Admins and Lchf: I find it a bit... - Weight Loss Support

Weight Loss Support

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Admins and Lchf

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July

I find it a bit concerning personally that Admins are suggesting LCHF in their welcome posts to new members - perhaps as admistrators of the forum you should let people make their own mind up, so as to avoid forcing one diet on any new person who arrives?

That's not to say that any member who has found success on LCHF or any other diet plan can't recommend it, just that Admins should be more unbiased in my opinion.

119 Replies
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SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator

Hi 1stoneandcounting.

People follow a range of weight loss plans around here and admins typically take a lead from what the new joiner says they want or is doing.

It has to be said though that when joiners ask what plans people have followed, I don't think administrators should be barred from sharing what worked for them.

I lost 8 stones following LCHF so I'm very happy to recommend it personally, though I'd only do that if someone was stuck and looking for suggestions, or didn't have a strong sense of what to do and wanted somewhere to start.

We reference all sorts of plans and approaches as you can see here: healthunlocked.com/weight-l...

I trust such a strategy isn't concerning?

😄

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to SofaJockey

Sure if people ask for recommendations then Admins should go ahead - my main point is that when Admins welcome new members and send them the links to the diary etc, they also often suggest LCHF immediately. Some do this more often than others but I won't name names.

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Many new joiners don't share what plan they are following (or intend to) and ask for 'help'.

It will always be a judgment call of what to suggest, as this forum does not have a 'default' weight-loss method.

I'd welcome any member to chip in with their suggestions. Admins are here to keep things tidy and friendly but we're personally only making a small proportion of posts. 😄

slipstick
slipstick1 stone

That's what I was just thinking and particularly when you get a token mention that other methods exist and then follow it up with a comment like "other's methods will not be sustainable".

I fairly often feel that I don't really belong here as I insist on using the "wrong method". OTOH I'm suitably thick-skinned so here I stay!

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to slipstick

What method are you using slipstick?

If it works it works in my book. The most common plans here seem to be Calorie Counting, LCHF, Slimming World too (plus many others) and if people are succeeding with them that's fantastic and they should do so unmolested.

😄

slipstick
slipstick1 stone in reply to SofaJockey

As I said in your Weight Loss Methods thread I'm basically eating the SW way, which worked well for me in the past. This time round it's modified with reduced carbs and some increased fats. And as I don't need to go to meetings to get weighed it's a no cost method. It works for me but I have no idea who else it may or may not work for.

lucigret
lucigretAdministrator in reply to slipstick

slipstick, it is great that the SW way is working for you, although I see that even you have reduced carbs and increased some fats. What would be good though is when you see a Newbie post asking for 'recommendations for a safe weight loss plan' that you actually reply and tell them what you are doing, especially if you think it will balance out a reply they have already received.

The newbie post that you refer to in your reply to 1stoneandcounting is the one I replied to yesterday. You will see that I have given links to LCHF and to the diet methods posts. I have also suggested that they do some research and see what they think will suit them. The 'other's methods will not be sustainable' should have read 'other methods' and I stand by that. Before sofa jockey's post was updated it mentioned slim fast and shakes - they, in my opinion, are not a sustainable way to loose and maintain weight.

I don't feel that this newbie welcome was pressurising the newbie to follow LCHF, it gave plenty of advice for alternatives and it was left to the newbie to make their own decision.

As an Admin here, who gives their time freely, I support anybody on any weight loss journey, that is my role, but if I can see that a person is a yo-yo dieter, feeling miserable and overwhelmed and wondering 'what is wrong with me', then of course I will refer to what has worked for me. After all I have been that yo-yo dieter, feeling miserable and overwhelmed and wondering what was wrong with me!

As I am free to give my advice and experience, so are you, 1stoneandcounting and anybody else, so why not join in here and share your journey's with the Newbies and the not so new Newbies that are struggling - they may find it really helpful.

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to lucigret

I was actually thinking of someone else but good to know more than 1 admin are doing this

lucigret
lucigretAdministrator in reply to 1stoneandcounting

My question to you is, why don’t you come and share you’re story with others. You have obviously found a way that works?

PedallingMinstrel
PedallingMinstrel3 stone in reply to lucigret

Thank you for that. People come to this site for support and many may be quite vulnerable for many reasons. Personally I never felt pressurised in any direction when I joined the forum. However as a consequence I have now lost over 2 and half stone. I don’t think Slimfast WW or even SW or any other organisation or company that does it for profit would’ve had the same impact on me. Everyone is always directed to the 12 week plan as a first course of action

mudgiebananas
mudgiebananas3lbs in reply to slipstick

Hi Slipstick,hope you dont mind me asking,I was interested in your reply about what eating plan you are following,SW and modifications,I am struggling with LCHF,I firmly believe its the way to go but cant get my eating into the right pathway,I stop and start,and many moons ago I was succesful with SW,can you give me some ideas on how you combine/modify SW with LCHF,would appreciate your thought,thank you

slipstick
slipstick1 stone in reply to mudgiebananas

It's a bit complicated to explain because I've edged gradually into this way of eating over quite a while. I'm sort of sneaking up to moderate LCHF without giving up my favourite foods. E.g. I love fish, chips and mushy peas but I've found it quite satisfactory to skip the chips while still having the battered fish and peas. That's by no means low carb but it's lower than with the chips!

I mostly eat the SW "free foods" but don't count pasta, rice and potatoes as "free" so I cut down a lot on them, often replacing them in meals with vegetables like green beans or broccoli. I also eat almost no bread or breakfast cereals except porridge. But then I don't worry about "low fat" versions of everything so I cheerfully eat full fat yogurt, butter, relatively fatty meats and so on mostly because they really do taste better!

I have no idea why it works but for me it seems to even if only slowly.

mudgiebananas
mudgiebananas3lbs in reply to slipstick

Thank you very much for that,its along the lines that I thought it might be,almost a slow countdown to LCHF with the freedom of SW,leaving out/cutting down the pasta,bread rice etc is a good thing to do and also the obvious doughnuts,cakes ,goodies,I also like the butter, cream,fatty meats and was in a pickle over low fat or full fat,but realise I've got to decide,thanks again for your help,this soothes my mind to persevere👍👍👍

slipstick
slipstick1 stone in reply to mudgiebananas

One good thing about reducing carbs is that you can increase the fats a bit to compensate for missing calories so long as you don't overdo it. And I'm lucky because I don't have a sweet tooth so cakes, doughnuts and similar are not a problem for me. OTOH pork pies and chips are but for now they'll just have to be an occasional treat.

Good luck with whatever your version ends up as ;)

mudgiebananas
mudgiebananas3lbs in reply to slipstick

Thanks again for your help, I'm glad that 1stoneandcounting started this 'discussion' its given me the opportunity to chat with you and pick your brains, good luck to you too !😁

Sewnknit
Sewnknit4 stone

You've obviously done well to reach 1 1/2 stones, would you like to share how you did it?

A lot of people (me included) find themselves here because nothing else has worked.

I looked at the NHS 12 week plan and decided all by myself that it wouldn't work for me. I gave LCHF a go and have been doing well.

No one is forced.

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to Sewnknit

Perhaps forced was the wrong word choice - but when it's presented as the ONLY option that works it certainly seems as if its being imposed on all members. I know many other members who don't follow LCHF have similarly felt discouraged by this mantra of "the food is lush and you're never hungry"

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Those are my words, and that's how I feel, I've never said it's the only way !

SewMore
SewMore17kg in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Hello 1stoneandcounting, I’m so sorry that you are feeling discouraged rather than supported.

I am always curious to find out what is working well and learn about new recipes and tips and tricks. For LCHF there is a dedicated forum. Here on the WeightLoss forum we each follow all kinds of plans and share our experiences.

Many different methods do work, and it really depends on you and what appeals to you and fits with your lifestyle, from calorie counting to meal replacements, to following a book, or a classic program with “live” weekly meeting..

What I love about the forum is that the weekly meeting is virtual and takes place at a time and day that suits me 😀

Snubby
Snubby2020 October

I think maybe all diets work if adhered to ,but personally I need to count calories as I eat too much other wise ,,even veg 😆

Sarah-Phim
Sarah-Phim3st 7lbs

Hi, each to their own. If it helps you stay healthy do what works for you is my motto. I think the admin just share their own journeys which seem mostly to be LCHF. But many others share what they are following. I for one don’t follow a specific regime and when I welcome anyone I tell people that and also suggest they find what works for them. 😀

Iwilldoit22
Iwilldoit225st 7lbs in reply to Sarah-Phim

What’s all this about 🍂🍂🍂

Sarah-Phim
Sarah-Phim3st 7lbs in reply to Iwilldoit22

Bit of a conversation regarding LCHF being suggested. I think we all decide what to put in our mouth ourselves and make our own choices ultimately.

Iwilldoit22
Iwilldoit225st 7lbs in reply to Sarah-Phim

I think each person will make there own choices 🍂🍂🍂🍂

Sarah-Phim
Sarah-Phim3st 7lbs in reply to Iwilldoit22

😉

PedallingMinstrel
PedallingMinstrel3 stone in reply to Sarah-Phim

I think it’s only when you try different ways of eating to reduce your weight you discover what works for you.

I found calorie counting too restrictive. I was concerned at slimming world plan was promoting too many carbs. I’ve tried LCHF which I try to follow but when I eat too many fats though I put weight on.

I think different people eat in different ways and it works better for them .

I think it is important that we all realise there are a range of options to suit our different bodies’ life styles and our personalities, personal circumstances social and emotional.

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs

I think we're all here (voluntarily) to help each other in any way we can and if you've found something that could help others you're going to want to spread the word, we're only human :-) x

slipstick
slipstick1 stone in reply to Lytham

Sure and there's nothing wrong with enthusiasm. But I think the official welcome should be just that. Then it's always possibly to add a second post about your preferred method. I must admit I'd prefer it to be toned down a bit, more like "I've been using (method of choice) and it's working great for me" rather than the "Try (method of choice) it's brilliant and is just what you need" that we sometimes see. But that may just be my natural British reticence ;)

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to slipstick

Well I'm not Admin and I apologise if I've ever upset anyone with my enthusiasm, but I understand only too well the pain of being overweight and if I can suggest something that might help, I will. People can just ignore me if they choose :-) x

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to Lytham

May I make the observation that as a 'Host' (which is not an admin role) your energy and hard work to help people in many, many posts. is phenomenal.

I take my proverbial hat off to you. 😄👍

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to SofaJockey

Ha ha ! It's not entirely selfless, it keeps me focused! :-) x

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to Lytham

One of the best way to keep doing a thing is to support other people doing that thing. It's a wise choice. 😎

Shield-Maiden
Shield-MaidenWork in Progress in reply to SofaJockey

Here here!!!

And if some members don't like it, they can always 'scroll on by' or choose a different forum!

I LOVE the awesome help, advice, enthusiasm......on this forum....so, a big thank you Admins...and, Lytham xx

Personally, I have taken the advice, and, adapted it for myself, and, have now thankfully found something that works for me 🤗🌻

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Shield-Maiden

So pleased you've found what works for you, that's AWESOME! :-) x

Shield-Maiden
Shield-MaidenWork in Progress in reply to Lytham

Thank you Lytham x

It's all down to this site, for the little nudge in the right direction, and the support of the amazing members (and Hosts!) just like you :)

I can't believe that this site is FREE!! lol (I suppose that I should whisper that one, really lol)

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Shield-Maiden

Ha ha !

Awe thanks hun, I'd rather be trying to help people than just criticising others that are! :-) x

Shield-Maiden
Shield-MaidenWork in Progress in reply to Lytham

I totally agree! x :)

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Shield-Maiden

Thanks hun :-) x

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to Lytham

I’d never ignore you, Lytham 😂

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Trimmerteacher

Ha ha ! Thanks Chick !

Wouldn't it be great to see more effort put into welcoming Newbies, helping people with their meal plans on The Daily Diary or even cheering and supporting others on the weigh in rather than criticising volunteers who are doing their best to help us all on our way? :-) x

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to Lytham

Absolutely! 😊

BrynGlas
BrynGlas2020 January in reply to Trimmerteacher

Lytham would never let you ignore her Trimmerteacher!!!

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to BrynGlas

Ha ha ! You know me so well, you can run but you can't hide! :-) x lol

TheAwfulToad
TheAwfulToadMaintainer in reply to Trimmerteacher

Trying to ignore Lytham is like trying to ignore a jet aircraft landing on your lawn :)

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to TheAwfulToad

🤣

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to TheAwfulToad

LOL ! You better believe it ! :-) x

Ermintrude77
Ermintrude772st 7lbs in reply to Lytham

Lytham you’re fab! X

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Ermintrude77

Ha ha ! Awe bless you, thanks hun! :-) x

That's interesting 1stoneandcounting as I hadn't interpreted suggestions in that way, I hope it hasn't put you off using the site for support. Personally I do my own thing without following a specific plan. I've recieved tips at times that wouldn't be compatible with my lifestyle but other users/admins are just trying to help so I'm grateful anyway.

Hollysgran
Hollysgran2020 September

Hi 1stoneandcounting.

I joined via the 12 week NHS plan of 1400 calories per day . After 3 weeks I felt my weight loss was really slowing down and decided after it had been suggested, to try LCHF, something I hadn’t even heard of until then. I began the 4 week gentle introduction to LCHF and lost nearly 5 pounds in my first week (after 3 weeks of calorie counting and losing weight).

My attitude to food in the last few weeks has changed dramatically. I am no longer obsessed with food and only eat when I am hungry. I am the lightest I have been for 5 years and even though my winter holiday has just been cancelled, I intend to continue with this method.

It may not be for everyone but there must be many people like me who would just have continued on their merry yo yo dieting way if it had not been suggested.

I am 18lbs lighter so it worked for me.

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Hollysgran

I would have continued with my many years of yo-yo dieting had it not been mentioned to me too. I'll be forever grateful, wish I'd known about it years ago :-) x

Shield-Maiden
Shield-MaidenWork in Progress in reply to Lytham

Me too x

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to Shield-Maiden

Brilliant! :-) x

PedallingMinstrel
PedallingMinstrel3 stone in reply to Lytham

Me too !! 😃

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to PedallingMinstrel

Pleased you're sorted now ! :-) x

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to Hollysgran

I agree, Hollysgran . I have actually been successfully calorie counting and maintaining on here for a few years, but I tried the 4 week trial of LCHF (just near the end of week 4 now) and have managed to lose 3lb (of my lockdown gains) in 3 weeks (unheard of for me, I’m a very slow loser), but the best things are I have honestly not felt hungry once, and I hardly dare say this, but it may have actually helped reduce my migraines too. I usually have one a week. Since starting LCHF, I have not had a single one. May be coincidence, but for me it is close to life changing!

TheAwfulToad
TheAwfulToadMaintainer

When people come here they're often very confused about how to even start. In fact the typical first post actually says "how do I even start?".

Not everything needs to be "unbiased". In most cases there are right answers and wrong answers. If you go to an expert and ask them how to solve a problem, then you expect them to give you the best possible option given the problem constraints. The admins are simply flagging up the method that (statistically speaking) is most likely to work, for most people. If people want to try something different then of course they can do so, but I don't see any problem with the admins giving a straight answer to a straight question.

As you observed above, if the question isn't asked then the admins often refrain from supplying an (unwanted) answer, so I think that addresses at least half of your objection.

What would you prefer that they do? Surely "do whatever you like, it's all good" is not very helpful? Put yourself in the shoes of the confused, endlessly yo-yoing dieter. They're desperately unhappy. They've already tried a whole bunch of other stuff and found that it doesn't work. They want results and reassurance that everything's going to work out this time. What they do not want is "choice", despite the ongoing NHS fad for that sort of thing.

I suspect your post boils down to some misunderstanding about what LCHF actually involves (one of the problems here is that it even has a name like "Low Carb High Fat", which doesn't do it any favours). We eat fresh veg, meat, eggs and dairy. We avoid fake food and highly-processed food. There is a lot of overlap between LCHF and the locavore/slow-food movements. In other words, advising people to eat LCHF is basically just advice to eat some proper food instead of the trash that Big Ag foists upon us.

If you think this is a Bad Thing, you really need to qualify why it's a bad thing.

PedallingMinstrel
PedallingMinstrel3 stone in reply to TheAwfulToad

The forum also directs you to other information which is useful. My attitude was changed when I saw something about carbs being transferred quickly by the body in to fat sources and their consequent effect on making us feel hungry again and craving more carbs.

This does not happen with fat and protein. That doesn’t happen with me now as I am not eating all the carbs I used to. Knowledge and understandingly of what our bodies and minds do is really helpful.

Very much enjoying the fact that rather than my concerns being listened to, I'm being told that I'm wrong.

I agree with you, I feel like people who don't want to follow LCHF and dietdoctor get rather discouraged when they start using this platform.

Cookie101
Cookie101Restart Jan 2020 in reply to 1stoneandcounting

I do agree with you. The one thing I find strange is that as an NHS forum, the diet that I'd expect to be promoted is the NHS 12 week plan. That is the one provided by the NHS and has all the NHS support. I realise that a lot of people do well on LCHF. But where did it come from to be promoted over what is recommended by the NHS? LCHF is not something I've tried. (In fact at the moment I'm not trying anything) But many people come here without a specific understanding of what they need to do. Everyone has different circumstances. The good thing about the forum is the variety of people to speak to about different ways of making weight loss work for them. By providing one overriding option, it makes people think that is the only way to go and when it doesn't work for whatever reason, they feel like they are the failure. It's the wrong way to welcome people into the group. It's better to let people to ask for advice and let people share they're experiences.

elliebath
elliebathMaintainer in reply to Cookie101

NHS advice is not always up to date, based on worldwide research and evidence. For years, those of us with high cholesterol, or vascular heart disease, were told "eat low fat , low cholesterol foods, no eggs " etc . It turns out that as the body doesn't actually absorb the cholesterol in eggs, they are now recommended and high carb cereal and toast is not. That's just one example. Evidence evolves and advice can (eventually) change. The NHS takes quite a long time to update dietary advice, it's not gospel.

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to elliebath

So true, elliebath !

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to Cookie101

It's worth bearing in mind that the NHS does not advocate only one weight loss method.

The firm I started losing weight with (Second Nature) is very much LCHF and it's also supported by the NHS on the same page as the

nhs.uk/better-health/lose-w...

As for this forum, it is true that it used to be 'badged' NHS, but that caused confusion because people inferred that it was primarily a forum for people using the NHS course (which it was right at the start).

Over the 7 years of the forum things have very much broadened out.

You can read the 'HealthUnlocked' rationale for 'de-badging' the NHS from the forum here:

healthunlocked.com/weight-l...

😄

Lonmayloon
Lonmayloon2020 September in reply to 1stoneandcounting

On the contrary your concerns have been addressed with considerate and polite replies. You threw a five word “hand grenade” into the group about 2 months ago and received much the same response. Why is it so important that everyone must agree with you?

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to Lonmayloon

If saying that "carbs aren't the enemy" is as destructive to this forum as a hand grenade, perhaps that says more about the mentality of this forum rather than me.

Lonmayloon
Lonmayloon2020 September in reply to 1stoneandcounting

That was a metaphor. I do apologise if you have taken offence but please tell us why it’s important that everyone agrees with you.

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to Lonmayloon

That's the most passive aggressive message I've ever received, yikes

Lonmayloon
Lonmayloon2020 September in reply to 1stoneandcounting

You’re right and I’m wrong, I’ve seen the error of my ways but behind all my passive aggression I’d still like to know why it’s important that everyone agrees with you. I’m also interested in the method you successfully used to lose over a stone. So just to recap that’s two questions to answer and of course you have the last word.

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to Lonmayloon

Well said, Lonmayloon

BettyBadger
BettyBadger2020 July in reply to 1stoneandcounting

I hear what you’re saying. And I think that the level of response to your post shows that many people have listened to you.

I don’t agree with your post, personally, but that doesn’t mean you’re wrong.

We just have different ways of seeing things.

Shield-Maiden
Shield-MaidenWork in Progress in reply to BettyBadger

Nicely said 😊

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to 1stoneandcounting

I'm a little puzzled, 1stoneandcounting.

I've shared the administrators' approach which is to support people in following a range of weight-loss plans, but also where they specifically ask for help, to point them towards credible weight loss solutions.

One of the first questions I'll often ask someone who has kept 'yo-yoing' over many years is what method they have been following, as I'm not convinced it's very responsible to just suggest they 'try again and try harder'.

But as you appear to be unhappy with the response your question has elicited, and in an attempt to listen to you, can you explain please what alternative strategy you are suggesting when people (some of whom have struggled for many, many years) are asking for help?

😄

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to SofaJockey

As I stated in my original post, I'm not against people suggesting LCHF when ASKED, but when Admins suggest it immediately to all members in the welcome posts they send to all new members with the links for the diary etc (no not all of them do this, yes some of them do) I don't think that aligns with the message of "everyone is supported to do what works for them". As other members have said this tends to discourage people who don't think LCHF will work for them.

Unfortunately, this is an LCHF dominated forum and your concerns are the same as many others.

I've been here about a year and this concern regularly crops up and comes back around on this forum.

It's very unlikely that things will change much.

At best you'll probably find other diets will be tolerated.

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to MintTeaMascara

I have calorie counted for four years on this forum, and succeeded in getting to my goal weight. I felt supported every inch of the way. Having said that, I tried LCHF to lose some stubborn lockdown gains, and the weight fell off effortlessly. So I can understand why it is promoted by those for whom it has worked.

I completely understand why people would choose LCHF but definitely believe it's not for everyone.

I did try a few LCHF meals and honestly really didn't enjoy them.

Personally I'd much prefer to go hungry and eat cornflakes if I wanted to drop weight quickly but that's also a method that's not right for everyone.

I've felt supported too with the weight loss aspect but feel my preferred dieting choices are at best only tolerated by some and there's always the pull to go LCHF no matter what the circumstances.

Obviously that doesn't go for everyone.

I'm not sure why some people are just not cool with the fact that I don't want to follow LCHF and also many others 🤷🏼‍♀️

It's just not in my dictionary.

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to MintTeaMascara

Well I’m cool with it. Whatever is sustainable in the long term for each of us is what counts 😊

elliebath
elliebathMaintainer in reply to Trimmerteacher

Says it all TT. A combination of both methods work for you too 😄

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Your concerns are being listened to, 1stoneandcounting , and people are addressing them in their responses. I don’t think anyone has actually said you are wrong, have they?

TheProf
TheProf2020 July

I also find the blatant "pushing" of LCHF very discouraging. I also needed more than the NHS 12 week plan. I have been calorie counting for a year and lost 27kg... and there's more to go...i reckon another year. I now eat less. I had been eating well for many years but as I tried LCHF in the 70's I found it didn't suit. I have put up my personal take on calorie counting but it was arrogantly rubbished by a member. If you are interested in helping then help don't preach.

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer

Weight watchers have been out there for years and many more ‘commercial diets’. And do you know something they don’t work and never will because they don’t want them to work. Too much money being made.

Count calories, how on earth do you do that. I am not a mathematician and don’t want to spend my days counting calories. Or worst still eating the same thing every day purely so I don’t have to be a mathematician.

Finally what is wrong with eating normal food ie, vegetables, meat, fish, cheese. Oh let me see, I am not giving my money to the processed food industries or supporting some coffee chain or stuffing myself with fast food.

If you want to make a comment then comment on the latter. And leave our hard working and extremely generous admin and hosts alone.

1stoneandcounting
1stoneandcounting2020 July in reply to Lesley1234567

Instead you're just giving money to the agricultural farming/meat industry. Great stuff

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Just by living we effect the environment. Personally I purchase my meat from farmers who actually have cows and sheep in fields and not pumped full of antibiotics. We don’t eat large amounts of meat or fish. Also we do have meat and fish free days. I need a variety of foods, and I feel so much better by not eating processed foods. It may not be convenient for everyone to cook their own food from scratch, we all have different lifestyles and families to consider. Eating LCHF has changed my attitude to foods completely.

I have butter, full fat yoghurts, Cheese, cream in my coffee, fresh foods. I never feel hungry, my weight has stayed stable. I now don’t crave sugary foods or savoury snack foods. Food is not an issue anymore for me. After years of joining slimming clubs and different diets I have found LCHF has worked for me. This may be because of my age and lifestyle, we are all different. I think the administrators do a great job supporting members and will give great input on all variations of all diets.

Trimmerteacher
TrimmerteacherCasserole Off Winner in reply to Lesley1234567

Well said!

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to Trimmerteacher

Thank you. It is all a matter of preference but I do think the administrators do a fantastic job. And I have learnt so much from this forum.

BrynGlas
BrynGlas2020 January in reply to Lesley1234567

Agreed

TheProf
TheProf2020 July in reply to Lesley1234567

Counting calories is easy - you do it once and portion your food appropriately. It's not rocket science. We have a list of food that we cook which has about 60 recipes on it. All of which are low calorie. That's it stick to my rules - no snacking, no extra portions, see my previous post. It's easy - and you can eat what you like - No need to cut out anything just find the right portion size to fit and then repeat until the weight has gone. It works for me.

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to TheProf

It’s great how you have worked it out for you. But to say you can eat what you want it sounds very much like weight watchers. And everything has a calorie number. Eat everything low fat because it’s half the calories, but not as enjoyable as full fat. I would rather have a piece of cheese than a slice of bread with low fat spread. I just hate counting calories it drives me potty.

TheProf
TheProf2020 July in reply to Lesley1234567

I don't do low anything but calories. Tasty food in moderation. I just eat less.

slipstick
slipstick1 stone in reply to Lesley1234567

"Finally what is wrong with eating normal food ie, vegetables, meat, fish, cheese."

Yes indeed what is wrong with eating normal food i.e. potatoes, other root vegetables, peas, beans, most fruits, even rice, bread and pasta? You can't get much closer to real food than potatoes and carrots straight from the ground, peas from the pod or apples from the tree.

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to slipstick

I agree with potato and carrot and other vegetables root or otherwise. But a big no to processed rice, pasta and bread.

Sherlock20
Sherlock20Maintainer in reply to Lesley1234567

If you think nobody makes money from LCHF, I beg to differ. Since starting on here and doing some independent research of my own on the web, my face book page has deluged me with Keto and LCHF weight-loss plans. All of which request that you pay money. Atkins made a fortune out of it, and so, I suspect, has the oft-referred to 'diet doctor' that people get linked to on here. The latest one I keep seeing is 'noom'. Every single diet that exists has someone making a mint out of it. You could equally argue that 'eat less, move more' is fairly simple advice that nobody can make money out of, yet people have because it isn't that easy to do. LCHF is no different. If there's a bandwagon, someone somewhere will make money out of it.

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to Sherlock20

I agree with you totally. And this is why this forum is so good. You have the support from other members and one of the ambassadors has spent their own time preparing material to use by people who wish to follow keto. Furthermore, the administrators and volunteers have also taken time to support as many people who required it. Can I just add this forum is not keto exclusive, but it appears to be the limelight presently.

Sherlock20
Sherlock20Maintainer in reply to Lesley1234567

I agree, this forum is great. It is sad, though, to see that when diets start to get recognition, the money men, away from this forum, move in. I wait to see 'Keto' cheesecake and 'Keto' bread appear in the supermarkets, then the ethos of making your food starts to get lost ... again. the fast food industry is already moving in on veganism. And when that happens, the value of it - healthy, honest, real food, what makes it healthier in the first place - is reduced in favour of quick, easy, throwaway substitutes and we are back where we started. All we really need to do is get back to cooking from scratch and not snacking all day, but as you say, no money to be made in that.

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to Sherlock20

So right. I know someone who is vegan and in conversation she reeled off a list of prepared foods she bought. What surprised me most is she actually went vegan because of the food she was eating was causing her stomach problems. I just thought well nothing changed still buying processed food and still have problems. I think this is where the ‘diet merchants’ come along and make their money. They don’t want you to loose weight, why would they.

With so many people agreeing with me, we cant have all wildly misinterpreted the nature of this forum

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Some agree with you, others disagree.

I think it's good that we can have a healthy discussion about it. 😄

One 'project' I'm working on is an overview of all the different weight loss methods that are used by members here:

healthunlocked.com/weight-l...

I'd like to see a better understanding of the methods used, particularly by new members, as well as the pros and cons (shared by people who follow them) of each.

😄

Tank_EG
Tank_EG5st 7lbs in reply to SofaJockey

Hi SofaJockey,

I have been thinking exactly the same, I'll go over to your post and have a look 😀

BrynGlas
BrynGlas2020 January in reply to 1stoneandcounting

Is this a competition? I'm the king of the castle?

Lesley1234567
Lesley1234567Maintainer in reply to BrynGlas

😂😂😂😂 🏆

Lytham
LythamSuper Host 3st 7lbs in reply to BrynGlas

LOL ! :-) x

elliebath
elliebathMaintainer

I've been using this forum for 6 years, successfully, and always felt very supported by Admin. I certainly didn't feel that they 'pushed' any particular method, other than to draw attention to the 12 week plan ( which for many people who have little understanding of food types, is a good place to start).

However as time goes on things change: knowledge changes, evidence changes, and for many reasons it is now known that a lower carb higher fat way of eating has many proven health benefits, not just weight loss.

Six years ago I lost my excess weight purely by calorie counting. So yes, that method "worked" for weightloss. But that alone did not necessarily improve my health. For five years since then I've maintained my weight and improved my overall health ( confirmed by health checks and blood tests ) by a mixture of LCHF, calorie awareness, and exercise. It's not complicated, just a way of life, which is the prime message I've seen on this forum...."lose as you intend to maintain", ie choose a method that you personally are able to follow longterm.

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to elliebath

Sound awesome, I too used a mixture of LCHF, calorie awareness, and exercise to shift my 8 stones.

But I'd be equally happy to read stories from calorie counters or other methods to share how their successful methods worked.

elliebath
elliebathMaintainer in reply to SofaJockey

It all comes back to how we define "what works". Surely we should all be striving for weight loss, weight maintenance and improved health? The "what works" for weight loss won't necessarily achieve the second two .

We don't have the stats to measure it on here, but internationally it is said that the number of weight losers who then regain their weight within 2 years is eye watering... around 85%.

None of this is easy, as the maintainer pals on here will no doubt agree, but if my six year experience means anything, I can only say that the lower carb way of eating is definitely the easier method I've found for longterm weight control and improved health.

TheAwfulToad
TheAwfulToadMaintainer in reply to elliebath

Yeah, this. I started off on low-carb many years ago with the goal of losing weight. I found out quite quickly that it works because it's healthy, and I stuck with it for that reason.

I now view low-fat, calorie-controlled diets as disastrously unhealthy, because eating like that made me fat in the first place.

Tank_EG
Tank_EG5st 7lbs

Hi 1stoneandcounting,

this is a hard one, newbies who have never tried dieting or have failed many times would benefit from a place to start. I haven't found this to be a problem but then I was clear on my diet knowing what works for me: my problem is keeping the weight off once I've lost it.

Where I worry is when an admin challenges me in an open post on what is working for me, suggests I should eat more fat to make me feel full and not rely on protein to do so without giving any reason as to why. Research would suggest that maybe there is value in both for helping hunger control along with fibre from fruit and veg 😀

The great thing about this forum is to discuss what works to give people new approaches when the weight loss stops. Admins have an important role in keeping us safe and maybe sometimes get a bit enthusiastic of their preferred method; they are human after all.

PandQs
PandQsMaintainer

When I joined here it was after decades of failed attempts to lose weight and keep it off using every low fat calorie counting, SW, WW, Cambridge, Cabbage, replacement meal diet under the sun. Like others arriving here, because LCHF doesn’t seem to be marketed prominently by someone trying to make money out of it (where’s the profit in saying “eat real food”?) it was a new concept to me after years of avoiding eating fat as much as possible. I only ever remember being recommended to read about it. I made my own mind up. Best thing I ever did. Thanks to whoever it was, host, admin or fellow contributor.

Sherlock20
Sherlock20Maintainer in reply to PandQs

Oh, believe me, it is now marketed by people who want to make money out of it. The amount of stuff I've had on my facebook page after a couple of internet searches on LCHF/Keto has been unreal. Atkins made a mint out of his version of it. Where there's a diet that becomes popular, someone will crawl out of the woodwork to make money out of it.

PandQs
PandQsMaintainer in reply to Sherlock20

Maybe that's the difference, I've never had a facebook account. I haven't paid a penny out for advice on how to eat real unprocessed food, and haven't joined a club and paid to get myself weighed. But you're right in one of your other posts, when industry sees that theyre losing their grip on the plastic low fat food substitute market, they'll start marketing "keto" bread. I do buy cauliflower couscous from M&S :)

Sherlock20
Sherlock20Maintainer in reply to PandQs

I've not paid a penny either, but I can see why people do. Unlucky folk who haven't found this forum...

UnitedRed
UnitedRed5st 7lbs

Surely all of us are on a journey with this stuff?

I started in May with purely calorie counting to get portion size down. After a month or so I started 16:8 eating (after seeing people post about it on this forum). Over the past week or so I’ve been thinking about lowering carbs (mainly reducing/cutting out bread/toast for snacks) , but can’t ever see myself going full-keto or LCHF as it just won’t work with our family life.

Yes, the forum probably does sway towards LCHF, but to me that’s just a reflection of the people who are here and active. I’ve always felt supported by anyone who’s commented/posted.

elliebath
elliebathMaintainer in reply to UnitedRed

That's a sensible observation. It could indeed be that those people who were successful with a different method have either: succeeded and are happily living their new slim lives away from this forum, have dropped out entirely, or are maybe still trying but no longer engage with the forum .

If there other Non-LCHF success stories lurking within the forum, then please do speak up , so that newcomers can hear advice from all sides. 🙂

TheProf
TheProf2020 July in reply to elliebath

I think 27kg loss in a year with a calorie controlled diet is a good result. More to go.

Sarah-Phim
Sarah-Phim3st 7lbs

Is interesting watching this thread pan out. I think the bottom line is we are all adults that can choose to be here or not. Like most things in life what works for some, doesn’t for others.

I think tolerance of differences is the key here. The message is meant to be that we are all sharing a similar struggle with weight and should be supporting each other and cheering each other on to try to maintain a healthier lifestyle, no matter how that looks.

Could it be taken on board by the administrators to provide a welcome that seems a little more balanced with regards to available regimes and plans?

Personally when welcoming those who are new to the forum, I don’t want to look like I’m some “professional dieter” because I have managed to lose a chunk of weight, because I am far from it and I know how it feels to be at day one feeling like you have a mountain to climb.

We should be pulling together as life is hard enough right now without bickering between ourselves in text boxes in an online forum when there are bigger things to worry about.

Having said that I have found people here to be lovely and it has helped me no end to stay focused. 💜

I've never thought anyone forcing one plan over another just advising the different ones and saying what worked for them. The admins are all volunteers after all and do a great job. I started off on the 12 week plan and pretty much have stuck with calorie counting with some old weight watchers menus thrown in and never felt pressured to change but said if falter might consider it.

Cp1965
Cp196545kg

Just catching up on threads having been away for a few days and read this one with interest. I'm a bit cynical of dietary advice these days, having struggled with my weight all my adult life.

I was once referred to an NHS dietician who had me writing down everything I ate during the week, which I did religiously only to be accused of "missing out the odd trip to McDonalds" on my return visit... I've been on and off several varieties of medication, including Orlistat which messed with my digestion for a number of years. I've done the diet clubs, which smacked a little too much of weight loss by ritual humiliation for my liking. Plus, the business model of these organisations relies on a steady stream of overweight people coming along, paying their subs, buying the overprocessed ready meals etc.

Me? I've lost weight most successfully by cutting out processed foods, ready meals, yes I have cut down on carbs, and use full cream milk, but I've never felt that any particular method of weight loss has been forced on me. I've settled into a sustainable (FOR ME) lifestyle. I participate in the forums, on which are people following various plans. There are vegetarians and vegans on here, I don't feel I'm being judged for being a meat eater. Yes, there are differences of opinion, but they are usually settled in an adult manner (although there has been the occasional amusing flounce 🤣) but ultimately we are all here for the same end- to shed a bit of excess mass and hopefully become healthier.

There was probably some point I was goi g to make but I'm damned if I can remember what it was...

SofaJockey
SofaJockeyAdministrator in reply to Cp1965

I was a delightful ramble nonetheless...

And your plan sounds excellent. 😄

Bellaxo
Bellaxo1 stone

I hope I don’t upset anyone because I admire the time admin take to run this group, but I can agree in some ways and also disagree slightly. When I first joined, I posted in the weigh in and a couple other places and mentioned I was counting calories. I had lost 4lb that first week and was overjoyed. But the comments I received were to consider changing to LCHF instead as “counting calories doesn’t work” with links to discussions on why we shouldn’t count calories. Admittedly I did feel pressured to change as this was my first attempt at dieting, and so I switched to keto (because I don’t have much weight to lose to reach my end goal). I didn’t feel supported at the beginning and wondered if the change in comments I received was because I was following the same diet as the majority which makes me feel guilty as now I do feel very supported by admin and others and see that they support people following other diets as well. It’s possible that there was never a change in the attitude, they have always been supportive, it just felt a bit harsh when starting a diet for the first time, especially after being anxious to join a group. I think admin do have a right to offer suggestions, it’s often helpful especially to those confused, but maybe think before telling people to switch diets after their first week if they have mentioned a diet that is going well x

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