Just wondering whether any vagal AFfers have a daily routine to which they adhere (still can't end sentence with preposition!!).
Deep breathing exhale for longer than inhale.
I have started splashing face with cold water morning and night, gargling vigourously, causing gag reflex to work on purpose when cleaning teeth and humming (which I do anyway without being aware!!)again vigourously
There are lots of references to this but how reliable I know not. Heres one allied-services.org/news/20...
Always enter the shower when first turned on so resulting cold shock. CDreamer told me that one.
I just cannot do that Bob, wish I could. I think I feel the water colder than anyone else does. I read about a woman recently who died through swimming in cold water, that would be me! Do you feel better for doing it?
Jean
Then gradually turn down the temp in your shower. Sudden cokd water immersion can cause death - if you aren’t taught how to cope with it - see Wim Hoff - Freeze the Fear. Cold water works directly on the autonomic system but you need to be in the right mindset.
It’s not how much you ‘feel’ the cold - it’s how you deal with it.
Immersion of your face or forearm into iced water can also work - the idea is to cause that shock to the system - safely. It’s amazing how quickly you get used to it and how alive you feel afterwards.
Competive dinghy sailing was a great training ground, especially the Icebreaker events!
I used to be a strong swimmer, training twice weekly, but have always had problems getting into the sea, even in the height of summer, or in a hot country it takes me ages. I walk down to the sea determined to go in, then feel the iciness and back out. It got to the point where I said to the group I was with, if I don't go in can you give me a push. I was furious when they did that, but soon got over it. Once in I'm usually fine and ok from then on, it's just that first time.
Jean
I do the cold shower 20 secs warm - 10 secs cold - alternating until all cold for 30 secs. You need to achieve the gasp affect and then focus on breath and control.
Breathing with power breather.
If I remember & have time a series of yoga exercises which include humming/chanting - about 2-3 times a week.
I stick to hot shower first and then cold for 10 seconds; the other way around doesn't work for me. I would love to stay under the cold for longer as it increases the 'young, can do anything during the day' feeling but too cautious that I would be pushing my luck and risking an AF episode.
Exactly that, the same routines (of whatever nature) help; shunned for most of my life I now embrace them.Breathing absolutely agree, focussed on this area over the last 2 years.
Splash face with cold water, found that relaxing all my life and now see the link to the Vagus Nerve.
Gargling, I do less but find it can feel right at times.
Humming, just started doing that more on my walks as read it induces more Nitric Oxide which is beneficial; sorry forgotten why it is, maybe some link to the heart.
I don't think my AF is vagally mediated - I'm more of an anxiety and stress bunny. However, the digestive end of my vagus is distinctly dodgy so I do use some od these strategies mentioned. Cold shower at the end of a shower, humming and walking, breathing techniques that trigger the vagus and seem to help me digest. For me the most important routines are: daily walk of at least 20 minutes, power walking if it's a short walk, time outside in daylight, meditation (I do 20 minutes every morning), regular yoga and massages. I'm also very strict with eating times in the evening and the type of food I put in my.body these days.
As a retired English teacher let me just say that I’m impressed with your aversion to ending your sentences with a preposition!
Steve
I went to an all girls grammar school, many spinster mistresses as a result of losing loved ones in the war. At a 50th anniversary reunion of us starting school there (in 2005), we all agreed that we lived our school days in fear, but some things stuck!!
I think fear (but of what, parents and shame?) helped us to learn an awful lot in those days, for good or ill. As a teacher, I can say that there is only the fear of exams left with learning for those left very late in the day, while learning in depth rather than by rote has become much more take it or leave it, and it’s mostly the latter.
Steve
For me and most of my peers, our parents had very high expectations. When I found myself teaching nurses, I could not understand the "student led learning". How could they choose what they needed to know when they didn't know what they needed to know? Hey ho, we digress.
We do - but so enjoyably. The educational world and the teaching of children has changed, not entirely for the worse, of course, but it seems to me that the narrowness of learning is a worry.
As for nursing, well, in the year 2000, when SEN nurses had to put away their uniforms, along with the pride they conferred, and don in their place those bland blue outfits, the NHS lost a very great deal. And when this government took away bursaries, expecting nurses to borrow several tens of thousands to qualify, madness entered the scene.
Steve
I am sure that the cold water shower and variations can stimulate the vagus nerve and possibly in a positive way but they can also potentially put some into afib. Reminds me of an episode on some doctor show where the resident threw ice cold water on the patient to cardiovert him. I also had a friend who went into afib right after jumping into a cold lake. One of my personal triggers was drinking iced beverages too quickly.
That said, James Bond was a big advocate of the hot/cold shower routine which I suppose helped him clear his mind off the three packs of unfiltered Chesterfields and 12 or more daily shaken but not stirred Martinis! In my early 20's I showered early in the morning under an ice cold waterfall at a Yoga Camp and it was wonderful. Thinking about it today almost puts me in afib 
But whatever works.
Jim
Maybe it's like a rocker switch then?? What improves tone can also set you off. I just stick to cold water face splashing, breathing exs andhumming and retching!!!
Absolutely, what puts you in afib potentially can get you out and vice versa. Unfortunately, I have tried the ice water splash when in afib and it didn't work.
However, I did convert once after drinking strong coffee and sugary donuts. Two things I usually avoid when in normal rhythm.
Jim
Absolutely, what puts you in afib potentially can get you out and vice versa.
So true.
I do Stanley Rosenberg's "Basic Exercise" twice a day. Page 187 of his book "Accessing the Healing Power of the Vagus Nerve". Sometimes I do some of the other exercises as well.
All the best.
Roy
Thanks. Just bought it on Amazon. A lot more cost effective than the $700 Parasym device. LOL.
There are devices online that stimulate the vagus nerve. I've seen less expensive ones online but this one has some studies behind it for afib.
parasym.co/parasym-device-t...
One study here:
"At 6 months, the median AF burden was 85% lower in the active arm compared with the control arm..."
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/321...
Note: I contacted one of the researchers and he emphasized that it may only help a select group without any structural heart issues that can come with age. He suggested I may be part of that group but still intrigued. The only downside as I see it is the high price.
Jim
That's very interesting Jim another option always welcome. I used TENS machines for pain relief when I was working and the placebo effect was amazing sometimes. Had a patient who described his pain as "like the skin being ripped off my leg". On follow up, pain was gone but I also realised he'd only been adjusting the intensity control and hadn't actually switched it on.My AF is very rare at present so don't think I'll be investing £600. Pity mainstream EPs not advocating more, must be cheaper than ablation.
Wendy
Very funny but poignant story! Yes, the placebo effect can be strong and often we just get better on our own and subscribe it to something we took or did but in fact it was just mother nature and father time healing us. Unfortunately doctors, drug companies an equipment manufacturers often take credit! That's why blinded trials with control arms are so important vs testimonials or less vigorous trials. o I believe this machine was trialed against a sham control device. And yes, expensive but way less expensive (in all ways) than an ablation.
Jim
My GP lent me a TENS machine to try but my back pain was so bad I could only feel a slight tingle on full power.
All the best.
Roy
Roy, in olden days when TENS involved Pads, electrode gel, tapeg this up long wires and a little box plus batteries there was a sweet spot between " the pain isn't bad enough to faff about setting this up" and " the pain is too bad ditto". Between these two it could work!
It was a long time ago and I did not get any feeling from it at all on the lower settings, it was only when it got to full power that the sensation became feelable over the pain coming from my back.
The GP sent me to see a consultant who diagnosed ankylosing spondylitis when he saw my X rays. He said I would be in a wheel chair within 5 years. But I read up a lot and started a high exercise regime. Cycling on a recumbent was part of it and I'm still wheel chair free 40 years later. I was fortunate to live near Herne Hill Velodrome so I used to go there to train on a regular basis.
All the best.
Roy
Good Morning Jim
A few years ago this device was talked about a lot on the forum. I believe it was offered on rental too and I can remember members in the U.S. were annoyed because it was only available in Europe. One member, who I don't think wasn't a regular one, said he had sent off to give it a trial by rental. However, we never heard from him again and I often wonder why that was. Did he die, or was he cured and then rode off into the sunset forgetting us here!
Jean
Well let's hope he road into the NSR sunset!
Haha, nothing to do with A bloomin' F but I love the way you won't finish a sentence with a preposition! (only just seen this post).Thanks for the vagus nerve tips and the link, always worth a try 😉
Here's a joke about ending a sentence with a preposition -
A bright lad from a poor family in one of the southern States secured a place a Harvard University. While walking around the campus on his first day, he stopped to ask two other students, 'Excuse me, do you know where the bathroom is at?' One of the students replied, 'Here at Harvard, we never end a sentence with a preposition'
His answer - 'Excuse me, do you know where the bathroom is at, asshole' 😂🤣😂
Vagal AF
Vagal a fib
A vagal manoeuvre to try…
Vagal AF
