time if there was any cause / effect from these exposures. While I, too, am a former chemist, I sure didn't know anything about this at age 7, or even at 23 when I did the computer service work. But yes, I do suspect that there is some connection. Too late to do anything about it now.
Herb,
I feel somewhat responsible for your post going way off track. You may be a chemist today, but at one time we were all young and dumb.
I did a stint in the pesticide biz, and one thing I know as fact: "Household" pesticides don't come close to the toxicity of the commercial stuff. If either was used as labeled, chances are you would be safe from being poisoned.
The men who had feet down in Nam are the ones who got the shaft. And their gov't knew it. First, they got showered with it. Then, they had to eat in it , sleep in it, fight in it, and far too often, die in it. Who knows how many cancers were caused in the final outcome.
Yesterday, I had written a diatribe about what may have caused my PCa. I deleted it. It turned into a confession of all my past misdeeds as a teen and young man. The point is, I don't think anyone can pinpoint a time or circumstance that may have kicked it off. Being men, as we age the prostate grows naturally. Some just go whacky. That's my non-scientific input for the day, thank you very much.
Peace, Joe
Joe, I am fascinated how this little "unimportant" query did elicit so much action! And I need to correct you. I was young and stupid, now I is old and stupid! The best part is that I ended up teaching, consulting and lecturing on chemical safety!!!
herb
LMAO Herb! This is good stuff to just put a smile on your face and screw the disease.
Joe
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