I had a dental appointment yesterday, now my German dentist understands AF as his wife had quite an extreme form where her heart would go so fast she'd lose consciousness.
I told him I'd been 6 months AF free, until I'd started pulling out brambles in the garden a few weeks ago and a few heart bumps had started, next morning I'd gone swimming and then when I arrived home my heart rhythm took off making me feel hot, faint and dizzy. I'm still in AF now, but at a lower rate.
Immediately he answered, "It sounds to me like you have inflammation in your body and when you use your muscles, toxins from that area are released and affect you heart". I was astounded by his reply and thought what a sensible and plausible idea. Now why didn't my GP think of that? In fact why doesn't any professional medical person think that way?
He's right about the inflammation in my body and I'm waiting to see a consultant about it.
I'm just wondering what your views are on his simple response?
Jean
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I think a lot of your dentist response regarding inflammation as I had inflammation in my lungs (radiation pneumonitis) that started at the same time as the a fib. Prednisone cleared up the inflammation but of course the a fib is still there.
Wouldn't it be great? It's always made me think....we are told it's a symptom of bodily distress ,not a disease,and many of us have hearts that have no structural issues...xx
Its nice when somebody comes up with a possible new cause/ trigger for the dreaded arrhythmias. It's better than being offered more drugs or ablations.
Hi this is very interesting to read as iv just seen my cardiologist to be offered a second ablation or medication ....I don’t really want either!!I told her how the anxiety that runs alongside it becomes bigger then the problem and stops me from doing fun things or going abroad living in dread for the next episode of svt she went on to tell me there will soon be a nasal spray on the market 2/3 years)what you use as soon as you get an attack this news has made me feel very excited but 2/3 years is a long way away but how fab if it works imagine how our lives would change .
One day someone will say,,, I wonder if I were to go on a non inflamatory diet how I would fare,, and do it!
Perhaps living on 100% fruit like myself!
Incidentaly I only eat one type of fruit in any meal,,, I have one meal a day and I have nothing after 4PM other than water or herbal tea,, no sugar no tea or coffee and no alcohol ever.
Two of the most inflamatory foods you can eat are grains and dairy but not the only ones.
Jean, I do not have AF. I do however have prostate cancer and fibromyalgia.
I refused radiation and surgery for the prostate much to the disbelief of the consultant,,, verging on anger.
That was about 8 mths ago and the symptoms are getting better and my PSA is now down to below 1 from 8.7 ,, I think,,, and without any hormones or drugs. I am in no doubt that it will resolve.
It is not difficult once you make your mind up and as to it spiking your sugar,, I have measured my BSL and the spike is not that high and normalises quickly even if I were to eat a rediculous amount of fruit.
I make a lot of use of watermelon, pineapple,, any decient fruit I can find but I avoid berries as they are notorious for sucking in pesticides,, if I could get organic berries they would be fine but none to be got here.
I suggest you google and download Prof Arnold Ehret's book it's out of print and can be gotten for free in PDF format ,, just google him. There is a bit more to it than that but start reading searching and learning,, that's my tupence worth.
Once you have a few days past it's quite easy once you get all the stodge out of your colon,, probably about 48 hrs.
It dosen't matter what the ilness is,, it is about the body getting a chance to heal it's self,,, Dr's cure nothing! Drugs cure nothing,, its just being traped on a treadmill and swallowing pills.
You need nothing special,,it's not about what you take but what you do not take,, many will try and sell you some herb or whatever but I don't buy that as do may that have did this long term.
And before anyone starts harping on about protein and B12 my B12 is better than it had ever been.. my blood pressure is now around 127 / 65 and resting HR of 65 apox.
My resting HR used to be verging on techicardia at high 90's.
John that's amazing to hear, but I'm not surprised at how you've managed to help yourself. My father was a great believer in healthy eating long before it became fashionable, he turned to healthy eating in the 1950's. There was a book written many years ago which I think was called The Gentle Way With Cancer, which involved the Bristol diet. I don't know whether the author you mention is connected to that in any way, but I will look him up.
I'm so pleased to hear that you're getting better and have to say that I admire your decision and would hope that, in a similar situation mine would be the same.
Hi Ray, this is very timely and thank you for taking the trouble to provide such useful information. My PSA was historically around 1, then after 5 years found it was 4.1 and 6 months later 4.6 not looking forward to the next 6 month test later this month. Would like to try your approach, if I can trouble you could you give me a headstart by listing your Top 3 tips for me to focus on. Best wishes and would like to be present to see your consultant's face if you go back!
Do we all have some kind of inflammation going on I wonder?
My dentist is amazing, he once told me that by looking at my tongue he could tell I was short of vitamin B. I think Germans are more into natural health solutions than we are.
Im doing accupuncture and each and every time I go (3x a week for my afib) he looks at my tongue. And he feels for my pulse in my wrist in 3 different spots.
Hi Jean - I have mentioned this quite a few times. Stress = inflammatory response and stress can mean a physical stress ie over exercise add on emotional and psychological stress ie frustration .........
There are quite a few herbs and foods you can include in your diet which really help with this - the main 2 I use are Resveratrol and Astragalus. Anything dark purple in colour such as sable grapes, beetroot etc will be rich in Resveratrol but you can take a concentrated liquid form which is incredibly affective. Astragalus is great if you have a virus.
I also find that if it is physical overload, which happens quite a lot with me when I’m gardening, having a warm bath with added Sea Salt (or if you can Epsom Salts) really help move the lactic acid from the muscles. Athletes go into ice baths immediately after racing for exactly this reason - to minimise any inflammatory response.
I have found though that the only real remedy for me is allowing for a long period of rest after any exercise and rest means feet up and doing nothing. Again elite athletes are trained to do this - their day consists of cycles of training and then sleeping and eating.
We push ourselves far too far and don’t allow enough R&R time. Certainly our GPs are very aware of this, the trouble is that 10 minute appointments don’t allow for explanations and sitting down and telling you. My GP’s constantly monitor inflammatory markers in blood and urine because of my medical history but I think this should be part of a regular practice for anyone with a chronic condition - information, training and monitoring. You can ask for a CPR test which is none specific but will give you an indication of the level of inflammation in your body.
I knew about stress and inflammation causing AF also athletes who tend to train very hard. What struck me with what my dentist said was that it was actually me using my muscles and doing something physical that may have allowed the toxins from inflammation in my body to upset my heart. Perhaps that has been said on here before and I missed it. Though thinking about it now I guess stress makes us tense our muscles which is a similar thing.
It was just so lovely to hear a simple reason for the onset of my AF. Such a better way to look at the cause, rather than what pill shall we give you now. If we know our AF triggers we can avoid them, but alas I guess there are so many causes!
I didn't feel like going swimming when I did, should have listened to my body!
Thank you for the tips re Resveratrol and Astragalus. I'll look into buying some. I do eat beetroot and black grapes regularly and also have magnesium baths.
True, but for me having been AF free for over 6 months and then doing lots of exercise and AF immediately kicking off - well, my dentists theory sounds more likely.
PS - Ashwaganda is a herb often used in Indian medicine as a an anti-inflammatory adaptation.
I would certainly agree that sugar, some grains such as wheat and dairy are the main antagonists for inflammation generally and cut those foods out and it makes a huge difference. I’m not sure I could go to only eating fruit though as my Nutritionist is very hot on increasing protein proportionally and believes restricting fruit to a handful of berries a day is ideal.
I have to say I haven’t been that strict with myself on holidays and am suffering right now!
Oh no, we often have to learn what not to eat, the hard way! Sometimes it's worth it though, rather than make a fuss with hosts that you don't eat this or that!
I sometimes wonder if I eat too much fruit every day without fail I have a banana, two apples, two satsumas, a kiwi, nectarine, dates and sultanas. Then weekly there are grapes and peaches.
Im sorry I cannot answer you question any better,, all I can say is that I am doing it and I am happy I am at this stage going by experiance,, I am so glad I took the step forward that i did.
Sadly people just do not know were to look and half of those that do will not make the changes necessary,, but that is there decision.
Everyone wants proof,,, what proof dose you Dr offer,, he can't even gaurentee you will make it out the door!
I am selling nothing just telling of my own first hand experiance.
I have been suffering with arthritis in my hip and knee and I have noticed that when the pain is bad I have lots of ectopics and sometimes little runs of something fast as well as extra trips to the loo during the night so I have no doubt that inflammation affects my heart.
Last year I caught the coughing virus and was so ill that I was hospitalized. The Consultant Neurologist said " It's either inflammation or the effects of radiotherapy." I reminded him that the radiotherapy on my left shoulder (10x more than a breast cancer patient would get) was over 30 years ago. "Yes" he replied " But the effects are ongoing."
I was stunned. So thanks to their experimental treatment I now have a disintegrating shoulder, fibrosis in my heart and a spastic arm and hand.
They've now got me on Cannabis oil which is of very dubious benefit.
Have I got inflammation? Probably. My dentist said that I' d got some gum disease but the 2 lots of antibiotic which they gave to me in hospital certainly cured that.
I suspect that they are only ever grasping at straws.
I think the treatments for cancer are absolutely brutal and have horrible on-going consequences but unfortunately it was that or nothing 30 years ago.
I find the early markers for systemic inflammation for me are - sticky, itchy eyes in the morning or inside of the lids going pink, aching muscles - even when I haven’t done too much, chronic fatigue and a rash where one shouldn’t get a rash.
Bleeding gums are a real big marker and one that can cause a lot of damage to the rest of the body so good gum hygiene is really important. I see hygienist 4 times a year as the gum disease I had 15 years ago ended up costing me a fortune in reparative treatments.
Cannabis oil is also a good adaptagen but herbs work in such a different way to drugs. Did you get that prescribed through NHS?
I think the true consequences of stress - inflammation - disease have only been truly recognised in the last 20-30 years.
Can well relate to that, I am now rigorous in my dental routine and like you spent a fortune on dental treatments tackling gum disease ! Inflammation I am convinced causes a huge amount of AF cases, poor diet, stress, lack of sleep, lack of connect with nature, long working hours etc !
Yes, after 3 lots of drugs had failed the Neurologist prescribed Sativex spray for my spasticity. I do intend to post about it soon. Suffice to say that it is vile tasting and of doubtful benefit.
Anybody who takes advice from a dentist over a real Dr. has lost their mind and should see a psychologist ASAP. A dentist (who’s wife has AF)does not Know 5% of what a real doctor knows about AF. SMH!! Is this real life?
none of us here are doctors either, but we all have our experiences and you are hear reading them. I often choose not to take recommendations of my "doctor" often, simply because I know my body so much better than he does in the 15 minutes he spent with me. I listen to his "suggestions" then I do my own investigations, and talk with others in similar situations to get their input.
After I have exhausted all possible avenues, then I make a decision on what to do. Im also married to a surgeon, and our conversations about medical treatments are from two different perspectives. His comes from medical school and practice, mine comes from life experience and open to new ideas from all sources. We all look for what will work for our personal AFIB's. So lets not blast someone that has a new idea or a new perspective. You never know what will work for that person. Unless, YOU have found a cure for your Afib lets not poo-poo or insult others opinions. And btw... a dentist IS a real doctor,
My dentist said little about my AF other than what I wrote above. I felt his words could be right. So you think I need to see a psychologist? Are you medically trained to give me that advice? Do you think I should I be listening to what you advise?
Appalling arrogance. My first ( suspected) afib attack came after a bout of diverticulitis though I suspect the Cipro treatment as much as the actual infection as the last CRP blood test done at the hospital showed the inflammation marker well down and the attack came when I got home. But my last one last Oct was after a UTI. All I took for that was d mannose and oregano oil. I think your dentist's theory perfectly plausible.
I was just totally amazed at the simple cause he suggested, it sounded exactly right to me. My dentist is such a gentle, quietly spoken person, he said no more about it than a few sentences and my mouth was full of dental implements so I couldn't speak. No medical professional has ever discussed the cause of AF with me and it was so refreshing to hear.
That's interesting re the d mannose and oregano oil helping your AF. Do you take a combined mixture, or the two separately? Years ago I took a combination of oregano and garlic oil to cure h-pylori.
I took the combo for the UTI not the afib. I did not want to take an antibiotic. I would be very reluctant to take anything other than Augmentin which I know I tolerate and I had already had one 14 day stretch of that earlier last year before my damaged colon was shortened. The combination worked but the day the afib struck after about 12 days of taking it I was feeling really really tired. Still apart from a few ectopics I have been afib free for 10 months now. I take 1.25 mg Nebivolol ,Apixaban and am very strict about magnesium 3 times a day.
My GP was the first to notice that every time I had some infection in other parts of my body I had a bad bout of AF . Now I notice it myself even a stomach upset will set it off. So there is a reaction in my case, but as always we are all different to what triggers we have.. all the best o you.
Ive been told the same thing! I developed RA, one year before the Afib. Its said that 60% of people that have been diagnosed with RA will develope Afib. Its all about the inflamation! I just left my RA doc yesterday. Blood work taken to look at my inflamation markers, and of course the regular testing. Will know results in 2 days
What your dentist said makes perfect sence to me too.
I fell really ill last August with a burst appendix. I suffered a massive infection. A week in hospital with IV antibiotics, then a couple of weeks after discharge, had AF and cardioverted, same again last January. Cardiologist alluded to the appendix being the culprit for kicking it all off. Now almost a year later, I'm a lot better, but it has taken me that long to get back in to any sense of normality.
Jean ... absolutely ... inflammation in the body can cause all sorts of bad things ... l take one half of a very mild statin ... l wanted to stop them altogether until l started reading about how they prevent inflammation in the body. My cholesterol is normal nonetheless, l take a very minimal low dose statin to keep it in check and deal with inflammation simultaneously!
Don't know if you follow Life Extension (LEF.org) but they now are advocating "metabolic cardiology." What they have to say about supplements for HF and heart dysfunction, and restoration of heart muscle, may also apply to AFIB. You might find it interesting.
Hi, thanks for your post, and much food for thought there. Two weeks ago had my first full blown AF episode for a couple of years (lots and lots of ? Ectopics though). It happened 4 days into my dog sitting fortnight for my son. I was taking the dog for many walks and had been struggling with a bad back for some weeks before so had been having gentle walks and exercise but nothing too strenuous. Did taking more strenuous exercise, and having back pain, cause it? Very interesting. I lived in Germany when my AF started. I was straight away put on a magnesium/potassium supplement. They are far more likely to advise complementary medicines than here. Myrtle oil capsules to help clear catarrh after a cold works at treat! There is so much more to be explored re causes of AF and maybe one day.......
Thanks for all you do answering queries and your support.
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