Has anyone else had a steady heart rhythm but changing rate?

[Elli86]

Morning people.

Woke up this morning and feel pretty weak. Heart rate on watch seemed to be jumping around quite a bit so I thought may be glitching. Checked with good old finger on wrist and confirmed that heart rate seems to be speeding up and slowing down yet weirdly is in rhythm and doesn’t seem to be skipping. Confirmed with ecg on watch that is steady as well but again seems to be speeding up and slowing down. Can’t seem to settle into a steady rate?

Feel pretty weak as well. Checked blood pressure as well and although within healthy ranges it’s recorded the lowest diastolic I’ve ever recorded at 69.

Any ideas anyone?

Thanks 👍

Edit : also I’m aware that the heart rate when measured over a few seconds will change and jump around but this is noticeably different. You can’t normally notice much of a difference when measuring at wrist manually but this is definitely speeding and slowing

[jeanjeannie50]

What sort of rate is your heart changing to Elli and are they all taken after you've been sat still for a while?

[Elli86 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Was when I woke up this morning so hadn’t even got up at the time. According to my watch we’re talking 10/15bpm which is very unusual for me. More evident when checking pulse manually. As you count there’s a very noticeable difference is pace of the beats but weirdly no “skipped” beats like with af. Felt very weak as well like my bp was low. Checked on bp monitor and wasn’t out of normal ranges but low diastolic for me at 69. Lowest I’ve ever recorded on my bp monitor.

Have been out the rest of the day so not kept an eye on it. Been resting for last hour and now just got steady low grade tachy at 94/95 bpm.

Been off all meds since last Friday. Was going pretty well till today 😫 been out for a meal and now feel shattered.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Elli86]

Right, I think it may be your heart trying to establish a new rhythm without your meds. Our heart rate first thing in the morning, after sleep, is generally lower than the norm. Low BP levels can be because of dehydration ( a nurse when I was in hospital told me that). My normal diastolic is 62 the same as my pulse rate. It could also be little tachy runs, or atrial flutter.

I don't know why, but days of exhaustion months after an ablation do tend to happen.

Hope you feel better tomorrow.

Jean

[Elli86 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Thanks Jean. How would you know if it’s atrial flutter? What does it feel like? Exactly how I’ve described?

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Elli86]

Atrial flutter is a fast evenly spaced beat.

[Elli86 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

😫 just been reading about it. Unfortunately it sounds very similar. Really hope it’s not the Case. It’s taking me long enough to recover from this ablation without having another one 👎

[Ppiman]

Hi there, If the rate wasn't stable, it could be AF. Atrial flutter gives a fixed rate that is stable and steps, rather than slides, between ratios of 300, i.e. 150 > 100 > 75 and so on. Did you use an Apple Watch? It should show AF or "Inconclusive" with a varying rate.

Steve

[Elli86 in reply to Ppiman]

Hi steve.

Apple Watch only picks up af if the rhythm isn’t stable not the rate. I use Apple Watch 6 and it always picks up when I’m in af. I don’t think this is af as the rhythm is very steady. It was just the rate that was changing. We may be using contrasting terminology though. By rhythm I mean the gap between beats and by rate I mean the actual bpm.

[Ppiman in reply to Elli86]

I think I have it right - tell me if not! It is confusing.

The gap between beats is a feature if both rate and rhythm. NSR is a rate at a regular rhythm (i.e. the same gap between beats); AF is chaotic vibrating of the left atrium that gets translated by the SA node into an irregular heartbeat (i.e. varying gaps between beats); the rate (pulse)in AF can be anything from bradycardia > normal > tachycardia.

AFl is a very high regular rate (~300bpm) in the right atrium that is modified by the SA node into a regular pulse rate, but at a fixed ratios of 300 (2:1, 3:1 and so on).

The Apple Watch (from model 4) detects both rhythm and rate but is currently only allowed to notify these as NSR, AF, “Fast”, “Slow”, and “Inconclusive”.

[Elli86 in reply to Ppiman]

You are right in that its confusing 🤣 made even more confusing by my use of terminology to describe my symptoms when compared to the generally accepted term of normal sinus RHTYHM 🤣

How you describe af sounds correct. However all ecgs are coming back as NSR. My personal af is usually within normal range in terms of bpm. Usually between 70-90. But when you look at an ecg readout it will look completely chaotic in terms of gaps between beats.

Right now looking at an ecg the gaps look completely normal, my watch is telling me NSR yet the bpm readout jumps about and when doing a manual wrist check the beats seem regular yet the bpm seems to be increasing and slowing? This has never happened to me before.

Quite difficult to put this across in understandable terms but it makes sense to me atleast 🤣

[Ppiman in reply to Elli86]

I get what I think is the same as you describe both without and with AF (mostly without). The effects on me are identical whatever the rhythm - chest discomfort and anxiety.

I had it two nights ago after dropping my son and his family off at Robin Hood airport - wonderful timing. The Watch showed just what you describe and I could feel it exactly as the Watch picked it up. My pulse was 75-125. That time I had only a few ectopic beats (i.e. palpitations) but sometimes oh my! I took a bisoprolol and weathered it but it makes me so anxious wondering what’ll come next.

Mine seems linked to a hiatus hernia or some stomach issue that seems to be “external” to my stomach if that makes sense (i.e. my digestion itself seems fine).

[Elli86 in reply to Ppiman]

It’s not great steve. Worst bit is not knowing what follows on from it like you say 🤦‍♂️

[Singwell]

Jeanie's comment sounds sensible given you're coming off meds. And if your HR is altering so will your BP. Technically tachycardia is a rate over 100 so being in the 90s should not be something to worry about, especially the lower end. Diastolic of 69 is well within normal. I got lethargic with high HR when I started coming off my medication too quickly. We adjusted my dose and I stabilised.

[Elli86 in reply to Singwell]

Hi singwell. Thanks for input.

I’m aware of the technical ranges of tachy which is why I normally use the term low grade tachy to describe upper 90s. Personally I do not subscribe to the “normal ranges” as normal for me may be abnormal for you. Resting rate of 97 after resting for an hour for me is definitely not normal.

Same applies to the bp. As I said I know it’s in normal range but is very low for me personally. Was just using it as additional information for someone reading. Thought it may be applicable.

All seems to have stabilised now anyway so hopefully was a blip. Was just curious if anyone had had this before.

Thanks for help 👍

[Singwell in reply to Elli86]

Yup I get that! Normal is about stats and averages and we ain't! Glad things have stabilised.

[Elli86 in reply to Singwell]

🤣🤣 exactly! Thanks for input 👍

[stoneyrosed]

When I stopped my meds two weeks ago I went into tachy pulse 107, readings of over 80 for a couple of days, got me slightly worried so emailed cardio nurse to advise on taking a beta blocker to lower hr. He said continue without and allow the heart to recalibrate. It seems to be doing that has I now get readings of 65-68 and generally feel a bit better. Perhaps your heart is just adjusting without the meds, maybe give it a week or two.

[Elli86 in reply to stoneyrosed]

Yeah that’s what I’m hoping stoney thanks for help. Not caved in and taken tab just yet. Seems to have stabilised this morning so hopefully was just a blip 🤞 in general heart seems to be a bit all over the place so hoping it’s, like you say, recalibrating itself 🙏

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

It probably is coming off the Bisoproplol. There should be practically none left in your system now and your heart has to get used to that. You just have to hang in and put up with it . Or go back to your taper with every other day!

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

Yeah I’m pretty sure it is just wanted to check if anyone had had it before. Very strange but then I should expect the unexpected right now anyway to be fair.

Will only go back to taper as a last resort now to be honest. Would have made sense if was only 2/3 days since last tab but it’s been 9 now so just gonna toughen up and ride it out like you say 🤣💪

Thanks for input 👍

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

No it would not have made more sense. The half life of drugs means that the longer you go after stopping the less there is in your body. I have read accounts of people tapering off Biso where they get this sort of thing for weeks even months after completely stopping. It is thought that when we first start taking beta blockers the body responds by making more beta receptors. When we come off these are still there so there are more to respond to adrenalin that is no longer being blocked. Eventually these will down regulate as the body realises they are not needed but this can take time depending on the individual. I don't know if this theory is correct but it makes sense.

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

🤔 interesting! I shall bear that in mind thanks. Also it does give me an excuse if I suddenly buckle under the pressure and take a tab and will make me feel less guilty 🤣 so thanks for that 👍

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

I think it's daft to feel guilty! I don't feel guilty when I succumb and take a painkiller because I 'm fed up with pain or because I know I'm going to be doing something that will engender it- like sitting for hours on hospital chairs waiting to see my surgeon who is always runnung behind! Even though I know it will upset my guts. You really need to be kinder to yourself!

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

I can’t remember the last time I took painkillers to be honest. Try to refrain from taking any drugs unless I absolutely have too. Even when I’ve had proper flu in the past I’ve just rode it out as horrible as it is. Hence why I’m doing my utmost to get off the bisop. Maybe guilty was the wrong word. It’s more disappointment at the feeling of taking a backward step. But that’s me all over, one of my biggest flaws but I’m working on it 💪

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

I suppose I feel the same about having to take a painkiller. Now both hips are replaced I'm hoping to be able to do lots of things without pain - like climb on our bike for instance. I am on a tiny dose of Nebivolol now - .65 mg. I haven't yet plucked up the courage to go every other day . I'm not at all sure it's making a difference to my attacks and I would really just like to use it as a PIP. Perhaps I could try every 36 hrs but that would involve remembering!

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

Set a reminder on your phone to repeat every other day or 36 hours. I really despise taking meds but at the same time I recognise what a positive overall impact they have had on humanity. I take them when I absolutely have to and even then I hate it

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

I'm not a phone person. It lives in the study on the charger and I really have to make an effort to remember to take it out with me!

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

Really? That’s unusual this day and age. How old are you if you don’t mind me asking? I could go without my phone if I wanted too no doubt but think you would swiftly be left behind unfortunately. Humans are basically already cyborgs in my opinion. We have limitless knowledge at our fingertips (not always factual or useful granted) the only thing stopping us now is bandwidth. Once this threshold is breached technology really will go through the roof. That’s if AI isn’t unleashed first. The future is going to be interesting to say the least

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

69. I spend alot of time on my tablet. I find typing on the phone difficult. I only really use it to WhatsApp my family and friends. I am a dinosaur when it comes to technology. I don't use any social media other than WhatsApp. I'm not even sure if that counts as social media. Left behind what?

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

I don’t use any social media apart from WhatsApp myself. Poison as far as I’m concerned.

I meant left behind in general. Meaning everyone else would have access to abundant knowledge apart from you. Plus I like to listen to podcasts whenever I’m alone, travelling from place to place, walking dog etc. limitless music at fingertips etc. language learning continually with me whenever I want it. Wouldn’t be the same now without it.

[Auriculaire in reply to Elli86]

Well it's the internet that provides all this. You don't have to access it through the phone and I actually find the small format of the phone off putting. I listen to the tv when working in the kitchen and when gardening I prefer to listen to the sounds of nature than to music. I do listen to stuff on the internet but not as much as reading . My husband is the opposite. He does use the phone to listen to music on the bike.

[Elli86 in reply to Auriculaire]

Convenience more than anything else.

[Elli86]

Just had a reading of 131/91 on bp monitor as well which is sky high for me. Any thoughts in addition to rest of post?

[alfrae13]

I have something similar. My BP would be normal and the HR showing around 70. But My Kardia monitor shows that the distance between peaks varies and shows I am in AF

[Elli86 in reply to alfrae13]

Hi Alfrea.

What do you mean when you say distance between peaks?

[alfrae13 in reply to Elli86]

I mean the spikes that go up in an EKG. In NSR they are spaced equidistant, in my case the distance between them varied, some shorter some longer. I think they hsve the R designation on an ekg

[Elli86 in reply to alfrae13]

Right ok that’s what I thought you meant. Mine are all pretty equal hence the confusion. Usually during af they will be all over the place but currently they’re all resembling NSR it’s just the bpm that can vary a lot more than usual at the minute 👍

[seasicksurf]

Hi Elli,

I'd call this one of the "healing" symptoms post-ablation. I looked back at my health log that I kept after my ablation earlier this year and your description of your condition (variable heart rate) is a virtual copy of what I wrote in my log. In one instance I noted having three heart rates in the same minute (70 bpm for a bit, then 45 bpm, then 60 bpm). This happened a few times a day for a couple weeks, from week 4 to 6 post-ablation. I haven't had it since. Good luck.

[Elli86 in reply to seasicksurf]

Thanks seasick.

Was this after coming off meds as well? It’s started last 2 days, or atleast that’s when I’ve noticed it and I came off meds 9 days ago today. Didn’t have it post ablation till now. Good to know you’ve had it and it jogged on though. Hopefully same happens for me.

Mines not moving around quite as much as yours was. Mines more like 10/15 bpm but its causing me a little bit of agg. Stamina has gone down the pan again. Not that it has been anywhere decent since ablation anyway.

[seasicksurf]

I had a couple short variable-beat episodes after coming off the meds at 90 days post ablation--generally associated with stressful events (short-lived, infrequent events). I'm now 7 months post-ablation and continue to improve. I still notice ectopic beats nearly daily, but my stamina is so much better. I suppose I don't give the whole issue that much of my mind anymore. I'm one who goes by the adage that thoughts are real things. So I think of my body as healed and go about my day. The mind is more powerful than any tablet.

[Elli86 in reply to seasicksurf]

Once I’ve got the stamina to get back to work I’m guessing I will go much the same way, all being well of course and forget about what my ticker is doing. Hopefully that day comes sooner than later 🤞