Ectopic question

[MJZaw]

I've seen numerous posts over time about "ectopics" but hate to admit that I have no clue what that is or how it feels. I had a successful ablation for PAF in January and have been free of Afib. However, occasionally I will feel a sense of flutter which normally is associated with what I eat or when I'm very hungry... seems like its something in the digestive track. It's more annoying than anything else, something I've felt once in a great while since I was a kid - it never stopped me from doing anything.

However, since the Afib episodes I'm more vigilant of anything I feel related to cardio. When it happens it does not manifest itself on my Apple watch, neither as Afib nor any change in heart rate. I guess my question is, "is it an ectopic?" And what does an Ectopic feel like?

Thanks for reading what might appear to some of you as a stupid question...:

Marty

[pottypete1]

An ectopic beat is when your heart either skips a beat, has a very slight delay on an individual beat or slips an extra beat in between two regular heart beats.

Normally although not a very nice feeling ectopic beats are benign.

Pete

[Hidden]

Dr Sanjay Gupta, who is a highly respected Cardiologist from York Hospital here in the UK, has produced a number of videos about ectopics and palpitations on YouTube. Suggest you take a look as I’m sure they will explain everything you need to know about the subject……

[CDreamer]

Multiple ectopic beats can make you feel rubbish but are considered harmless and are quite usual after ablation for some months.

There is a connection between heart and the digestive system - the vagal nerve because stomach and heart lie very close to each other and the vagal nerve passes close to the heart and through stomach.

Ectopics may be eased by LSD - Long, Slow, Deep Diaphragmatic breathing techniques - I like the 4-7-8 described in this article but called it 7/11 breathing. The important bit is use your diaphragm to breath and to extend your out breath so it’s longer than your in breath. Breath soothes vagal response - helps both digestion and heart because they lie so close to each other, they interact. Just a practice of 5-6mins a day will help.

healthline.com/health/diaph...

So much revolves around breathing and most of us breath incorrectly most of the time. Look on YouTube for a conversation between James Nestor - author of a book called Breath and Patrick McKeown. Very informative.

[Singwell]

I get this digestive thing you refer to. Also have had it for decades. Nowadays having AF, I now notice it more acutely because one is so much more aware of ANY changes.

I track these sensations using my Kardiamobile and it's rarely ectopics (occasional missed or irregular beats). The stomach, diaphragm and heart all lie very close together in the body and things going on in one can often be 'felt' in another. I think in my case I've a sliding hiatus hernia and if I eat too fast, or something that causes gas, then that's when the fluttering sensation comes on. I sit quietly, upright, then walk around a bit and the sensation soon passes. If it does not I breathe slowly, slowing my breathing down to 6 breaths a minute - very effective for ectopics!

Occasional ectopics are considered benign but I'll let others explain in more detail about them. Kardiamobile will track and identify a number of ectopics if you use it in advanced mode.

[MJZaw in reply to Singwell]

Your experience seems similar to mine. And I agree that since Afib I am acutely aware of ANY changes or different cardio sensations. My first Afib episode began with a prolonged episode of fluttering that I could not stop...my perception is that it led to the Afib episode. Thanks for sharing...

👍

[KMRobbo]

My ectopics are felt as a "fluttery" feeling in my upper chest /lower neck. Feels like a touch of wind initially, but then goes on. I actually only started getting them (or noticing them) several months after my successful AFib PVI cryoablation.

If you take your pulse in your neck, left side , approx 1 inch below the back corner of your jaw ( using fingers not thumb) then you ought to be able to feel your pulse and

the "skipped" (extra) beats , but also count the regular beats in between, to give you the appropriate count of how many ectopics you have. Also note, in my experience ( for me) worrying about them makes them more frequent and worse, so be warned.

The converse is also true, ignoring the things makes them less , but to do this you have to be in the mindset they are benign. I have had them for 4 years so dont worry at all as they dont stop me doing anything and now I don't generally notice them. However this is also depends on the rate: if less than one skipped beat in 20, then easy to ignore, if greater than 1 in 15 then increasingly intrusive and irritating. I also have noticed that increasing you heart rate reduces them, or reduces the impact. So if they get irritating go for a walk!

Also that if I get some sort of an infection (eg a cold) then they become worse. Sometimes my heart notices the bug before I do!

Not medically trained, just recounting what I have had/noticed.

[MJZaw in reply to KMRobbo]

Your symptoms sound familiar...thanks for sharing

[Samazeuilh2]

A Kardia would be one way you could keep track of what is going on- it yields more information than the Apple Watch. You could also request a 72 hour Holter test which , hopefully, would provide some reassurance.

[MJZaw in reply to Samazeuilh2]

I'm going to get a cardia device...thanks for replying

[Blondie12345]

I’m very glad I have found someone who is experiencing something similar to myself when I’m at rest or I haven’t eaten for a while like you say when you’re quite hungry it does feel like a strange fluttering but I don’t know if it’s to do with being hungry, or is it just a low blood pressure or low blood sugar because you haven’t eaten in a while

[MJZaw]

There is a bit more to my story that could be of value to you:

After the ablation, I remained on medication (Sotalol) for approximately six months. Then the Sotalol was reduced by 50% for about 3 months during which time I could feel no difference. After three months, the Sotalol was terminated. During that time I experienced what I thought were "ectopic" episodes. Each time it happened, I checked my Apple Watch which indicated that I was in sinus rhythm. I contacted my EP, he prescribed a 30 day monitoring device which recorded my heart Rate, rhythm (ECG) etc 24/7. The data was electronically fed to a Control Center and monitored in real time.

The EP who read the final results of the 30-day monitor indicated there was no evidence of Afib or any other abnormality. However, about halfway through the 30-day monitoring period I began using CPAP machine for "moderate" sleep apnea, and noticed a cessation of the those episodes. I am guessing there was a relationship between the use of the CPAP machine and the lessening of the symptoms. The interesting part of this story is that during the 8 years of being treated with medications for Paroxysmal AFIB no-one on the medical team thought about the possibility of sleep apnea. It was the EP at Johns Hopkins University Hospital that performed the ablation who suggested having a sleep study which resulted in the diagnosis of "moderate" sleep apnea.

BTW - It has been 14 months since I had the ablation and have been in sinus rhythm thus far.