My cardiologist has suggested Amiodarone as a pup after I got side effects from flec . Has anyone any experience of this? Thanks
Amiodarone pip : My cardiologist has... - Atrial Fibrillati...
Amiodarone pip
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Peony4575
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That sounds strange to me, but then I'm not a cardiologist. Just that Amiodarone for long-term dosing needs 2 weeks on a loading dose (typically 600 mg) followed by 200 mg (or less) continuous. It is used intravenously in hospital for rapid response. Maybe PIP is new thinking.
Well if I can’t take flec or it’s ineffective . He said 200mg and if that doesn’t work 200mg a couple of hours later. I don’t think it’s new as much as only used as a second line. I hate all the uncertainty, the try this, try a bit more of that and stand on one leg and cross your fingers hoping for the best
😂😂 that' s about the size of it!
I guess it will stay in the bloodstream for a while and hence be active. Ultimately it gets taken up just about everywhere in the body and then takes ages to get out again.
As you know, Amiodarone has some significant side effects for some people, so if you were to go on it permanently you'd need to ensure you're scheduled for the regular blood tests.
I was on Amiodarone for 5-1/2 years and all my thyroid and liver tests were fine. I got the eye deposits but these don't bother your sight. I am also not a sun lover so the exposure to sunshine was never a problem. However, and no doctor ever said for sure that it was the amiodarone, but after being on it 2 years, I had a slow degradation in my general strength, plus neuropathy issues, and after 5-1/2 years I became concerned about lung damage, as my asthma was worsening. My cardiologist did say that people do report a range of odd symptoms and weakness is one listed on some lists (some lists are much more comprehensive). So I stopped (my own decision), and 6 months later went into atrial flutter, which degraded to fib. An ablation has stopped those, and Flecainide appears to be reducing the ectopics, fingers crossed.
Hopefully if PIP works for you, you can avoid all that worry.
If you're willing, can you say what side effects you get from Flecainide? I just get a minor constipation so I eat regular figs with breakfast. Nothing resists figs!
Yes, I've had experience of taking Amiodarone. It damaged my thyroid and I'll now have to take pills for life to rectify that. Saying that I knew someone who took it for 10 years with no problem. I'm afraid I'll always say don't take it. I guess it depends on how bad your AF attacks are.
Jean
Sorry that happened to you Jean . I try not to take any drugs as they are never plain sailing .i might fill the prescription . If I have another episode I might go and sit in a&e and take the flec so at least am close to resus if it all goes horribly wrong . My episodes are 184 bpm with rvr for 24 hours so I would like to cut them short because my heart obviously takes a battering
Flecanide didn’t agree with me either and no did Quinidine. I’m on Amiodarone awaiting cardiac surgery but it’s my understanding that Amiodarone is not used as a PIP? Can it even work as a PIP - I may be wrong …..
Well this cardiologist has used it before . I expect it depends on individual reaction . Good luck with your surgery
He must know what he’s doing - wish I could have used it as a PIP as I’ve now got an under active thyroid. In terms of it keeping AF at bay, it’s amazing!
I read somewhere maybe about 1 year ago that trials were been done using amiodarone as pip
There's a study online (James A Reiffel et al) that looked at the use of PITP drugs as they called them, and it seems amiodarone was given in 13% of cases so not all that unusual.
In general, aside from its potential toxicity, of course, I’ve only read truly good things about amiodarone in terms of its cardiac safety and effectiveness in treating AF.
Steve
Many thanks for finding that Steve that’s really useful to know . Am being very well behaved trying not to wake the beast , but will get the prescription and see what happens . Really not keen on the whole highly symptomatic 24 hour bouts
Repeat after me, “I will be fine!”
😉😊
I need to do that Steve . Am not the most positive person . I will repeat it
On health matters, neither am I. I truly envy those who are able to be phlegmatic.
Steve
I envy them too Steve . I am however daring to repeat “ I will be fine.” Because it has to be better than the alternative . I do suspect that those who do not worry when they have a serious health issue , are not paying attention !😂 Dear God ! There’s nothing in which the stakes are higher !
Actually, having seen some of the calmest people eventually "flip" over health issues, I have come to realise that there's a point at which everyone gives in to their nerves. One of those, an elderly friend, used to say when his late wife was in her usual panicky sate, "I just won't let myself get into such a state". I reminded him of that only recently when he was in a similar "state", too, which turned out to be nothing much!
Steve
Can I please ask a few questions as I'm rather concerned about the contribution of PIP flecainide to my most recent AF event? did you get negative side effects from your PIP flecainide? did it make your arrhythmia worse? or was it that it wasn't effective? And what dose was your PIP flecainide? Thanks.
It was the first time I had used it. I was told to take 50mg flec and if that didn’t work to take another 50mg 2 hours later. The first 50mg no side effects and dropped heart rate to 167 from 184. Took the next 50mg two hours later and my mouth went bone dry and stayed that way for hours , I felt hot and not very well and my pulse started going back up . At that point I rang 911and after an exhaustive questionnaire which had nothing to do with what was wrong with me they said an ambulance would be at least 4 hours and could I get myself to hospital . Obviously I didn’t drive and the hospital was almost an hour away. When I got there HR was still 167 and mouth still bone dry . That is the limit of my experience with flec
Hi Peony4575, I have been using amiodarone as a pip for a couple of years. I have some thoughts regarding amoriadone and iodine which may be helpful to make it work.
Amiodarone contains approximately 37% iodine by weight. Each 200-mg tablet is estimated to contain about 75 mg of organic iodide, 8-17% of which is released as free iodide. Standard maintenance therapy with 200-mg amiodarone can provide more than 100 times the daily iodine requirement as the rda is 0.15 mg per day. . The human body is said to saturate at about 1500mg of iodine which is what I think drives the loading doses usually needed for amiodarone. I think the attraction of the iodine (maybe it is a toxic version?) in amiodarone to the thyroid is what causes the most common problems.
To get around the thyroid and loading issues, I take a dose of Lugol's iodine daily providing iodine in the range of 25 to 50mg. This is a very large iodine dose compared to the rda. The excess iodine saturates sensitive tissues like the thyroid needing iodine so they are not as likely to absorb amiodarone and be harmed.
Usually I can flip from afib to sinus rhythm within a day or two by taking 2 to 6 200mg amiodarone pills. I spread them out by several hours until I'm back in rhythm and stop at that point. One good thing is that once amiodarone restores normal rhythm, its long half life works in your favor to keep the rhythm normal. Typically I stay in rhythm for several months. Other people may not be so fortunate, like those needing a maintenance dose, and will require a different approach.
Taking high doses of iodine without issues requires a fair amount of caution, research, and literally weeks to gradually work up to high levels, so please don't try this on a whim. Approach experimenting with iodine cautiously as it can cause severe allergic reactions in some people and potentially greatly disrupt thyroid function. There are easily searched books and Facebook groups dedicated to high dose iodine use that can help if interested.
I may be all wrong on the how I avoid the loading dose and thyroid issues for pip use, but it seems to work for me so far. When initially taking amiodarone daily for a few months, I was also taking iodine. I still noticed lung and eye problems so iodine is not a way around those problems. And iodine on its own was not a solution to my afib as I had initially hoped. But I really don't worry about afib anymore and my exposure to the toxic effects of amiodarone is minimal. Hope this helps!
Hi yes that is very interesting . You are braver than I , I am reluctant to take anything . I can’t say when my next AF episode will be but so far the average is two years and I am hoping my ablation will have happened and even more hopefully fixed the problem before then so am sticking with just very restrictive lifestyle until then and keeping my fingers crossed ! Please be careful
Hi, Have just seen your post . I was given amiodarone as a PIP and it worked well until I had my first covid booster when it stopped working. Didn't use it very much as a PIP but it certainly stopped my AF when I did.I was taking verapamil at the same time. I then took it daily for almost a year following that booster and it didn't really help then and I ended up having an ablation. On it for a year it damaged my lungs, luckily that was temporary. If you take it quite a bit I would just say if you develop a cough or wheeze, make sure you get checked out and don't be fobbed off by your GP which I was.
Many thanks for responding ! I no longer trust GPs . Seen too many disastrous oversights . The only thing I want from them is a referral . Will pay if necessary .
Very useful to read your experiences . Am in waiting list for ablation. Realistically think am looking at the back end of next year . But have just taken delivery of the Amiodarone . Not taking rate control .
I decided no more jabs and am being very well behaved with lifestyle and hoping for the best . Did your ablation work for you ?
Good luck with ablation, hope you don't have to wait to long. My ablation helped a lot and got rid of my atrial flutter totally for a while and then the smaller bouts I got were controlled or stopped quickly with verapamil. 2 years on its become a bit more problematic, but I was always told as I have hypertrophic cardiomyopathy there was only a 50% it would work, I suspect another ablation is coming up
I am glad that you found some relief and are able to manage what you have been left with . None of it is easy and I am not blessed with a great deal of stoicism . I hope your next ablation brings more improvement . My clinic appointment won’t be until the end of February to see the EP who will be doing the ablation so I think it will be probably 7 months or more after that. NHS 2024 the reality
TracyAdminPartner
Thank you for your post, you may be interested in downloading the information sheet available on the AF Association webpage: api.heartrhythmalliance.org...
Kind regards
TracyAdmin
information sheet
Thank you Tracy that is useful
I tried amiodarone, stopped taking it because of side effects. Found research in China about using Berberine. 500 three times a day. Has been effective for me.
They are trying to make it into a drug form, so they can reap rewards financially.
Well that’s a sign it’s effective . Drug companies don’t pursue orojects they don’t think will pay . Maybe an interesting development for the future but the process takes years
I first tried flaccinad; caused heartbeat to surge to 200 Afterwards was put on amiodarone. Then checked Chinese hospitals. Shanghai had been experimenting with berberine. I am English and live in Arizona. My wife is Chinese. I have found many things that work in Traditional Chinese Medicine. You might also try The Great Pulse teapills made by Plum Flower Brand. (Also known as Sheng Mai Wan.) It too can stop A-fib.
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