I stumbled across a study that I thought would be of interest to those who struggle with getting enough protein without interfering with meds. Unfortunately it's just the abstract, so no info on dose/delivery methods; pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/367...
"Conclusions: Our results show that whey protein supplementation does not interfere with DRT's efficacy and can be used in PWPD who need a protein supplementation without restrictions in intake hours."
One concern I have is that Dr. Mischley suggests PWP avoid dairy. Does anyone know if that advice extends to whey?
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Rufous2
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Laurie Mischley is a doctor who treats PwP, some of them participants here. She has been conducting a study on what people who are progressing slowly are doing diet/supplement-wise. Apparently dairy consumption is associated with faster progression.
Do men in Canada progress faster into PD than men in Europe? because there is a big difference between the two groups in dairy consumption . I was told by an old pharmacist ( confirmed by an Neurologist ) that dairy protein does not have as large an effect on the LD /CD being converted to Dopamine suitable for use in the brain and I have used a glass of milk to wash down my medications for many years.
Unless your good doctor has some new reliable data I think that she may be just passing on another PD old wives tale.
Actually, studies showing an association between dairy and PD have been around for a long time. Dr. Mischley's study just seems to concur with those. link.springer.com/article/1...
That being said, the info you got from your pharmacist seems to agree with this new study on whey....ie "dairy protein" doesn't interfere with meds as much as other forms of protein. Whey protein is only one part of dairy though, as the casein protein and fat have been removed.
I haven't come across anything that indicates which part of dairy is the suspect in PD, which is why I'd like to know what, if anything, Dr. Mischley has found in this regard.
So I've been looking into what the theories are, regarding dairy's connection with PD. One theory has to do with the propensity for dairy products to lower uric acid levels, which already tend to be low in PwP. Unfortunately, trials raising uric acid levels haven't proven helpful, so this probably isn't the reason.
Another theory has to do with toxins/pesticides that are found in milk. The hole in this theory is that these substances would likely be concentrated in fat, and low fat dairy is equally (maybe even more) associated with PD than full fat products.
Michael Greger MD says galactose, a metabolite of lactose, might be to blame; nutritionfacts.org/video/th... If this theory is the correct one, whey protein isolate should be safe for Parkies, since the lactose has been removed. It would also explain why cheese and yogurt seem to have less association with PD than milk, since much of the lactose gets used up in their production.
I'm not a biochemist so take this with a grain of salt, but this is my understanding...... Lactose gets turned into galactose during digestion and it's the galactose that has a bad effect on the brain. In "lactose free" milk, that step is accomplished for you, so the galactose is already present in the carton.
Dr Gregor (how not to die/diet/age) seems to think saturated fats from animals and the amino acid methionine and branched chain amino acids isoleucine, leucine, and valine are causes of aging. Restricting methionine and BCAA restricts mTOR which causes advanced aging.
He recommends getting protein from plant sources like nuts , beans, lentils, chickpeas and all plants have amino acids with less of these ones above.
And casein, unlike whey protein, is absorbed very slowly. For that reason it's sometimes suggested for increasing satiety. My guess would be that the casein fraction in dairy interferes with meds more than that of whey.
For those that may not have seen it, hmm77 posted this on the "Experiences With Fast Protein Digestion" thread;
"I have used Now brand whey protein isolate for years with excellent results. It digests so quickly that I'm easily able to fit it in between medication times. I have been able to keep my daily protein intake over 100 g for retention of muscle mass despite the various PD-related dietary restrictions. Your mileage may vary, of course -- some people object to any dairy, for example."
Thank you Boscoejean, I believe that's the same study I linked to at the top of this post. Seems like whey protein isolate "might" be a really good supplemental form of protein for PwP. Just wish I could find info on whether it's use is associated with progression, like some other dairy products are.
Yes. Avoid whey protein as animal dairy products (except butter and ghee) increase inflammation and increase the risk of PD symptoms. It also increases the risk of osteoporosis.
Plant protein powders (e.g. pure pea protein or hemp protein )are much better and can be very useful.
This is at best an overstatement. The data are nowhere near this conclusive, and my own experience contradicts them. I am 8 years in and have had remarkably little progression. I eat dairy with every meal and supplement daily with whey protein isolate.
Whey protein isolate comes in unflavored and unsweetened versions. It might be important to point out that the isolate form is different from whey protein concentrate, which has not been through as much filtration and consequently has higher carb (lactose) content.
Rufous2 is correct. I use the unflavored, unsweetened version. Note also that whey isolate (as compared to regular whey) absorbs extremely fast, so it is relatively easy to time it so as to avoid competition for the same uptake pathways that levodopa uses. I go through 10 lb bags of the stuff every couple months.
Thanks so much for posting this! In researching , I found this very important and enlightening review of nutritional interventions to optimize LD absorption and counteract side effects. The authors strongly recommend a daily regimen of vitamin B-12 (500–1500mg), vitamin B-6 (200mg), folic acid (5mg), along with protein redistribution diets (PRDs), dietary fiber, vitamin C, and caffeine.
Hi Bwhitmanwins, thank you for this review! It is definitely worth looking into what measures you can take for better absorption of your levodopa medication. One problem that many of us have (unnoticed) is a severe deficiency of B-vitamins, which also increases the risk of peripheral neuropathy, especially in the case of a B6 deficiency.
However, the recommendations you mentioned do not align with the conclusions of the study. While the authors do recommend standard supplementation with B6, B12, and folic acid in combination with levodopa use, they do not mention the specific quantities you mentioned. In fact, taking such high dosages would greatly increase the risk of peripheral neuropathy due to overdose. These quantities were used monthly (!) via intramuscular injections in a sub-study involving 8 PWP who were using duodenal levodopa/carbidopa gel. So they were not general recommendations. It might be a good idea to remove that information from your text to avoid incorrect dosages. 🙏
Yes, avoiding muscle wasting is critical for everyone as we age. The problem is that some forms of protein interfere with some PwP's medication. Whey protein "might" be less problematic in that regard.
Happy to hear your neurologist recommends creatine. It's effects on brain and muscle can be profound (even for those without PD) and I have yet to read anything negative about it's use.
Glycomacropeptide is a cheese whey derivative that is claimed to be a very helpful prebiotic that discourages the overgrowth of bad (DSV etc) gut bacteria while encouraging beneficial flora. Trouble is, even though it is a food it is used by the medical profession to treat a rare food intolerance disorder it has become prescription-only and by association, expensive.
I've been trying for 6 months now, to find a cheesemaker/microbiologist to make it for me. The base ingredient is as cheap as chips - a waste product that is fed to pigs.
7springshollow posted..."I have a big jar of whey in the refrigerator from making cheese. I'm going to try it. The milk was raw organic from our neighbors cow."
Maybe you could start making cheese. Consume the whey and feed the cheese to the pigs! 😜
Have to wonder these days about new players on the block that we really haven't considered yet, would seem to be endemic and ubiquitous, are the pfas, the very large poly fluorinated family of forever chemicals... Even the single part per billion is considered dangerous and there are claims that molecules are already in our blood system, and our tissues, there to endlessly accumulate and stay forever. Not to limit the comment to proteins and cancer and PD, it's just happened to pop into my head while reading through the string.
Agreed, very scary stuff. I think one of the questions on Dr. Mischley's survey is whether one drinks out of plastic containers. And I believe har research has shown an association between the use of canned goods and faster progression.
im going to reply without reading the comments because frankly, im feeling lazy. Whey protein isolate is ok because, even though it is dairy, there is no lactose. Also, it contains all the essential amino acids, including Cysteine, which is a precursor of Glutathione. Very good stuff for people with Parkinsons! The only thing bad about it is that it’s gotten very expensive recently.
Ok I went back and read (almost) every post. Lactose is what you need to avoid. That’s “milk sugar”. Butter and cream are all fat, no sugar, so no lactose. Whey protein isolate is the byproduct of the cheese making process. You know that “water “ on the surface of sour cream or yogurt? That’s whey. You might be thinking, “no way!”, but…whey! Yes way!
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