Would really appreciate your comments. Have been aiming to reach optimal levels in preparation for using NDT. Endo reduced thyroxine from 100mcg to 75mcg 10 February 2020. Would not prescribe T3. No longer suppressed dose of levo. Thyroidectomy and RAI 1992 due to cancer. Am taking all supplements suggested on this site to assist T4 to T3 conversion. Have hypothyroid symptoms for several weeks now.
Am I any where near optimal thyroid level?
THYROID CHECK ULTRA blood results
CPR 1.13 0 - 5
FERRITIN 98.7 13 -150 or 143 13 - 150 see footnote?
FOLATE SERUM 10.74 3.89 - 19.45
B12 ACTIVE 150 37.5 - 187.5
VIT D 91.7 50 - 175 or 97 50 -175 see footnote?
TSH 2.69 0.27 - 4.2
FT3 3.44 3.1 - 6.8
FT4 16.4 12 - 22
THYROGLOBULIN 13.4 0 -115
THYROID PEROXIDASE 9 0 - 34
Blood draw taken 10am. Did not take levo that morning. Also stopped taking B complex 8 days prior to blood draw.
Footnote: In addition to having Thyroid Check Ultra also had a separate B12 Active blood test and single vitamin D blood test. Although all blood samples were taken at same time and dispatched together the results are different. Can anyone explain why this could have happened.
A lot to ask I know but would be most grateful for any feedback.
thank you most kindly
Written by
dragon51
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Well, you're extremely under-medicated and therefore nowhere near optimal - although optimal is not a number, it's how you feel. But, your TSH is too high - should be down to 1 or under - and your FT3 is scraping along the bottom of the range - should be at least over mid-range.
Initially i saw endo,s understudy and requested a small dose of T3 with a reduction of the 100mcg levo. I pointed out to her low FT3 from TSH blood result from October 2019. Pointed out to her that low FT3 was effecting my heart (waiting for cardiology tests) and other parts of my body. She would have non of it but she was willing to increase levo to 125mcg. I refused increase and she referred me to see her boss, the top endo which I did a week later.
Surprise surprise the boss endo looked at quite a lot of graphs on TSH results and he actually informed me that I was and had been over prescribed levo for quite some time in pursuit of suppressing TSH levels. He went to say I had been in hyper state for many years which had contributed to cardio problems. No mention of low FT3 refused T3 but he did reduce levo to 75mcg instead of upping it as was suggested by his understudy the previous week.
Have to say though blood pressure gone down, I am gaining weight, so cold, cant sleep, no energy.....metabolism totally slowed down.
Hence I opted for NDT which I i managed to purchase but got to get levels sorted before I can take it.
No, you don't. Just take it. Who told you you had to 'sort levels'? Or do you mean nutrient levels?
Isn't it depressing when top endos come out with rubbish like that! No idea what he was talking about. If this wasn't a family forum I'd say something really rude!
In the past I would have just taken the NDT without question and throw caution to the wind. But now older and feeling so unwell I am afraid incase I get worse rather than better.
Yes I need to get vitamin levels right to avoid any pitfalls. I may even have to work on adrenal issues, again to avoid any pitfalls when taking NDT.
In the meantime low FT3 is a real worry because day by day I know it is detrimental to my heart and brain plus else where in my body.
Ohhh sod it I got nothing to loose gonna half grain tomorrow.
Well, if you've been on 75 mcg for the last six weeks or so, I would be tempted to start on 1 whole grain - or at least go up to one grain after two weeks, if you want to be really cautious. Because taking another cut in dose could make you feel worse rather than better. You do have plenty of room for an increase.
Thank you greygoose yes I would be taking another cut in dose by starting with 1/2 grain and could feel worse but I would be ok with that just knowing I am working toward end goal to hopefully feel better. If the going gets too tough I will up the dose to one grain because as you so thoughtfully state I have plenty of room for an increase.
was planning on sorting my adrenals out before taking NDT but unable to carry on like this. Time is not on my side so i am ready to take the plunge now.
Just one question for you.
You say you was taking 125 levo one day, stopped for one day then following day took 1/2 grain NDT. Roughly this equates 30mg of NDT. Here comes the question: Levothyroxine does not leave the body simply by missing one dose so am i correct in saying NDT is basically mixing with remaining supply of levothyroxine in the body?
Ok - I went from 125 Levothyroxine @ 3 am to 1/2 tablet of NDT the following morning @ 3.00am.
My NDT contains 38 T4 + 9 T3 per grain/tablet so on my first week I took 1/2 grain :
Week 1 1/2 grain = 19.00 T4 + 4.50 T3 :
Week 2 3/4 " = 28.50 T4 + 6. 75 T3 :
Week 3 1 whole grain = 38.00 T4 + 9.00 T3 :
If you get up to 2 grain/tablets, hold there for 6 weeks and take a blood test just to see where you are in the overall scheme of things.
NDT generally presents with a suppressed/low TSH ( irrelevant ) - a lowish T4 and depending on the time gap from medication to blood draw high/slightly o/range T3.
I come in slightly over range, but am by no means overmedicated and now don't care.
I have one blood test a year, just to ensure my vitamins and minerals are optimal as they assist the conversion of the T4 into T3. and I continue to supplement where necessary now I have the blood test and a bench mark to work from.
Levothyroxine takes about 6 weeks to totally leave the body so as this medication was reducing over those 6 weeks I was building up my NDT levels :
I am ok on 1+ 1/2 NDT grains/tablets which works out at 57 T4 + 13.50 T3 :
NDT has a set ratio of T3 / T4 at around 1/4 which is generally a ratio that most people feel well on - and if we work on the assumption that T3 is 4 times more powerful than T4 and extrapolate that out I find myself with 57 T4 + 13.5 x 4 =54 which totals 111 T4 :
and if we believe that the fully functioning working thyroid would be supporting you daily with approximately 100 T4 + 10 T3 I seem to "come out" pretty close to all that I read.
There are some people who when pretty close to where they feel they need to be and stable add in a little extra T4 or T3 - I tried adding in a little t4 in the hope of a little bit more stamina but it had no obvious benefit so stopped that.
I also tried adding a little bit extra NDT in the afternoon and found myself eating everything in the fridge at 10. 00pm. so stopped that as well !
I hope that all makes sense - I've had two phone calls whilst doing this and hope I haven't totally lost my thread(s) .
P.S. Yes, I understand about the adrenals as they work in tandem but I think as soon as you take the pressure off them, with adequate thyroid hormone replacement, they will then, in turn, start to repair and regenerate themselves. There are some adrenal glandular products on the market but don't think it's a good idea to change more than one thing at a time.
ohhh so sorry pennyannie for troubling you and hope you havent lost your threads. You state things so simply and you articulated the point i was trying to make in my question about thyroxine taking time to leave the body etc. The point I was trying to get at is exactly what you wrote below but you made it much more clearly than I did. Not making excuses but i do write words without thinking it through properly which is somewhat down to muddled foggy head which has been my reality since taking thyroxine.
Your quote; "Levothyroxine takes about 6 weeks to totally leave the body so as this medication is reducing over those six weeks I was building up my NDT levels"
This was all I needed to hear because this is what I suspected but you put it so much clearer than I could.
The rest of your reply to my question was not necessary because i printed the similar info from private message you sent me weeks ago which I am so grateful for. I trully appreciate your most welcome help and invaluable support. How kind and thoughtful you are. Do not think I would be making this NDT journey without the help you have given me.
You wished me LUCK...I humbly receive that....ohh to have a clear mind/brain!!!
I know when I was reading up on here, I learnt so much from reading other people's posts, and so try and write as thoroughly and completely as I can.
I also don't remember exactly what I wrote and to whom, so it's just to cover my own back really and I'm like a tape recording, once started I don't seem to be able to press pause or stop until I get to the end.
I was only diagnosed a year ago. So not private tested much. My NHS said Hypo and Medichecks result said over medicated. So this isnt safe. So disillusioned with it all now! The NHS results followed a sensible trend so I dont believe Medichecks. Others on here have got in touch and got free retesting. Its diappointing to say the least! x
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