In two informative discussions, a link between PD and diabetes was rejected. However, some findings suggest differently, eg:
Diabetes and Risk of Parkinson’s Disease.
2017. Pmc.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
Increased risk of Parkinson disease with diabetes mellitus in a population-based study.
2017. Pmc.
PD diabetes link was rejected in one response. Here are the two threads.
Why does it matter if you take too much B1 if excessive B1 is excreted anyway?
healthunlocked.com/parkinso...
Vitamin B1: "It's the closest treatment for a cure, there is."
A lower percentage cause of PD will not show up as a statistical correlation if one compares it to the general PwP population.
This is a possible connection:
It’s a known fact that most diabetics are found to be thiamine deficient. Metformin, for an example, directly affects the transporters responsible for thiamine and inhibits the absorption. It seems obvious to me what the repercussion would be.
Drug companies should consider adding thiamine to Metformin, adding NAC to Tylenol to protect the liver, etc. They already add caffeine to drugs to prevent drowsiness.
Have you looked into the negative effects of taking tylenol?
I have been on metformin for 22 years and my B12 is checked regularly. (One of the possible side effects of taking metformin is Vitamin B12 deficiency and not B1 deficiency.) It has never been deficient.
You're one of the lucky ones. About 70-90% of diabetics are thiamine deficient. Also, blood serum level does not correlate to thiamine deficiency symptoms, which indicates compromised transketolase activity.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
justvitamins.co.uk/blog/thi...
Those links appear to reference to those with high blood sugars. Manage your blood sugars well and any vitamin B1 issue should not be a problem. The research that mentioned the figures you give used a very small cohort of people with diabetes. Also one of the links was to a vitamin site.
If the B1 issue is so great it would have been reported by now and warnings necessitated as with B12.
"If the B1 issue is so great it would have been reported by now and warnings necessitated as with B12." I agree it should be, and it's unfortunate that mainstream healthcare hasn't caught up.
Not sure what part of the fact Metformin affecting THTR-2, a major transporter of thiamine that caused a major thiamine deficiency Wernicke's encephalopathy for patients during the clinical trial you're not clear of.
Here you go, search on your heart's content. I'm sure you'll find an acceptable source for your liking.
google.com/search?rlz=1CAMW...
How many people had that serious encephalopathy? We have a drug repurposing scheme here. I guess those working in publicly funded diabetes research here in the U.K. would have looked at this. I will ask the question.
I don't know exactly how many, but the fact is that genetic differences (such as SNPs in SLC19A3) dictate which thiamine transporters one may be more dependent of, and if mostly on THTR-2, you're screwed on Metformin.
What form of B12? Is it methy B12? How about reversing your diabetes in a few weeks by changing your diet?
That is what I have read, as well. Can't diabetes II be controlled and reversed with diet? That would include B1 supplementation.
Yes, it is possible to reverse diabetes through diet, but it does not apply for all.
The Newcastle study showed that calorie control, for those who are overweight, can have a positive effect on Type Two Diabetes - without B1 supplementation.
What matters most is not the calories, but what you are eating. Are you drinking sodas, either those that are full of sugar or sugar substitute? Do you eat cereals, cakes, cookies, jam, bread, potatoes, candy, donuts, white rice? Do you drink orange or other juices. How about fast food, chips?
Not true, I am afraid. The Newcastle diet, as used in the research, was based on nutritious drinks that were calorie controlled.
Absolutely nuts! I believe you are relying on the wrong source. Doesn't it make sense that foods that turn into sugar, or actual sugar would, in part cause diabetes II? Try going without the above foods and previously mentioned foods and see if your diabetes disappears. It has nothing to do with calories.
Before you comment, check your facts. The research is fairly well known in diabetes circles.
Who conducts the research? Do they want to keep you on your diabetic meds? They don't make money if you reverse your diabetes. Doesn't it make sense not to eat sugar or things that turn into sugar? Making dietary changes isn't easy. Try it and see if you're able to lower your A1c markers and get off meds altogether. Educate yourself from many different sources, not just one. There are many books and posts on how to reverse diabetes. It's so much easier to continue what you're doing and take a pill. You will not reverse diabetes by doing that.
I educate myself from many sources as any decent research co-applicant would do. Here is a source from which to do the same: ncl.ac.uk/media/wwwnclacuk/...
Where is the science? Aristotle stated, "Let Food Be Thy Medicine, and Let Medicine Be Thy Food". Read " The Plant Paradox". Dr. Grundy has cured diabetes with nutrition, including consuming a liter of olive oil a week. Read and study information that you haven't read before.
I had not read the results of the clinical research at Newcastle until it was published. What you really mean is you want me to read the info that supports your views of life. Not helpful on a support forum.
Wait, .......let's see, you would rather take medicines,( that almost always cause long term harm,) and don't cure, rather than change your diet and take supplementation? Research outside the box. There are so many restorative doctors out there who have healed millions of people, I venture to say, that no longer believe in pharma directed approaches. Try it!
You wait. The Newcastle diet is not about medication. Read before you let your fingers loose on the keyboard. You are dangerous.
Are you taking medications for PD or anything else, including diabetes? I read the report where they claimed a low calorie diet would help. So, yes, I read it. There are more effective ways of getting rid of diabetes. I learned a long time ago when someone says "You....." They are pointing 1 finger in my direction, and 3 fingers back at themselves. That is true most always!
I only take metformin for diabetes and have normal blood sugars throughout 22 years. For PD, I have taken the lowest strength of Stalevo since diagnosis 11 years ago. My PD has not progressed since then.
As the paper I referenced produced peer reviewed and published research on a calorie restricted diet and its results, can you do me the courtesy of doing the same?
Fair enough.
Out of PubMed: Format: AbstractSend to
Nutrients. 2020 Jan 26;12(2). pii: E323. doi: 10.3390/nu12020323.
Pomace Olive Oil Concentrated in Triterpenic Acids Restores Vascular Function, Glucose Tolerance and Obesity Progression in Mice.
Abstract
Pomace olive oil, an olive oil sub-product, is a promising source of bioactive triterpenoids such as oleanolic acid and maslinic acid. Considering the vascular actions of pomace olive oil and the potential effects of the isolated oleanolic acid on metabolic complications of obesity, this study investigates for the first time the dietary intervention with a pomace olive oil with high concentrations of the triterpenic acids (POCTA), oleanolic and maslinic acid, during diet-induced obesity in mice. The results demonstrate that obese mice, when switched to a POCTA-diet for 10 weeks, show a substantial reduction of body weight, insulin resistance, adipose tissue inflammation, and particularly, improvement of vascular function despite high caloric intake. This study reveals the potential of a functional food based on pomace olive oil and its triterpenic fraction against obesity progression. Our data also contribute to understanding the health-promoting effects attributable to the Mediterranean diet.
Mediterranean diet rich in olive oil and obesity, metabolic syndrome and diabetes mellitus.
Abstract
2
After decades of epidemiological, clinical and experimental research, it has become clear that consumption of Mediterranean dietary patterns rich in olive oil has a profound influence on health outcomes, including obesity, metabolic syndrome (MetS) and diabetes mellitus. Traditionally, many beneficial properties associated with this oil have been ascribed to its high oleic acid content. Olive oil, however, is a functional food that, besides having high-monounsaturated (MUFA) content, contains other minor components with biological properties. In this line, phenolic compounds have shown antioxidant and antiinflammatory properties, prevent lipoperoxidation, induce favorable changes of lipid profile, improve endothelial function, and disclose antithrombotic properties. Research into the pharmacological properties of the minor components of olive oil is very active and could lead to the formulation of functional food and nutraceuticals. Although more data are mandatory the Mediterranean diet rich in olive oil does not contribute to obesity and appears to be a useful tool in the lifestyle management of the MetS. Moreover there is good scientific support for MUFA diets, especially those based on olive oil, as an alternative approach to low-fat diets for the medical nutritional therapy in diabetes. The objective of this review is to present evidence illustrating the relationship between Mediterranean diet, olive oil and metabolic diseases, including obesity, MetS and diabetes mellitus and to discuss potential mechanisms by which this food can help in disease prevention and treatment.
That is only an abstract and not a peer reviewed paper. The abstract itself is not definitive in its language.
Here's another one. If you Have to have ALL the boxes checked, and the suggested therapies are not harmful, it might be worth a 'go'. Quit eating crap, eat nutritious foods, eat extra virgin olive oil, and supplement. One can count calories and eat junk and not improve overall outcomes.
Abstract Source:
Oxid Med Cell Longev. 2017 ;2017:6405278. Epub 2017 Sep 10. PMID: 29081890
Abstract Author(s):
Laurie K Mischley, Richard C Lau, Rachel D Bennett
Article Affiliation:
Laurie K Mischley
Abstract:
OBJECTIVES: The goal of this study is to describe modifiable lifestyle variables associated with reduced rate of Parkinson's disease (PD) progression.
METHODS: The patient-reported outcomes in PD (PRO-PD) were used as the primary outcome measure, and a food frequency questionnaire (FFQ) was used to assess dietary intake. In this cross-sectional analysis, regression analysis was performed on baseline data to identify the nutritional and pharmacological interventions associated with the rate of PD progression. All analyses were adjusted for age, gender, and years since diagnosis.
RESULTS: 1053 individuals with self-reported idiopathic PD were available for analysis. Foods associated with the reduced rate of PD progression included fresh vegetables, fresh fruit, nuts and seeds, nonfried fish, olive oil, wine, coconut oil, fresh herbs, and spices (P<0.05). Foods associated with more rapid PD progression include canned fruits and vegetables, diet and nondiet soda, fried foods, beef, ice cream, yogurt, and cheese (P<0.05). Nutritional supplements coenzyme Q10 and fish oil were associated with reduced PD progression (P = 0.026 and P = 0.019, resp.), and iron supplementation was associated with faster progression (P = 0.022).
DISCUSSION: These are the first data to provide evidence that targeted nutrition is associated with the rate of PD progression.
Article Published Date : Dec 31, 2016
This effort at research has looked at too many areas to be sure of what is assisting PD. The subjects are all self-reported so not necessarily diagnosed. There is also no sign of randomisation or blinding. Nor is there any indication of whether there is pharmaceutical intake Again you have managed to find an abstract and not a full published paper. That said, what you do is for you to decide. I prefer to rely on solid research as I provided you with.
The only entities who can afford to do double blind, randomized, peer reviewed studies are the pharmaceuticals. I believe most all, if not all, pharmaceuticals cause damage. Why not give something a try if it shows promise, such as natural therapies, that cause no harm. What's wrong with this picture? I followed the pharmaceutical model for years. When my 45 year old son was diagnosed with ADHD, I refused to put him on drugs. I then began my research into natural therapies. I have been following natural therapies ever since. Of course, there is more published literature on pharmaceuticals, they can afford it. Some of the studies have been manipulated, as well, to sell more drugs. If you, or anyone else feels the pharmaceuticals are the only way to go because there is more 'evidence' then, you have been forewarned. We will still go with natural therapies.
In the U.K. there is a lot of research done that is paid for by charities and by the Government. All the research projects I help manage are publicly funded. Everything has the possibility of causing damage - Chemotherapy for instance However, there is no doubt it saves lives. But you go ahead and believe as you do despite the evidence. That is something you are entitled to do both for you and your family. I wish you well with that.
Then why are we not seeing millions of “screwed” people?
They're there, you're simply not "seeing" them at various levels of barely functioning with low energy, brain fogs, CFS, kidney, and other "syndrome" disorders that eventually lead to bigger problems.
There is a project - to let healthcare professionals know of all the invisible people.
You're going to see them as chronic alcohol drinkers and alcoholics but unless you run a tavern enough to know to give thiamine to your regulars at the end of their night, so they will be better able to return to spend the next night, you may not often make the connection.
Your humor again!
Not this time, based on truth and in all seriousness. Chronic alcohol use, even in moderation, is very bad for mitochondria in all cells, your energy producing machinery, and for your nerve cells in particular. Pour some alcohol on a wound sometimes, it acts on cells the same way turpentine does. Concentrated ether.
The bar story was drawn from actual experience from a couple bar owners I knew next to a medical school where I did some grad work some 40 years ago.
Thanks for that reply! (I knew you were a cut above with regards to your education.) I am the partner of pwp. I had started taking B1 myself. I drink one glass of red wine a night.
Alcohol manufacturers wanted to add thiamine in their products during the 40's, but it was outlawed.
nytimes.com/1979/02/12/arch...
Fascinating.
Yep - it's unfortunate that too many today forgot the importance of thiamine, especially when typical Dr ordered blood panels almost never include a B1 test. Even if it’s ordered (for alcoholics) it's not a reliable indicator of thiamine status, with extremely few labs testing for the deficient enzyme activity. People survive on little food fortification while eating empty calories for years of degradation until simply too late.
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