Hi all. Should I post this or not. Maybe not but I will. I hope people will correct me on this one. I don't want to put anyone off from having an ablation. However half the time it doesn't seem to work. You need a second or third one for it to be successful. Even then it's not always a 'winner'. Now I want to be 100% clear here. It works for some and cures their afib - that's great news. For me leave me in afib. Would I have an ablation - no I think not. I'm very interested in what others have to say and their views.
Paul
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Well that should liven up a fairly peaceful weekend. I’m gonna hold off before I chip in with my tuppence worth 😉
I think the figure my ep gave me was around 75% success rate for a single PVI ablation. That was when I was diagnosed with paroxysmal afib. They said similar for persistent afib which I'm in now. If you go into permanent afib there is a significant drop in the success rate.
The Cleveland Clinic in the US says 75-80% cure from a single ablation where no other heart disease is present. I was recently on the phone with a nurse from the Mayo Clinic and got a slightly lower figure.
Not sure how long any of them follow the patients, however, but there should be some online data that will tell you.
And yes, some people do need a second or third ablation and even then they might not be cured. But I think your 50% figure is much too low for paroxysmal or even persistent afib without significant heart disease.
Also might add that even a "successful ablation" can be ruined if you don't take care of yourself. John Mandrola MD, author of the "Haywire Heart" has made this point repeatedly. So if after your ablation, you start to gain weight, start drinking to access, don't pay attention to your blood pressure or go back to running marathons, etc. -- don't count on the ablation to necessarily hold. Of course, you can do everything right and afib can still come back. Afib can be very fickle and cruel at times.
For me ablation was the answer and as I have mentioned once or five times probably saved my life. Had I still had AF in 2010 the surgeon would not have been prepared to do the radical prostatectomy which enabled them to find that the cancer had already spread. This meant that other treatment was carried out and I am still here. OK I'm short of a few bits and pieces from inside that I can live without and a much small bladder than I went in with but that was 12 years ago and I'm still here.
The other thing of which I constantly have to remind people is that success stories are not news. Very few people who have successful ablations either stay long here or come back to tell us. We get a few for sure for whom we are extremely grateful as they do at least bring some good news to the party.
OK ablation must always be considered part of ongoing treatment and may need repeating but have one have three. Once you know what is involved it so easy.
I was finally diagnosed with AF in 2004/5 and AF free since 2008. Yes I have other arrhythmias from time to time but the ten years I spent free of them all and free of all drugs (bar antioagulant of course) was like a re-birth.
Here ends the summing up of the council for the defense.
I decided not to have one, the risk of possible long and unpleasant recovery plus possibly needing it done again and again were definite negatives for me and my Cardiologist agreed, he’s not a fan of the procedure!
I was caring for my now late husband at the time and he was going in for major heart surgery so me being out of action wasn’t an option. I also wasn’t convinced ablation was right for me and my cardiologist agreed, I had a pacemaker and meds instead.
I would say that it depends how badly you are affected by AF. I finally agreed to my first one after a bout of pulmonary oedema caused by bring left in AF for 3 weeks. I was very badly affected and wondered what was going on.
If I was in the position of being rate controlled then I would possibly leave well alone and live with it. Unfortunately this was not possible for me.
The first ablation was in 2009 and since then I've had 3 more, the last one July 2021. I've been a difficult case but I'm hopeful that we have finally nailed it !
I was diagnosed with paroxysmal AF back in January 2010. Ways forward were discussed with my Cardiologist. Ablation was discussed ..... I rejected it, opting instead for medication to bring the beast under control. A year or so later I added diet and lifestyle change to the mix.
For me it was the best decision ever PLUS ..... my diagnosis was made and medication started in 9 hours from first onset. That speed was, in my humble view, instrumental in my AF being so highly controlled today, now age 77. Yes, AF still gives me a bit of a mugging 3 to 5 times a year, short bursts but it has never sent me to either my GP, Cardio consultant or an EP ! Yes I still get bouts of palpitations, but, again no sweat
Speaking here on behalf of my husband. No 1 ablation didn’t work & left him feeling quite ill for a few weeks. I didn’t want him to have it done again but the AF was causing him to pass out quite worryingly. On one occasion I had to call out the paramedics. So ablation number 2, he’s never looked back. He felt well from word go. That was a year ago now. It’s given him back his life. For how long who knows. Good for him for not listening to me but don’t tell him I said that!!
Ubiquinol is the active ingredient of CoQ10. It’s available at most health stores, Amazon etc. I found I absorbed CoQ10 better and it’s a lot cheaper. I take 2x100mg daily.
Lots of info on Mag and which type to take. I tend to use spray oil because I can’t take orally.
My research into the beneficial uses of Magnesium and Ubiquinol (CoQ10) were prompted by the many posts on this forum. Many folk suffering from AF, AT and other arrythmias (ectopic beats, etc) were noting that magnesium was helping them. A number of Cardiologists also recommend Magnesium. After some testing of various magnesium capsules, I settled on magnesium glycinate and take 500mg per day in the evening. In addition, I take 200mg of Ubiquinol (CoQ10, Kaneka brand) every morning. My doctor/cardiologist prescribed meds remain the same as always and I take Sotalol (beta blocker) plus other meds for blood pressure, anti-coagulant, etc. I do take some other supplements for overall heart health but think these are secondary to the 2 above. These include L-Carnitine, Vitamin B-12 and Alpha Lipoic Acid.
It depends on how symptomatic you are and whether drugs help. I went through a horrific year or two. I couldn’t work, I was in and out of hospital and had tried almost every drug. Leading up to my last ablation I was on Atenolol, Digoxin AND Amiodarone (a real cocktail) and that still couldn’t control my AF. Maybe it’s because I’ve had a number of arrhythmias, not just AF. Ablations gave me back my life but they aren’t for everyone.
After a long gap rereferred to cardiology. Having very short episodes of arrythmia which left me feeling off colour for a day or so ( bearing in mind anxiety plays a part I'm sure. New guy very sound, (have a friend who is cardio spec nurse and thinks he's excellent) increased flec and mentioned ablation as an option if no improvement!! I was very surprised as episodes so short and even he not sure from 14 day monitor if AF or not.Does the suggestion depend on the mindset of one's Consultant??. I certainly wouldn't say yes as things are ( in any case much improved with inc. dose) I'm 78
My first EP had a “no big deal-live with it” attitude. After a year or so of that, I switched to another EP who within minutes said “let’s schedule an ablation”. I was astonished at the contrast, so yes, different mindsets for sure!
I’ve had one and am now thinking about a second. Yeah the op is scary and I was very nervous and my legs hurt a lot after but I’d do it again. When I was first diagnosed with persistent AF, I lived with it for 6 months before my first cardioversion- it was like night and day. Going into NSR was like waking up from a nightmare. Constant headache, out of breath, no energy but the real thing for me was and is… the fear.
I hate feeling my heart jumping around.
So yes, when I get offered another one, I’m going for it.
I am a firm advocate for ablation and for getting it done as soon as possible after diagnosis with PAF as from my understanding that gives the highest chance of success. However as has been mentioned before this needs to be accompanied by lifestyle changes so that previous bad habits that triggered Afib episodes are avoided.
My worst episode, that lasted nearly 3 days, came after being a complete idiot and undertaking a day of strenuous physical effort followed by joining some friends in a social evening that led me to drinking a full bottle of wine.
I have had my ablation and the recovery so far has been great. I have also cut down on caffeine, alcohol and sugar in my diet. Exercise is moderate but regular and the overall benefits of these changes are starting to show through.
I have no desire to find myself on a long term drug regime with the associated dubious side effects and the ablation gives a chance to achieve this.
I didn’t have an ablation until I found it affected my day time activities. I was taking Flecainide (300g a day at one time) and verapamil which helped a lot.I enjoy tennis and golf. My AF usually happened at night but after about 10 years it was occurring when I was out and about. I wasn’t keen on having an ablation but eventually had one nearly 5 years ago and I am really pleased I made that decision. I do get eptopics but I don’t worry about them now. Life just seems so good not having to worry about suddenly having an attack. I know the AF may come back but life is good at the moment and I’m hoping it will stay that way.
I had ablation 2 days ago and unfortunately it "failed". I'm gutted!I won't know for a month or so if they are prepared to try again.
Recovery has been, so far, no problem at all and certainly wouldn't put me off going again . No pain or discomfort following but emotionally I'm a bit battered. And of course 3 weeks of isolation and the impact on work/ life etc. But my heart conditions and the cocktail of meds also impact on both. Lots to consider!
They told me on the day it failed. They couldn't get all the veins. Cardioversion also failed. Was in AF before during and after. They may try again. I'll wait to hear.
Good morning Paul, as the old saying goes 'you will never know until you try'I decided to have an ablation after full discussion on the ups and downs with my Cardiologist, I had a cardioversion and two ablations which failed to keep me in a normal sinus rhythm. The AF was affecting my lifestyle leaving me breathless and shattered due to the medication for AF.
Again following full discussion I had a pacemaker fitted which has placed me back to normal lifestyle.
I am 77 and enjoy golf 3 x times per week, weather permitting, plus I also am able to play for the Seniors at our social matches with other golf clubs.
I can only speak as I find but I would do the same thing again
Hi Golfer, I'm very interested in your journey after the pacemaker. I had an ablation a year ago which hasn't really worked well. I am seeing the cardiologist next Tuesday for a review of my present status. I may be offered another ablation, (which I do not want - I can only be sedated, not anaesthetised, and I found the whole procedure horrible!) Any way, I have been told that any more ablations after the age of 80 are probably not a good idea. But I have also been advised that the consultant may offer a pacemaker followed by AV node ablation . I'm really nervous about this, though I can imagine it would be well worth it if af went away for ever. But I can't get away from the fear of the procedure itself. I used to be brave and strong, but aging is a psychologically damaging process!
Hi, diagnosed in 2015. Was immediately offered an ablation. Mentally prepared myself for the procedure, went to see the specialist who said "it's not without risk you know" in such a voice of doom that put me off. He seemed to be saying if the drugs were working why do it. I still have breakthroughs. I might go a month where I feel it everyday then the next month nothing at all. I still don't want to get my heart zapped unless I need to. It may then be too late of course. I hope they will find another "cure". So many people seem to have it and some I have spoken to have never heard of an ablation, seen a specialist, or seem that bothered by it. Good luck.
Surely it should be based on a case by case basis. Personally since I have be in permanent AF since last October I have felt better. When I was just having short attacks it was causing me more problems. So as asymptomatic I’m not sure I would go for an ablation. However there are many on here that AF is very symptomatic and they would be very happy to have an ablation. Also one has to weigh up what long term damage AF is having on your heart even with out symptoms.
I am agreeing more and more as I learn more and more about the consequences of just living with AFib and the future damage to your heart. I think that's one of the reasons people end up with a pacemaker. Though multiple ablations also hard on your heart. So, I am still thinking about it all. Leaning towards giving it a go, but not sure I would do more than one if it failed.
My ablation worked 90 per cent. If you have to ask whether an ablation is worth all the hassle, then you are not suffering too badly at all. My life began again after my ablation. Prior to that I had no energy, couldn't even talk for long without running out of breath, and woke up at 2am in the morning with a thundering heart .... which kept going for another hour or so. Ablation is not a cure. It's a quality of life op. And by the way, my afib was genetic. Had no other risk factors and am still a healthy weight etc.
Would have one again tomorrow if needed.... but in no rush at the moment!
For a number of months now I've been trying to figure out why I have so little energy. I didn't know if it was the heart meds, stroke recovery, or AFib. The more I observe my symptoms, I'm thinking it may likely be mostly my AFib. I feel horrible! Waiting on results from a heart monitor to see just how much AF I am truly having. Your post is encouraging!
I would be guided by your cardiologist, and his or her view on whether the continuing PAF might lead to any important long term deterioration in your overall heart condition, especially left ventricular output.
Overall, long term success to a single ablation procedure does seem to be determined quite a lot by other factors, such as pre-existing sleep apnoea, obesity, diabetes, overall heart health and hypertension. As you say, the recurrence rate is quite high, and from what I have read, maybe 60% after five years.
That’s pretty much what all of the retrospective studies show from what I could see, even 60%.
The good news seems to be that even permanent AF, so long as the rate is controlled, does little harm. I hope I’m right on that. My elderly friend is certainly fine after very many years of permanent AF.
Good point… you mean either positive or negative? I recall reading somewhere that rhythm control (either by medication or ablation) doesn’t improve lifespan. The overall feeling I get from the studies I’ve read is that rate and clotting need to be controlled.
This is another great question to ask my EP next time we speak. What are the consequences to the heart, if any, of living with permanent AF? Although I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that it weakens the heart muscles.
I am not sure so I will be interested to see what your doctor tells you. From what I have been told it depends on other heart factors. For example, I have some degree of left branch bundle block (LBBB) and my doctor has said that whilst this is normally not anything to worry about, it's not good to have this alongside frequent AF. Luckily, so far, I only rarely get any episodes so, for now, he's happy with things but wants me to have an echocardiogram every so often to check for any effect or weakening of the heart's output (i.e. effect on the left ventricle).
I suppose we could look at it as maybe it buys us two years, while they discover another and better means. But who knows? The jury is still out in my opinion. Though I have gone from an absolutely no way am I doing an ablation to at least an open mind. My first priority is getting a Watchman or some means of closing off the LAA and reducing my chances of another stroke.
I've had three in last 24 months. None successful. But I was being cardioverted every 2-6 weeks. I go into fast af and cannot hardly move and the drugs which slow it make me feel just as bad. I'm now running out of options, I think next is amiadarone though they said I was a bit young for that or a pacemaker.I don't smoke, drink, have high BP, I'm not overweight, I used to keep myself fit but nothing extreme and my diet is good.
AF is a b*mmer for sure and I understand your concerns re ablation.
Just wish it wasn't so invasive. Don't like the three cuts they do on each side. And, it can be a tough recovery for some. But, as far as success, not sure anything out there as good!
My experience is that after 2 ablations, I am still in AF. A third was mentioned, but would probably be no more successful. I also now have a PM. At least I can now take the meds without my heart slowing too much!
My AF has always been well enough controlled and infrequent enough (three to four episodes a year, swiftly terminated by flecainide PiP) to not consider pressing for an ablation. However, I am undergoing cancer treatment and in the past month have had two lung ablations. I had no choice but to come off anticoagulants and with the second ablation resuming them was delayed as they thought I may need a chest drain for an air pocket. I have never felt so out of control in all my life, I was absolutely terrified, I don't think I had an actual episode but there was some very hard heart thumping going on. When eventually they 'released' my medication, I chomped an Apixaban down immediately in full view of the ward consultant!
So my view has changed somewhat, it had never occurred to me before that vital treatment for other illnesses may put me at much higher risk from a stroke caused by AF.
Ty Irene. I wish you all succuss with the cancer treatment. Serious - you sound very brave to me - I would be scared too.Good luck with it and I hope it sorts it's self out soon. Well done for overcoming your fear.
Irene, I understand your fear. I had surgery after my stroke and had to come off of the Eliquis. Boy was I nervous! Could hardly wait to get back on it.
I am curious as to how the procedure is arrived at. As in who makes the decision? I hear a lot of people here “insisting” their doctors allow this procedure to be done, some say their Drs recommend it be done? All I know is my Dr. tends not to take orders from those without PhD’s in medicine, so I tend to take his advice. When I initially brought up the subject of ablation...which I had read about in length on this forum, he and the EP and cardio staff looked at me sideways and clearly said “no, you are not a candidate” and when I told them “well, I will eventually have to get one, as afib only ever gets worse..right?” Again the look. “You are consulting Dr. Google again, aren’t you?” *me looking sheepishly at my shoes*...”yes, sorry sorry” So ya, I tend to be confused about the whole ablation issue.
Well, in my case, since I don't have a PhD in medicine, my particular Dr. does know best.
He has kept me and my entire family happy and healthy for over 20 years. If I have questions or concerns, he always listens. He never dismisses my concerns.
He and the cardio staff, said I was not a candidate, because mine was a one-off (followed by 2 very short and not intense episodes) event, and since meds were keeping it under control with zero side effects, I would not need an ablation at this juncture. If my situation were to change, they would of course revisit ablation, or any other procedure that would help. :^)
As it stands, I am not in afib, nor have been for over a year...but according to many here, and yes, I am grateful for the input and support of so many here, who live with this condition daily, it will return sooner than later, and will always get worse not better, so it is those voices of experience that keep me listening and watching.
Of course It is my wish that mine doesn't progress into permanent AFIB, but according to many here...who have far more experience than I, it will, and not if, but when, so I pay attention.
The ablations mentioned on this forum were not prescribed nor done by "Dr. Google" but by qualified ep's. And while I'm the fence about ablation, my GP as well as several ep's I've consulted have said it's a very reasonable option.
I would ask your doctor exactly why you are not a candidate and if all you get is a "sideways look" I would get opinions elsewhere.
The fact that you're on this forum, suggests you are interested in shared medical decision making as opposed to taking marching orders blindly from your doctor or being condescended to.
So again, find out exactly why they think you are not a candidate. Then evaluate their answer, post it here if you want, and then make up your own mind after you have more information.
Sorry if you misunderstood my post, or if I did not articulate as well as I should have..but I thought I was pretty clear. I have mentioned him in previous posts as well.It wasn't my intention, to suggest anyone here relies on Dr. Google (or Dr. Facebook) for medical advice. I have mentioned more than once that he does not make specialty assessments or advice, he is a GP and refers such issues. He and I consult with the cardiac team...they advise him. He also has dozens of patients with AFIB and other heart related issues, so I'm confident he is more enlightened than I. Please re-read my post, I did explain why I was not referred. ...I should have said that the cardiac team, did not feel I was a candidate and passed this on to my GP explaining why, and, as a GP, he is not prone to second guess the cardia team.
I was responding to your first post only. I now see you had a second, follow-up post where you explain why you are not a candidate for ablation. Makes sense.
From your first post, it did seemed your doctor was dismissive when he mentioned "Dr. Google" and gave you sideways look. But the devil as they say is in the details, plus I wasn't there -- so if I'm wrong, wouldn't be the first time Good that you have full confidence in him.
NP, I should have mentioned he and I often joke about "Dr. Google" as he has parents who often send him links or articles...medical "advice" and we all know folks like that, and he has mentioned..."a day doesn't go by without one of my patients "enlightening" me. So ya it was one of those "had to be there" moments, sorry for the confusion
Sounds like you have a good, and long-standing, relationship w your GP and that the DrGoogle jab was perhaps just a teasing interaction.
Personally, I think we all need to do what we can to educate ourselves about our health and treatment options. And “Dr Google” is just the starting point.
There are so many excellent online medical resources available for free. And your local library may be paying for subscriptions to other online research resources that you can access from home or from the library.
When I’m facing a big medical decision, I fork over a bit of money for a month of access to a database that many of my doctors use. Helps me ask good questions at least. And after decades of being a research librarian, I just can’t help myself, I have to research! 😂
Always a good plan to educate and articulate, to assist your doctor to refer, advise and treat where applicable. Unfortunately a great many people do not find The Mayo Clinic, John Hopkins, AHA, CHA or other official sites, they click on the first hit from their search. As a researcher, you of course are acutely aware of this issue. Sadly people go into meetings with their health care professionals, armed with reams of "proof" "experts" "studies and findings" from...social media, so I imagine how much more complicated this makes their work...being advised and educated by patients. Catch22 ;^/
So true! So much dubious info, so readily available. And so many people just fail to put on their “thinking caps”, as my old teachers used to put it! Must drive doctors crazy. One doctor asked me if I was a medical professional after a discussion with him. Felt pretty proud of my librarian street cred at that moment. 😂
I wish I could talk to my doctor! I just had a letter from the consultant who's never seen me saying it's up to me to decide if I want one or not. End of...! No comeback. No appointment, nothing.
I decided to have an ablation myself after having af episodes every few days, and my episodes were horrible. So I prodded my then cardiologist who did nothing, and ended up seeing an EP privately who offered me an ablation. This has eased my af - they said it was a success . This was about nine months ago and I am usually in sinus rhythm now except when I have a virus or similar bug. I think you should make a nuisance of yourself as you need to speak to your doctor to make this decision. Phone up and insist on speaking to him! Good luck.
Thanks but although I am having af episodes most days it doesn't worry me too much as my heart goes back into sinus rhythm after a few minutes. It's allegedly because of covid that they won't see me. I just had a phone call from a nurse. So I will wait until I end up in hospital again. Don't want to upset the applecart while I feel well.
Hi Paul,I had an ablation for PAF in early December 2021 after about a year from diagnosis. I know it’s early days yet, but have been AF free since🤞
I used to nearly always get episodes in the middle of the night, which left me exhausted the next day. So if the ablation keeps these at bay, I’ll be happy.
My EP said there was an over 80% chance it could work for some time, as having it done early.
I think you already know my thoughts on ablation Paul. My first ablation made my AF worse, but it did stop my heart banging in my chest when I walked up hills. I had no idea that other people's hearts didn't do that.
My second ablation failed too and made my attacks of AF longer. I often spent days in hospital. There a cardiologist told me that the ablation scarring inside my heart had probably made it a bit stiff in it's working. I felt dreadful.
On to a third ablation, this appeared to help and despite having tachycardia/flutter on the day I was meant to leave hospital and staying there another day, I think this one helped. Went back to the hospital for a cardioversion about 5 weeks later and was ok for a while. My PAF attacks still happened. On a return check up visit to my EP I was told that some people aren't helped by ablations and I was one of them, because of this I wouldn't be offered any more. He then dismissed me from his care and now I'm purely under the care of my GP. I can be referred back to AF nurses though. At first, because my heart slipped back into AF so often I was given about 2 cardioversions a year. I would feel so ill and quite disabled while waiting for them. Then the time came when I was told they wouldn't offer me any more cardioversionss. I felt abandoned by everyone.
I took it upon myself to experiment with not taking my Flec and beta blocker. Two summers running I did that and was totally free of AF for 6-8 months. Unfortunately my AF came back every winter. Then I tried the same thing a third year, but my heart wasn't happy at all and since then I haven't tried again.
I'm now in constant AF, but to be honest feel so much better this way and my heart rate is between 60-90.
I would say try all the healthy eating options before having an ablation.
Since it appears you are in this for the long haul have you considered a blood thinner that does not require as much monitoring as Warfarin? Along with limiting healthy food options for Warfarin.
Yes, I'm sure they do but in my case I don't think I had any lifestyle choices to make, I wasn't overweight, didn't have high blood pressure, wasn't unduly stressed, ate quite healthily and so on. It went on and off like clockwork every two or three days, kept going for 15 - 25 hours then would suddenly stop. I have no idea what triggered it.
I really don't know, but I do supplement with Vitamin D x 2,000 IU. there's something else our bodies absorb in the summer other than vitamin D, but the name escapes me at the moment.
Jean
To have an ablation or not depends on so many factors. In the UK, ablations are not offered lightly on the NHS, so you can be fairly confident that if one is offered, then the Consultant is confident that it will make a significant improvement to the patients quality of life. From what we hear, in some countries which have an insurance based medical system, the motivation for offering an ablation is probably very different and patients need to be more cautious.
In terms of determining success or failure from the posts on this forum is in my view, a big mistake for a variety of different reasons.
1. Statistics - pre pandemic, around 9000 ablations are performed a year in the UK alone. It is commonly accepted that all forums tend to attract bad news. Interestingly, most of the posts which talk about problems are those which occur during the blanking period. Problem posts from members outside this period are fortunately few but they do occur, as we have recently seen from Lord Gabriel.
2. A lot depends on whether your consultant is a Cardiologist or an Electrophysiologist. Anyone seeking a referral from their GP will almost always see a Cardiologist. At the time of diagnosis, patients knowledge is often low and there is a natural tendency to follow the guidance offered by the GP. GP’s and Cardiologist’s will always prescribe medication and to some extent, the treatment process die is cast. Although EP’s tend to be pro ablation, it’s not inevitable that this is the route they will take unless they are confident of a good result.
3. Patients see things differently than medics. The thought of having the inside of your heart tinkered with is an anathema to many, after all, we only have one heart! However, for EP’s carrying out an ablation, it’s just another day in the office. Given their expertise, the sophistication of the equipment used and the resources available to them, the risk is considered minimal. It is no bad thing for patients to be cautious when considering an ablation, I know I was but the turning point for me was when my Cardiologist (who was known not to be pro ablation) said if I was you, I’d have a Cryoablation!
4. Maybe in the USA they talk about an ablation as a “cure” but that’s not the case here. Cryoablation’s are often carried out first because they are relatively quick and treat the pulmonary veins which are the main cause for AF but is commonly known that a second or even a third ablation may be necessary. This may well be an ordeal for the patient, but it’s just another routine day for an EP.
5. Patients personal circumstances will vary enormously. I know many who are in persistent AF, who take their medication and lead normal lives and some are now in their 80’s. They wouldn’t give any form of intervention a second thought and who can blame them. Sadly it’s not the same for everyone so it’s good that there are alternatives that they can consider too.
So Paul, there are no easy answers, but if someone is relatively “young” and has done all things possible to improve their lifestyle but finds AF is impacting on their quality of life, reluctant to take increasing doses of potent medication and fearful that things will only get worse, maybe an ablation or two (or three) is not such a bad idea!
Thanks FJ. Great to hear your thoughts - I think I'm more confused then ever by posting the thread.My thoughts overall ? Maybe have one. I can't decide - a light bulb moment will come
I had my AF for years and was relatively asymptomatic but now I feel so much better than I did. What's not to like about a simple procedure that takes about an hour and stops what was pulling your down?
Hi Paul I too am anxious about having an ablation and yes I feel more confused by the answers to your post but glad you did it as it prompted a lot more answers than my previous post.With the current waiting list I think it could be 6 or 8 months at the very least so plenty of time to consider.
OK. If we are being Frank and honest about this then here goes.I had PAF for at least 3 years prior to diagnosis at age 49. I got to the point where I had to sit in front of the TV for 3 days a week and customer visits may end up with them close to calling an Ambulance. I could not cut the lawn and struggled to mash potatoes.
The first ablation was great but after 1 month my AF returned as persistent. I received a second ablation 2 months later and I am about 85% fixed with no recorded AF since.
I could now do the London to Brighton cycle run again in aid of the BHF, something that I completed twice before developing PAF.
It says on the packet, you may need more than one treatment. I would recommend a second then get on the bike. Happy Easter all.
It depends how symptomatic you are. I have never seen it as a cure, just a respite. I had 5 over 10 years and even though the last one failed to put me in SR, so i have a PM, I would do it all over again.
Hi Pete. Thanks for your reply. I'm sorry but if you had to 7 ablations it's not working. This is my whole point. I can't sit around all day during the 'recovery' period 7 times as I'm not retired and need to work. Enjoy your day and Happy Easter.
Very unusual to have more than 3. Most EP’s that I have heard speak say they are unlikely to go beyond 3 ablations for AF but other arrhythmias can occur which may benefit from an ablation. I don’t know what you do for a living Paul but most folk can return to work after 2 weeks. Work involving heavy lifting etc may need a bit longer.
Ty FJ. My business was based abroad (before Brexit and Covid) but easy enough to run online. However it seems to have died a death now due to a mix of two. At the moment I am living on savings but they won't last forever !
Yes, I didn't find this forum until after I had had my ablation. I guess I hung around to give a bit of support to the Apple watch when it was seen as very inferior to the gold standard Kardia.
I'm glad I did because the discussions on Vit D helped me and I think have improved my health a lot.
Well done Pete - I take my hat off to you. In fact your post gives me inspiration. I too worked a demanding job with much stress involved. I had a 3000 mile return trip to get to the office and back (I worked abroad). Now I find it hard to walk to the shop and back. However somehow I'll beat it but it's a struggle at the moment.Afib won't beat me though - I'll die first. No joking about.
Thanks Paul for your reply and kind words. By the way I am 75 in 10 days time and I am still working albeit freelance now and at my own pace.
After all the ablations the last one was in 2017. Since then, although I have a slow heart rate now I rarely get AF (maybe twice a year) and on each occasion I have been able to determine the episodes with an extra dose of Flecainide.
I had two ablations and both failed. EP recommended a third but I ducked it - the emotional stress of high expectation of success followed by failure was too much to bear a third time. (To be fair to the EP did say it could take 3 or 4 attempts). 21 years of AF and now permanent. Also I have associated central sleep apnoea. Can’t have another ablation even if I wanted one. At 65 I get by reasonably well on a good day (eg two hour briskish walk with dog). But a bad day is totally exhausting which may be partly due to the Bisoprolol or Apixaban. Still manage a few beers and wine when I feel like it which I find picks me up but alcohol definitely doesn’t help the day after! I believe the policy is now to wheel patients in for ablations as quickly as possible after diagnosis rather than trying medications. It will be interesting to see if this improves the success rates which still seem to me to be lower than the official figures suggest. I know several people who have had failed ablations but less where they have been successful. Sorry - this is not going to help you much - unfortunately in my view it is a difficult decision.
Why do you say success rates are lower than official figures? People responding on this site are not a representative sample for the reasons others have given. "Official", by which you mean published evaluations I assume, need to follow a methodology so will be more reliable.
I was commenting on my personal experience of probably 20 odd AF sufferers I know or who have come across over the last few years. I would say less than half of those had succeeded sometimes after more than one procedure. Some had led to improvement but not complete elimination of AF. So the idea of even a 60 or 70 % general success rate for a first ablation looks too high to me. You mention methodology. But I think the measurement of the statistics is subject to varying definitions and terminology. What is a successful outcome? It is a very long time since I looked into this in any detail and of course I am not an expert; nor are the majority of contributors to this forum. But personal experience is want this forum is about. If you delve into the mass of information which exists on the Internet about ablations you will be able to make judgements for yourself. But always remember there are lies, damned lies and statistics.
I understand (but may be wrong) some EPs consider the outcome successful if at the end of the procedure the mapping shows that the electrical currents have been contained. In my case that happened but a couple of days later I was back in AF. So I may have gone onto the stats as a successful outcome.
My EP also said, when I asked him what the hospital‘s success rate was, (one of the top heart hospitals in the UK) “we are not very good at keeping the statistics”!
Definitely pro ablation . I started off anti ablation so faffed about with drugs for 2 years without fully controlling the attacks and them getting more frequent and more persistent until I was stuck in high rate AFIB mostly 165- 195.lying down for 8 days. AFib BEGETS AFib. The more you have it the more you will have it.
So then I did a U turn and requested an ablation which I had 6 months later.
4 years and 3 months after my cryoablation and still still no afib.
The only hiccup was 9 days after the cryoablation I developed Atrial flutter which was quite incapacitating , nothing to do with the ablation, just the adverse effects of the flecainide promting other arrhymias! Ie the drugs!
One month later right atria ablated for the flutter, no flutter since.
I have not taken ANY drugs since May 15 2018.
It is true to say I was lucky in that I did not have any other comomorbidities and was pretty fit for 57 as I used to go running and cycling
My EP quoted the usual stats of 70% effectiveness first ablation and possible but unlikely side effects and then asked if I wanted to have it.
Far more importantly the EP said I was a good candidate for ablation. That is what you need to know.
As for the scaryness of the ablation. We'll it's not . I was a bit nervous about it going in , it was
the unknown! BUT on the day I was chatting to the annethesatist lying next to the big VDU and suddenty he pointed out the catheter which was already in my heart. I never even felt the groin incision with its local. The pain of the ablation on cryo is the pain you get biting into an very cold ice cream on a hot day. It is not as bad as the dentist and certainly not like resetting a broken bone!
Ablation is also not open heart surgery or anything invasive.
I am aware that not all go as well as mine did, and nothing is 100% safe but if I develop afib tomorrow morning I will happily have another ablation tomorrow afternoon to keep off the drugs and avoid the inconvenience and faff of dealing with AFib when it strikes.
I can’t remember who said it but ‘if you have to ask you don’t need it’ was a comment that struck me. After that it’s a question of whether you want to take the chance on a better QOL and looking at the stats quoted it’s a good chance 🍀
I’ve had one almost 6 years ago. Completely successful. I take no meds (which I regard as a very good thing) and live a completely normal life. I do everything I did before I had AF. It maybe takes a little longer to get up to speed when running (which I put down to my heart being slightly stiffer than before) but once I’m warmed up I can rattle along ok. I haven’t been running much this year due to injury but I’m building up my mileage again now for the London Marathon in October. Tbh, AF is the least of my concerns 🙂
That said, there does seem to be a big variation in people’s results. It looks to me that the std Cryo Ablation frequently seems to require further work. I had a RF Ablation by a team that obviously knew what they were doing. Indeed, after the procedure, when I discussed the method they had used, the consultant looked slightly aghast at the idea of a cryo procedure.
There’s also the fact that our hearts are all different. Some are inherently more difficult to treat. Not to mention the huge variety of fitness and health levels among patients.
All this means, it can appear to be something of a lottery.
I’m fully aware that AF might well return but for now, I’m incredibly happy with my results and would have another ablation without hesitation.
Hi, I'm really interested to see how this thread goes as I am about to be seen (hopefully) by an Electrophysiologist as I've been referred to him by my Cardiologist who has already told me the next step would be to have an ablation and to be honest, for the reasons you have mentioned, I'm really not keen!
My Afib has become really constant with almost daily episodes which leave me very tired and breathless. Basically affecting my everyday life. I will be reading the comments with interest. Stay well,
I am nearly 2 years post my successful 2nd ablation. I didn’t cope at all well with various combinations of drug therapy after my initial AF episodes started in April 2019. The first ablation was partially successful but the 2nd, 12 months later, allowed me to get off all drugs. I would definitely go again if needed in the future.
I was not convinced an ablation was the thing for me, but af was interfering with my life. Had an ablation 2017. Af stopped and ive only had one episode (pneumonia) since.That said, my hr was in the 40s after ablation. Last month it was found to be in 30s with episodes of sinus pause. I had to get a pacemaker. Only meds im on are metroprolol and pradaxa. Did ablation necessitate a pacemaker? Not sure. My mom and grandmom had pacemaker
Last Thursday (04-14) I had an ablation. I’m feeling fine but keeping expectations realistic. A week before the procedure an electrocardiologist from the hospital contacted me and asked if I’d like to be a part of a study. He explained that Northwestern hospital in Chicago is doing the study to figure out why some ablations work and some do not. Additional time in my pre-procedure MRI (15 mins) and a blood draw after the procedure were my contribution to the study. I agreed. The study has 200+ volunteers with a goal of 250. I’m hopeful that they succeed.
Hi Paul no ablations here...I live alone and although my frequent episodes of P-AF are unpleasant and make life difficult I can cope with 'the familiar' knowing and I am in control.
I could have an ablation and be much worse off and unable to look after myself . I know someone in that situation.
I have read so much on the subject of AF the best piece of advise I have seen recently from an EP was ''Do as little as possible to the patient '' that sounds good advice to me.
I would probably go for a third one if I needed to. I had an appointment with my EP on the 12th, a year after my (2nd) ablation. I had a couple a-fib episodes after the 3-month blanking period. He said if episodes increase, he'll put me back on Dofetilide; if that doesn't work, then another ablation. I asked if my age (72) would be a factor, and he said no. I'd probably have a third one then, if needed.
Good luck with it Snow. This was the reason for my post. I always assumed an ablation would be a 'magic' cure. For those reading this thread don't let it put you off if you are down for one. It could work for you and not just work - but work wonders. Get stuck in and don't let this thread put you off. If your EP suggusts it then it's for a good reason. It's likely to help. In some way's I feel bad about starting this thread because I DON'T want it to put anyone off. We are all adults and able to discuss things that affect our health. Look at the postives on the thread - fair play it doesn't always work - often though it seems to. It might well do for you
I think if forum participants feel so fed up with their condition and are considering an ablation, it certain helps to get the input from others who have had it done.
Hi Paul,I have the same dilemma… my cardiologist was fairly laid back about me staying on the meds. I found I had AF 18 months ago, I’ve had two Cardioversions, a year apart, which only kept me in sinus rhythm for a few days. I’ve been in persistent AF for 6 months now.
I’m still s as votive golf, gym etc., but my 39% LVEF does restrict me and I struggle to do golf/gym/walks on consecutive days.
I went to cardiac community nurse team and they reckon ablation good idea for my profile.
I went to consultation in London wrt ablation. He wasn’t convinced he could improve my condition by getting me in sinus. I only ever went into sinus for a couple of days with meds, so I couldn’t say i’m defo better in sinus as such short time. But I did recall I felt so good, no tiredness on 3rd day in sinus after my last Cardioversion. So he agreed that’s a good reason to do it, so I’m going for it, before it’s too late….I hope this helps. Regards John.
After one year of PAF I had a cryoablation. I am very symptomatic and afib felt dreadful. It was like a light switch from sinus to afib. The EP said 75-80 % success and could last 5 years. He told me up front I may need 2-3 ablations. Cryoablation was successful for 14 months then I developed atypical aflutter. I had a radiofrequency flutter ablation done by his colleague. My doctor said his colleague had more experience with complex cases. They were both present at the ablation. It was found that the cryoablation had held firm. Four flutter circuits were ablated but at the fifth circuit the ablation was terminated. The procedure was getting long and I had been cardioverted four times during the procedure. They decided to see how I fared clinically. In the following two years, I had two episodes both around the same time as a viral infection. I feel so much better after the ablations.
It really isn't. I can honestly say I enjoyed the whole day at the hospital when I had my ablation. My EP was not special and worked at the local District General Hospital.
Hi, I shied away from ablation when my cardio first suggested it, because I was frightened of the stroke risk and like you, read that the first seldom worked.After more stress (redundancies) at work I realised I had to try it as the drugs were giving me awful side effects and not really helping much.
So I had a successful ablation in 2009 and have not needed any drugs since. I felt I got my life back. My heart is obviously not the way it was before Af but it works and i only get sx, ectopics mainly, when the stress rises.
So, I was lucky and my successful ablation, still holding after 12 years, was a good decision for me.
It took me 10 years of different medications and numerous EPs to help me decide. the thought of the side effects of long term medication and an EP with whom I could relate and feel comfortable with ,finally swayed me to have a Cryoblation. I occasionally have episodes of short lived tachycardia but on the whole I’m elated and drug free! My procedure was 8 years ago now I think.
I was and am symptomatic with AF. If I wasn't I may have decided not to go for an ablation. For me, being symptomatic filled me with a sense of dread each time an AF episode came along. After so many years with AF it was an easy decision to go the ablation route. Medications did not help. Touch wood I have had only 3 or 4 short episodes of AF in 42 months. Personally, I regard this as a great improvement and a much better quality of life. I would have another one. But I respect everyone's different.
Interesting thread and good question. I’m currently undecided about having an ablation. I can opt for one if I am unhappy to stay on medication long term, or if my AF gets more frequent. At the moment I get paroxysmal AF two or three times a week but it rarely lasts for more than 30min. Medication impairs my ability to run at anything more than a moderate pace, so I just stick with that and accept that I can’t run faster for now. I also have to avoid alcohol as anything more than 0.5 glass of wine seems to increase the risk of an AF episode!
It’s the risk of having a serious complication of the procedure that puts me off. I’ve been quoted 1:200 risk of stoke, and smaller risks of other serious complications.
I’m waiting to see if my AF worsens or not. If it does then I’ll go for ablation. At the moment my AF is neither getting better or worse!
Same here SHT. My Chad score is 0. However I still made the call to take them. Maybe it's a wrong choice but I have to at the moment as waiting on a CV (one day).
If I was having longer episodes I’d probably opt for them but as I have PAF and the episodes are generally short in duration I’m hoping that the risk of a stroke is low. Will rediscuss this with the EP at my next appointment to make sure I’m making a sensible choice.
This is true! And at anytime. You are wise to be on the blood thinner as you consider what you are doing next. Also, thanks for this post question. I have gathered several questions from it to ask my EP as I further explore ablations.
My Chads score was low too, until I had a massive stroke, not on a blood thinner, just aspirin. Poor call by the cardiologist. Also had PAF and no other heart issues.
I agree. Previous cardio, unfortunately a believer in aspirin for PAF. One of the first things the new cardio said when he met me, "You would not have had a stroke had you been on an anti-coagulant." I wish I had started to look into AFib more when diagnosed. If I had I would have known the importance of being on an anti-coagulant. Unfortunately my AFib diagnosis came the day after I was told I needed multiple breast biopsies. I felt so overwhelmed! After the biopsies I had a bilateral lumpectomy. 4 weeks later I had my massive stroke. Very fortunate to get to hospital soon enough for clot busting drug and surgery.
Sounds like you had a rough ride there Theo. I hope things worked out for you - sounds like they did so stay positive. I'm sure everyone on the forum wishes you all future success and will be here to help if you need a chat.
Gosh, sorry to hear about what happened you. I am going to get back in touch with my EP to discuss anticoagulation, and also to ask a few more questions about ablation.
1. Not all EPs are equal, you can only choose your EP on the Private. There arw some EPs that unfortunately not as experienced as the best ones and I think a large part of the success comes down to the EP weilding those catheters.
2. I'm awaiting an Ablation with Professor Richard Schilling in The London AF centre and I think it's the only centre that publishes its results and they are VERY impressive indeed. Now I get daily multi episodes of AF even on Amioderone 200 MG, so my point is if you have it every morning and night your quality of life goes out the window and suicidal thoughts creep in at times as sometimes you just get so fed up. I will be diving on that Cath lab table and can't wait for my date. Everyone's circumstances are different and as I write this I'm in AF around 80 BPM
Don't let them Herr - boot them out right away. Look at the positives with an ablation coming your way. 80 BPM in afib isn't that bad - well within the range. Stay positive and you'll stay on top.
Such an interesting thread, bringing together experiences that are scattered through many other threads. Most useful!
My experience is of 3 RF ablations. First 2 w one EP. 3rd with current EP. First 2 ablations worked fairly well for some time. Was drug free after first one for a year or so. The 1st one also hit a bit of atrial flutter as well. Eventually that dr and I parted ways after he had been extraordinarily rude to me during an appt.
New dr did a 3rd ablation and touched up the breakthroughs that were giving me short afib events. Sadly, he couldn’t trigger the tachycardia that is my only remaining symptom. The day he says we have new tools that will fix that, I’ll be signing up for a 4th ablation. At this point it’s a 50/50 chance of fixing it. For now, I’m working my way through ALL the meds. Ughh…. Eventually they’ve all failed. Just stated dronedarone. Would so much rather be drug free.
Current dr did an ablation on a friend with tachycardia, was told,that it had been really difficult to trigger it, but they did and they zapped it. I live in hope!
As for the fear of the procedure itself? I was terrified the first time. Now? Not at all. Of course it’s no fun being in the hospital, even for just 24 hours, but frankly I’d rather have an ablation than so many other medical procedures.
I'm with you on this one LOG. I hate going to the dentist. The fear bubble really kicks in. The thing is we afibbers need to avoid is gum infection - otherwise it can trigger our afib. It's very important for us to keep good dential hygiene. But I understand - they scare me to death. I need a root canal but keep putting it off. The fear bubble is the best one. Just say I'm going in to it - get ready and let's go. You'll come out of it and burst it. Job done, That could for any medicial procedure.
Ah, yes, the root canal fear. Been there, done that. And surprisingly, wasn’t anywhere near as awful as I expected. Yes, dental health is so important. I have Sjogrens Syndrome, which further aggravates dental issues. Supposed to have cleaning 3 times a year. Ugh. But I do it. Good luck with the root canal.
Hi! I'm in the US and have paroxysmal atrial fibrillation. I have no idea how long I had been living with it. Medication and cardioversion were unsuccessful. I have no other heart disease, calcium score was excellent. Cryoablation for me had an 80% chance of working on the first try. When they did the procedure, my anatomy dropped it to 75% chance. Once it was done and I recovered, I couldn't believe how much better I felt. If it is available to you, I think it's worth it. It's relatively mildly invasive and now I'm hoping to get off of blood thinners completely.
I'm in Illinois. You can only get the ablation if you know exactly when the AFib started. In my case, I went back into sinus rhythm and then reverted back to AFib. It was at that point I was qualified for the procedure. I was terrified about doing it, but once it was done, well worth it.
For what it is worth I have had 2 ablations over the past 18 months after being diagnosed with parox afib about 4 years ago (age at time 46 now nearing age 50). Over time episodes were getting longer/ stronger/ faster hr and I was becoming more symptomatic so, based on my age, quality of life and lone afib (no other heart/ health issues), I chose the ablation route. Note that I was living pretty healthy lifestyle pre afib and have kept this up throughout (though have had to reduce exercise intensity).
However neither ablation stopped the afib episodes on their own, yet seemed to have helped the medications do a better job of keeping my heart stable and increasing quality of life. Had wanted to come off the meds completely but does not look like this is in the cards at this time. Am looking at 3rd ablation in coming months as my EP has determined that the bouts of pacs/ tachycardia i also experience are triggering my Afib. Hopefully my 3rd abalation will be more successful, but still after the first two was in a better/healthier place.
Can only speak for myself but I found the procedures and recovery time to be relatively straight forward and pain free. Wish you all the best in your decision making process
I don't suppose most will ever read down to this comment but here it is anyway.
What frustrates me on getting to the bottom of this recurring debate is I have seen no facts on this Forum or elsewhere. The 'For Ablations' say the majority of 'successful' ones don't return to this Forum; but there has been no reference of the source (so we can read it ourselves) or if indeed any collective reliable national survey results figures are known. Also while I am on results, I think I read some time back EPs consider their work is 'successful' if you become AF free for just one year; not my opinion!
Conversely, neither have I read about any national survey results to support the favourability of the alternative drug therapy route.
So I can only offer one personal experience. As I have gone now for over 8 years, with only two 20 minute AF episodes, on Fleacinide and Lifestyle changes and have good energy levels, I can say I have been a 'Drug/Lifestyle' success and this is why I am still comfortable with my choice to postpone an ablation.
I keep an open mind on most things,so am not anti ablation per se.
I am actually on the waiting list for one,should I go for it when asked .
However I have concerns regarding the procedure which, due to extensive waiting list of 12-18 months in Warwickshire ,then Covid, then being medically deferred due to shoulder break has given me time to pause for thought.
Here goes;
A)It is the one in 200 average for stroke during procedure that frightens me. UCHW do not do the T.O.E check for clots prior to proceedure. Even on anticoagulation the risk is the same
B) we are advised on here that it is essential to research your EP for experience and success rates. For one thing,very difficult to find out success rates and how this is determined,for another I did research well. However,last time I spoke to him, he said it may not be me who does it on the day...😲🙄
C) my AF has not progressed but actually improved on a medication and lifestyle improvement regime. I am not over concerned about taking meds long term. I already do take blood pressure and statin meds ,will do forever.
D)I would much prefer to be knocked out for it as I have arthritis of the spine and shoulder after breaking it last year but again this is not an option here.
So what would I gain from ablation,I'm not sure. Of course everyone is different and ablation is worth a shot if nothing else is helping!
I think it's so difficult because it's almost as if we are given the choice . If,say,we had a heart attack or other cardiac issue,we would be carted off to surgery and we wouldn't say a peep!
May be to much information is sometimes a negative thing,I have a friend who has AF and never questions her Dr ,even when he put her on Amiadarone when she us a known hypo thyroid patient ( I told her I thought bad idea but she stick on it and now has more thyroid issues)
It's a great question with many interpretations!!
Enjoy your Easter Monday and hope your injuries are healing well xx👍
Hi Paulbounce I am in permanent AF and have been for several years. Prior to that I had PAF . I have sought several opinions from professionals EPs about ablations. The overall concensous is that it is never a cure, it is done to try and give people a better quality of life for however long that may be some last longer than others. There are many people on here that have had multiple ablations and swear by them, which is fine it is a personal choice. I didn’t choose that route, I made some lifestyle changes and was given medication including the all important anticoagulant. I have learnt to live with it and know my limitations. I am now 70years young my problems started in my late 50s. I know your question is going to provoke many lively differing replies, ultimately it’s a personal choice once armed with the correct knowledge. Good Luck x
I had my first ablation in early 2017 and that held for over three years, when the Af came back in late 2020 it was fast but nowhere near as fast as before. My quality of life was drastically different(for the better) post 1st ablation. I’m currently ten months post my second and having some ectopics but no Af, I’ll give it until June then come off the beta blocker again and see how that goes. If I have to have a third I will. They give you a chance at normal life again and by the sounds of pulsed field ablation a cure is round the corner for many people 👌🏻
Achant1 Thank you for pulsed field info. Looked it up. Be good to have a normal life where I am confident to go somewhere overnight. Very interesting points on this subject. So glad yours worked for the better.
I'm like Paul shall I shan't I? ³ I was offered one in hospital few weeks back now but had the DCCV instead. But I am thinking maybe next time.
Point well made Achant. However for some it does have a negative effect - reminds me of the Clash 'Should I stay or I go'. Read Jean's post. However I'm getting to the point (after reading all the posts) were I think I might give it a try. Cheers Paul
I have had AF since 2015 but decided not to have an ablation as I was told I could have the first one under sedation but if I required a second it would have to be under GA. As I have had problems with GA in the past (lucky to come round the last time) I decided not to go ahead with an ablation.
While I wouldn't necessarily say my AFIB is "cured", I went from having an AFIB episode 3 times a week to not having had an AFIB episode in the last 2.5 years. I occasionally get a rapid string of heartbeats over about 3-4 seconds (which I kind of compare to a lawn mower trying to start up) which in the past has progressed to AFIB but does not progress to AFIB anymore. I will mention that I did also start taking magnesium supplements which could/could not be preventing me from going into AFIB anymore too.
I know of two people who had successful ablation but theirs was for SVT, If your Afib is that bad you wouldn’t question it you would be that desperate to give it a go. I suffer with VT and multi focal PVCs Im currently taking 10MG of Nebivalol and 50 MG twice daily of Flecainide that have helped but I’m still not happy . Im waiting for the Flecainide to be increased to 100MG if that don’t work then it’s an ablation for me. I don’t understand why people are afraid of having an ablation my two friends was awake when they had theirs and was back home the same day with just a sore groin where the catheters was inserted.
I think your quality of life with AF is a good guide.. My first ablation was unsuccessful, my second improved matters a lot although by the time I had my third I I was having 3/4 episodes a week and sometimes 2/3 a day. So far so good, 7 weeks since my third and no AF so far what a joy that has been. As someone said here I know that AF is not supposed to be life threatening but it sure does feel as if it is sometimes. After what I’ve been through the last 15/20 years I’ve no intention of trying alcohol again and I am making serious efforts not to get stressed. It’s still early days for me but I’m glad I had an ablation. Good luck to all. J.🚜🌾
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It's a serious question for me though. Cheers Paul
Good that you have full confidence in him. 
Ablation or not.
Ablation or Not?
Ablation or not 
To have ablation or not
