Email

[TheFlyer]

Hi All

I received this yesterday I guess because I am a T anyway can someone advise why Antibiotics are needed in case of the Coronavirus ?

If you are a CLL or SLL patient, it is advisable to keep a supply of antibiotics in reserve. We suggest you speak to your GP or consultant about this.

This is the last sentence below.

Special medical newsletter

02 March 2020

The spread of the Corona virus (2019-nCoV) is causing considerable concern, and we have received requests from members and others for more information. The situation is changing rapidly and it is likely that the virus will spread, even though there are currently very few cases. Current advice and details of the spread of the virus can be found on our website here

The government website giving further up-to-date information can be found here It is updated daily.

Our technical medical adviser has posted a comprehensive summary of the situation on our HealthUnlocked forum and why the virus seems to attack vulnerable adults here (please note, if you have not already joined Health Unlocked you will need to join to view this page)

Currently, the risk of catching the virus is very small. However, this is an opportune moment to remind everyone about the sensible precautions that should be taken to minimise risk.

This time of year is, in any case, a peak time for annual influenza and the precautions are the same in both cases.

Why it is important

CLL and SLL patients are at increased risk of infection because we have an immune system that is not working properly. This means that infections can be more serious than for people whose immune response is normal.

What you should do

Avoid, as far as possible, crowded places where infections are likely to be passed on.

Wash hands regularly and thoroughly. Pay particular attention to the back of hands, between fingers and the base of the thumb. It's recommended that two minutes are needed to cleanse hands thoroughly, about the time it takes to sing 'Happy Birthday' twice!

A virus can exist for a long time on things like doorknobs and handrails, so consider wearing gloves when you go out.

If you feel unwell, contact your GP immediately. The trigger point is if your temperature reaches 37.5 - 38.0 degrees. This could signal an infection which may, or may not, be influenza but should be checked in any case. Your GP and receptionist should be made aware that you have leukaemia and are immune compromised, so that your symptoms can be investigated immediately.

The symptoms of the corona virus are shown below. Please bear in mind that the early symptoms are in some ways similar to the usual seasonal 'flu symptoms. Both are types important to refer to your GP. Do not visit the surgery as this risks spreading the disease.

Just a few final points:

Make sure your pneumonia and seasonal 'flu vaccinations are up to date. Our website gives full details of what you need here

If you are a CLL or SLL patient, it is advisable to keep a supply of antibiotics in reserve. We suggest you speak to your GP or consultant about this.

[Newdawn Administrator]

Hi Flyer,

Who sent you this? I’ve not received such a letter. What do you mean by ‘being a T’.

Newdawn

[PaulaS Volunteer in reply to Newdawn]

I got this email too, from CLL Support (previously called CLLSA).

Paula

[Newdawn Administrator in reply to PaulaS]

Really Paula? I’ll take a look in case it’s gone into another folder but I’ve not received it.

I’ve found it! I will speak to my Consultant about the need to keep in a course of antibiotics which are compatible with my I&V treatment but presumably this is to prevent bacterial pneumonia developing because the Coronavirus is viral and wouldn’t be helped. I’m already on prophylactic Septrin like many people on treatment and have wondered if it offers any protection as a preventative measure.

Newdawn

[PaulaS Volunteer in reply to Newdawn]

Yes really Newdawn! It came yesterday, I just checked it again. I thought it was helpful.

Flyer, good to hear from you again after quite a while. Re your question about antibiotics - although Corona is a virus I think it can lead to bacterial complications.

Not sure what you meant about "being a T" though.

Paula

[TheFlyer in reply to PaulaS]

Hi Paula I am ok I guess the same as everyone else as if we need the Coronavirus to throw a spanner in the works Jules

[TheFlyer in reply to Newdawn]

Hi it was sent on the 2nd March I got it on the the 9th hence the T being further down the list

[TheFlyer in reply to TheFlyer]

the email ist

[TheFlyer in reply to Newdawn]

Hi New Dawn looks like Sarah Tobin

[TheFlyer in reply to TheFlyer]

from Our mailing address is:

CLL Support

Suite 112, 8 The Bridge

Chippenham, Wiltshire SN15 1FY

United Kingdom

[Newdawn Administrator in reply to TheFlyer]

Yes I’ve got it now thanks Flyer.

Hope you’re doing ok.

Newdawn

[TheFlyer in reply to Newdawn]

Yes I am I think

[GMa27]

It's viral not bacterial. There are no antibiotics for coronavirus.

Just hydrate and take something for fever.

[Newdawn Administrator in reply to GMa27]

I think the rationale is that bacterial infections tend to ‘join the viral party’ with CLL’ers. They certainly did when I developed pneumonia.

It’s up to our doctors to advise in our individual circumstances. I’m already on prophylactic antibiotics along with many others currently on treatment.

Newdawn

[GMa27 in reply to Newdawn]

Very interesting!

[closh in reply to Newdawn]

I was reading an article the other day after the suggestion to update our pneumonia shots came up. It was saying that pneumonia arising from the flu is often bacterial - an opportunistic infection - but that the pneumonia from the new Coronavirus appears to be from the virus itself and so the pneumonia vaccine doesn't help.

It's still good to have our vaccinations up to date but its doubtful this will help with CV19 pneumonia (on initial data though).

Graham

[TheFlyer in reply to Newdawn]

Hi Newdawn

I called the surgery yesterday and checking this out today a perscription has been sent to the Chemist for me no questions asked.

Thing is when would you take them ?

Jules

[JerrysGirl3]

I would be careful about taking antibiotics while on other meds specifically BP meds. I found out when I had to take amoxicillin before dental visit that the reaction to the BP Med Bystolic I take (on and off) can be deadly!!! I check all my drugs on Drug Interaction Checker. I had no clue and neither did my doctor. All of my medical issues conflict with the others so the fact that I'm still functioning fairly well is a medical marvel.

Also. Don't antibiotics devalue WBC counts in fighting disease? Since Corona and flu are viruses, unless absolute infection symptoms appear I would steer clear of antibiotics unless necessary. Although I guess keeping one script can't hurt but you have to know WHEN to take it and that's the difficulty with distinction between viruses and true infections.

I myself have been eating raw unprocessed clover blossom honey for several years. Raw honey has had antiseptic tendencies for hundreds of years if not more. I do believe deeply that it has helped me through many possible illnesses I could have gotten and increased my inner and outer resistance to disease. And it tastes great. But it has to be raw and unprocessed otherwise it's just a jar of honey because all of its healing properties have been processed out.

[AussieNeil Partner Founder Admin in reply to JerrysGirl3]

Antibiotics can suppress bone marrow production as I have personally experienced a few times.

Consuming raw honey when neutropenic is inadvisable. It should be pasteurised.

mskcc.org/experience/patien...

Neil

[JerrysGirl3 in reply to AussieNeil]

I didn't know that. Thank you for letting me know. I was clear in a response below that there was no "professional" info on it that it was just my personal thought. I honestly didn't know of this side effect so I'm glad you brought it up Neil.

Kerry

[Dawn-Marie in reply to JerrysGirl3]

What does this raw unprocessed honey help?? Blood work?

[JerrysGirl3 in reply to Dawn-Marie]

I actually have no clue. It's just a feeling I have since I've been inordinately healthy all these years and raw unprocessed honey has been used as an antiseptic outside the body (because all those years ago there was no processing which takes all the goodness away) for hundreds of years by many nations. I just feel like it's keeping my insides healthy as well. No written data. Just me lol.

[AussieNeil Partner Founder Admin in reply to Dawn-Marie]

Honey has natural antibacterial properties, with the best (but still uncertain) evidence avaiable for Manuka honey, which is generally used for topical application to wounds and skin ulcers.

webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/man...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/289...

As I mentioned earlier, eating honey (unless pateurised) is not recommended if you are neutropenic, which is common during treatment. Here's what Leukaemia Care says on this topic -

Honey naturally contains yeasts and spore forming bacteria. Despite its antibacterial properties, it is recommended that honey from the following sources is avoided during your treatment; raw honey, fresh honey comb, unpasteurised honey or strained honey. Pasteurised or filtered honey removes fine particles of dust, pollen or nectar and is fine to use. Where possible, use small jars or individual portions.

leukaemiacare.org.uk/suppor...

[Dawn-Marie in reply to AussieNeil]

Thank you

[JerrysGirl3 in reply to AussieNeil]

Thanks for the link. I haven't started treatment yet and I don't think I will in the forseeable near future. I did not know that boiled rice should not be reheated!! I like to add the previous nights leftovers to omelots the next day!! I am in compliance with everything else.

[Smakwater]

Flyer,

In the U.S antibiotics are prescribed according to a specific application. It is important that the correct antibiotic is applied or a resistance can be developed. I have been advised numerous times by doctors that antibiotics do not treat viruses as well. The prescriptions are not issued as items to stock up on, but rather to be taken as directed by the physician.

This is an unusual post, however, with the current hightening political influences on health, I am persuaded to stock up on on stocking up.

Be well,

John

[Big_Dee]

Hello TheFlyer

That is strange, I did not receive any such e-mail. In any case I am not taking any antibiotics now and live in USA. Normally in USA we would only get one prescription of antibiotics and would require another visit to doctor to renew prescription if required. I am not sure if they are concerned about antibiotic supply or getting coronavirus from visit to doctor for refill.

[4Glory]

I'm confused. Since when are antibiotics used to treat viruses? I hope this wasn't already answered, I wouldn't mean to repeat!

[AussieNeil Partner Founder Admin in reply to 4Glory]

The advice is to have a script of antibiotics in reserve, not commence on a course. I've done that for years with different antibiotics for skin and respiratory infections. Doing so means that you can begin taking them per your doctor's advice if you become ill and for whatever reason you can't/shouldn't go to see your doctor or can't get antibiotics from the pharmacy. Antibiotics are only effective against bacteria and ideally we should have cultures done to determine the most appropriate one for a suspected secondary bacterial infection. Broad spectrum antibiotics are first prescribed while cultures are developed to find out if a targeted antibiotic is more appropriate. With our compromised immune systems, it's risky to wait for cultures to be developed which could give time for secondary bacterial infections to become firmly established.

Neil