Depression,

[suzytoshoes]

Hi

do quite a lot of people get depression, with AF? My doctor seem to think i have Depression, and says its quite common with AF,

Suzy

[BobD Volunteer]

Real depression is quite hard to define I think and doesn't always involve feeling down and fed up. AF does often make for panic attacks, feelings of loss of control , sleep problems etc some of which could be depression. I did spend a lot of time in committee at BHF banging the table about providing more psycological support for patients with AF when we were trialling the arrhythmia nurse project and having access to one shows good results in that area but there are not enough and still many centres don;t have one.

Bob

[Bryonny]

I went through a period of anxiety and felt very low and frightened. I had some counselling session which helped me and I used mindfulness techiques which I found beneficial too. I am not sure I was ever depressed but it certainly felt tough for some time. When I saw a consultant who listened and provided me with answers that made a great difference in a positive way. I found this web site amazing in providing great support and reassurance. Hope you get linked in th support that works for you.

[coopo]

Hi Suzy , I think most people suffer from depression at some time in their life if they are on meds or not , Its normal to be fed up sometimes we are not supermen/women.

Just try to not hold on to it and let it flow away. Sometimes people purposefully put on sad music to experience feeling "low" and then feel great after getting rid of that emotion. you've heard people say that a good cry can relieve you of your sad emotions.

[Dave1961]

I've suffered from depression for decades, exacerbated by alcoholism.

My diagnosis of AF DID make me more depressed but certainly didn't trigger it.

What I HAVE found is that after starting magnesium supplements my depression has improved out of sight and I have not had an AF attack in 8 weeks.

It's a nutrient thats very important in our bodies, including stabilising mood and regulating heartbeat.

Since quitting the booze several antidepressants in the past 2 years have left me feeling on the verge of an AF attack constantly so being able to find a natural "remedy" after so long has been a godsend.

[Hidden]

What doctor are you seeing? A few years back I was seeing a GP and getting nowhere and feeling very low. I had aged 20 years in an instant. Eventually I asked for a private referral to an EP who sorted me out in a few weeks, and I no longer feel low as my arrhythmia is under control.

Koll

[nikita7]

I certainly understand what you are saying. For the first time in my life I have been referred to a psychiatrist /psychologist to talk about my difficulties dealing with my AF problems. I had three failed ablations and still suffer from lots of AF episodes and lots of PAC's, even more so than before.

And I feel it gets harder every time I experience one. I saw a therapist and he suggested psychotherapy. But I don't really get how a conservation with a therapist every two or three weeks can take away the anxiety and desperation that comes with AF.

[CDreamer in reply to nikita7]

Hi Nikita psychotherapy does work for people, but you do need to commit to going EVERY week, not just every couple of weeks. Psychotherapy helps disclose your thinking, your behaviours and your emotions and your physiology and teaches you how they interact and how you can change your perceptions and your behaviours and thinking so that you feel differently. Will it take away your AF - probably not, but it will help you adjust and cope and help enormously with the anxiety and desperation. And you have to want to do it.

Very best wishes CD

[nikita7 in reply to CDreamer]

Hi,

I really want to go, I really do but I am just scared that I am in for another dissapointment. I have had so many of those lately and I am so tired of asking for help and not getting any but I would love to settle for just being able to adjust and cope. So I am going to give it a try!

Thanks for your reply

Nikita

[CDreamer in reply to nikita7]

Finding the right person for you is the key. The one thing that a counsellor or psychotherapist will do is listen, if they don't or don't hear what you say, dump them.

Disappointments come from expectations so therefore I strongly recommend that you are explicit about your expectations on your first meeting and expect your therapist to be honest about their ability to meet your expectations, they may or may not be able to. Without that you will not have a 'working alliance' which is what a properly trained person will spend a lot of time working on. This can prove frustrating for the client, but unless you establish what you both are committing to, nothing will happen.

It takes time, most useful work takes months, and it can be life-changing. I decided to train in counselling/psychotherpay in 1993 after traumatic life changing events and it was the hardest and the best thing I ever did for myself. However, my first encounters were rubbish and what prompted me to do a first training was to educate myself as I thought - there has to be something better than that! There was, I found it and never looked back.

2 sites that maybe useful - itsgoodtotalk.org.uk/‎ lots of info on various types of counselling/psychotherapy and questions to ask of the therapist (whether or not on the NHS).

psychotherapy.org.uk/

People often ask the difference between counselling and psychotherapy - most therapists struggle explaining! Basically a psychotherapy training through UKCP (United Kingdom Counsel of Psychotherapy) is much lengthier and they go into greater depths but the BACP (British Association of Counsellors & Psychotherapists) - 'It's good to talk' site is very informative.

I was BACP Accredited and there are some great people on their list. The types of training also differ greatly in quality and latest methodology so learning a little about the jargon helps!

I would suggest that at the very least you look for someone with specialist training in Anxiety - may seem obvious - but many, many don't have that training.

[CDreamer]

How did he diagnose? Did he give you a psychometric test for depression or just ask you a few questions? More importantly, if he thinks you have depression what help or suggestions did he offer?

I agree with Bob, clinical depression differs from low mood triggered by coming to terms with a chronic illness, but that doesn't make it any less difficult to adjust.

The symptoms of clinical depression are:- difficulty in sleeping, not wanting to get up, not taking care of yourself - washing, dressing etc ie:- not caring, withdrawal from social contact, anxiety, an overwhelming weariness and lack of looking forward to things in the future, feeling overwhelmed and hopeless, suicidal thoughts. If you have these symptoms you do need treatment, the sooner the better.

May I suggest you check out this site the Human Givens Institute

hgi.org.uk who have a very comprehensive explanation of depression, what causes the various symptoms and more importantly what can help lift even established clinical depression.

The difference between an event triggered depression and clinical depression is that most people with event triggered depression want to get better but don't know how.

As the others have said many people diagnosed with AF go through a difficult time adjusting because it alters our lives, we can't always do what we used to do or want or expect to do, AND many of us have had treatments which means we have no more AF. Many others find ways of adjusting through things like relaxation techniques such as Mindfulness or for worry thoughts leading to anxiety - CBT - cognitive behavioural therapy.

I hope you now know you are not alone in this and that this can be a great support network for you so please keep posting and tell us a bit of what exactly is worrying you?

VeryBest wishes CD

[Japaholic]

I used (and still continue to use and advocate for..) acupuncture to help with the anxiety my AF created and it does help. Its not perfect, but it does help. Am I depressed? No, I am anxious, worried, concerned about this beast of a condition and the affect is has on my life.

[lingooz]

Hi. I have been on antidepressants for year, (since being diagnosed, with P A F ) for anxiety! Now down to half a tablet, feel much better, probably quite usual to feel that way in beginning as is a shock, hope this helps x

[Hidden]

There is no doubt in my experience that at the start of AF life is full of anxious moments and low feelings as a result of tests and lifestyle changes. I think one of the things that helped me was a determination to use AF as a lever to improve my health and QOL generally even with continuing AF i.e. turn it into a positive factor.

Good Luck, stick with it, it does take time.

[lizwright]

As I have said on this site so many times, if your heart is racing or arrythmic then you get a flight or fight reaction. I feel this is seriously over looked in considering the care of patients. If you are in flight or fight mode you will be very anxious through chemical reasons, let alone the fact you will be anxious about adjusting to managing AF. I think if you know you may fee anxious and that it is partly physical reasons, then that immediately helps you to feel calmer.

[barnes12]

Yes I do I ended up having a breakdown just after I was told I had it although I don't think it was just down to that it was the last straw I thought I was going to die I had panic attacks I won't bore you with everything I went through but I have had a fantastic gp in london who helped me so much great care at both the royal brompton and kingston hospital I then found this site and with some great advice from bob and ian I am starting to feel like me again its taken over two years karen

[suzytoshoes]

Hi Everyone,

thank you all Regarding Depression, I seem to get very low just before a AF Attack but I did not realise at first, It comes on all of a sudden then after a couple of days I feel ok again, I don't have sleep problems only when in AF I do feel very tired when like that, and on the odd occasion felt weepy, but not sure why I am normally quite a positive person,

But recently have been getting these symptom's, and they are before AF so I mentioned to my Dr about it and he seem to think I am getting depressed. I wonder if could be something to do with the tablets I am on Flecanide and Verapamil

Suzy

[CDreamer in reply to suzytoshoes]

I very much doubt it, more likely to be the AF. I used to get what I can only describe as an adrenaline rush anything up to 24 hours before an episode. Your body knows what is happening and the symptoms you describe I think are your body's way of alerting you. as the others have said AF makes you feel very tired, disrupts sleep and increases anxiety first through chemical signals and secondly through worry thoughts.

You feel weepy because you feel vulnerable, I used to be very weepy and believe me when I say my Bank Manager finds me scary when I am 'normal'!

Relaxation, acupuncture, reflexology, mindfulness may all help but the only thing that will really help is if you are able to not have episodes of AF.

Regards CD

[Basia12 in reply to suzytoshoes]

Suzy are you also on bisoprolol? A friend I know was put on these beta blockers for AF and they caused depression and she was put on antidepressants .Her cardiologist seemed to think they were the root cause as it was such a dramatic change. I think he had come across it before with beta blockers . Hope this is helpful x

[suzytoshoes in reply to Basia12]

Hi

No I am not on bisoprolo, I am on Verapamil , 120 mg and Flecanide, as I also have mild Asthma, so only certain drugs I can take I am so tired a lot of the time, mainly when have a AF Attack knocks me really bad but getting more bad days than good at the moment,

so the doctor thinks I am Depressed, mainly because I get weepy but that is when in AF too, then I am a different person when feel ok , think it is trying to cope with AF getting my head round it, thank you so much for your help, and everyone else don't know what I would do without you all, its a great group.

Suzy, plus I am on Isotard, and blood pressure tabs

[Basia12 in reply to suzytoshoes]

I also get weepy when in AF ! ( I'm 46 and female and have also always been a bit 'hormonal'!)My mood is usually fine when not in AF.It is hard to get your head round I was diagnosed in sept , and I'm still learning! ,yes this site is great for advice and reassurance. I have been reading old posts an find quite a few people with my experiences and symptoms and find it really helpful that I'm not alone .good luck x