anyone tried DNAnudge and/or Zoe

[Wired123]

keen to hear experiences of those who have actually tried one or both. Would be keen to hear of learned experience before I decide to spend the money.

[Jaydee1507 Administrator]

What is it that you want to know about your DNA? What do you hope to gain from it?

I just looked at the DNAnudge one which is quite pricey at £100 for just testing 8 genes. You could buy an Ancestry DNA kit for £59 and test many more genes then run it through a functional gene analyser for a report. You would also get all the standard family dna stuff that comes with Ancestry. Could also use 23&Me, both allow you to download your raw data.

[Wired123 in reply to Jaydee1507]

if you read the website it tells you how it analyses your DNA to guide you to the best foods for your body and wellbeing. It’s specifically about helping you make better food choices tailored to your particular DNA. I don’t think Ancestory are set up to do the same thing.

Nudge seem quite cheap compared to Zoe, but if members like Radd are going for it I expect it’s a comprehensive service and worth the £600 investment.

[Jaydee1507 Administrator in reply to Wired123]

DNAnudge also does one for skincare and exercise, indeed I read the website.

No Ancestry or 23&Me aren't set up to do that but there are many free and other paid for analysers you can run your raw DNA though to find out much more information than whats being offered by DNAnudge. Just another option depending on what you wan to get out of it really.

[radd in reply to Wired123]

Wired123,

Zoe isn’t £600!

I DM’d you for diplomacy 😬 but seeings as it’s being discussed …. .. I paid just over £200 for a year with a discount code. I think the glucose monitor was more on top but I can’t remember.

I’ve recently gone through the whole gut, mould, LC, etc, etc testing as every new practitioner has to do their own testing but for someone starting out I would say it is good value as includes gut testing. I’m more interested in the science behind how they test individual responses to fats and other foods.

Hidden indicates it’s a pain having to log everything so I opted for a year so can dip in and out.

[Lavender-Blue in reply to radd]

Do you have the code to share please?

[radd in reply to Lavender-Blue]

Lavender-Blue.

Just go searching on the internet. There are loads but many have been discontinued now as demand for Zoe out strips supply.

Just google something like 'Zoe Nutrition discount code' . You have to go through them to see what is working. I struck lucky with 20% off after about three attempts but this was a while ago.

[Lavender-Blue in reply to radd]

Thanks Radd.

[radd]

 Wired123,

DNAnudge - no.

Zoe - yes, on waiting list to start very soon. Hidden already on it.

[Wired123 in reply to radd]

oh wow, can’t wait to hear your experiences given you are already a fountain of knowledge on this forum!

How much did it cost you all in?

[Hidden in reply to Wired123]

Wired - I paid £139.96 for the testing and £49.99 a month (for 6 months) after that. I've got 2 months left. I've been humming and hawing about signing up for another 6 months, and I think I will.

I love the programme. I'm a big advocate! and I can tell you when I eat to my suggestions I feel great. That feeling is hard to quantify though; yes, my gut motility improves but I just generally feel 'lifted'.

The app is easy peasy to use if you're using foods with barcodes... difficult to use if you're eating home-cooked food. With homemade meals, you either enter each ingredient every time you make it or create the 'recipe' to be able to reuse it.

Ultimately I think the problem with the app is that you're signed up for a finite period so personally, I'm not going to invest the time entering recipes that I might only use 2 or 3 times in 6 months. It would be better if you could import a recipe from a website.

It also highlighted to me some issues with blood glucose control. Mine was poor and after further investigation, I think I've got some level of insulin resistance.

I take my thyroid hormones all at once at bedtime and what I assumed were thyroid 'slumps' throughout the day are actually correlated to my blood glucose levels so for me it was worth it just for that, if I'm honest.

While I'm thinking about it; I think the other reason Zoe is difficult to follow is that the standard British diet is so far removed from how most of us 'should' be eating it feels like a major overhaul to the diet which is hard to sustain. The focus of Zoe is 'Progress not perfection' and this is a change for overall health, not a faddy diet plan. Tim Spector himself is plant-based with a heavy emphasis on any meat, fish, or dairy being good quality infrequently eaten rather than 'at every meal'.

[Jaydee1507 Administrator in reply to Hidden]

Can I ask which foods that this app has identified you have to avoid due to your genes?

[Hidden in reply to Jaydee1507]

Hi Jaydee,

I'm going to sound like a pedant but the Zoe programme heavily impresses that it's not about avoiding foods but about eating to your body's capabilities. It's nuanced but there is a difference in the delivery from Zoe that makes it feel less claustrophobic!

For me personally, something like sausage and mash would score poorly (because of the fat and glucose content). So anything with 'bad quality' fat or too high in carbs is scored low for me but if I were to have one sausage, a palm sized amount of mash, alongside half a plate of veggies then I can still eat it fairly regularly.

[Hidden in reply to Wired123]

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Wired - If you scroll down this thread I posted pictures of my results if you're interested in the format.

You get a 2 much larger PDF's with all the info in - I just screen grabbed my summary pages.

[Jaydee1507 Administrator in reply to Hidden]

Gosh I missed that thread, sorry! I've done alot of gut stuff pre fancy apps so its interesting to see how it works. Thats a good spin they are putting on it though about eating to your bodies capabilities. In reality though I think the more fatigued ones of us are all likely going to be carb & bad fat intolerant to various degrees. With the app and glucose monitor though you can fine tune things like you say having smaller amounts of things that you arent so suited to.

I did check my stool analysis and it doesnt specifically mention the strain that the paper in the previous thread is highlighting which is a shame.

[Hashiboy in reply to Jaydee1507]

Hi Jaydee1507 I just posted to Hidden about my results with ZOE - in case its of interest the post follows:

Hi there    Hidden how are you. Yep got my results a couple of weeks back so now following the personalized eating programme. The results say my gut microbe diversity is in the lower 25% but my ratio of good to bad microbes is in the 88th percentile so very high. God knows what that means in practical terms - basically not a whole load of microbes but pretty much everything there is considered good and very, very little bad bacteria. I’m positive for Blastocystis the good parasite. Most reassuring is that my blood sugar control is classed ‘excellent’  and is in the  76th percentile and significantly above average for my age range. Blood fat control on the other hand is categorized as ‘poor’ at the 29th percentile (this Is just a bit below average for my age). So the bottom line is the personliased advice to me is that I should carry on eating lots of plants and low GI carbs but make a big effort to limit my fats and stick to the good fats. My ideal diet is likely to be mostly unprocessed vegan whole food with the odd bit of fish and a little good fat like extra virgin olive oil. Red meat and cheese need to be treats but carbs like white pasta and rice seem like less of a disaster. Keto would be about the worse diet for me. I think the problems with fats is very typical in hypothyroidism. Eat real foods, mostly plants and limit fats sounds very standard mainstream advice but I’m now clear that the paleo or keto routes would overload my poor blood fat control. I had half a tub of Hagen daz caramel and brownie ice cream to celebrate getting the results, please don’t tell them.

[PixieElv]

Hi Wired123

I was part of the original Zoe research group, to provide data, so got early/free access to the App. I find it very hard to use and have not used it to ‘fine tune’ my diet.

The reports on gut bionome is good though as was the report on the sugar, fat and protein blood glucose response.

Would I have paid for it? No.

I hope that helps

[Wired123 in reply to PixieElv]

so it sounds like the app isn’t good (yet) but the actual testing is very good?

Have you been able to make better choices based on the report alone?

[PixieElv in reply to Wired123]

Not really. That could be due to the fact that I am lucky enough to metabolise protein, fat and carbs equally well and my gut bionome is pretty good. Maybe if yours came out as one is much better than others you might be able to adjust your diet?

The App is just too fiddly. I found it hard to find what I was looking for and some versions of food were good for me whilst really similar versions were bad, with no difference I could work out

[Singwell]

You mean the Zoe nutrition programme with the App, poo test and blood sugar monitor? Yes I've done it. Found it helpful. What are your goals?

[Wired123 in reply to Singwell]

looking to lose weight and feel more energetic. I’ve come a long way already and improved my diet and energy, but still feel that more precise fine-tuning could get me to the next level based on person-specific testing

[Fruitandnutcase]

someone in my Pilates group does Zoe - or should I say did Zoe. - she’s been complaining about not letting sing weight then last time it was mentioned she said she’d stopped using it because it wasn’t easy to use.

[mstp]

Ive been on Zoe since January. At first it was quite time consuming. Getting used to using the app to log meals takes a while. In the first two weeks while the blood sugar monitor is on there are challenges which can be done to give a greater insights into what is going on with blood sugar. They are optional but I think if you pay your money you might as well gain the most benefit from it. One such challenge centres around breakfast and compares eating carbs before protein (I chose porridge and almonds), protein before carbs, carbs then exercise, carbs and protein mixed up. There are a library of about fifty of them so I'd suggest having a look at that beforehand, choosing ones you'd like to have a go at and making sure you stock up with the relevant foods. I felt afterwards that I missed out a bit in that fortnight because I wasn't well enough organised with that part of the programme. I ended up sitting up in bed at midnight eating brazil nuts and chocolate to find out their effect before the monitor stopped working at 2 am!

Perhaps I should make two points here. Firstly, even though I could do with it, I wasn't trying to lose any weight. I went on the programme because I wanted to feel generally better. Secondly, ever since I began in January I have been struck with this coughing bug that everyone seems to have at the moment so I have never felt truly well. However, Now three months later, I have lost at least 5 kg ( I havent weighed myself for a couple of weeks so it might be more).

Despite the bug, I feel more energetic and kind of lighter. I was surprised to find that my body handles sugar ok but it metabolises fat badly so I have had to adjust the fish and chips every Friday. I still have it but cook my own without batter and do chips in the oven with added nuts and olive oil. I also make sure I add peas as that pushes up my score - high scores is what you are after so rather than cutting out you keep adding foods that are good for you.

I suppose I would say, if you have the time, Zoe is really good. Having the awareness of what foods are actually doing to your body is quite motivating. ie you really do not want to eat the foods that score 0 and do want to find ways of combining foods that you know work for you. I also like the way they train you up gently by asking you to try to reach a daily target of 50+ at first and then 60+ and, I presume, onwards up to 75+ eventually.

[Batty1]

I doubt very much testing DNA will reveal anything other then your lighter bank account and now your DNA is floating around in someone’s database.

[HotelHurricaine]

I've done the Zoe test too and would say the testing is worth it but the app is too fiddly if you cook everything from scratch and have to put in all ingredients separately.

Unlike some previous posters here I came up as managing fat excellently but sugar poorly. I loved wearing the CGM and trying out lots of foods - no big surprises here but it did make a difference to see things drawn on a graph as they happen. So now I have seen that once I have some carb I continually want more carb all that day and the rollercoaster it causes in my glucose levels.

Its reminded me to eat my vegetables first and then fat/protein/carb and to try apple cider vinegar before my meals as spikes are lower (which Id been told but seeing it work helped me to believe it!).

If you do the app after the test it does help you to make healthier eating choices and makes sure you add a good variety of foods to your diet - and yes, Zoe doesn't seem to approve of much meat or fish but if you add lots of vegetables to the meal it becomes a healthy one. So it has made me more mindful of that.

I'd say for the price it was worth it for me. It's helped me to believe lots of stuff I've read and put them into action which for me is a plus.

[Divine1990]

Really interested in everyone's feedback regarding Zoe. I have just completed, my first 2 weeks so waiting in anticipation for the blood, poop results etc. Recording all your meals on the app does become easier with time.

I was really surprised at which foods and combinations spiked my glucose levels. I didn't realise just how much I tend to eat the same fruit and vegetables as well.

Zoe suggests 30 different plants to be eaten each week, I have already consumed 26 sofar this week. Plants includes fruit, vegetables , whole grains, nuts , seeds, pulses, spices and herbs. Fermented foods, plain yoghurt and smelly cheese are also recommended for the gut. Its all about the microbiome! To be fare nothing really is off limits.

I am mainly hoping I can keep my enthusiasm going in the longer term. I am now cooking alot more from scratch whilst considering what I am actually eating.

The food that really spiked my blood glucose was a gluten free macaroni cheese meal from M&S. Processed food is definitely not my friend which I already knew but actually seeing you blood glucose spike made it really strike home.

I would really be interested to hear about people's progress through the weeks