As predicted my occasional episodes of A Fib which began in 2007 has recently become more of a problem. They are now presenting differently tho. My resting heart beat is about 60bpm and whilst in Afib they are now usually 60 to 75, only rising further when I am moving about. My question is can anyone associate Afib with poor sleep. ? Over the last few months my sleep patterns are all over the place, averaging about 4-5 hours a night. Sometimes even less, seem to go off to sleep ok but wake up between 2-4 and then can’t get back again. Occasionally I do eventually go off about 6am and sleep for maybe an hour. I know my problems are are not as bad as many on here but it’s now affecting my daily life. I’m becoming reluctant to make any arrangements in case I have to cancel.
I have this year had several examinations and testing. Been diagnosed with mild to moderate pulmonary hypertension and a slightly leaky valve.
I know what you're going through Sue, not being able to sleep is hell and it has to be experienced before people can understand. My sleep problems started in my late 30's and my Dr prescribed a mild sleeping pill. Then I was taken off of them and life went back to being hell. You can never guarantee how you're going to feel each day, so I was reluctant to offer to drive anyone anywhere far. When you haven't slept it's a feeling next day like you have flu, but I'd find that by the evening I felt better and of course wasn't tired then.
I've now been taking the lowest strength of the sleeping pills Zopiclone made by Milpharm (they contain no colouring, as colours make me a bit hyper), these have been prescribed by my GP for what could possibly be about 10 years and life is normal again. I can't bear to think where I'd be without them. People who have never experienced what it's like not to have a good nights sleep really don't understand.
Sorry, I don't have an instant cure for you.
I have found that the Pukka herbal tea Peppermint and Licorice, helps me sleep deeper.
Hi Jean, Thank you so much for that. I have been trying to hold off from sleeping meds, I’m so sick of side affects from other stuff couldn’t cope with any more. Do you think the sleep thing is a trigger for Af?
I think some of us have no alternative other than sleeping pills, honestly I struggled for years and tried every natural remedy there was.
Getting up in the night is certainly a trigger for AF. As we get out of bed the heart has to beat harder to get the blood to the top of our body and sometimes it doesn't slow down and that's often when we go into AF. When you have to get out of bed, the knack is to always sit on the side of the bed for a short while. I take my thyroid meds then which are best taken away from other pills. When you're back in bed do deep breathing, concentrate on that (not what your heart is doing) and you should drift off back to sleep.
I've had AF for 18 years, with the last 3-4 in constant AF and I must admit I don't get so het up about what my heart is doing now. I remember how awful PAF was though.
I never quite understand when people say that permanent Af is not so bad compared to paf. I had paf and it was awful. Drugs didn’t work so ablation for me. Why then do we not let paf go to permanent and life will be better?
It all depends on your heart rate and how high it goes when in AF. After my third ablation I never had a really high heart rate again. I'd also discovered the benefits of a diet free from artificial additives, sugar and alcohol. Then when I went into AF constantly, my rate eventually dropped to where it is now between 60-90. Before my last ablation, my heart rate would shoot so high that I could hardly move from one room in my house to another and I'd spend a lot of time being admitted to a hospital ward.
Artificial additives to food were a sure trigger for my AF attacks. How I wish I'd known that before having any ablations. Also I never wear anything tight around my body now.
I am glad you are better now. Like you I was very symptomatic . I stopped drinking which was a definite trigger.
I worry ever time I get a blip (usually high bp and hr). Strangely the thought of having permanent Af and leading a normal, stop worrying life, appeals. So many say that permanent is easier.
I was lucky to have had a successful ablation 3 years ago. Nearly Af free .
Just lately I have had a couple of hits where my BP and pulse shoot up. Last time the BP came down quickly but the pulse stayed in the 90s for 6 hrs. I really hope it is not coming back.
My 3rd ablation really helped me, but didn't cure my AF and I still had a few minor attacks, which were cured by cardioversions. Then after having two cardioversions in one year I was told I wouldn't be offered any more. I don't think about AF at all now. Do think I need to get fit again though.
My sleep patten has been irregular for years, very similar to you last night. I think its a chicken & egg situation does poor sleep contribute to more AF or does more AF usually lead to poor sleep.
My AF is in remission but I have noticed in our hot weather over the last couple of months more ectopic/flutter very short occurrences. Maybe the heat isn't helping you.
As poor sleep can cause a multitude of other important issues, despite sharing your sentiments, I am tempted by Jean's solution of lowest strength Zopiclone. As one gets older it seems to me a balancing act with all these drugs and therefore a very individual decision.
thanks for your comments, i actually think on reflection that many things are contributing now, like having to get up for the loo a couple of times in the night, having a partner with the same need for the loo but at different times. I used to be able to go back to sleep every time but not over the last few months. It’s only been 18 days since my last episode, 12 months ago I could go many months between episodes. Guess I better just get used to it. I am seriously rethinking my decision re sleeping meds.
Poor sleep is definitely a factor in my case. In fact, since developing AF, and with me and my husband having such different sleep habits (his involves playing games on his phone at night to 'relax') that we opted for separate rooms, we both sleep better. Cuddle time has to be factored in but I think we're both happier. He also snores like a rhinoceros because he's overweight bless him. Do love this man but at present he's ignoring all the warning signs!!
Anyway - I 'taught' myself to sleep better. No phone at night, phone for long periods in the evening, dark room, conscious 'winding down' from around 9.00 each night. Getting into sunlight within an hour of waking each morning and sitting in it for 10+ minutes. Do some googling on Circadian rhthyms and sleep patterns. Theres lots out there. You might find it interesting too.
My wife and I also do separate rooms, which works much better but we both miss the intimacy. The prompt was anxiety causing AF as getting into bed I knew I was going to be disturbed due to the Missus liking to read for some time and then when the lights did go out the snoring started 😁.
Oh I relate! When we travel and need to stay in a twin room thr first thing we do is move the furniture. Lord knows what the hotel staff think 😀 and then the other half has instructions to wait till I'm asleep before he switches off. Have you tried the myotape mouth tapes? We're both snoring less and sleeping better with these.
Yes, anything that has to be done for a good nights sleep!
Yes, I have myotape, which I use but not every night. I think I may have trained myself to keep my mouth shut at night by practising during the day with 6 breaths a minute on my walks and whenever I think of it. My thinking is this has stopped the habit of taking short gasps of air forcing the mouth to be used...but who knows.
Yes, I take it you've read the James Nestor book. I used some of these techniques whilst walking too. Spoiled my walk for a bit but I'd noticed the mouth breathing habit which I'd developed as a response to AF. The other half is a long term mouth breather
Recently I too started waking stupidly early in the morning and unable to go back to sleep. I did find the Pukka herbal tea called Night Time can help a lot. It’s got valerian in it, which is an old-fashioned sleep aid. Maybe others can comment if that’s known to be a potential problem with AF?
I have persistent sleep difficulties compounded this past couple of years by nighttime visits to the loo thanks to suffering an enlarged prostate pressing on my bladder when lying down. I ought to try sleeping standing up!
When I am especially tired, which was the case yesterday, my heart always feels unusually fragile and I get a large number of ectopic beats, especially of I exercise. It’s unusual for me to develop AF, that comes maybe every few months, but I have no doubt of a link between tiredness and my heart problems. If you are prone to AF, then I gather that any ectopic beats caused by excessive fatigue might well trigger it.
Prostex by Lamberts Healthcare seems to have sorted my long diagnosed enlarged prostate.
I believe part of my success in keeping AF at bay is to moderate my past habits which included flopping into bed exhausted. The flip side of that is it may be contributing to an imperfect sleep pattern. You take your choice and ....😃
Thanks for the tip. I’ll look into that. Oh for relief! A few weeks ago my GP switched me from alfuzosin to tamsulosin to try to help. The tablets work well enough during the day but, somehow, the act of lying down, and most especially if I have any constipation, seems to irritate the bladder.
Hi Stokessue06, i can identify with you on this as my sleep is also all over the place, and on a particularly bad nights sleep my legs feel heavy next day and heavy legs seem sure to bring about an af episode, i also am reluctant to make plans on outings with people as im sure to let them down, now if invited to something i mostly just tell people ,if i am there you will see me, i cant be bothered trying to explain af to people anymore, they dont seem to hear .
Hi Tom, Thanks for your comments, I don’t tell many people, I think Afib is something you have to experience to have any understanding. My family are brilliant, they can see a big difference to how I used to be so they do, I think understand.
Chelated Magnesium works for me. Sleep like a baby after one tablet with my evening meal. Just get up once about 3am to urinate then fall straight back to sleep.
Are you taking magnesium? It’s essential for all oft functions. I take Mag taurate (for heart), Mag bisglycinate (for relaxing and sleep) and ionic (liquid) magnesium. Not sure what type of magnesium the ionic is, but it’s 99% absorbable.
Stay away from Mag citrate as it’s used in larger doses as a cure for constipation.
You need 400+mg magnesium per day. I do find the bisglycinate gives me restless leg type feeling if taken too near to bed time, but that doesn’t happen with the ionic.
I combine the Mag taurate with Vit D (4,000iu), calcium, plus 4x drops of (4,000mg) CBD oil about a hour before bed and have good quality sleep.
Yes poor sleep = more palpitations/ aniexity. In fact i was in AnE the other day where for no reason my heart started racing above normal levels and started panicking which obviously increased it even more. It turned out to be ok so probably just a panick attack.
Anyways i have noticed my heart failure symptoms but more specifically ectopic skipped beats occur way more frequently if i have had a rubbish nights sleep. It makes it even worse to try and sleep with ectopic beats. Nasty circle.
So iv looked into sleep teas and the best one i found is Valerian tea. Cant remember name but its Dr something or other valerian tea. It works like morphine! Brilliant stuff for deep vivid dreams. Doesnt react with heart meds like some herbs can.
Also make sure your bed is lying south facing or eat or west but never north! Head does not face north! As we are energy and connected to the earths magnetic forces. Face south or east for better nights sleep. Face north if you want bad circulation, bad sleep, headaches and even strokes! Goodnight... X
thanks for that, I’ve found Pukka night time is working quite well at the moment. I’m certainly sleeping better than I was.
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