Everyone should see this: This closed Government... - PMRGCAuk

PMRGCAuk

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Everyone should see this

maria40
maria40

This closed Government consultation proposes that, after EU regulations no longer apply to UK laws on vaccines (after Dec 31st), that unlicensed vaccines for flu and Covid 19 could be used. It would also allow unqualified staff to vaccinate with no redress on any adverse reactions.

Please read it as it has worrying implications. Though the date to submit comments has passed (September 18th) there is still an opportunity for medical professionals to comment. (See final paragraphs)

I am in no way opposed to vaccination but this concerns me and feel it should certainly be debated in parliament and more widely known of.

I can't get the link to come up here but the document can be found if you search under Government consultation on vaccines.

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19 Replies
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DorsetLady
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer

gov.uk/government/consultat...

Is this article you mean?

maria40
maria40 in reply to DorsetLady

Yes that is it. I find it rather concerning in the hands of this Government which seems to have scant regard for normal parliamentary procedure.

DorsetLady
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer in reply to maria40

Yes they do....and that’s down to B.J. and DC. I read yesterday from a past colleague of B.J. that he doesn't like confrontation - that would explain a lot of things! But how can you be expected to perform as PM or attend PM questions in House of Commons if you don’t like confrontation?

maria40
maria40 in reply to DorsetLady

I do find the role of DC rather worrying. He is said to have expressed eugenicist sympathies in the past and his relationship with the truth seems somewhat tenuous - but that of course can also be said of BJ. But these are the people who have to 'guide' us through Covid19 and they haven't even got us a functioning testing system.

I know this is not the place for political opinion but when Government policy impinges on our health in such a critical way then I think it is relevant.

Viv54
Viv54 in reply to DorsetLady

Exactly !!

Viv54
Viv54 in reply to maria40

Wow , thats scary !!!!!

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador

This is a link to an article with discussion of the document:

standard.co.uk/news/health/...

which does explain the concept. I'm not saying that I'm not concerned about how this current government could use it as a basis for something broader but it is aimed at speedier access to Covid vaccines.

maria40
maria40 in reply to PMRpro

I agree that in principle it sounds logical but the fact that it extends to 2022 and that this government has a tendency to govern by edict rather than parliamentary procedure I do have concerns. Unfortunately I only heard of this yesterday so too late to do much.

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to maria40

There isn't much chance of there going to be a vaccine before the spring - and that will be a starting one, there will be better later, so faster implementation will continue to be needed for a while I think.

yorkieme
yorkieme in reply to maria40

This forum has proven to be an extremely helpful source of information for me personally during the last nine months and I am sure for many others.

While I have no doubt the majority of posters are able to reach their own conclusions regarding political decisions I feel a little uneasy that in the first instance you quite rightly raise up the document for people to consider,but then go on to express your personal views of Johnson and I assume the initials refer to Dominic Cummings.

My views of the two individuals differ from yours and I would always enjoy a debate with you on that subject, but ! I don't agree that it should happen on this forum as it could have the tendency to push me or others away.

Sorry if this offends you but it isn't intended to. I agree entirely with the rest of your comment.

DorsetLady
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer in reply to yorkieme

I referred to both individuals as well - but as you say - not a subject to be continued on here. .. and as for me no offence taken, it’s a free world (last time I looked) and all entitled to their own views. Nuff said.

Unlicensed does not mean untested. One would anticipate that such a vaccine would have been required by law to have undergone the same rigorous testing and retesting as any other marketable / healthcare product / drug. Unlicensed drugs are widely endorsed by GP’s when there is no suitable alternative. I have come across it in psychiatry several times. Unfortunately BJ and friends do no instil us with confidence in these uncertain times and when all is said and done they are likely to opt for “the greater good” which in itself cannot mitigate against all risks 😬. As PMR pro has suggested fast implementation may be needed for the time being.....Without wasting time on the bureaucracy required for licensing which may hinder our access to what is required here and now....

maria40
maria40 in reply to CF2020

I do appreciate the difference between untested and unlicensed and I agree with much of what you say but the fact that under EU law unlicensed vaccines cannot be used and they would have to wait until the end of the year when we have left the EU does suggest a lowering of standards

Longtimer
Longtimer in reply to CF2020

Yes I saw a breakfast tv doctor explain that many unlicensed drugs are used........so EU regs must be allowing them.....

It does rather smack of that doesn’t it maria40. Let’s hope BJ does the right thing over the next 24 hours or so to keep our most vulnerable as safe possible 🙂

Dear Maria40, this is terrible news so many bad things are meant to be happening when we leave the EU. We need to be strong together and if we see something we don't like stand up to it!

maria40
maria40 in reply to Teatrees

I feel that too but also feel we have little power to do so .

I was a pharmacist prior to retiring and I have worked in regulatory affairs where I was responsible for preparing documents for submission to the MHRA for the purpose of gaining marketing authorisations and product licences. Having just read the document you refer to, I cannot see the problem? As for "unqualified personnel administering vaccines" I think you are misinterpreting the proposal and perhaps are unaware of the laws which govern administration of medical products to humans. For example a Vet is not permitted to inject or treat a person under the law as it stands at the moment which is why this change to the law is necessary and hence the consultation process. There is no way the population of the UK will be vaccinated by anyone who has not received training. That person will also be protected from prosecution because of the temporary exemptions this new legislation provides.

Sorry, but I have to say this! This forum was, WAS, the one place I could go without seeing somebody criticising Boris & his govt...I guess the people who are doing this could be doing a better job themselves. These are completely ‘uncharted waters’ the world find itself in, & I think every country is feeling their way. I’m not turning this into a political debate, I’m just fed up of reading more & more criticisms of the govt, & I wish we could all just pull together, they are all we’ve got, and I, for one, think they are working long hours & tirelessly to try & help. I’m not commenting on success, or otherwise. I realise you are trying to bring a medical matter to our attention. I read a long article on how people will be trained to give the vaccines...they aren’t going to be using untrained folk, & the type of people they suggest are healthcare workers, in the main, who are not licensed to give injections at present, but will be trained to. All those diabetes who inject themselves daily were untrained, too! Hope you don’t find my reply offensive, it’s not mean to be, & as I’m not interested in politics, per se, I will support any govt who is trying to deal with a new global pandemic, with no history.

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