Lawn treatments

[Smittybear7]

My yard is overrun with weeds and .my husband wants to use a lawn company.i have contacted several companies to see what chemicals they are using and if they are toxic. They all claim they are not harmful. They do say to stay off the lawn for 2 hrs after application including pets.They say all the chemicals are FDA approved. I said that doesn't mean much. Does anyone use a lawn company.? Would it have an effect on Parkinson's. Thanks for your input!

[park_bear]

Demand to know exactly what chemicals they will be using. There's really no such thing as a safe pesticide, but be sure to stay away from permethrin, paraquat and rotenone. Better yet, demand and receive agreement not to use any pesticide or herbicide.

[Smittybear7 in reply to park_bear]

Thanks

[Gioc in reply to park_bear]

I'm almost sure they'll use glisophate like totally erbicide and reseminate .

[MBAnderson in reply to Gioc]

Glyphosate

[Smittybear7 in reply to MBAnderson]

Thanks for the information!

[Gioc in reply to Smittybear7]

MBA

The glisophate It's a new product, they only do it in Italy 😂😂😂

Thank you, I'm always happy if you correct me when I'm wrong. 😀

saved .. Flowers are like human souls: all different, all beautiful if you want.

[ForViolet in reply to Gioc]

In addition, I always feel it's an Italian twist to your comment if it's a little different.

[Smittybear7 in reply to Gioc]

Thanks

[SilentEchoes in reply to park_bear]

They don't use paraquat for lawns, 2'4-D and heavy metal contaminated fertilizer are the biggest problems.

[Boscoejean]

learn.eartheasy.com/article....

"What are lawn care chemicals?

They include more than just fertilizers. Chemicals that kill weeds, insects and a variety of diseases are sold separately and in combination with fertilizers such as ‘weed and feed’. These formulations may include organophosphates, carbamates, phenoxy and benzoic acid herbicides like 2,4 D, MCPP, and MCPA, pyrethroids and organchlorines"

Do lawn care chemicals pose a health threat to my family?

Yes. Pesticides used in controlling weeds, insects, etc., are toxic. These chemicals have been created to kill pests and most are broad-spectrum biocides. This means they are poisonous to a wide variety of living organisms, including garden plants, wildlife, pets, your neighbors, your family and you. Inert ingredients, which may comprise 50 to 99% of a pesticide formula may actually be more toxic than the active ingredients.

Of 30 commonly used lawn pesticides, 19 are linked with cancer or carcinogenicity, 13 are linked with birth defects, 21 with reproductive effects, 26 with liver or kidney damage, 15 with neurotoxicity, and 11 with disruption of the endocrine (hormonal) system. Of those same pesticides, 17 are detected in groundwater, 23 have the ability to leach into drinking water sources, 24 are toxic to fish and other aquatic organisms vital to our ecosystem, 11 are toxic to bees, and 16 are toxic to birds.

[Smittybear7 in reply to Boscoejean]

Thanks for all the information.

[Boscoejean]

How to avoid greenwashing and harmful pesticides in lawn care

Organic? Natural? Companies are looking to cash in on consumers' desire for environmentally friendly options.

ehn.org/pesticide-free-lawn....

[Smittybear7 in reply to Boscoejean]

Thanks for the information.

[LAJ12345]

I wouldn’t touch them!

[Smittybear7 in reply to LAJ12345]

Thanks

[Mechjack]

You will have to do it yourself or at least purchase all the products yourself and pay someone to put them down. I would trust no one to do what they say they will in that business particularly.

[Smittybear7 in reply to Mechjack]

Thanks

[Gioc]

The only way I know to have an acceptable lawn without herbicides and fertilisers is to have a lawn composed of native essences, that is, local 'weeds'. How can you get it?

1) remove the artificial irrigation.

2) Remove the all fertilization

3) make the cuts based on a better survival of the most welcome herbs.

For example to eliminate the clover ☘️ just cut more often. It will be hard work and the result depends on where you live. If you live in a semi-desert area I wouldn't do it, but in a subalpine zono you might like . See the photo.

Perhaps it would be common sense to use fertilisers and herbicides very sparingly and settle for a slightly rustic lawn to cut more often.

Prato sub alpino italiano

[Smittybear7 in reply to Gioc]

Thank you!

[SilentEchoes]

Plants are grasses (monocots) and broadleaf (dicots) and different herbicides have different modes of action. 2,4-D is toxic to broadleaf plants but not grasses. They are all toxic to people, pets and pollinators.

Lawn chemicals and fertilizers are contaminated with heavy metals. I agree with Gio, naturalization is the way to go. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[Smittybear7 in reply to SilentEchoes]

I agree. Prior to Parkinson's, I took care of the grass myself. I used corn gluten ,milky spore and applied organic fertilizer twice a year. All but 1 of our neighbors use True Green Lawn Care. All of the companies claim their products are not toxic to humans and pets after 2 hrs. I asked the person, who was wearing shorts and no protection, if he was concerned about the chemicals he was using and he said no. He said he was doing this for 12 years and no problems. They probably tell their employees that everything is safe. What a racket. Thanks for your response. I hope you are doing well.

[SilentEchoes in reply to Smittybear7]

I'd reach out to TruGreen and ask to be notified 24hrs in advance of when they will be spraying your neighbors yards and then make yourself scarce for the day.

Pay attention to plant damage from drift and report them relentlessly to the department of agriculture if you see it. Also note dates and weather conditions. I had to do this with my commercial ag neighbors. I can share photos of drift damage from my own property if people are interested.

There has to be someone who uses OMRI approved practices. That's the question you need to ask.

I'm okay, thanks for asking. Dealing with kidney issues that could only be caused by my poisoning, therefore I'm being neglected by doctors.

I'm a warrior, they won't get away with it.

Be well,

SE

[Smittybear7 in reply to SilentEchoes]

What is Omri practices?

[SilentEchoes in reply to Smittybear7]

OMRI - Organic Materials Review Institute omri.org/omri-lists

[Smittybear7 in reply to SilentEchoes]

Thank you

[MarionP]

See what some of the others have said.

Absent getting caught in a dense application fog or chemical fog or deep spray, ie extensive acute exposure, a single or very very occasional use probably won't hurt you, unless you're allergic and it gives you some sort of breathing disorder or skin eruptions. Absent an intensive exposure, or allergy, really it's prolonged or chronic exposure is the thing that will get you (or your pets).

Carrying on with the larger picture though:

You must have a comprehensive list of the chemicals they are using and then you go to work doing your own homework by looking up the chemical names of every item with a chemical name that you see on the labels. You also want to insist on seeing each manufacturers list (they publish them) called MSDS or material safety data sheet...

Now whenever you read the definitions of the chemical names, which you just have to Google is all, look for anything that involves chlorine, nitrogen, fluorine, and the suffix -ate or -ite. Especially what you were looking for is anything that uses chlorine, and then look up the molecule on Google and read the information there.. to make an extremely long story short, any molecule that uses more than one atom of chlorine, and especially in the presence of nitrogen or carbon, it's often is going to form up chemicals that are roughly the equivalent of agent Orange, and you can read about agent orange when you look that up too. Too much of it, especially if you happen to be heavily dosed with it yourself, is a recipe for cancer and, as I can attest from having lived 50 of my 70 years in an agricultural region of the US were these chemicals are used and have been used on a widespread basis all across the region, results in higher than normal proportions of population being diagnosed with Parkinson's, and other neurodegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's and other dementias, which has been common widespread belief in our region (upper midwest, many many farms producing very wide variety of agricultural products for the world, and the center of a great deal of commercial chemical and genetic research in ag products, livestock, grains, veggies, legumes, beans seeds, other truck, fruits) for many decades. Especially pesticides and herbicides (any '-cides'). ("-cide" basically means "poison." Some of them only harm insects or certain plants and not people, but a great many of them kill people, impose horrible diseases, breathing diseases cancers, dementia's.)

Also you want to know that glyphosate mechanism is basically a chemical that takes the weed and forces it to grow faster than its food supply, so that outgrows its food supply and thus in effect starves even as it grows larger and faster, so that it dies...which basically is another way of saying uncontrolled growth, and uncontrolled growth is a form of cancer by definition. WHO world health organization has now finally come out and said glyphosate is a carcinogen. Like with tobacco, which was effectively hidden by heavily spending lobbyists for about seven decades, the proof is now there for glyphosate.

PS no service is ever going to tell you something that would reduce their sales or increase their legal liability or potential liability. Assume that, because that is the way it works for all commerce. Don't set yourself up for problems by forcing somebody to answer you in a way that would punish them for telling the truth or harm or reduce their livelihood (after all, it's called "livelihood" for a reason).

[Boscoejean]

A few years back one of my friends was having True Green come to take care of her lawn and they wanted her dog to be inside for at least 2 hours. I said to her that it seems like the products they used could be toxic to her dog after 2 hours. They had told her they were using some kind of iron compound and that was why it was not good for the dog to get it on his paws until the spray had dried. It sounds to me like they were not telling her the whole story.

[Smittybear7 in reply to Boscoejean]

Thanks That is the response I got from all the companies I contacted. After 2hrs no problem???

[MarionP]

Well talk about your total coincidences, it's about 90 minutes since I wrote my response to you. Now scrolling through one of my newsletters, I see this brand new release in my inbox. Remember my little comment about multiple chlorines?

science.org/content/article...

[Smittybear7 in reply to MarionP]

Unable to open

[MarionP in reply to Smittybear7]

science.org › article

Widely used chemical strongly linked to Parkinson's disease

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About featured snippets

A groundbreaking epidemiological study has produced the most compelling evidence yet that exposure to the chemical solvent trichloroethylene (TCE)—common in soil and groundwater—increases the risk of developing Parkinson's disease.2 days ago

URMC - Rochester

urmc.rochester.edu › c...

Common Dry Cleaning Chemical Linked to Parkinson's Disease

Mar 14, 2023 — For the past 100 years, trichloroethylene (TCE) has been used to decaffeinate coffee, degrease metal, and dry clean clothes. It contaminates the ...

[Smittybear7 in reply to MarionP]

thank you

[brettnmi]

don’t those chemicals cause Parkinson’s ?

[WinnieThePoo in reply to brettnmi]

The short answer is "No they don't". And I haven't even checked which chemicals you are talking about. They might contribute to an increased risk of developing parkinson's, but they don't cause it. A couple of simple tests

1) when was that chemical first invented? And when did James parkinson write his essay on the shaking palsy?

2)how many people do you know who have chemicals applied to their lawns who don't get parkinson's? Or, like my client Geoff, who is 70 and worked a lifetime as groundsman using those chemicals and doesn't have parkinson's?

[Esperanto in reply to WinnieThePoo]

This is a too easy relativisation of a serious problem. Until recently, such arguments were also used in the danger of smoking and the application of asbestos. Lung cancer also occurs in non-smokers and also in people who are not exposed to asbestos. While this has been known for more than 60 years, governments, partly to protect industries and tax revenues, have failed to intervene. The WHO estimates that about 8,1 million people die each year unnecessary. 

You can see the same pattern with PD. The cause of PD is complex and there are usually many other causes (as with lung cancer). Rather, there will indeed be a accumulation of factors, but that does not eliminate the risk of (co-)causative agent. The Dutch Neurologist Bas Bloem  warned already in 2020 of ‘Parkinson’s Pandemic’ linked to toxic chemicals. STOP NOW these nonsensical forms of pollution so you don’t have to say later to your grandchildren “Wir haben es nicht gewusst”… 

PD pandemic

[WinnieThePoo in reply to Esperanto]

You mistake my comment for an endorsement of chemical poisons. However, my real point is that if you blame substances which didnt exist until the 20th century for a disease which was comprehensively described at the beginning of the 19th century, you are going to be looking in the wrong place for a cure

[Esperanto in reply to WinnieThePoo]

Lung cancer also existed before global nicotine addiction and asbestos use, but to a much lesser extent. My point is that you will also have to look at the cause of the current PD pandemic in order to arrive at an integrated approach to PD.

[Gioc in reply to brettnmi]

It would seem that growing the vine in French does not help, copper and sulfur-based fungicides and derivatives are widely used on the vine. Man, since prehistoric times, has worked with copper and sulfur ... and breathed.

*For the record, the use of copper and sulfur-based fungicides and derivatives began in the 1800s and they are still widely used today especially in the cultivation of vines, not to mention those based on manganese.

sciencedirect.com/science/a...

agrimag.it/fungicidi-rameici/

[BIB23]

I use white vinegar concentrate and mix a 10% solution which is then applied via spray pump (on a sunny day). The sun helps drying out the weeds. It has to be repeated more frequently than a herbicide though.

[Smittybear7 in reply to BIB23]

Does it kill the grass? Thanks

[BIB23]

It's definitely drying up, the earlier you catch it, the better. If it's killing all the way to the roots, I'm not sure. But it keeps it at bay. We are using it on and along our gravel walkways. A once a month routine works best for us here in the tropics.

[Smittybear7 in reply to BIB23]

I need it for weeds in the grass. Clover Does it kill the good grass?

[BIB23 in reply to Smittybear7]

yes, I am afraid it will

[Thal]

stephentvedten.com/index.htm

[Smittybear7 in reply to Thal]

Thanks Any suggestions as to how I can find a company that uses those products?

[DrewE]

Correcting some info: Be concerned if your lawn care company tells you the products are approved by the FDA; horticultural chemicals are regulated by the EPA. Also note that the trade name for glyphosate is Round-up and as a result of its use to control weeds in GM crops it has vaulted to the top of list of most used herbicides. The EU has banned its use due to implications for negative health effects. Yet in the US, anyone can buy Round Up at any hardware or home center store .

[Smittybear7 in reply to DrewE]

Thanks

[SilentEchoes]

Pesticides aren't regulated by the FDA (Food and Drug Administration) they are regulated by the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) on the federal level and Department of Agriculture on the state level. OMRI sets the standard for organic agriculture - a lawn is a monocrop for all intents and purposes, just like a golf course, public park, baseball, soccer and football fields, etc. They are turf. Can you top dress the yard with black dirt and reseed in the fall with a resilient seed mixture to outcompete the weeds? Mow often to prevent weeds from going to seed before reseeding in the fall.

[Smittybear7 in reply to SilentEchoes]

Thanks