Food, fun & festivities....and Age re... - Advanced Prostate...

Advanced Prostate Cancer

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Food, fun & festivities....and Age relevance (I'm 61 & Stage 4)

greatjohn
greatjohn

hmmm. I keep reading on here that so many of the community are either Vegan or Vegetarian. It sounds good. BUT, my whole JOY OF LIFE is eating...I'm not kidding...and cooking. I'm a moderator on a Foodie Group on Facebook and post all my meals ).

***AND...my weight is staying at a good place according to my Oncologist and his assistant and my regular Doctor...AND I eat meat. And I eat Cheese...and I eat carbs...I eat EVERYTHING...even S U G A R ! ! ! !

*** I do try to eat some veggies every day...and some fruit...but I also love a hamburger. A couple of nights ago...I was making big delicious salads with home grown vine-ripened tomatoes...AND I sent my partner to McDonalds for a couple of burgers for us to go alongside the salad. It was delicious. I just ate a couple of chocolate chip cookies a neighbor had brought over. For lunch today I had two hot dogs (no nitrates) on whole grain tortilla with a little chili and cheese and homemade slaw....with a few chips.

***My question is...I maintain my weight ...eating like I do. If (and I don't think I would ever do it) I gave up meat, fried foods, carbs, dairy products (I love gouda cheese with truffles)....and kept up my lifestyle...which is walking about 4 miles a day (total)...and going to the gym 2 or 3 times a week and working in the garden...I'd weight about 90 pounds.(currently 188)

**I don't see how anyone could eat enough vegetables to maintain their weight. Is anyone else out there...eating EVERYTHING...? those on the stict diets...have you lost a lot weight? ~~Just curious. P.S. I think we should start all of our posts with our age...when I read someone's "journey"...and hear about their exercise...I think they are doing badly...but then I figure out they are 85 or 86...and I think WOW...they are doing great. AGE really is much more than a number. How a 60 y.o. eats, sleeps, etc...is MUCH different than how an 80 y.o. does..or for that matter someone who's 40. Without age made obvious as I am reading people's posts...I have a hard time "seeing" what I am seeing...if that makes any sense. A 40 year old who runs 1/2 marathons is not that same as a 60 y.o. who runs them. Life is beautiful...and it keeps changing.

~~curious John

p.s trying to enjoy this crazy thing called LIFE ! ! !

32 Replies
oldestnewest

I’m with you. At 81 how much life can I add if I give up the foods I love. Same with booze.

The way I look at it, I've given up enough already. The last thing I want to give up are my reasons for living. I think that having things to live for is also important too. If I can't eat the foods I enjoy, there's less to live for. I hear people make blanket statements like: "cut out ALL dairy" or "don't eat ANYTHING with sugar in it". Then I think to myself "there'd better be a huge payoff for that". The problem is that so much of these diet and supplement solutions are based on a lot of speculation. Reduction in quality of life is all but guaranteed, while improvement of health is not. I don't doubt that they can contribute to overall health, but the difference is relatively small if it's there at all. So that has to be balanced with the cost to your quality of life. I already tried the Vegan thing, no thanks. Plus a lot of these "special diets" are so inconvenient that you can hardly go out to eat or have dinner at someone's house without making all sorts of unreasonable demands. I generally don't cook for people who have an extensive list of things they "can't eat" because of the newest fad diet their on.

When it comes to food, my goal is to just not eat so much. Ever since my diagnosis, I've kind of been pigging out as if it's my last meal or something. As they say, everything in moderation. That's my motto.

I eat as per the Adkins Diet--which I was doing long before Adkins--I have been known to have Prime Ribs for Breakfast. I hobby on Foods, and provide Free Chef Services to Churches. Vegans do not get the right mix of amino acids and certain minerals and vitamins. If I die early because from my Pca and my diet so be it. My supplemental program, may be protective though?

Man cannot live on water long---40 Days maybe.

Nalakrats

I am 54 love to cook and eat. I try to eat healthy but I am not going to give up the things I enjoy. Already gave up enough of those. “Let them eat cake!” And steak

greatjohn
greatjohn in reply to Dad1963

a motto I can live with!

I'm 100% plant based and can say I have no problem keeping my weight on. Almonds, beans, and other non vegetable type foods contain a good amount of calories.

A lot of Onco's say diet may play a role in helping to prevent cancer but once you have it diet doesn't mean much

WSOPeddie
WSOPeddie in reply to gusgold

There might be a few things to stay away from that are said to fuel PC, like flaxseed oil (?). I'm not much into stringent, healthful diets. I do stay away from fizzy sugar water and have done so for years. I'd have an even bigger belly if I didn't. Milk, cheese, some red meat? Bring it on.

I am 68 and on a vegan diet. I exercise heavily - I ride my bike 12 to 13 miles 5 or 6 days a week. I also work a little with dumbbells and do back and core strengthening exercise for about 25 minutes 5 days a week.

I have not lost any weight on this diet and in fact need to watch my weight just as much as before I adopted the vegan diet. As some others have observed, nuts and beans are fairly calorie dense. I do drink moderately and often have some bean-based chips with a beer.

I never was a huge meat lover so I have never felt like the vegan diet was a sacrifice. It is important to find tasty recipes though; I am gradually accumulating those.

adlerman
adlerman in reply to smroush

You may not have lost any weight but with your exercise schedule you must have lost inches.

Diagnosed at 58 Gleason 9 (5+4) I was at that time a vegetarian doing triathlons. Vegetarian due to heart disease. It kept my cholesterol down but was boring. I was in good shape and ate a lot of pasta and beans to maintain my weight at about 155 (5 9). With radiation I went back to eating meat and have never stopped. I worked overseas and eating different foods was my entertainment.

With hormone treatment weight went up. Also could not exercise as much. Recently my heart Doc put me on adkins which I love. Gave up most bread and sugar but got my weight back down to below 160. Eat lots of meat. Gave up potatoes but eat other veggies. Do cheat with some Italian food and pasta occasionally. Now lifting weights and feel good. Currently 73 on Xgeva, avodart, lipitor, and supplements. Cannot drink beer since radiation. Drink glass of wine not every day. Scotch occasionally. Play golf, will ski again when bone mets come down, walk, and fish. Generally enjoy life.

Superheat 12

Me 61, Stage 4,

sounds like you're doing every thing RIGHT ! ! ! Enjoy! Since I got diagnosed at 59 with Stage 4...your life "story" is one I would like to follow. I dream of seeing 70. ! ! !

Me 61 Stage 4,

I guess you're one of the "lucky ones" ...I have friends who just "never loved meat". Meat is my life...LOL. But I have really cut back ! ! ! Sounds like you are staying active and doing the same kind of light weight work out that I am doing now. I've only been "part of the group" aka stage 4 for about a year (diagnosed). Thanks for including your age...it makes my reading of your work out and diet more easily visualized in a proper context. I have always eaten "massive" amounts of food...and assumed I had a high metabolism. I kept thinking it would slow down drastically....especially with Lupron...but it doesn't seem to have. If I eat "lightly" / say 2000 -2500 calories for a few days in a row...I still lose weight. I'd say I'm at about 3000 a day almost every day....and I am staying within a 2-3 pound range. We're all different and the paths are all different...Good Luck ! ! !

~John

If you are considering a vegetarian/vegan diet, you don't need to worry about keeping weight on. The real issue is making sure you get enough of certain nutrients and minerals. Protein can be an issue (but you can deal with that with proper mixing of beans, nuts. soy and dairy.) B12 vitamins can also be an issue, but you can deal with that through a multivitamin or B12 fortified foods. You need to think more about your diet (at least initially) to make sure you are meeting your nutritional needs - but you should do that with any diet meaty or meatless.

BTW - I am 6' 4", weigh 220, and am a long time vegetarian. Weight loss has only been an issue for me when I am into intense training (e.g. for a marathon)

greatjohn
greatjohn in reply to Fauvemarin

me 61, stage 4,

hmmm...not really considering it for me...it's just not doable....just want to hear stories of how people are "dieting, eating...and living" while on the journey....and what works for them.

Thanks! ~~John.

p.s. age? as I am trying to make people see that this is relevant in considering how well people are doing from their comments.

Fauvemarin
Fauvemarin in reply to greatjohn

Good idea to scope out the playing field - lots of info on this page, some of which is useful.

I am 71; only Stage 2, but Gleason 8; PCA was 21 when started treatment, had two courses of radiation (1 external and now have 60+ radioactive iodine seeds implanted in prostate), plus hormone replacement. By and large therapy has been easy but I was in good shape to start and on the right diet.

When my psa went from 1.7 to 3.7 I went on a diet of oatmeal buleberries and banana in the morning. When i was sill working salad with grilled chicken in it at 3pm and another salad at around 8-9 pm. I did this to lose weight first and maybe might do something for the cancer second. I did lose 24lbs by my 3 month psa test and checkup and i did feel much better. Unfortunatly it did nothing for the cancer as my psa jumped to 9.8 and mets in collar bone.

I was put on Xtandi and had to quit work so my regement was interupted and im strying off my diet and eating other stuff. Alot because of eating out more due to traveling for scans and MO visits. My wife just cant stand eating the boring diet and i cant blame her really. Since i do most of the cooking and not working i am back to eating a more varied diet. Chuch dinners and lunches i do participate in since i have the time derail the diet even further. I can resist all that home cooking!

My final thoughts on almost vegan diet. I did lose weight that made me feel better but did nothing for the cancer. I do restrict portion size these days but im eating what i want, life is going to be to short not too.

Thomas

greatjohn
greatjohn in reply to Tjc1

me 61, stage 4

I agree with you....if you're a bit overweight...losing the weight is good...I feel "heavy"...for me...because my motto was always "you can never be too rich or too thin"...LOL. But all of my doctors, nurses, and people around me...say I should stay at my weight which seems crazy high...(to hear it)...but looks different on me. I'm only 5'8" and I weight just under 190. I've always had dense...heavy muscle...and I guess until I lose all of that from the Lupron(Castration)...I'll be able to carry a bit more weight than most. And the muscle still seems to keep my metabolism pretty fast. More importantly even...I stay SO perfectly regular in the bowel department. This from eating high fiber breakfast...and kind of what ever I want all day...but with some veggies and fruits thrown in. ~~John.

**if I recall correctly from earlier posts...you're very young...so keep up the good work and ENJOY. Life is Beautiful! ACTUALLY I JUST WENT BACK TO YOUR PROFILE AND WE'RE ABOUT THE SAME AGE. SINCE AGE DOES SEEM RELEVANT...I HAVE DECIDED TO START POSTING MY AGE AND STAGE BEFORE I COMMENT...SO THAT PEOPLE CAN DECIDE IF THEY ARE "COMPARABLE" TO ME. I FIND IT HARD TO COMPARE MYSELF WITH A 40 Y.O. OR AN 80 Y.O. ...IN TERMS OF PROGRESSION...PHYSICAL FITNESS...ETC.

AS long as you don't eat the bun if is OK with Adkins.

I have also read a lot about the benefits of vegan diet during cancer treatment. But so far unfortunately I couldn't follow this diet. As I am living near sea shore I use to eat fresh fish practically everyday. But I have limited the quantity (50 to 100 gms). But I eat chicken or meat very rarely. I use to take milk with my two cups of tea ( total around 150 ml) . Two eggs a week like omlet or fried egg. The total sugar I consume daily maybe two teaspoons with the the tea. I eat lot of vegetables and one or two fruits daily. I don't know whether this diet will promote the cancer growth. I feel sorry that couldn't change my diet habits despite my efforts to try for a vegan diet.

greatjohn
greatjohn in reply to dress2544

It sounds like you are doing everything right and eating very healthy! Good luck on your journey!

dress2544
dress2544 in reply to greatjohn

Hi Greatjohn

Your reply encourage me to Stick on the diet which I am following. Thanks for being with me!

I am 66 and am an active hiker and x country skier. I am now a modified vegan pescatarian . I do eat some cheese[very little] and some milk in my coffee. Also an occasional egg. I have gone from 193 to 172 lb and this has been a good thing. I love food as well and have found there is a whole new foodie thing going on out there based on vegan concepts. It is now cool, fun and delicious. I hope to go back to grain fed ethically raised and killed red meat at some point. Chicken as well. I think for now it is worth it to give this a try as I would like to live a while longer. I also have the occasional glass of red wine. It does not have to be boring or not fun so to speak. It is hard at first but because it is a change. I like it now. I also still love sex and if possible will not let them change that. My creed,

Believe in yourself, eat well, live.....with Gusto!

I'm a bit of a foodie myself, but changing to a plant based diet was easy. I have a Gleason 8 and originally had a PSA of six. Before my proton treatment, just changing to the new diet reduced my PSA by two points. Check out Dr. Michael Greger's book, "How Not To Die," as well as his new cookbook that has the same title.

I’ve also become a vegan-pescatarian after diagnosis. I’m not under the illusion that it’ll cure my cancer, but I’m fairly optimistic that it will help a great deal with the comorbidities. My personal experience also tells me the diet has a role to play in controlling the spread of the disease. My PSA went from 47 to 99 in one a half months after the diagnosis. I switched my diet at this point and the next reading the following month just before I started on medication was 94. Far from a scientific evidence, but good enough for me.

For people who did not see any improvements after a dietary change, it’s difficult to say. Perhaps it was ineffective, or perhaps it would’ve been even worse had they not changed.

A “balanced” diet does not have to be as restrictive as a vegan regiment. But I strongly believe we cannot just go on eating carelessly the way some of us used to (myself included) and pretending it doesn’t make any difference.

75 Gleason 9 stage 4. Had to give up booze when I went on chemo since the chemo puts a strain on the liver and additional strain not needed. Don't miss it, but will go back to moderate drinking when I go off chemo in 2 weeks. I have always said that any religion or ethical system that says I can't have a beer with my ham sandwich is one I would never have any interest in. Most of this dietary stuff has nothing to do with health - it's about feeling morally elevated if you don't nosh down a nice juicy steak or knock back a shot or two of Oh Be Joyful. Humans are omnivores; as long as you consume a balanced diet in moderation, you should be OK. As I say I'm 75 and aside from this damn cancer as healthy as a horse. My dietary lifestyle has worked fine for me so far so why should I change - in spite of the "tsk,tsks" from my abstemious better half when I put a shot of Old Overshoes in my after dinner coffee.

me, 61, stage 4.

love the attitude..love the humor. Enjoy your "shot" once the chemo is over. I never have really drunk very much....but during Chemo(I just finished end of January)...I just couldn't even conceive of even a small glass of wine or a beer...

Now, I will have an occasional Martini...beer...glass of wine....and a couple of days ago..had two, count them, two...delicious strawberry margaritas ...it tasted and felt GREAT! with the grilled flank steak and black beans and rice and sweet plantains. YUM.

You're making me hungry!

I have lived with Pca for 25 years, and became a vegetarian a few days after the diagnoses. I was 42 years old and the idea just made sense to me. PCa is a hormone fed cancer so why would I eat domestic animals filled with growth hormones to make them grow big fatter faster. I don't claim being vegetarian cures cancer but why not do everything you can to fight the disease. If I had been diagnosed in my 80's maybe I would have felt differently.

greatjohn
greatjohn in reply to Magnus1964

me 61, Stage 4

is that 25 years with Stage 4? 25 years sounds like a long time to live with anything...LOL. I assume the stage 4 diagnosis came years after original...how long for stage 4? just curious.

Magnus1964
Magnus1964 in reply to greatjohn

I was stag 4 out of the gate.

Dx PSA 571, 7 bone Mets. On Zoladex and Abiraterone, and PSA immeasurable since 12 weeks in, for the last 6 years.

I’ve lost one of my major loves, sex, so I’m buggered if I’m giving anything else up. I enjoy a good mixed diet, and a few scoops of lager twice a week.

I’ve decided I need to go on a fat free diet, as my weight has increased by 14 pounds (1 stone in UK) over the last 6 years. All my bloods are good, and I’m pretty well given my original dx of 6 months.

Eat what you enjoy, and keep laughing, it’s the best medicine. The post about “ my scrotum is as soft as a pony’s nose” had me ROFL.

Onwards and upwards!

Cheers

Martín

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