New remedy for Parkinson's

[12stargate]

Did any of you read this?

What do you think about it?

livebetterparkinsons.com/fi...

[soup]

Although neuroprotection was quoted in this article, the paper they were quoting did not measure it. Results were just for blood Dopamine levels before and after taking the substance.

In the discussion section the neuroprotective claims arose from two other papers which I did not have acess to.

[fwes in reply to soup]

Right on! Caveat Emptor

The lead-in sentence "Ramón Cacabelos, a world known expert for neurodegenerative disorders and genomic medicine, and his team have completed preclinical and clinical studies ...." might lead one to conclude that the clinical studies included something directly relating to PD. We checked the scientific paper ( #tabs1 is the Abstract, #tabs2 provides the full text).

scitcentral.com/article.php...

Alas, preclinical = "animal model studies" and the clinical efforts are confined to the carefully documented blood drawing procedure and associated chemical and statistical analysis. Less well documented is the broad SUGGESTION in the

"DISCUSSION

This first clinical study with Atremorine in patients with

Parkinsonian disorders clearly demonstrates the powerful effect of this novel bioproduct on plasma dopamine (Figure

1) in both untreated patients and patients chronically treated

with conventional antiparkinsonian drugs (Figure 2). This

pro-dopaminergic effect can be attributed to the rich content

of natural L-DOPA (average concentration 20 mg/g) in the

composition of Atremorine (Table 2). However, the

neuroprotective effect of this nutraceutical product on

dopaminergic neurons, as demonstrated in in vitro studies

[20] and in animal models of PD [21], cannot be only

attributed to L-DOPA, but to other intrinsic constituents

(selective neurotrophic factors) of the compound [20]. This

study also makes clear that 100% of untreated PD patients

exhibit a dramatic hypodopaminemia, with plasma levels of

DA below 20 pg/mL (Table 5) and that PD patients under

long-term treatment with L-DOPA and/or conventional

antiparkinsonian drugs experience a hyperdopaminemic

status which might be responsible for (i) the clinical improvement of PD cardinal symptoms in the short-term, (ii) the “wearing-off” phenomenon [12,13], (iii) motor fluctuations and dyskinesia [10,14], (iv) systemic

complications (gastrointestinal disorders, cardiovascular problems, hormonal dysregulation) [18,19], and (v) neuropsychiatric disorders (depression, anxiety, toxic psychosis) [11,18]."

WOW! Our problems are solved. Or are they?

First, Soup's point: "... clinical study with Atremorine in patients with Parkinsonian disorders clearly demonstrates the powerful effect of this novel bioproduct on plasma dopamine" .... aka blood chemistry.

Second,watch the pea: "the neuroprotective effect of this nutraceutical product on dopaminergic neurons, as demonstrated in in vitro (test tube) studies [20] and in animal models of PD [21]"

Third, the good stuff: " This study ... dramatic hypodopaminemia ... which MIGHT be responsible for ..." CAPS are added for emphasis.

How many recall "MIGHT have WMD" ?

FYI. hypodopaminemia = increased dopamine.

[20] European

Patent EP16382138 claims. ,

[21] in vitro and animal model studies.

They are touting “AtreMorine® is a highly innovative food supplement rich in natural L-Dopa & Neuro-protective”, which is "obtained by means of non-denaturing biotechnological procedures from structural components of Vicia faba L" aka fava beans. Price 97€ / week, 248€ /month (save 20€ if you order today)

CAUTION: HIGH LEVELS OF DOPAMINE CAN CAUSE DYSKINESIA.

The clinical trial: "All patients received a single oral dose of 5g E-PodoFavalin-

15999 (Atremorine®) (Table 3) in the morning to avoid circadian variations in biochemical and hormonal parameters, and blood samples were obtained prior to Atremorine intake and 60 minutes later."

Recommended dose: ” 10g of AtreMorine® increases the level of dopamine in average between 500 % and 4000 % in only 1 hour with a duration of action up to 12 hours.” atremorine-viaphyt.com/buy-...

The science is interesting. I hope that they continue their studies and are successful. I shall wait on investing in their company.

[12stargate in reply to fwes]

fwes

Thank you!

I am grateful I have my friends on this site to check things out with before I headlong dive into a buying very expensive product👍

[park_bear in reply to fwes]

ROFL: "MIGHT have WMD"

PodoFavalin - a levodopa laden extract of fava beans perhaps? A rise in blood dopamine after a dose of that would be no surprise.

[fwes in reply to park_bear]

park_bear, you keep me honest and I appreciate that. I admit that I choose my words carefully, since I know that you are in the woods

Of course, Not a Surprise and Not a Panacea. Fava beans are Old News and likely not worth 248€ /month. I tried to refrain from negative statements in my original post, but since you asked, I will share some additional thoughts:

I am concerned that by slipping MIGHT into a page full of seven syllable words, and ahead of a nearly comprehensive list of PD ills, a less than fully careful reader MIGHT be lulled into believing that this is a CLINICALLY demonstrated breakthrough for PWP, when in fact, all that they established CLINICALLY is a careful repetition of some 1960's vintage blood work. Carelessly used or read, MIGHT is a MIGHTY word.

I have carefully refrained from saying that they do not have something. I have carefully parsed their words from several web sites to distinguish between what they have demonstrated and what they have suggested. To my suspicious mind, the fact that they chose to rush this to market as a very pricey food additive, rather than making the effort to get approval as a drug MIGHT suggest that, in their expert opinion, there MIGHT be considerable risk regarding whether they can successfully take the next CLINICAL step.

Reading other Replies, it would appear that I am not the only one who is suspicious.

[hanifab23 in reply to fwes]

do you recommend this product have you tried it

[12stargate in reply to hanifab23]

hanifab23

Neither.

That is why i was asking you all's opinion.

[soup]

I read this headline summmary and went to the original paper.

The easy to read article claims it is neuroprotective but the scientific paper Only gives measurements on blood Dopamine levels. Unsurprisingly they go up after treatment.

The neuroprotective effects were just citations of other work.

[12stargate in reply to soup]

soup

Thank you😊

[Pelley]

Sounds too good to be completely true. I mean not only does it help the PD newbie with their first problems relating to dopamine shortage, It safely increases the dopamine content (naturally) by up to 4000% or something??? Safely with no adverse reactions?

On top of these claims it's also good when combined with existing PD meds (for all the long term Sinemet users) already chemically replacing nearly 100% of their dopamine and living with the multitude of adverse side effects that it causes.... without added side effects.....

At first blush its something for everyone..... But wait! Mention this add and receive another bottle for just the handling fee..... or a set of Ginsue knives!

Sorry, but see a few of these medical miracles produce nothing but some cash in a developers hand. Don't mean to be negative, just realistic.

Smoke and mirrors Stargate..Smoke and mirrors.

[12stargate in reply to Pelley]

Pelley I think you are right.

Thanks

[Beckey in reply to Pelley]

Can I still get the Ginsue knives?

[dadcor]

So one year past, anybody tried it...??