is it reflux or CMA??

[shirlz8485]

Hi I have a 9 week old LG that suffers badly from bringing her milk back up after a feed. Sometimes straight away, sometimes even hours after a feed. She can be sitting happily OR even asleep and will bring up her milk. It is nothing other than milk.

I have spoken to the doctors, and what a waste of time so far They have prescribed Gaviscon infant since she was 2 weeks old and it hasn't helped... all I get from them is lets keep trying for another 2 weeks.

Being fast asleep and at least 2 hours after a feed, and then bringing up ,isn't right is it??????????

I have our 8 week check tomorrow so will be seeking a second opinion (as its another doctor) because it is really getting me down that I know something is wrong but the docs don't seem too bothered.

So could it be a CMA?? the symptoms are so similar … or even colic as again so similar

Im a desperate mummy after some answers... thanks for reading xx

[Lovefood1984]

Sorry to hear your little one is bringing up milk, I have a daughter who was diagnosed with CMPA at 7 weeks and she’s now 6 months old. I agree the symptoms can be confusing, I told my GP I wasn’t sure if ours was silent reflux or CMPA and she started with the milk first, we then used meds for two weeks whilst things settled down but other than thickening the milk didn’t need them after that. Can I ask if she has any other symptoms, green poo? Not settling after feeds or in the evening? Bad napping/only sleeping upright? Rashes? By 7 weeks our little one would not nap during the day at all! due to the pain and at night would only sleep upright 😢 If she’s happy in herself with no other symptoms and is gaining weight then I’m afraid they probably will just put it down to reflux which she will grow out of x

[shirlz8485 in reply to Lovefood1984]

Her poop is a normal colour but 99% of the time is constipated she gets unsettled after every feed as if she is in pain and has “milk spots” on her face and around her ears.

She will sleep in a laid down position but has to be on her side but again then she is so unsettled and it trailing her arms and legs most of the night. Doesn’t settle well in the day and I do sometimes struggle to get her to have a decent time of a nap.

She is on anti reflux milk and gaviscon infant at the minute but still being milk sick after most feeds and always looks and acts uncomfortable

She also cry’s uncontrollably for hours in the late afternoon/ evening as if it is colic ... which again the symptoms are so alike.

I have her 8week check today so am going to ask a lot of questions to see what happens.

[Lovefood1984 in reply to shirlz8485]

The constipation is probably from the gaviscon but can also be a symptom. If you want a thickener to use there’s a one called Carobel that doesn’t come with the side effects but her anti reflux milk will contain the same ingredient actually. Judging by what you have said with regards to other symptoms I’d push to try one of the extensively hydrolysed milks (they are the first port of call with trying to diagnose), there’s Aptamil Pepti 1 which contains lactose but is the most closest tasting to regular formula, SMA Althera, Nutramigen 1 and Similac Alimentum are the most common. I’d ask to trial new formula for a week or two (bear in mind the tins are half the size of the supermarket ones so make sure they give you enough, oh and they stink so hopefully she will drink it!) and ask for a review after that, you’ll notice a massive difference if it is CMPA within a day or two although it will take a few weeks for things to settle down fully as the gut heals. Try not to let them push meds, they like to do this as it’s cheaper for them to treat reflux and not the underlying cause which is why they start with that first 😢. Personally I don’t believe in ‘Colic’, babies don’t just cry for no reason, something must be bothering them but it’s not always easy to work out so gets labelled as such. Hope you get sorted x

[shirlz8485 in reply to Lovefood1984]

You are amazing thank you. Not many people around me that actually understand ... my mum even said... you may just have a sicky baby.... I know there is something more and I’m going to push it today.... I can’t carry on for another 2 weeks on gaviscon because it will still be the same so why delay something that needs doing anyway in the long run. I will let u know how I get on xx

[Lovefood1984 in reply to shirlz8485]

I think it’s true mother’s know best. Even at 5 days I knew something was wrong as she screamed for hours, luckily for me I had been expressing and once she took a whole bottle of breast milk she was fine which got me thinking. At the time I knew nothing about CMPA so we bought some SMA HA milk which is broken down more and she settled but by 7 weeks it had all gone very downhill and by then I’d done more research and knew she might have it, I was lucky to have a GP who was happy to try, let me know how you get on. Surely they can’t moan at a few trial tins to rule it out x

[shirlz8485 in reply to Lovefood1984]

Well the doctor listened we have been given milk free formula to try.

So far we have had 3 bottles and more active and less uncomfortable

We still have a bit of posseting but I think that is down to the need of upping her gaviscon she has gone over the 4.5kg mark to have 2 sachets per feed.

Need to call them tomorrow to let them know how she is getting on and get some more milk and up her gaviscon no doubt.

But it’s early days so taking each feed as it comes until we see some real improvement

[Lovefood1984 in reply to shirlz8485]

Yayyyyy! Which one did you get given? (Just curious 😊) We noticed a difference within a day or two, you may find once everything is settled you don’t need the gaviscon but I’d certainly stick with it (we’ve not moved her off her thickener yet, I’m waiting until she stops bringing up stuff, albeit small amounts but I was hoping by 6 months she’d of grown out of it 🤦🏼‍♀️) I’m not loving this weaning malarkey, she may have reacted to a coconut based yoghurt (no milk in it) this week so I’ll need to retrial next week to confirm it was that and not a bug 🙄 So that’s all dairy alternatives we’ll be avoiding if it is the case as I’ve been told to keep her soya free for now too 😂 the joys! Roll on a dietician appointment, it’s taken a month just to get a letter asking if we wanted an appointment after the paediatrician referred us. Hope things improve swiftly for you x

[shirlz8485 in reply to Lovefood1984]

Nurtamigen 1 they have given Me.

It’s early days as she is still constipated from the Anti-Reflux milk and gaviscon. The only thing I’m worried about is this milk being a lot “looser” like water which is why she isn’t keeping it down... but it’s only the 3rd bottle she has had so it’s going to take some time to adjust.

When I call the docs tomorrow (as they only gave me one tub) will see what they say about the thickness as that helped a lot with the regular formula so she can keep it down.

But we are on the right track :).

[Lovefood1984 in reply to shirlz8485]

Unfortunately a lot of the prescription milks are thin, you can get thickener to add, my GP wouldn’t prescribe it so I buy 6 boxes a time off amazon but some will, hopefully they’ve already offered you some today as we find it does help 😊 I’m so glad to hear you are on the right track as I’m sure are you, sometimes mums instinct is totally right x

[shirlz8485 in reply to Lovefood1984]

Can I ask which you use due to cmpa?? They won’t prescribe it because she is on gaviscon.

Like just... have her a feed less than an hour ago and she is sat here as happy as Larry not doing a lot ... and just brings up the majority of her milk....

I know it’s going to take some time to settle down with milk change etc I think I’m trying to rush it all

[Lovefood1984 in reply to shirlz8485]

We use Carobel made by cow and gate, any pharmacy can order it in for you to buy or Amazon sell it. I know a lot of people on the Facebook CMPA forum use it either instead of gaviscon like us or use it for the bottles where they can’t use gaviscon (due to sachets per day limit?) I think it’s less likely to have side effects such as the constipation that gaviscon has which is why we got recommended it by the GP. I’ve heard it’s the same stuff they put in comfort milk anyway 🤷‍♀️ There are a few CMPA babies who react to it as it’s made from locust bean gum which is the same family as soya which some CMPA babies can’t tolerate either (hence why we’ve been told to wean soya free for now too until we see a dietician). The good thing about it is you can change the consistency as suits you, I'm hoping to wean her off it eventually. A bit like comfort milk you may need to go up a teat size.

I’m sure as her stomach heals which can take a few weeks you’ll hopefully see less milk coming back up, although as long as she’s happy that’s the main thing rather than being in pain with it. Having an unhappy baby is the most painful part x