dr eric berg videos
In his video (I will have to try and get another link as the one isn't coming up) it states that as well as taking Vitamin D3 we need to be taking Vit D. I take Vit D3 but cannot find a separate Vit D supplement. I understand that Vit D is Vit D1 and 2 and Vit D2 can only be sourced from certain plants and also understand that taking Vit D can be toxic. I am well and truly confused that I should be taking Vit D as well as Vit D3.
I found this clarification online:
"The term "Vitamin D" now refers to several different forms. The two forms important in humans are: ergocalciferol (vitamin D2) and cholecalciferol (vitamin D3). Vitamin D2 is a synthetic form (man made) and Vitamin D3 is the internal form that we make.
German researcher Adolf Windaus first discovered 3 forms of vitamin D, which he called D1, D2, and D3. It was later learned that the vitamin D1 was a mixture of compounds rather than a pure vitamin D product, so the term D1 is no longer used".
So I think Dr Berg means vitamin D2 when he says vitamin D, but both D2 and D3 appear to do the same thing. This article tells you more: getroman.com/health-guide/w...
I understand that vitamin D3 is the one to use for OP and I take vitamin D3 as part of my calcium supplement, Citracal. Getting direct sunlight on your skin is great for boosting vitamin D levels too.
I fractured my spine 3 years ago and osteoporosis was diagnosed. I was told by the rheumatologist at my local hospital that all I needed to do to get enough Vitamin D was to ensure that I spent at least 10 minutes every day outdoors. It did not matter whether the sun was shining or not as long as I got some light on my skin. I have followed this advice for 3 years and have had no further fractures but since Corvid 19 I have started taking a multi vitamin D tablet as I have read on line that it can help. I feel a bit more energetic since taking them. I am 82 and am also trying turmeric to strengthen my bones. Apart from pain killers, I don’t take any drugs.
Hope this helps. Phee
I hate to contradict a specialist, but our ability to make our own Vitamin D from the sun declines as we age. It also depends on where in the world we live and the time of day and year (if the sun is too low in the sky the relevant rays don't reach us), how dark our skin is, and how efficient each of us as an individual is at making Vitamin D. Most people in the UK are deficient during the winter months, and many are deficient all year round because it takes all summer to get our levels back up to normal before they start falling away again in the autumn. Vitamin D plays a vital role in absorbing calcium, which is essential for bone health, so carry on taking the supplement!
Hope you don't mind my asking why were you referred to a rheumy? as doctors generally do not refer all of us diagnosed with op to a rheumy unless there is a specific underlying condition. Did neither your gp or rheumy prescribe bisphosphonates for you taking your age into consideration and you decided not to?
I was referred to the Rheumatology Department of Southmead Hospital, Bristol, when I fractured my spine 3 years ago. Alendronate was prescribed and, when I could not tolerate it, Zolendronate was suggested In order to strengthen my bones prior to a vertebrloplasty.
I was very suspicious about these drugs as I had a friend who had suffered a fractured thigh almost immediately after coming off Alendronic acid. I therefore researched them on line and went to see a private consultant at theSpire Hospital. He assured me that these drugs helped many women but there were side effects. I decided that I was not prepared to take the risk and since then have just used Butec patches and other pain killers when needed. I have also been fortunate in being able to join a hydro therapy group at Southmead Hospital. This is a joint venture with the NHS and the Bristol Osteoporosis Society whereby I am able to join a group of my fellow sufferers in the pool once a fortnight with a physiotherapist for exercise and laughter. Sadly, because of Covid 19 it is cancelled for the time being.
With regard to Vitamin D, I am no expert, but I distinctly remember being told that daylight was all we needed. Sunshine was not needed. Nonetheless, I shall continue with my supplement. My good wishes to you all.
Thank you for your reply, My gp just prescribed AA, which I had an allergic reaction to and I stopped taking it. From what I hear from a lot of other women it seems it is the norm for doctors to prescribe bisphosphonates without finding out if one has any underlying health issues. We have to do our homework don't we.
I've tried to find a link to Dr Eric Berg and his recommendations for Vit D, but all I've found is references to Vit D3 and Vit K2 (not D2). He's in America, where supplements often contain D2 rather than D3, but it's recommended to supplement with D3. In the UK I'm not aware of any supplements containing D2 rather than D3 so is shouldn't be something we have to worry about here. I'm pretty sure we don't need to take a D2 supplement as well as D3, but it is recommended to take K2 with D3. D3 helps our bodies absorb calcium from diet, and K2 helps direct the calcium to our bones, rather than clogging up our arteries and/or causing kidney stones. It's possible to take K2-MK4 or K2-MK7, but the MK4 form doesn't stay in the bloodstream for long (has a short half-life) so is best taken several times a day, needs to be taken in much higher doses than MK7, is more expensive, and is hard to find in sufficient dose size in the UK. For that reason most people here take K2-MK7. Please also be aware that Dr Berg apparently isn't a medically qualified doctor, and he sells his own supplement range (which always makes me suspicious of what's being promoted)!
this is the video link It is Why people shrink with age and for me it is confusing when he refers to Vit D and gives no specifics.
Arcadia10 thanks for the explanation so I can take it that I don't need to be taking Vit D2 if I am taking VitD3.
Met00 thanks for that I hope the link works for his video "Why people shrink with age.... " Very enlightening that he isn't a medically qualified doctor and has is own supplement range. I do take Vit k2 mk (can't remember if it is mk4 or7) netto - and all the other supplements that I think I should be taking. Just very confusing when you come across information like this.
It can be a bit confusing can’t it. I’m in the U.K. and I always assumed D3 is the one we need to take and I take K2 Mk7 Natto as well for the reasons given by Met00
He's referring to D3, so when he says Vit D he means D3. He's also an advocate of the Keto diet, but I've read elsewhere that you risk missing out on some essential nutrients with that. I can't remember which ones. He doesn't say how much D3 you need, but this will depend on you as an individual. For example some people make a lot more from the sun than others so need less supplement in the summer months. I supplement all year round, fairly high dose, to keep my blood level over 100nmol/litre.
Thanks Met00 he does initially talk about Vit D3. He later, probably nearing the end of the video, talks about the importance of taking Vit D. I thought he meant taking Vit D as a separate additional supplement to Vit D3. Very confusing as he didn't mention how much of either Vit D3 or Vit D you need, if if you had particular need ie op. As I said earlier I cannot find any Vit D supplements all I can find is Vit D3 supplements.
Yes, I spotted that towards the end of the video, but I'm pretty confident he was still referring to D3, just abbreviated it to D. I wouldn't put too much weight on one particular doctor's point of view, rather read around and check what others think. There's a general consensus that we all need Vit D3 and that unless we live near the equator it's unlikely that we'll make sufficient from the sun in the summer months to tide us through the winter, when the sun is too low in the sky for the relevant rays to get through the atmosphere. Most "experts" suggest anything between 400 and 1000iu daily in the winter months, but as I mentioned previously, that isn't going to be sufficient for many of us, and the only way to know your own individual need is via regular blood tests. About a year before I was first diagnosed, I had a Vit D test (for another reason) and my level was 47nmol/litre, which my so-called expert GP said was fine, even though it was below the lab recommended range of 50-150, and even though this was in November, so my level would have dropped throughout the winter months; it's very likely, in fact, that I'd had low Vitamin D blood level for at least half the year, maybe for many years, which would have been a contributory factor to osteoporosis! When I was diagnosed with osteoporosis I paid to see a private orthopaedic consultant and he told me my blood level should be at least 75nmol/litre, preferably 100! He asked my GP to prescribe 2400iu daily in winter, 800 in summer, but after a few years of failing to reach 100nmol/litre I discovered that my levels were going down in summer. I now take 4000iu all year round, yet a friend reached over 100nmol/litre on 2000iu winter, 1000iu summer.
Met00 - very confusing to refer to Vit D as Vit D3 and then Vit D in a later section of the video. I think you are right because I could not find any Vit D supplements - only Vit D3. I checked my Vit D blood test after reading about yours. Were you told that your low VitD could have been a contributing factor to you having op? l Mine was 51mol/L which is borderline. As 50-200 mol/L is sufficient for bone health. When I had the dexa scan the radiologist advised that I ask my gp to do blood tests for Vit D and calcium and the gp just dismissed me. I had to ask another gp if I could pay to have the blood tests and he arranged for me to have all the blood tests done. It is only from using this site, and getting advice from others, like you, and going on-line that I have found out about the supplements and exercise I need to be doing.
I take Barefoot Nutrition D3 complete (I think it was another poster on here that mentioned it). Its Vit D3 4,000iu - 100ug per capsule. No one has advised me how much I should be taking. But you have doubled your Vit D level from taking the prescribed daily amount - amazing. Do you feel better in yourself?
No, I wasn't ever told directly that low Vitamin D could contribute to osteoporosis, but I've read how essential good blood levels are for calcium absorption, without which our bones deteriorate, and as I mentioned before, the orthopaedic consultant said my blood level needed to be much higher. It was trial and error over a number of years before I increased to 4000iu daily and until my blood level stabilised at just over 100nmol/litre I was having a Vit D and calcium blood test 3 times a year. I've reduced that to twice a year now, and fortunately my GP has been supportive. I'm not sure it's made any difference to the way I feel, though I think it's probably improved my immunity as I used to get 2-3 bad colds a year and another 2-3 mild ones, but I haven't had a bad one for a very long time and usually fight colds off within 2-3 days of mild symptoms starting. Good (over 100nmol/litre) Vitamin D blood levels are also claimed to be good for overall health, including helping prevent a range of diseases, such as cancer and Multiple Sclerosis. There's a chart here which demonstrates this (to convert ng/ml to nmol/litre, multiply by 2.5): grassrootshealth.net/docume...
Thanks for the link, unfortunately I still do not know how much Vit D I should be taking. When I had blood tests for my Vit D and calcium levels because both were in the normal range the doctor did not discuss the levels with me. The ROS recommend, like the government, that you should take 10mcg\400 iu daily, the level of my supplement is 4,000 iu\100 ug. So if you follow the government\ROS's advice if you have low Vit D levels it is not accounted for. Very confused - I think I will have to have my Vit D level checked privately.
Yes, sadly the NHS and ROS only give very general guidelines about Vitamin D, at a level that would be safe for everyone, but clearly won't be anything like enough for some of us. I've heard quite a few stories of people being prescribed very high dose Vit D short-term because of a deficiency, then put on a maintenance dose of 800 iu with no further testing, only to return to being deficient in the long term. Because my GP said my level was OK (when it was below normal), I started buying a supplement initially. I started with 400iu, but 5 months later (a further test for a different condition) I was still deficient. I increased to 800iu and was then diagnosed with osteoporosis so got it on prescription, which raised my blood level to 65, so much better, but it was at this point that the consultant asked my GP to prescribe 2400iu to get it over 75. As I said previously, a friend got her level to over 100 (I think it was actually 125) on 1000iu summer 2000iu winter.
Have you asked your GP to test your Vitamin D and calcium? As both are essential for bone health he ought to be willing to do this at least once a year. The calcium blood test will only show if there's an issue with your parathyroid or some other health problem that's preventing calcium absorption, but it's important to keep an eye on that too. If your GP refuses, there is an NHS blood test you can pay for (£29), that's sent in the post from Birmingham I think: vitamindtest.org.uk/. There are probably others too, and I believe one of the supplement companies offers one, with "free" Vit D supplement included in the price of the test!
Met00. It seems as if it was trial and error you getting your Vit D level up to the "sufficient for bone health level". The doctor I saw after I had my dexa scan just dismissed my asking for blood tests for calcium and Vit D. I told her that the radiologist had recommended I have these tests, but she just ignored me. Saw another gp who did send me for blood tests but didn't discuss with me what Vit D supplement I should be taking as my Vit D level was borderline at 51 mol/L. I am now due to have them done again. If the doctor won't I will try the blood test service. Thank you very much for telling me that I should have the tests once a year, as I didn't know and the doctor didn't tell me.
The considered opinion in the UK is that 4000iu daily is the safe upper limit. I wouldn't have been prescribed more than 2000iu longterm if it were considered unsafe. In addition this limit has been calculated without any reference to co-factors such as Vit K2, so it may be that considerably more is safe when taken with co-factors. Scroll down to what happens if I take too much Vitamin D (100mcg = 4000iu): nhs.uk/conditions/vitamins-...
Thanks, I am very confused about the i.u. measurement. The D3 complete I am taking is Vitamin D3 4,000 i.u. and the amount per capsule is 100 ug , % NRV is 2000. I would not think that this supplement's recommended daily dose would exceed the UK's recommended amount. It was a few years ago when the government decided that certain supplements should not exceed the dose that the government recommended. A lot of women and supplement companies were very upset about this because they could not get the optimal benefit from taking a smaller dose. On the ROS website they advise taking 10mcg of Vit D daily, which is way below what I am taking.
I don't know whether your reply was aimed at me as it was a reply to yourself. I am sorry if you have misunderstood the reason for my starting this thread, I am trying to find out about Vit D, as there is a lot of conflicting information on it and for me Vit D comes under Bone Health.
With regard to dosing, and this is for everyone reading the thread, you should, if you can, have your Vitamin D level checked. Most people will be found to have a low to normal level in which case you know the supplements are necessary. There is a small group of people, however, for which this is not the case and I am one of them. If you have sarcoidosis your body may activate too much vitamin D. I happen to know I have sarcoidosis as it was confirmed through biopsy many years ago. However as it is very often a non-symptomatic disease people can have it and not know. So I recommend that everyone get tested for their D level at least once. My first test showed a very high level, not quite toxic but getting there. I stopped taking the supplements, other than what was present in other supplements, a much smaller amount. Also, I've never been a sunlover. By the end of a winter with no extra supplement and no sun my level was down to low normal. I added back one of the capsules and next test had me at optimum level. Haven't been tested since. They usually only do it once a year, under sufferance, here, so I had to pay for the middle test myself. Had I continued taking the extra D my doctor had recommended when I started taking a steroid medication I might well have run into problems after a few more months.
Thank you Heron for a very helpful reply. It explains why you need to have your Vit D blood test done, doesn't it?. I have today, taken my Vit D blood test, that I have paid for privately. My first and only Vit D blood test was borderline and for my own peace of mind I want to know what my level is now. I didn't know what sarcoidosis was and I think that unfortunately a lot of women also don't know either.
I wouldn't either, except when I was in my 30s I had a swollen lymph node in my neck. Naturally that was rather promptly biopsied! The sarcoidosis diagnosis was a great relief and I never had any other symptoms. A few years ago when I had an x-ray checking for back problems "incidental note" was made of "old granulomatous disease" and I assume this is evidence that sarcoidosis had been more active then I realized. What I understand happens is these granulomas are actually a kind of biofilm which activates Vitamin D. Normally our bodies only activate what we need - which you'd expect, or we'd all be poisoned by the sun. 
I was going to add that sarcoidosis is very rare but after looking it up found out that apparently it has now been found to be widespread throughout the world, found in both males and females of all races and occurs mainly between ages 20-40.
Heron, I normally get healthunlocked new replies in my inbox but I didn't with your reply so sorry it took me so long to reply. have noticed from looking at op sites that a lot of women have sarcoidosis. Are you aware of having it in that you have to take certain medications or do you have to restrict or eliminate other supplements as well? It seemed that some women didn't know they had it until they were diagnosed with op and had a Vit D test I guess.
Talking of Vit D I received the results of my Vit D test which is now 87.5 nmol/L, it was 51 nmol/L when I had it done last year - so it is a great relief that I haven't been taking too much Vit D. The supplement I have been taking is 4000iu -sule cap 100 mcg when the recommended dosage in the UK is 400 iu and 10mcg
I haven't taken any medications, no idea there were any. As I don't have any symptoms and never have except for that enlarged lymph gland which led to the diagnosis I think we'll just leave well enough alone! I was diagnosed more than half my lifetime ago, and probably had it long before that. I do know it can affect many organs, including the brain, but most people will remain asymptomatic throughout their lives.
Hi. Jumping in late to this thread here. But I find it interesting. I am in North America (Canada). And the phrase "Vitamin D", over here at least, universally refers to D3. And in Dr. Eric Berg's video (which is very good - thank you for sharing that link)... he is quite clearly talking about D3 in beginning, and then just abbreviates it to "D" by end. But I can see where the confusion comes in. I don't know if I have ever seen D2 sold over here in NA. And I look at a lot of shelves in health food stores. I almost think one needs a prescription for D2.
As for the issue of the very low dose of any government's recommended daily allowance... Don't forget, that recommendation is based solely on the minimum amount of D you need to prevent rickets. It has nothing to do with the optimal level of D for good bone health, heart health, anti-cancer health, etc.
While it is always good advice to get your Vitamin D level checked before supplementing... I have always heard that even without a test, no one will hurt themselves with 2,000 IU daily - especially if you are also taking K2, since the primary risk with excessive vitamin D supplementation, as others here have mentioned, is excess calcium build-up in blood (hypercalcemia). And that calcium is actually being pulled from your bones to maintain a certain blood level in presence of additional D. But the addition of K2 prevents that.
I take 2000 IU of D3 daily (as an oil in an eye-dropper, so it is easy to change dose should I want to). And I take 100 mcg of K2-MK7 (in capsule) at same time. Some people say you should separate, but I am not convinced that is necessary with these low doses. I started taking these for bone health (osteoporosis). But also now for heart health and anti-cancer health.
1000 IU of D3 = 25 mcg D3.
No you are not jumping in late as I have a very informative interview on Vit D and Calcium - on the premise that one size does not fit all - concerning how much of each you should take.
- healthcentral.com/article/i...
It is very confusing when Vit D3 is referred to as such and then referred to as VitD. I haven't seen any Vit D supplements in the UK only Vit D3. I was taking 4000 iu - 100 mcg cap and we are advised to take 400 iu 10 mcg in the UK- I didn't do my homework first on how much I should have been taking as I was finding it all a bit of a minefield. But in the UK Vit D3 4000iu - 100 mcg cap is the optimum amount but my Vit D blood is in the sufficient bone bone health level, and I also take Vit k2 M7 (netto).
Sounds like you are taking the right combo of D3 and K2! I think it makes a difference to our bone health to do this.
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