Conversion via Spontaneous electric shock ?

[allserene]

My Sunday night episode of flutter got worse. (After ONE Gin). I took a Beta blocker (50 mg metoprolol) at 11am Monday but the pulse kept going at 150 beats per minute all day.

At 5pm I took another meto.. The palpitations were not big, but I had no detectable pulse at my neck or wrists…I believe the fibrillation was pumping little blood.

My feet and nose were cold even though I was wearing a sweater and my face was ashen grey..

Suddenly, at 7pm, I felt an electrical shock in the left shoulder and across to my heart and it hurt. I thought I was dying, but 10 seconds later I realized that I felt great !... I said nothing to my wife for 5 minutes, then I told her. She told me that the colour in my face had returned 5 minutes ago and she was just about to mention that…

My nose and feet warmed up immediately and I felt a strong steady pulse in my neck and wrist..… We went to my blood pressure monitor and it showed my pulse had dropped from 140 per minute to 67 ! I had ‘converted’

The metoprolol is very cheap…$4 for 3 months’ supply !... I will take Eliquis anti-coagulant for 10 days (doctor says it should be a month)..I had very little pulse/circulation for 15 hours, so there is a possibility some minor clotting may have occurred…

Lessons: Take beta blocker Immediately an event happens .. and if its more than 5 hours, do a course of Eliquis (Doc says a month, but I say 10 days for a 1 day event) , and don’t drink Gin !

What do you afibbers think of my story of a spontaneous electrical shock hitting hard and knocking me back to Normal Rhythm ? Am I to be ridiculed, or has anyone else experienced it ?

[Paulbounce]

You are certainly not to be ridiculed. I think though you should seek medical advice and get things checked.

If you couldn't find much of a pulse for 15 hours and think you may have a 'minor clotting' then play safe. A pain in the chest should also be investigated.

I'm sure you'll be OK but don't chance it - contact your doctor or hospital right away.

Paul

[allserene in reply to Paulbounce]

I will certainly keep my EP appraised... It did feel like an electrical shock or 'spontaneous cardioversion in my shoulder rather than a 'pain in the heart'.. I feel absolutely great today. My heart is strong and I lift and heave my 100lb tractor snow plow around with zero dizziness or shortage of breath...I keep a good stock of Eliquis and I am back on them... Living in the US, it is a predatory medical environment and they will seize on any excuse to run me up a bill of many thousands, so as I am feeling great and back on Eliquis, and the hospitals are disorganized cess pits of the inner city Milwaukee Alkis and crazies, I prefer to use my experience with this condition and my 3 monitors, to assess what is happening... The first event last April had me sitting on a hospital bed being ignored for 3 days...and with a broken telly and torn shower curtains etc.. Then they double dosed me with cardizem and betas and they inadvertently stopped my heart for 5 seconds (and five times over) while I was watching the ECG flat lining !

[Dawsonmackay]

You are very lucky. Now go and get checked out.

[allserene in reply to Dawsonmackay]

I have the best EP in Wisconsin and I see him and his nurse practitioner regularly. I have had numerous tests, ECGs, Echo Cardiograms and treadmill stress tests, after which my heart was declared exceptionally strong... I have Beta blockers and Eliquis to hand at all times and have discussed how to respond to any tachycardia events with my specialist, and we agreed tactics. I recognize the number one danger is stroke, and so I resume Eliquis immediately at the first sign of trouble.. Spending unnecessary days in ragged depressing hospitals ( and lots of money), is also injurious to "quality of life", and so I would only seek help when it is a situation I have not met before, and have no plan/medication to deal with it. Through bitter experience, I have learned that hospitals are attendant with many dangers from deadly infections, to negligence by overworked staff who can easily overdose you......

[Dawsonmackay in reply to Dawsonmackay]

I can't tell if you're mad at me or summarizing your own fears about the medical establishment...

[allserene in reply to Dawsonmackay]

I really don't get angry, but I am prone to skepticism (lol). It's easy to be overly cautious, and it's what most doctors do (in defense of their medical liability insurance premiums). For we others, the internet is full of "Angels of death" who would urge us to spend a week in hospital after every sneeze. (It could be Corona virus !). I actually err on the side of hypochondria as you can tell by my THREE blood pressure monitors(to check on each other like the computers in an Airbus).. I even had my appendix out as an elective procedure in case it was the source of my guts ache... (It wasn't). However, I think that having a well informed plan is better than rushing to medical procedures ' just in case'.. A lot of people who have had back surgery or breast enhancement, have found that out the hard way... I don't have fears about the medical establishment, so much as a hard earned experience of the reality of that world with it's flaws and successes...... My niece was told her kid had bed bugs and "Look at the teeth marks under my microscope"... Next day the kid came out with chicken pox...

[Buffafly in reply to allserene]

😂😂😂 I don't quite know why I'm laughing so hard - well I do but a full explanation would take too long! I love your gung-ho attitude to AF and totally agree with you about A&E/hospital although ours don't sound as bad as yours. It is interesting that on the one hand we have Americans pitying us because of our 'socialised medicine' and on the other complaints about rapacious doctors overtreating!

I have recently had a similar experience so found yours interesting. I had AF which started high in the evening and after taking a slightly higher dose of my calcium channel blocker slowed overnight so I told my husband it was ok for him to go out. Then my heart suddenly started racing so I thought I'd have to get ready for a trip to hospital. All of a sudden I had a pain like a kick in the chest, very scary, and when I got my breath back I realized I was back in NSR. We must have a natural ICD 💖

[allserene in reply to Buffafly]

ah yes that was what my post was about and I wondered if anyone else had experienced a sudden jolt which knocked them back into NSR. My experience of the NHS is bit out of date, but I love using it to wind up my American countrymen, at least those with far right wing sympathies and confederate/nazi flags hanging on their trailers. For instance, I post that my 92 year old mother in Leeds, got a hysterectomy at 2 days notice and it was a great job and free, no entitlement documents required.. They just say that I am a LIAR. It is their only defence (defense). I believe that modern NHS waiting times are worse now and by design. 5 years ago I went to a cancer specialist in Milwaukee with a small sunburn cancer pimple on my ear (one of my ears !). ..She clipped it off like I was a wenslydale sheep and said I had to visit her every 3 months for the rest of my life. Never went back and my lug holes are pristine to this very day.. It's all $$$$$ here..... My wife spent 3 hours in OUTPATIENTS with a kidney stone and was billed $36,000...say £29,000....

[Buffafly in reply to allserene]

Can't say too much about the present state of the NHS as we are not supposed to get political here but what people in the US don't seem to realise is you can always buy private insurance here or pay one off for a procedure but if private treatment costs too much peeps just grit their teeth and wait so no use docs being greedy. I was told can't have private hip replacement because I have to have op in a hospital with an ICU but luckily physiotherapist fixed me up!

[allserene in reply to Buffafly]

Buying private medical in the UK is ok for now, but when the US giants move in, it will be £36,000 for 3 hours in outpatients.. just like here in Wisconsin. However, I got 5 hours radio therapy..5 x one hours sessions fully clothed like a sun-bed for $ 27,000 (say £ 21,000) and it was a cheapo procedure..

[Bagrat in reply to allserene]

Am confused by your description of radiotherapy. Presume totally different from cancer treatments on linear accelerator which usually take minutes. Would you mind explaining as I'm an inquisitive soul.

[allserene in reply to Bagrat]

Yes I had Cyberknife for prostate cancer..You wander in and lay down for an hour fully clothed while this 12 foot tall German robot (I called it Heidi), trundles around you and fires bursts of radiation from every angle as it does so.. You do that for 1 hour and for 5 days, and you are then cooked... My PSA (Prostate specific antigen) was 6.4 and rising fast every few months, and the biopsy showed MALIGNANT PROSTATE CANCER (In Capital letters )... That was 2007 and now my PSA is 0.7 and my prostate and cancer is a shriveled sun-dried raisin, slowly being absorbed.. ... Prostate cancer is the 2nd biggest cancer killer of men. It isn't without any risks, but I looked at the stats of radiation problems, and of the cancer, and decided to go for it... Glad I did...

[Bagrat in reply to allserene]

Wow don't think that particular treatment has reached the North of England yet. Thankyou for the interesting info .

[allserene in reply to Bagrat]

I am from Guiseley near Leeds, so if I had not emigrated to the US, it's possible I would be dead from prostate cancer now.. When I left the North 12 years ago, the NHS was really good, but it has been starved of funds since then, so it might cost me a few tens of thousands to stay in Wisconsin, but at least I will be alive.. Politics in the US is skewing heavily towards healthcare nowadays.. Nothing is more important....

[Bagrat in reply to allserene]

There is some ground breaking stuff re prostate ca going on at Jimmys but you may well be right. The prob with prostate ca - watch and wait or treat aggressively when not needed

( you may have gathered I was a palliative care spec nurse in my previous life)

[allserene in reply to Bagrat]

Watch and waiting while a deadly cancer develops was never my style.. My doctor has a patient with a tumour the size of a loaf on his shoulder ! It is prostate cancer. Once that breaks free of the prostate , really bad things happen. Quote: "Prostate cancer is the second leading cause of cancer death in American men, behind only lung cancer. About 1 man in 41 will die of prostate cancer." Cyberknife was a piece of cake.. quick easy and targeted to a fraction of a millimeter...

[Morzine]

Could it have been the tonic......it’s really not good and is well indicated for afib?

[allserene in reply to Morzine]

I have had that suggested by a friend who is into this stuff....... He suggested it some weeks ago in fact..The various characteristics of tonic water.... It would be wonderful if it were so because I am partial to a drop of gin or jack Daniels every 3 months or so. 20 years ago I used to go to Tenerife and drink 2 whole bottles of wine to myself between 8pm and 11pm.. Those days are gone.. Fact is, I dare not experiment now with pure gin or pure whiskey coz this week's event scared me so much. Having a deathly pallor and cold nose and feet and no detectable pulse at the wrist or neck, means I am not prepared to risk it just for one little nice drink... Over the last year I have had whisky and ginger 5 or 6 times on the plane or on vacation, and two pints of beer every week, with no event following......but this is the first tonic water in almost 2 years.. So there is a strong indication that you are absolutely right and it's the tonic rather than the alcohol...trouble is I don't have the guts to test the theory...

[Morzine in reply to allserene]

When I had my first afib, I was told no more white wine.........ouch that hurt!......so when I started feeling more like me again I thought tonic and ice and lemon was a good drink.....I had afib the next morning after tonic.....then it happened again aftertonic......then I looked it upon the internet.....And it said it was connected to afib........so I never touched it again.....coincidence?Who knows but it wasn’t worth the risk......

Poor you, your episode sounded scary......hope you are feeling normal now....

Sue

[allserene in reply to Morzine]

Hi Sue...The stories and evidence are mounting that TONIC is a no-no... I am feeling great now since I was self-shocked back into normal rhythm.. Strong pulse, good color, and warm....

[10Snut]

Hello allserene. I hope your life stays serene. Yes still have the gray face episodes and cold sweats. Been to the Dr. so many times while in the AF but they could find nothing. said irregular EKG not sign of heart attack. Blood showed no heart muscle protein. So was sent home. Now 20 yrs later and after the widowmaker that should haver killed me, I am on oxygen with heart fractions of 15-20. Soo, please have heart checked and have stress test done. Listen to your body and take notes. You were right to take meds to open vessels keep baby asprin handy also. But, remember ones heart muscle is damaged it cannot be fixed. You just limit your activities that agree with what is left of your heart. Please, go see heart dr. and have stress test better late than sorry expecially with the ticker. My blesssings to you and family. I am still kicking, but not very hard.

[allserene in reply to 10Snut]

I had all the stress tests and ECG etc etc in2017 and my heart was declared exceptionally strong.. Same in April last year with all that plus Echo cardiogram.. In 1998 I was told (In writing)that I had multiple sclerosis... My doctor told me to hand in my driving licence. I didn't. I rode my 1000cc motorbike in every European country and emigrated to the US 10 years later where I lived in 3 US States so far... I report ONE episode that occurred with the fear and shock and horror of Trump's election in 2016. Apart from that, NOTHING. We are all different, and having faith in doctors and gods is not the way to go. SELF responsibility via good information is...

[10Snut]

You may be one of the few who get Afib out of blue. Got mine after heartattack and flu last year. Went from 2006 until last feb to Afib. Now doc cannot get control of AFib. Know that theraflu and Dramamine can cause AFIB. Find out all you can. It is never to late to learn and find that something you took could trigger Afib attack. have blessed day.

[allserene in reply to 10Snut]

Indeed, I think that information+experience is our best protection... If my episodes got out of hand, I could get an ablation here in Wisconsin "On demand" with a maximum cost of around $6k for the year (annual max).. Apart from my first episode, I only got flutter when I either came off metoprolol and rebounded (twice) and or drank powerful alcohol (twice)... If I don't do either I am hoping for a good run, with perhaps ablation one day if it deteriorates to being a common re-occurrence... How come you can't get ablation ?