Weekly Chat 19th to 25th... The saying is that "those who can't, teach"

[GoGo_JoJo]

We all know of the coaches and trainers who almost made it but then ended up teaching others. Always seems a bit of a waste of potential, but then maybe not.

As an experiment last week I have done 2 guiding/mentoring sessions, 1 was one on one and the other 1 to 2 with one of them being the first lady again, to give others more experience and confidence on trails and the safety/security of having someone do the route/guiding.

I enjoyed it more than I expected and as a result I have decided I will get a LiRF Leadership in Running Fitness qualification, the FT version (Fell and Trail) which provides insurance etc and maybe see where it goes.

For me it seems odd anyone would pay for a couple of hours out running but it seems they very much would!

Both ladies enjoyed themselves hugely and both it seems learned new tricks and tips for up and downhill trail negotiation.

For me, it was nice to have company and to feel that I had something useful to pass on...

What new skills would you like to learn related to running or what do you feel you are able to pass back to those coming along their running journey?

As always, if you're new here, or just browsing through the community posts, this is a great place to introduce yourself and let us know how you are doing. You’ll find plenty of support and knowledge from your fellow runners here.

Have a great week, everyone!!!

The Marathon Team xxx

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[linda9389 Administrator Marathon]

That sounds really exciting! I once paid for exactly that with a company called Run the Wild runthewild.co.uk/ (my one and only venture into 'group runniing). They have clearly grown from much smaller origins and now do European trail running holidays as well as group running on our local trails. Who knows where this new venture may lead you 😊. Have fun and all the very best.

Running seems to provide constant learning without me even trying! At some point though, I think I'd like to learn how to run properly (as in efficiently/safely), but that would necessitate some sort of scrutiny and I'm not ready for that just yet 😅.

Have a good week everyone.

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to linda9389]

Yes, I'm still playing with the idea of a full sports lab experience but not sure I want the criticism!!! 🙈🤣

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Ahh, but they may tell you you're amazing!!!

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to linda9389]

Yea.... but they might (and more likely) not!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[roseabi Ultramarathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

I have been pondering your question but the only thing that keeps coming to mind is a proper lab analysis!

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to roseabi]

Yes, I'm still keen on this but it will need to be at a time I'm feeling good enough for it not to knock me flat!!! 🤣🤣

[roseabi Ultramarathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

I have been thinking about asking my husband to video me - it'd be amusing at least! 😂

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to roseabi]

That could be very amusing! 🙈 we're not very objective with ourselves though!

[misswobble Marathon in reply to roseabi]

I don’t think I’d venture to ask mine 😣

[Beachcomber66 Administrator Half Marathon]

I can see the sense in paying someone to take charge of the navigation on moor trails where getting lost isn't easy to resolve, especially when mists come down. A guide takes away that worry, and deals with my other hang up, not wanting to ruin the day for others by holding everybody up. If I pay, I get to set the pace.

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Beachcomber66]

🤔 I hadn't thought of that angle. I had simply thought we would run roundabout the pace of the slowest runner but also that many road folk don't realise the necessity of slowing down on the trails, the terrain often just doesn't allow for faster runs.

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to Beachcomber66]

Interesting! The one thing that spoiled my guided trail outing was the fear that I may be holding everyone up!!! That was even though the company had decided which group I should go in based on times you gave them (and I'd stressed they were road times and I wasn't used to trails AND I wanted an easy run!!!).

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to linda9389]

Surely everyone thinks they'll hold others up? I do! But I also think if people want to run with others they have to compromise/ work with that too...

[misswobble Marathon in reply to Beachcomber66]

Yes that’s true I’ve been out once on a ramble and it fell dark while we’d still got to reach the car park. We thought if we carried straight on we’d find it. Trouble is when it’s dark you can soon veer off course. Earlier on the same walk, we’d said just think if we were here and the weather came in.

[Beachcomber66 Administrator Half Marathon in reply to misswobble]

A couple of years ago I did a fantastic starlit head torch run up to the Wainstones. There were dangerous drops all over the place, but the guides made it possible for us to enjoy something we couldn’t possibly have done on our own. All for the price of a small charitable donation. Guides are amazing. 👍

[Tasha99 Marathon in reply to Beachcomber66]

BC. I have the wainstones half marathon coming up. I’m dreading it. Think it’s worse than roseberry half 😶🤣

[Beachcomber66 Administrator Half Marathon in reply to Tasha99]

You will be fine. 👍

[Irishprincess Administrator Half Marathon]

Good for you! A new running challenge! Sounds like a lot of fun and very satisfying. Good luck with your new adventure 🍀

I’d still like to learn how to pace myself better as I’m rubbish at it. Every now and then I make an effort and it’s not too bad but then on the next run I forget about it. At the end of the day I guess it’s not that important to me but I do think that it would be very helpful in races when I reckon my inconsistent pacing sometimes costs me a better finish time 🙄

In terms of passing back, I think I’ve mastered the art of being patient when injured and have full belief that I’ll always return to running so I’d try to give others a bit of self-confidence that injury is temporary but running is forever 🥰

In other news, I’ve had my first run in my new shoes and they were every bit as light and frothy and cloud-like as I expected 🥰

Have a good week everyone x

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Irishprincess]

Yes, self control when rehabilitating is such a big thing!

Have you tried pacing to a set beat? You can find out the bpm of tracks and then choose others that fit the right beat.

I think for most folk slowing down is harder than trying to speed up 🤔

[Irishprincess Administrator Half Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

I have tried pacing to a beat but haven’t done it for ages. Since lockdown I’ve run mostly on my narrow country roads and so no earplugs but I’ll give the beat thing another go just to mix things up!

[roseabi Ultramarathon in reply to Irishprincess]

My watch has a metronome - maybe yours does too? Not tried it mind you, so I don't know if it's any good...

[Irishprincess Administrator Half Marathon in reply to roseabi]

I just checked mine and no it doesn’t ☹️

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to Irishprincess]

I'm right there with you on the injury thing IP!

[Irishprincess Administrator Half Marathon in reply to linda9389]

We’re experts aren’t we Linda 🙄

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to Irishprincess]

Sadly so ...

[SkiMonday Ultramarathon in reply to Irishprincess]

One trick that I've heard is to listen to your breathing and use that to set your effort / pace.

[Irishprincess Administrator Half Marathon in reply to SkiMonday]

I use breathing for my cadence which, in my case, seems mostly unrelated to my pace 🤔 I can have a consistent cadence but the pace is all over the place.... still working on that one..

[RunWillie Marathon]

That sounds really exciting GoGo_JoJo 👍🏻Amazing to be able to do what you love and help others.

I’m very happy at the moment with my weekday maf run / walks and a faster 5k at park run. I’m always keen to learn new things about running though. Another runner passed me the other day moving very very quickly with quick fast steps. I would love to improve my cadence but always nervous about injury trying to adjust running technique. When I started low heart rate training I could only keep my heart rate down running if I ran on my tippy toes. I realised quite quickly that was going to end very badly for me 🤣

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to RunWillie]

That sounds good, it's nice to have a good routine.

Tippy toes... yea that could definitely get you into trouble... but you should be able to play with cadence a bit without too much worry. Hill work is useful for this as small steps help on both up and down sections and especially uphill a quicker tempo doesn't feel to hard but will get you up faster!

Shorter, smaller stride is great on uneven terrain to as it keeps your center of gravity more central reducing the chance of a slip or trip, and if you do usually you can recover it faster.

[RunWillie Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Thanks for the tips GoGo_JoJo 🥰

Hills are hard to find along the coast where I live in Western Australia Perth 🇦🇺. It’s so flat but I will keep exploring ❤️🏃‍♀️

[cheekychipmunks Half Marathon]

If anyone is made for a job like that it’s you GoGo_JoJo ! You’re trail queen and people will learn a lot from you. 😀 Keep us posted how it’s going won’t you?

It took me a while to accept that my trail times wouldn’t match my road ones, but my trials now are averaging similar to my old road times, at least when they’re dry like they are now. It’ll be interesting to see how I get on when I return to PR in June. I’ve barely touched a road since the first lockdown! I would like to learn how to run faster up hills though. I have no trouble getting up most - it’s just that I slow down a lot!

Happy runs in this luscious weather everyone. ☀️

[misswobble Marathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

I can’t run fast uphills! I can run slow up hills so that’ll have to do 😁

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

I wouldn't expect anywhere near road times off road, not unless you're seriously confident and long legged!! 👍🏻😁

Uphill I actually find easier than down. (Much harder to fall up the hill, yes I know it can be done!)

The biggest trick is to forget about the top. Looking up just demotivates instantly. Just focus on the ground in front of you. Tiny steps but faster cadence. 👍🏻😁

[cheekychipmunks Half Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

That’s where my little legs come in handy. I’m very confident running downhill and over rough (within reason) terrain. My lower centre of gravity helps I guess, but it doesn’t help me get up hills quickly! But yes, I agree about not looking to the top of the hill, that’s a killer! I will try to up my cadence though. 😀

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

Like you I live close to the ground! 🙈🤣 I sometimes envy the long legged but they often struggle downhills whereas I just pretend I'm a goat! 🤣🤣

[Cmoi Marathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

I'm lucky, quite a lot of the time I can't see to the top of the hill, because it's either covered in trees 🌲🌲🌲, has a load of bends in it, or it's just too far! If I head up the main road through the forest it's 3k to my usual turning-off point onto the forest track. I need to start going further up ... 🔜 🔝 🤔 🤣

[misswobble Marathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

I notice that men run up hills much faster than us. Because they’re physically stronger I guess

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to misswobble]

Er... I've overtaken fellas uphill. It's more the leg length I think. Strength is very subjective, I'm stronger than some of the guys I work with, no contest.

It's even funnier when it's fellas on bicycles. 🤣

[cheekychipmunks Half Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

My legs are definitely NOT long! 😅

[cheekychipmunks Half Marathon in reply to misswobble]

I remember “powering” up the hill at PR once, thinking how well I was doing, only to be left for literal dust by a dad pushing a double buggy. They are ninjas those buggy pushers, male and female! 🥵

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

Yes, now that is really putting in the effort!! 👍🏻🤣

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Whenever I look at my Grade Adjusted Pace in strava, I am way 'faster' going uphill than downhill; I know when I'm heading downhill I lean right back and braaaaaakkkkkkeeeee for dear life 🤣 I really do try to at least stand up straight, if not exactly lean forward, but before I know it I'm leaning back again digging my heels in for dear life 🤷‍♀️

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to linda9389]

That's because you're scared of falling forward. If you use smaller steps you'll have more stability. If you're really worried about falling go down in a zigzag to take some of the descent off 👍🏻😁

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Spot on, I am. We don't even have to talking steep or uneven 😅. Smaller steps? May give that a try 👍

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to linda9389]

We just need to get together, I'll help you find your inner goat! 👍🏻🤣

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

There must a logo and byline in there somewhere for your new business venture 😅

[SkiMonday Ultramarathon in reply to cheekychipmunks]

My current technique for going up hills is to maintain cadence and reduce stride length. Seems to work OK.

For downhills, my first approach was to try and "freewheel" as if I was on a bike but I found that I was getting to the point where I couldn't handle the speed. Nowadays, I go for the highest cadence I can manage and control my decent like that.

On some decents, I've failed to notice that I'm going downhill and just carried on at the same pace as on the flat. Maybe I should pay more attention.

[Beachcomber66 Administrator Half Marathon]

It’s funny. I can manage pace ok (but I check my watch regularly; I am not that confident!) and know when my stride length and cadence is about right for a particular pace. It’s stopping the rush of blood “go for a Pb” which is my downfall!

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Beachcomber66]

Ah well I've heard self control comes with age 🤔 I think the chocolate would disagree!! 🙈🤣

[Beachcomber66 Administrator Half Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

I am doing well at the moment control wise, but I have had loads of aversion therapy over the last 12 months!!! At 69 years old long periods of control may have bypassed me!

[Decker Ultramarathon]

Great stuff Jo. I think this role was made for you! I think for myself I’d like more knowledge around back country orienteering. I wind up using google maps in the woods when I get lost, but the signal is not always that solid, something a bit more important on solo runs the further you venture out. Not done any really remote running yet, but I would like to at some point.

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Decker]

Yes, map reading and navigation skills are important. I can't remember but there must be a national mapping system there like we have our Ordinance survey maps 🤔

[Decker Ultramarathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Now I’m thinking there are likely some good youtube vids on this subject to at least get more familiar with it. Going to do some digging...

[misswobble Marathon]

I want to learn navigation for running off-road. I run off-road all the time but not generally on fells etc I’ve done a short fell race but it was marked and marshalled. The longer ones aren’t usually so I’d like to learn how to get myself round

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to misswobble]

I've seen some courses for this, when I finally get up north for the certification I'll find out more 👍🏻

[misswobble Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Our local ultra guy does courses I hear. The local ultra is self-supported so you have to run with a map If it’s rainy and windy that cd be fun. That’s where “the knowledge” comes into its own 🙂

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to misswobble]

Definitely! More of an adventure too!

[Sandraj39 Half Marathon]

Sounds like a great plan GoGo_JoJo ! Best of luck with your training - I am sure there will be many who would benefit from your experience and training.😀🏃‍♀️💪

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Sandraj39]

Thanks Sandra. I do hope so. I'll still continue with my own goals of reaching 30 mules and seeing where that takes me but it should give another side to running to stop just chasing weekly mileages. 👍🏻

[misswobble Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

I’ve not got to 30 miles either. It’s like looking for buried treasure 😃.

When I did my last marathon I thought about having to go on to an ultra distance, and I didn’t think I could. I was done! At that time I reasoned that could be because mentally I’d set myself the 26 miles target. Had I set myself a 30 miles one maybe I’d do it 🤔🤷‍♀️ Maybe once I saw the finish I mentally shut up shop. If that makes sense ☺️

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to misswobble]

I know I can go longer, my only worry is the foot pain issue I had and still have to be careful of in the left foot.

I think my worry is where do I go from there... I want to be happy with 30 and not keep extending the carrot... I think 30 is a great "plodders" distance 🤔

[misswobble Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

If I got to 30 miles I don’t know where I’d go from there 🤔. Further, knowing me 🙂. If you can go long and navigate yourself about, then there’s nowt stopping you, injury issues aside

Wonderful thing to ponder, having not got there yet 🙂

[roseabi Ultramarathon in reply to misswobble]

I always stop when I reach my set distance - whatever the distance and no matter how far from home! 😂

[misswobble Marathon in reply to roseabi]

💪😃

[Sandraj39 Half Marathon in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Absolutely. I would love to have someone guide me a little with my running - despite profound concerns about being judged(!)😂😕 I think you will be fab!😊

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Sandraj39]

Gosh I don't think anyone who runs is very judgey.... 🤔 we all know how hard it can be plus we all have wobbly bits! 🤣

[Oldfloss Administrator]

Sounds really exciting and well worth while!I think if I took up an offer of training, it would be how to really improve my posture. Husband did video me running, a year or so again and it did hep me to focus more but gradually I found bad habits creeping back in!

[GoGo_JoJo Ultramarathon in reply to Oldfloss]

Yes, I've often looked at those shoulder/back bands! I have a dreadful habit of tensing my shoulders and they creep up to my ears! 🙈🤣 maybe I'm part turtle! 🐢

[Oldfloss Administrator in reply to GoGo_JoJo]

Ha ha..I lean in a rounded shoulder manner!

[misswobble Marathon in reply to Oldfloss]

Yes, so do I, so I have to haul myself up, and set myself right.

There’s a terrible photo of me on a marathon where I look 90 ☺️💪. I was fine at the end ,so we can correct ourselves