Once admired for the way it handled the crisis. After easing their lockdown they now have a second spike. I do hope that Boris is taking notice of this development, after all, he did say that they were learning lessons from other countries. By all accounts on Friday their R rate was 1.06
Germany's R number rockets again - fr... - Lung Conditions C...
Germany's R number rockets again - from 1.79 to 2.88.
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2greys
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•
I saw that on the news 2greys, scary stuff. Xxxx
This news is so worrying. Will Mr Johnson take heed? Your guess is as good as mine.
He has lied consistently, back peddled, everything you don't want or should have in a Prime Minister leading the country. His actions just dont inspire confidence.
Very worrying indeed.
From R rate 1.06 on Friday to 2.88 tonight. He really does have to take notice of just how fast it can get out of control. A lot faster than he can react. It took him weeks to bring in the lockdown at the beginning, weeks to sort out PPE. Months to sort out an app that doesn't work and never would and months to get testing up to a paltry 200,000.
He has got rid of a lot of the SAGE scientists, replacing them with economists. The mind boggles.
He and his cronies are just not up to the job! I just hope everyone can see through him now and actually see him for what he really is. Nobody in thrir right mind will respect him after all of this. Respect is something you have to earn.
"Respect is something you have to earn."
Unfortunately the site will only allow me the one like.
• in reply toRoadRunner44
Sadly just like the red tops Johnson/Hancock go for the headline grabbing stories on the daily update and then back track later, equivalent to the back page apology. We cannot rely on the government and need to carry out best practice ourselves ( and encourage families/friends to do same) to fend off the virus.
RoadRunner44• in reply to
You are right mapgo. This pandemic has certainly shown up the shortfalls in the current government. I have no faith in any of them.
It basically boils down to the fact that although the Tory party has plenty of talent amongst it's ranks, this current PM has none and has selected a bunch of 'yes men' also without discernable talent to be our Government.
Very eloquently put. However, It is still a very concerning and worrying state of affairs.
Indeed it is and I think that we here and others at risk need to monitor the situation for ourselves and tread very carefully.
This is very concerning. It will not be a surprise following the speedy easing of late if the same thing doesn’t happen here. Wherever it happens it has the potential to affect everyone worldwide.
Cx
The only thing Johnson takes any notice of is his poll ratings.
I’m awaiting developments.there seems to bea rush to kickstart the economy.
IM still shielding,it feels safer at present.
Stay safe.
The only economy Johnson will kick start is undertakers, they want to reopen pubs and restaurants on 4th July, but who’s going to want to go a pub or restaurant to sit there wearing a mask or stuck behind glass partitions!
I thnk that perhaps the plastic screens will reduce air flow. I think that am I will struggle to breathe with this. What does every one else think .
Hi Oshgosh, for the last month I have been going for walks locally using ambulatory oxygen, but I haven’t been in any shops or anything else since 5th March, I’ve just been going out for walks for my mental and physical health, I would be exempted from wearing a mask, but I would not feel safe going on public transport or indoors anywhere else without wearing one, so for the foreseeable future I will be in lockdown, whether the government says it’s safe or not,
I feel, if the distancing goes down from 2m to 1m, and the pubs and restaurants are allowed to open up their indoor areas, we will have a booming virus again. It is a balance between jobs and the older/iller/Black and Ethnic Minority members of society. We must wait to see what effect the extra shopping has had.
Oh dear that's not good.
I’ve always been a bit concerned about drawing conclusions about the most appropriate response by countries before the pandemic has taken its course, which is the only time when we can have any certainty about the best approach. To be fair, though, Germany’s increase is apparently due to pockets of infection, which might be effectively dealt with in the same way as S. Korea.
With regard to learning from other countries, you can only do this in retrospect, and contagion moves so fast that it can be difficult to react in time. I think here we are in danger of over-complicating matters, when the basic precautions of good hygiene and keeping as far from others as possible (without attempting to put a figure on it - “horses for courses”) are the obvious ways to reduce contagion, and wearing a mask in crowded places. If everyone did that, the virus would have nowhere to go; sadly, not everyone does. I wouldn’t mind so much if some people accidentally infect themselves (we all make mistakes), but I do object to the inconsiderate putting the rest of us at unnecessary risk.
It does appear that as the lockdown has been slowly eased more and more people are taking greater liberties and of course greater risks, all thinking it will not happen to them or the attitude of 'I am young so will only get it mild anyway' without thinking about who they might end up passing it on to. Temperatures are on the rise this week, another heatwave, I bet the beaches will be cram packed again.
This time it looks like there will be announcements, tomorrow, over relaxing the 2 metre rule and opening of pubs & restaurants. The covidiots will probably jump the gun again, the timing with the pending heatwave, starting tomorrow as well, does not bode well.
Good morning 2greys,
I believe this spike in Germany was due to the Coronavirus at the abattoir and not due to the ease of the lockdown, which also happened in Wales or Yorkshire, in abattoirs? And it has raised here, too, due to a too early ease up of the lockdown.
No matter the cause, if the R rate increases above 1 then it is far from contained, it is spreading, at an increased rate. This will affect those that were previously shielded (if it comes to an end) the mortality percentage of those infected will go through the roof. Because there is no more shielding, more of the clinically, extremely vulnerable will get infected.
The difference is they had a low death rate before lifting restrictions. About 9k I believe. Sadly, as soon as they started to lift restrictions the elderly and vulnerable were going to be at risk.
I do hope so to I would not Like to b in his shoes x
Very worrying. X
Hi 2greys,
Yes, I have been following the story in Germany.
What concerns me greatly, is that the main outbreak occurred in a meat factory that was employing foreign labour on a zero hour contract basis. My husband worked in both the Netherlands and Germany under similar conditions. The problem being that if you don't work you do not get paid. I would therefore question how many workers were aware of being ill, but chose to continue going to work. Regarding the UK - we have over 1000000 zero hour contract workers plus many self employed people - will they self isolate if they become ill and can they afford to? Very big questions when you consider how fast the R value has accelerated in Germany. I also think that in many respects the Germans are more honest about their figures than the UK - where politics and economics appear to dominate decisions, more than the well being of the people.
Zero hour and self employed, as you rightly say, pose a problem. Transparency and honesty by the Gov. are also an issue in the UK, there have been many lies, moving of the goalposts and omissions with the data. Some of us have good memories and see it all happening before our eyes.
As for meat packing plants the same is happening here in the UK:
Are meat-processing plants the new breeding ground for Covid? Scientists warn chilled climate with no sun light allows virus to thrive as THIRD factory is shutdown in UK - after outbreaks in German and US sites.
It seems to be related to very specific local outbreaks, particularly a meat-packing plant. See pages 5-6 of the German daily report: rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/N... Community transcription is otherwise low. Note also the quality and detail of the (daily) reporting!
Not just meat packing plants. Theres been an outbreak in the crisp factory in Leicester. I think we're going to see a lot of this sort of thing.
The neighbours at the back of us had a loud party with many friends from all over the place.
Only a few miles from the local hospital reporting 5deaths from the virus in 3 days and dozens of admissions with it.
In a neighbouring village a house party with 22 guests ,4 police visits to try and stop said party no notice of police taken
But don't worry the govt has dropped the alert level,social distancing doesn't exist neither does adhering to meeting up with only 6 folk!
Wow ! This exchange has become very political. I have no intention of defending this Government but would any of us like to be facing the dilemmas they have to balance at this moment in time.. This virus is going to be endemic (in fact, it already is) whatever action the Government takes. Has any government faced such a situation in the past other than total war ? The only answer for the long term must be antibody testing followed by a vaccine programme. In the interim, the UK has to be weaned back to some kind of normality otherwise the economic devastation will take decades to repair. The damage already sustained is likely to be significant. So come on folks , lets be a little more understanding of what is an unprecedented situation and stop calling the politicians ( or scientists, for that matter) all sorts of fools. I doubt very much if the political opposition could do very much better.
• in reply toCYMROBOY
They had ample warning 4yrs ago and still did nothing. I’m angry about that, it’s nothing to do with which party is in power. Here’s a link to a Telegraph article about Exercise Cygnus, the pandemic preparedness exercise in 2016 google.co.uk/amp/s/www.tele...
Funny how other countries, dealing with the same virus, seem to have managed rather better. Hard to be understanding when you have the second highest death rate, per capita in the world.
How do you know that they have managed better? Much is yet to be known. Thought this was started by the suggestion that Germany was not managed better despite what we had been told.
It was not political, until you changed it, by mentioning the political opposition!
Your post was not political but much that followed from others was clearly so. If it's not about the party in power Hanne62, who is it about ?
• in reply toCYMROBOY
It’s about the government, irrespective of party. I really don’t care who’s in power atm & am not at all sure any of the others would do a better job. The fact is, a national crisis is being mishandled in a way which is causing more deaths, and ruining our economy. You don’t have to agree, you’re quite entitled not to, but don’t drag party politics into it. It’s gone way beyond that.
2greys• in reply to
I would go a little further in saying it is about certain individuals in the Gov, that have totally mishandled the situation, in more ways than one
Mishandled to the extent that thousand of lives, in care, were needlessly lost, the stress and misery caused to those that looked after them. I will never forgive them for their part in that.
CYMROBOY• in reply to
Sorry but you and 2greys have missed my point. I did not drag party politics into it, others did. You are ,of course, entitled to your opinions on how those in authority have handled the situation but it is so easy to be wise after the event. I reiterate, the virus has gone endemic and we are going to have to live with it for some time to come until some measure of security comes from a vaccine; even then may be a risk to those with lung conditions, akin to that presented by influenza. I was merely asking for some consideration for the difficulty faced by those in authority, governmental or scientific, who have to make decisions on how to handle the situation on our behalf. To suggest that matters have been "totally mishandled" is an unfair and emotional response. Easy to take a view when you do not suggest any alternative actions or carry the responsibility.
It is too late for alternative suggestions for all those that have already died, it is too late for all the nights of tears and consoling my partner who works in a nursing home when there were daily deaths.
It is too late to console the both us who caught the damned virus from that nursing home.
Easy for you to view it like that if you have not been affected in the same way.
Easy for you to call it an unfair and emotional response.
It is totally unfair to have suffered what we and others in a similar position to have gone through in the first place.
It is unfair that we had to make the decision for my partner to continue to work in the nursing home, to provide care to those who could not look after themselves, despite me being shielded and at a risk to my own life.
It is unfair for her to work a 60 hour week because of staff shortages when they had to self isolate after showing symptoms. All at minimum wage!
As for following the science. Dr Jenny Harris herself said only last night that all the decisions have been made by the Gov and not by the scientists. Professor Chris Whitty had also said that at earlier briefings as well.
I can understand you clear emotion. My emotion is to sympathize deeply with you and your partner and to pray for your well being. We all need to pray that our decision makers are given the wisdom to deal with an unprecedented situation. We also need to pray that this virus is in some measure conquered. Nothing is easy for any of us who access this forum.
I am going to Mention This as I am very Angry. In Spain The Brits are arriving. My Little Town Called Los Montesinos have reported that Brits in their Supermarket where asked to put Provided Masks on as All the Spanish Do. They kicked up such a Fuss, as They felt they were superior to not have to wear a Mask . What a Big Let Down. Mind, seen it all, over The Years. Wonder what they will do when on the Beach, which is Partioned off with Blue Tape for all to keep their Distances. Respect Please Brits in Spain. I'm sure this is just a small Minority. The Mind Boggles. XXX Stay well . Sorry 2 Greys, using your Post to View my Disappointment. Knowing that your Post's are Read by Everyone. XXX C.
• in reply toHacienda
I’m sure it’s a small minority too, tho I can just imagine the sort of Brit involved. Loud-mouthed little Englanders I expect. I don’t imagine many of US are planning a trip to Spain!
Local media always leap on any bad behaviour by tourists though. My local rag is just the same. Civilised, respectful visitors don’t sell newspapers.
Hacienda• in reply to
The actual Comment Came from an English Resident of Los Montesinos to an Expat Friend of mine who has a Business there. . No Local Paper involved, Though I agree that all Media are the Lowest for Scare Mongering.
• in reply toHacienda
I wouldn’t worry too much then, if it’s just a comment from one person
It doesn’t surprise me to hear of that behaviour from British tourists Hacienda!
Whenever I go out to the shops here in Yorkshire I see only about one in ten wearing masks.
It’s as if some consider themselves immune.
It might help if our government made it mandatory to wear face covering in all public places but they even dither on that one as well!
It gets worse, as Boris set to announce relaxing the 2 metre rule!
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