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Severe light head attacks

mrhappydays profile image
51 Replies

I have been diagnosed with atrial flutter/fibrillation (TBH don't think they know) about 2 years ago - put me on bisopropol. My heart rate since has been stable at 58/59 until 6 weeks ago. It shot up to 128. Then I started getting attacks of 'light headedness' (would last 10-15 mins and would have around 8-10 attacks). The attacks take you to the point of passing out, apart from 2 of them where I ended up fainting fo a second.

GP has upped my bisopropol from 10mg a day to 12.5mg, heart rate has come down to 120, and attacks have disappeared. GP won't touch medication again until I see Cardiologist at Birmingham in 4 weeks time.

I've read lots about the condition but they don't seem to mention my efffects. Has anybody experienced this? / what was your treatment?

Thanks in advance.

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51 Replies
BobD profile image
BobDVolunteer

Presyncope such as this and occasional syncope (actual fainting) can be caused by blood pressure falling drastically during an event. It can Also be due to pauses in heart beat if rate drops too low. Some people expericenc it during transition from AF to normal sinus rhythm (NSR).

You GP is not allowed to prescibe many of the drugs used to combat AFso his response is understandable. Sounds like you need a holter monitor for a few days so catch what is happening and no doubt the cardiologist will organise this..

Welcome to the club by the way.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toBobD

Thanks for your input , Bob.

Physalis profile image
Physalis in reply tomrhappydays

For some years I had attacks of presyncope. It was first thing in the morning, perhaps 5 or ten minutes after I had got out of bed. They probably lasted for half an hour up to an hour or so. I wondered if it was low sugar, low blood pressure, dehydration etc etc.

It didn't happen that often or seem to coincide in any way with my AF.

However, since I had my ablation a couple of years ago which got rid of my AF, it hasn't happened once.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toPhysalis

Thank you so much for your input. My attacks happened anytime during the day, but quite prevalent in the evening watching telly .

Singwell profile image
Singwell in reply tomrhappydays

This could be a vasovagal event following evening meal. Worth checking out on York Cardiologist YouTube channel. If you're being seen at QEH Birmingham, their cardiology unit is very good.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toSingwell

Maybe but they would happen at other times of day too.

Singwell profile image
Singwell in reply tomrhappydays

Ahh OK. No point in jumping to conclusions is there. Hang in till you see the cardiologist.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toSingwell

Appreciate your time. Bry

bantam12 profile image
bantam12

My pre syncope was caused by heart block pauses, sorted with a pacemaker.

Hopefully your GP has told you not to drive until you have a diagnosis and treatment ?!

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply tobantam12

Interesting my gp didn’t mention driving but needless to say, my wife does it all now ( think she’d change the locks if I tried!) . Gp did say stop alcohol and get decaf tea.

MartinoH profile image
MartinoH

Hi mrhappydays, I have experienced this and I am certain that your cardiologist will find a solution. It can be very unsettling but it is resolvable. If it happens, sit down and relax and it will pass. Once your cardiologist has identified the reason, they will identify a suitable treatment plan.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toMartinoH

It was scary the first time; then I thought its copable; then I ended up on the floor after one attack. Really looking forward to seeing the Cardiologist.

MartinoH profile image
MartinoH in reply tomrhappydays

Yes, the same thing happened to me. Horrible. It was sorted out in the end. It’s really hard to deal with at the time but I’m sure there’ll be a solution. I hope it gets resolved soon 🤞

Afibflipper profile image
Afibflipper

Hi there, I thought I’d written that 😆 couple of years I was on 12.5mg bisoprolol then recently upped to 15 then 17.5 ( I was on other blood pressure meds which then caused over load an BP plummeted. The GP had increased this but then when I called back to say I thought this was too much could I just reduce back to 15 (I only had 3days at 15 before it was increased so not really in my system)Gp sent to hospital, spent 9 hours waiting, had bloods and ecg but no meds or food/drink - the latter caused more problems with headache and nausea but physically I could walk bp came up and they did what I suggested -back to 15mg (but this time in divided doses of 7.5 twice daily)

I felt pretty ok (well better than I’d been)

I’m not sure if GP can only raise past a certain level if they’re advised by cardiologist or A/E dept who usually want to see the effects

See the electrophysiologist - if you feel worse call to see if can have earlier appt or may need A/E

Good luck hope you get sorted soon

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toAfibflipper

Thanks for this. The GP might be cautious as history of heart disease in family (my daughter has half a heart; I ve had a narrowing of the aorta and the aortic valve needs to be watched). I ve read that 20mg is the maximum dose for bisopropol. On 12.5mg so far, and blood pressure has (generally) never been better, (typically 120/90), apart from the sudden drops. Cardiologist last year did discuss ablation as an option, so we'll see.

Afibflipper profile image
Afibflipper in reply tomrhappydays

I too have a horrendous family history - think I got off light but yes they’ll have to be cautious with you - thanks for sharing keep us updated on what happens at the cardio appt

bassets profile image
bassets

Hope you can get this sorted out son and feel much happier. Best wishes.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply tobassets

Thanks very much.

Hi,

I went into AF at the beginning of December 21, had a cardioversion at the beginning of February 22 that successfully converted me back into NSR with a stable heart rate of around 52 to 53 (as it used to be before AF).

All was good for 5 weeks then I had 2 occasions in the space of 3 days where I felt dizzy/light headed for a couple of seconds, just stopped what I was doing, sat down and the issue passed.

The following day I had the same dizzy feeling but this time I blacked out and fell to the ground, as soon as I hit the ground I was absolutely fine again.

Doctor checked me over and did bloods, all ok, said to go to A &E if it occurred again.

A day later same thing happened again in the garden, thank goodness this time my neighbour was standing next to me and caught my arm as I was falling. A second later and I am fine again.

Went to A &E, they did all the checks and could find nothing wrong. Next morning woke up and back again in AF, think it was because it was so stressful waiting over 9 hours in A&E and feeling dizzy many times there.

So now back in AF with a resting heart of about 75 and no dizziness or blackouts for the past 5 weeks.

Having a 3 day monitor fitted in about 3 weeks but not confident it will show anything now I’m back in AF.

As Bob said cause can really only be a pause in heat beat or a drop in blood pressure, identifying it is the difficultly. Never before have I suffered from blackouts.

Doctor told me not to drive which I had already decided was too dangerous.

Be careful as my first blackout was onto a hard floor and it took 4 weeks to recover from the aches and pains as you drop like a stone and don’t realise.

I could find very little information on the subject so will be interested in how you get on with your cardiologist, please let me know if solve the mystery.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply to

Thanks for that, Denboy. My experience similar, but getting multiple attacks, separated by a couple of minutes. Only ended up once on the paving slabs but think I was lucky as fell on my back. Had a light head attack yesterday - just one - unlike before when they were coming thick and fast.

Lilypocket profile image
Lilypocket in reply to

Hi, Are you on any medication? My EP ( first appointment yesterday after being followed by a cardiologist for 10 years) told me this is often provoked by Flecaine as it works on the heart . I get light-headed when I convert back to normal rhythm or for a little while after as my HR drops to about 39 BPM.

in reply toLilypocket

Hi,

The only medication I take is 2.5mg Bisoprolol which keeps my heard rate in the low 70’s (I have persistent AF).

At the time of my blackouts I was in NSR, so have ruled out them being caused by converting.

The only cause must be drop in blood pressure or pause in heart beat , trying to prove it Is the difficult part.

Lilypocket profile image
Lilypocket in reply to

See what you mean . I know someone who had long pauses with her extrasystoles so had a pacemaker fitted as it made her nearly pass out each time. She didn't have Afib.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply to

Thank you denboy

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toLilypocket

I’m on 12.5mg bisopoprol ( plus drugs for blood thinning and bp reduction ) . Interesting that a few people have mentioned light headedness as a sign of converting to normal heart rate. I ve not experienced any evidence of my heart rate dropping ( apart from coming down from 128 to 120)

Lilypocket profile image
Lilypocket in reply tomrhappydays

That is quite a brisk rate on such a large dose of Bisoprolol. I take 3.75 and an extra 1.25 ( advised by my Dr) when I go into Afib. 5 mg knocks me out when I eventually convert and is responsible for quite a drop in HR ( 120 BPM to 39/40). Many people have trouble on even smaller doses. I think Ppiman has put his finger on it in suggesting you could have two different things going on - Afib and Afl. Take care

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toLilypocket

Thanks for all your input , LilyPocket

Ppiman profile image
Ppiman

Oh dear - poor you. The things we suffer, eh? Why do you think they don't know what is happening? If you have AF, it can hide the AFl, which can be happening alongside it. If you do have both, the ablation will be a bit longer as both atria will need to be dealt with.

I would get a Kardia 6L and take a few readings to show your GP when this kind of thing happens. I did have similar before my ablation, but never got to the stage of actually fainting (syncope). The Kardia advanced determinations were once said to be show up AFl, although I don't know if that ever came about. In my case, I had to have an injection of, I think, adenosine, during the ECG to show up the flutter. I can't imagine Kardia include one of those on their packaging for home use! ;-)

Steve

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toPpiman

Thanks Steve. Fortunately, I have a lot of cardiac history on record so if need ablation, I might not have to get into an NHS queue.

Forgot to add I’m also on Bisoprolol but only 2.5mg which keeps resting heart rate fairly constant.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply to

Interestingly, when gp increased by bisopropol, it only dropped heart rate from 128 to 120 (where it is now) but it virtually stopped the multiple light head attacks. Still constantly feel a little woozy in head.

Cat04 profile image
Cat04

Syncope (or presyncope) is definitely a symptom of both flutter & fibrillation.Your cardiologist will sort out your meds for you & maybe other treatments. Hopefully get rid of the episodes soon.

At least you have an appointment booked in the near future.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toCat04

Thanks Cat

Jajarunner profile image
Jajarunner

Betablockers do this to me. A dose of 5 mg made me virtually pass out and lowered my afib heart rate from 175 to 80 in about 2 minutes! Ended up lying a hospital bed at a dignified 45 degree angle awaiting emergency cardioversion!

Hope you get sorted out soon x

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toJajarunner

Blimey!

Robbo1975 profile image
Robbo1975

Hi

I was the same on bisoprolol, I asked the cardiologist to change my medication, I am now on Nevibolol a much better drug with no side effects and resting heart rate the same around 61/65

Apparently bisoprolol is a “cheap” drug they offer everyone but has so many side effects on people and doesn’t agree with many

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toRobbo1975

83p compared to £37.52!

Bisoprolol is the drug of choice for both doctors and hospitals unless you have a problem with it. Nevibolol is an alternative or if beta blockers are a problem then Diltiazem which is a calcium channel blocker can be prescribed.

A woozy head is usually a symptom when you start taking Bisoprolol, I found it went after about 4 weeks on Bisoprolol.

Your initial post suggests you have been on Bisoprolol long term in which case the recent increase in strength may have caused it and should go in time.

It may sound perverse but ideally you want to be having your episodes when you see the cardiologist or if he fits a monitor which may happen, then he can see what’s happening first hand and treat it accordingly.

My chances of having an episode when I have my monitor fitted is next to zero I think as I haven’t had one for 5 weeks. Unfortunately the expectation of another episode is always with me.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply to

Thanks Denboy.

Dorchen profile image
Dorchen

My afib is permanent , and am on Bisoporol and Digoxin etc etc. I have no symptoms and just get days when I feel off-colour and exhausted. Afib is different for everyone. Try not to worry hope you get sorted soon. X

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toDorchen

Thank you . I’m in good hands but it’s the wait is a pain.

AussieHeart profile image
AussieHeart

Hi I was on NO medication when dizzy spells began, lasting one year before morphing into seizure-type collapse and dead faint episode which lead to my atrial fibrillation/ectopic beat dx. It took the cardiologist another year to work out (via loop monitor) I was experiencing ectopics and put me on Flecainide (I tried Sotalol and Bisoprosolol) but I believe it’s the Flec keeps me upright! It’s improved my bowels as well so fingers crossed this and magnesium is all I need (ablation has been mentioned)! I hope it doesn’t take two years like me for you to get sorted! Good luck.

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toAussieHeart

Thank you Aussie. You ve been through the mill a bit! Did you have any history of heart issues?

AussieHeart profile image
AussieHeart

Yes have “mild” mitral valve stenosis and told on its incidental finding it wouldn’t cause any issues for up to 10 years when afib decided to rear its head. I have a “small” murmur now, whatever that means!!!

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply toAussieHeart

Thank you Aussie

JOY2THEWORLD49 profile image
JOY2THEWORLD49

HiMy specialist priv tried CCB Diltriazem.

It worked exceeding well so well that my dose is 120mg.

Apparently the govt is finding it difficult to get it and the capsule is different.

They didnt tell why only 1 month!

Reason above so I geot another month and will be in for another next week.

Have a thyroid neck scan. No tests showed I had thyroid Papillary cancer which causes AF and for me a stroke.

At 73 years I was only on B12 Solgar gold top.

I am in NZ

I am finally CONTROLLED with 120mg a.m Diltriazem and 2.5mg Bisoprolol. p.m.

Separate them.

I was taking 12.5 split but left with 128 resting heart beats per minute.

But at night I go down to 48 always in 40s. That is fine.

Now during day 93. Able to have op on that.

Last week Dr found no irregular heart beat so asked DHB to do anoth echo and ECG connected tp treadmill.

Take care with CCBs and be sure to balance right dose. Better to start low.

cheri. JOY

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays

Thank you joy

mjames1 profile image
mjames1

Could be several issues, but whenever I get light headed I always make sure I'm properly hydrated. Especially when I go into flutter or rapid afib which makes me urinate excessively. Then I'll reach for a sport drink like Gatorade for quick hydration.

Jim

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays in reply tomjames1

Thank you Jim

trina97462 profile image
trina97462

I have/had Afib. I had my second ablation operation 3 days ago

mrhappydays profile image
mrhappydays

Quick update: I had my meeting with Cardiologist today at Birmingham. He thinks its atrial flutter. He's put me on Digoxin to bring down heart rate below 100 and put me on waiting list for ablation which he said might be in weeks, not months. Saifd it should be 100 % successful. Told me to do lots of walking and no driving until ablation.

Thanks for all your input.

Bryan Happy Days.

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