You need to ask to be referred to an electro physiologist (EP). He is a specialist in the electrical side of the heart whereas a cardiologist is a specialist in the pipe work and flow. Think of it as the difference between a plumber and an electrician and with AFIb we need an electrician.
There is a long history of high AF prevalence of AF in endurance athletes. You are not the first and will not be the last.
May I suggest you look at the work of Dr John Mandrola (a cyclist) who co-authored - The Haywire Heart - subtitle -how too much exercise can kill you and how to look after your heart - which looked specifically at this issue.
You may also be interested in The AFibCure which looks at lifestyle changes, which will include reducing your exercise, as well as treatment options such as ablation and the pros and cons of various drugs.
Also understand about AF - lots of information on the AFA website including Factsheets, video links and learning programmes.
Athletes with AF face a tough choice. The disease tugs at what we hold so precious: our beloved vigor. Each treatment has limitations, risks and benefits. No magic potion exists. No hike to the treasure easy.
Same here a runner most of my life. Persistent AF started a few years back and I can no longer do minor inclines. I can get to 5k with intermittent walking but its not fun anymore. Been through the drugs list, stopped Bisoprolol as the fatigue was killing my energy levels. Dr says I am to old for an ablation so it looks like I'm grounded.
You seem to know more about this than I. Why would the persistence be the barrier and what is the procedure on NHS to see an EP ? Probably have to wait years in the current climate. The only issue I have is with the problem with running and if that can't be overcome I would probably not bother.
"Flecanide only at first now it’s Verapamil and flecanide"
Good combo in my option. I'm not a medic though so can't speak for your needs. I asked for this a few years ago but was told no. Right call or wrong call ? Who know's ? Hmmm.
I'm with you fella - good run and well done. For sure it's frustrating - I still suggest moderation is key though. Enjoy your running but take it easy dude.
No worries fella. Don't give up what you enjoy but take things easy - for now anyway.
Enjoy your runs.
Have a great weekend.
Paul
EDIT post - I think about this and I want to add this comment. 10 miles is to much 4th. You might be be fine with it - you may not as well. I can't tell you what to do but just note you maybe ok doing it once or twice but it doesn't always mean you will. Not with afib.
Just saying
One more EDIT It can change over night - believe me on that one. Sorry I sound like a loser saying that - I'm not.
I was not such a rinner as you but ran 4 or 6 miles twice a week, plus a 25 mile bike plus circuit training for an hour.I took both drugs but not together. I was on verapamil 120mg mod release for 20 months , it did not noticably affect my running at all ( unlike beta blockers bisoprolol and atenolol which i tried first and i could not run on them).
Owing to my afib getting worse I was then put on flecainide with 200mg diltiazem rate control. I could and did run on the combination but it was very hard work max heart rate 137bpm, so basically i was flat out all the time and going slow.
However i am fairly sure it was the diltiazem causing this not the flecainide.
(Rate control) so maybe verapamil may be better. But with meds we are all different.
I then had an PVI ablation which allowed me to stop all meds. So I got back to running.
HOWEVER I am pretty sure that running was not the cause of my afib.
I have recently been listening to a very interesting chapter in the book about exercise " The Afib Cure " by Dr.John D Day and Dr.T Jarred Bunch and Matthew D La Plante , I am finding the book very enlightening and would highly recommend.
Hi P4th, I was running 4 to 6 times per week with distances between 3 and 10 miles when I first developed PAF. First treatment was flecainide and low dose bisoprolol for rate control. The bisop kicked my butt for a while, but soon got used to it. I then had an ablation (PVI and flutter), which fixed things for a short while before developing a 2:1 rate, so was stuck in tachycardia for a few months - 15mg of bisoprolol daily kept me at around 110bpm. Running was pretty much impossible during this time.
I had a 2nd ablation 3 weeks ago, quite a bit was to redo the 1st where nerves had healed and a coupe of new areas. I'm now back to very light jog/walking.
Fortunately my heart structure is healthy, but I do feel that pushing running may have been a factor in knocking my heart back into tachycardia after the 1st ablation. So I'm taking it much easier this time round.
I was on verapamil for 7 years, did me no good. I had several episodes at A & E and was accused , sometimes directly , of wasting their time (180 bpm) isn't fun. Anyway struck lucky one night when the duty A &E consultant gave me bisoprolol intravenously and pulse dropped instantly to 80 bpm, The duty cardiologist couldn't be bothered to come and see me so the A & E Dr told me that I'd have to ' fight it out with my GP' for a change in prescription. This I duly did, in addition to paying for a private cardio consult. That was about two and a half years ago. All well at present ...fingers crossed !In my opinion the NHS is like curates egg ".....Good in places..." However if it wasn't free I wouldn't be going there.
I'm 66 and cycle 25 to 40k a day, Sundays a light 10k spin.My afib episode was just once 4 months ago, and a large meal too close to bed time is the main suspect. Having said that, I am not, nor ever have been a runner. Not sure what the HR stats and science behind running are, but my HR while riding are displayed in real time via my watch, so I am careful to not exceed my max HR in my age group...155....I keep it within 125-135.
I am on channel blockers *Diltiazem* and Xeralto *thinners* and I see no difference in fatigue or endurance....having said that, it is mostly flat where I ride, so no "alps" to conquer lol. The ER initially gave me Metoprolol *beta blocker* , and it crushed me. I was a zombie... couldn't walk 50m with being exhausted. They quickly switched me to a channel blocker, and back in the saddle. As far as competitions...marathons, triathlons, not for me. I raced mountain bikes for a few years, but I sucked, and mostly DNF'd 😋
But I do have friends who did extreme sports for decades with no heart issues, and others who have afib now. Percentage by their demographic as compared to the general population? No idea.
Did they give you a stress-test *treadmill* and ultrasound?
And I know this gonna hurt...but have you considered... walking? Not sauntering or strolling, but brisk walking...not the arm flailing, stick flapping sort, but just the ol' regimental 120bpm sort.
Yeah I’m having to restructure my training nowAs I say I’m waiting on an appointment at the arrhythmia clinic,but as it’s the NHS there’s a huge backlog at this time
The link between exercise and Afib is interesting and I wrote a synopsis of lots of studies as my first ever post on my Afib blog. You might find it interesting:
I'm a runner and when I told the EP and other cardiologists how much exercise I did he laughed and said that that amount would not cause it. It was just bad luck, genetics etc
I had a cardioversion and started running again two months later. Then I got afib 4 mths later again. Had ablation and ran again 5mths after. More afib six months later and another ablation, which was two months ago so not running yet. But I will when I get over postablation fatigue.
I was on flecainide for 5-6 years and it didnt affect my running but obviously it didn't stop the afib either!
Lucky you. I'm always cometely incapacitated with Afib, can barely walk and in it permanently until electrically cardioverted. So no exercise for me!Ps I'm a man-ette, by the way, nott a man 😂😂😂😂
Same story here (heart fit, electric problem only). My flecainide experience as part of a pill in the pocket treatment was not good. Couldn’t exercise for days after. Ended up getting ablation. So far so good. Hope you do better than I did with flecainide
Hey. Im 29 years old. I ran around 30 km per week. Even completed a marathon, I seemed perfectly healthy. Now Im a paroxysmal AF patient. I used propafenone and metoprolol for months and I was able to keep being active. These medications did not interfere with doing exercise of any sort. But everyone is different, so are dosages.
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