Hey guys
Is there any kind of supplements or things you can take to lower high cortisol? I can see many posts on here but a bit confused as many are low levels?
Anything supplement wise to help high cortisol? - Thyroid UK
Anything supplement wise to help high cortisol?
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Saggyuk
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If you have your cholesterol breakdown, it would be worthwhile putting them into this calculator to give you some insight into what your numbers might mean: hughcalc.org/chol.php For me, the first thing I am interested in are my Triglycerides, then the proportions.
Personally, I am significantly less concerned about the total cholesterol number, even if it is outside the NHS range, which is a number that was selected randomly at some point in the past.
I don't supplement with anything, but concentrate on eating a good, varied, lower carb diet (now gluten free), with decent fats. By decent fats, I mean I avoid trans fats like the plague. Were I considering supplementing, I'd make sure I had my vitamin levels tested before starting to ensure I wasn't going to be overdoing things inadvertently.
Holy Basil helped me to reduce my high cortisol. I took this one for several months at a slowly decreasing dosage :
healthmonthly.co.uk/swanson...
There are loads of others to try, but I've only tried the one kind.
humanbean, how many did you take of Holy Basil? I've tried 2 x twice daily for about 6 weeks. I think it's helping. Wonder if you can take more, as it says 2 x twice on my bottle?
THanks for the link, will give it a go - hopefully it's gluten free 
I took a maximum of 2 capsules, 4 times daily for just a few days, but didn't feel well, so I reduced to 2 capsules, 3 times daily. I did okay on that dose and stayed on it for a few months.
When I started feeling less well, I reduced to 2 capsules, 2 times daily. I then stayed on that for several weeks. I then reduced to 2 capsules, once a day.
I stayed on that dose until I ran out of Holy Basil. I didn't notice any signs of relapse for quite a few weeks, but I am intending to buy some more as soon as I can get my act together, because my heart rate is now rising and I feel slightly jittery on occasion. And my sleep/wake cycle has gone completely mad - a common problem for me. I'm sleeping during the day, and staying awake at night.
I should point out that I don't have any special knowledge that says that taking more capsules is or was okay. I'm just a bit gung-ho when I do things for myself. Luckily I "got away with it". I did wonder how they decided what the maximum dose should be.
I use holy basil tea that I enjoy. I was in severe adrenal exhaustion but figured that anything that helped keep me calm would be good. Also if you have a cortisol and DHEA test use Aviva Romms book to guide you through the use of supplements based on actual results.
THanks. Problem is I'm generally quite calm already so not sure why it's high to be honest lol?? A few years back it was so low and had brown patches of skin everywhere and other indications of addisons they were about to test for. Plus it was lowest when I was actually stressed that day so a bit confused?
I'm going to look into other tests - so the DHEA test is worth doing then, haven't looked into that one much? I will look into book too 
I think that the adrenal issue is a real can of worms. I was tested for addisons and only just passed as normal. Things that have worked for me are EFT tapping to clear out any unhelpful thoughts/beliefs and to calm, nutrient dense diet, plenty of rest and a large box full of nutritional supplements. I think that we have to be responsible for all the basics and the relatively easy to do items hoping that the remaining issues are fairly clear cut, such that when we reassess it becomes obvious how we should proceed. Or who we should try to see. Good luck with your quest!
Yes, I worked on all that before three years ago and gave up gluten, that's when the signs of addisons and low cortisol reversed alongside all my other issues but now I have high levels. I eat pretty well now to be honest and have worked on my nutritional levels. This seems to be the only remaining issue.
Then I definitely recommend the Aviva Romm book for the next stage. I found the whole list of possible supplements confusing as I had listened to a lot of people and read everything that I could find. Perhaps try one set of recommendations and stick to them. Interesting that my issue sorted itself with the correct treatment for the thyroid and getting rid of bad gut bacteria rather than following the traditional adrenal programmes, although my supplements are pretty comprehensive. They are trying to tell you something.
There are other things besides Holy Basil that help people lower cortisol. It really is a case of trial and error to find out what works for you. Some links :
draxe.com/7-adaptogen-herbs...
moodcure.com/correcting_cor...
moodcure.com/pdfs/Townsend-...
Some people find Seriphos (phosphorylated serine) helps. It has been reformulated in recent years. (It was changed and then changed back.) Make sure you get the "original formula" seriphos if you try it.
interplexus.com/data-sheets...
There is also an alternative, more expensive than Seriphos, called phosphatidyl serine, which can also be bought OTC.
I had extremely high cortisol on all four points. I took the advice of my (very good) private nutritionist, and have been taking Phosphatidyl Serine, by Biocare, twice a day for some time. It is gluten-free and vegan. I had also been taking Zen, by Allergy Research, but it doesn’t seem to be available any more.
I was definitely feeling a lot better and, when I retested, my cortisol had reduced (although still a bit too high). I still take the Phosphatidyl Serine, 15 minutes before breakfast and 15 minutes before lunch.
I have another supplement, Liposomal-Gaba with L-Theanine, by Quicksilver Scientific. It is a spray, and my nutritionist suggested that I could use it to replace the Zen, or on an occasional basis if and when I felt I needed it, but I haven’t felt the need so can’t comment on its effectiveness.
I know lots of people recommend Holy Basil, it isn’t something I have personal experience of.
My nutritionist also got me to do breathing exercises with a bag (the same thing as the paper bag trick for panic attacks I assume). Several times a day, with the bag over my nose and mouth, I just breathed in and out for a couple of minutes. I wasn’t having panic attacks, just a constant state of sheer anxiety, wired, totally unable to sleep, and generally in a right old state. I was prepared to do anything to help myself, so happily sat looking like a right lemon doing it.
Lol thanks, sorry just made me giggle with me imagining you with a bag over your face lol. Thanks for the info will take a look at them
I just don't understand it as currently, I am almost too calm and too laidback brainwise compared to normal,nothing seems to be stressing me and I can sleep almost immediately if go to bed - just bad habits. Mind you, my body seems the complete opposite and can't stop wagging foot in very fast motion etc, i feel nausea and dizzy when the cortisol is high that's for sure etc lol!!
The staying up has worsened mind you alongside it.
How high are your AM serum cortisol levels or is it just a feeling of being stressed?
Do you still feel wired in the evening?
The answers to these will guide supplements and dosage timing
A general supplement to reduce cortisol is phosphatidylserine - some find it energising, so best to take it in the morning. There is a modified version branded Seriphos (make sure its the Phosphorylated Serine version) which is more expensive and harder to get hold of which has a more noticeable calming effect. Seriphos can be taken at night too.
Adaptogens / ayurvedic medicine: Ashwagandha works for some, but depending on where you are with your adrenal stress levels, it can have the opposite effect - take in the morning to reduce raging AM cortisol, or last thing at night to help sleep. There's also Rhodiola Rosea, which I also found to be stimulating, but again others find it relaxing.
I'd also check out Lactium - a milk peptide for sleep.
Otherwise you are starting to move towards herbal remedies (valerian, passiflora, avena sativa) or some of the relaxing amino acids - like GABA supplements (avoid Phenibut!!!) and L-Theanine; both can be taken daytime/nightime. L-Ornithine and L-Glycine are PM for sleep.
Ginkgo biloba is reported to reduce cortisol for daytime usage and a good magnesium supplement will help in the evenings (magnesium citrate or bisglycinate, oxide is useless!).
Happy researching
Saggyuk in reply to
Hello Ady - thanks this was nine seven months ago lol.
I did try many of the things suggested but they all either made me feel worse after a couple of days or I reacted to them as very sensitive to gluten and fillers etc. My cortisol saliva test had shown high cortisol starting early evening until the morning with the lunch time one being the only in range one.
I soon after found a report that said a raised tsh will cause high cortisol and I was having other issues that meant I could not bring tsh down from high even with T3 over range. I was on T3 only and thyroid had stopped functioning and was no longer producing T4 but was unaware of this as hadn't taken any notive of t4 levels as had been on t3 for fifteen yrs. It appears you can't live without T4 lol. Anyway I just ignored it as likely due to this. I've added T4 back in and have just stabilised my thyroid results a month or so ago so am now working on nutritional levels as became deficient during this time but was unable to take supplements either as seemed to pool in my blood and became toxic.
Anyway lol - After this is sorted and I'm all optimal, I'm going to retest my cortisol in a couple of months and see if resolved. If not, I will try your suggestions so many thanks as a few new ones in there
in reply to Saggyuk
Hi Sagguk,
I saw your post on the right hand side on the cortisol related topics and dove straight in with my response - only realised it was 7 months old after I posted! lol Glad you have some new suggestions to investigate.
On a note about thyroid and cortisol, I've had numerous cortisol and thyroid bloods done since 2015 (NHS, Blue Horizons and Regenerus). In Autumn 2017, my 9 AM saliva cortisol came back low, although NHS 9am bloods taken shortly after came back at 308 - this compares to 376 from BH in 2015, so definitely a reduction in total serum cortisol (which my GP dismissed as meaningless).
I've been confused about whether my thyroid was causing low cortisol and whether I need thyroid or cortisol boosting supplements.
I had full thyroids panel done in Autumn 2015 and Autumn 2017 (both by Blue Horizons); T4, TSH, FT4 & FT3 remained virtually unchanged from 2 years ago - everything was well within normal range, although not high-optimal. The 2017 T4/TSH levels tied in very well with 2017 NHS T4/TSH - which indicates BH can be trusted. My antibodies had reduced significantly from 2015 and my Vitamin B was now up in the 900's.
With my limited knowledge of the interactions, this all seems to indicate that my thyroid seems stable at the moment and that whatever is happening with my cortisol is adrenal rather than thyroid. What do you think?
Saggyuk in reply to
Hi Ady
I might be the wrong person to ask as I tend to look too in depth and annoy people by saying things they don't want to hear sometimes or I'm possibly way off lol. I spent decades so incredibly ill and understand how frustrating it is to not be able to get it resolved. I think one thing I have learnt is that the body is very complicated and when one thing is wrong it has a whole cascading effect but also sometimes it's more often simple things rather than the worse case scenarios. Often when we look at these things on google, we often see the worst case and don't see some of the more minor things or links.
Yes I would say thyroid is probably secondary as it stands or at least for now. bear in mind I'm no expert and just things I've picked up.
I had a look through your posts to get an idea and it could be something or nothing that is easily resolved with some effort.
You have low growth hormone and obviously when you look it up it can be caused by a problem with pituitary but this also includes head injury. You may not be aware that growth hormone is often low in those partaking in boxing with impact on other hormones. Also other hormones are often low if have injury for a couple of weeks after? Sometimes the timing of the test may be an issue if injury not yet healed.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/157...
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
Bodies are wonderful things and often heal given time - I think you said the test was shortly after the head injury? Maybe a retest after enough time will give different results or maybe you need to ensure no further risk?
Things that make me think not necessarily a functional or permanent issue is growth hormone deficiency for other reasons and hypothyroidism are often associated with low sex hormone binding globulin whereas yours is high.
However, after a quick google, many of your issues including high SHBG can just as easily be caused by long - term calorie restriction:
onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi...
health.gov/dietaryguideline...
Long term calorie restriction doesn't necessarily mean just low calories, similar affects can be found with exercising at a calorie deficit and missing essential nutrients in diet especially if restrictive diet. Unfortunately not getting enough calories can have the opposite affect people want and after a while, weight will plateau and your body will attempt to slow metabolism and other actions to protect itself. I saw some mentions of a diet and paleo plus exercise so thought possibly might be an issue? Thyroids and adrenals will react in similar manner to these situations and start not functioning optimally. Thyroids also need carbs, calories and good nutrition. Eating a good amount of calories also maximises the chance that you're not missing out on micro nutrients and minerals not easily tested - all of which are required by the body.
Now, I do think there's enough indication of an adrenal issue whether it be an actual disorder or something that can be reversed. I did have suspected addisons and near zero cortisol with other clear indications like high potassium and hyperpigmentation but my cortisol is now high since being gluten free so I definitely agree with a GF diet which i think you mentioned- there's enough evidence to suggest this can cause multiple system issues lol. Adrenal issues will cause effects across the body.
If not a functional disorder yet, if you read up on adrenal fatigue, yours seems to be in the final stages and crashing - this is apparently indicated by low cortisol and high DHEA as DHEA will pick up when no longer able to produce enough cortisol, in the same way cortisol has to pick up when out of calorie/glucose/nutritional energy - if it continues, DHEA will eventually stop too and there's not much back up after that.
However, if you have a google, there are lists upon lists of simple things you can do to stop the stress on your adrenals depending on your lifestyle/issues. Most important by far is getting enough calories, good stable sugar levels and getting everything you need nutritionally. Basically if you exercise at a calorie deficit or run out of food energy just doing daily things or other stresses, your adrenals have to pick up causing massive strain on them as this should only really happen in times of emergencies such as temporary famine or threat. Reducing any stress to your body whether physical or not, will help.
Some of the simple things include stopping caffeine, increasing sleep, dietry changes, not too much exercise etc etc etc. Dealing with any psychological issues is also good whether it be ptsd or depression - just trying to relax more will help even if means taking up yoga or going for walks. Higher levels of anxiety can cause hormone issues too and it's just annoying that cortisol issues will make this worse lol!
Not enough calories will also affect blood sugar levels causing swings in this will impact adrenals as they have a close relationship, can increase risk of diabeties and can raise sex hormone binding globulin. Insulin for example can also cause issues with SHBG.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
You can check your blood glucose levels at certain points over the day with a test kit from the pharmacy and there's plenty you can do to stabilise them if they turn out iffy.
Now please don't think I'm saying you don't have any problems somewhere or that any of these are the problem as were "just in case" based on little things in your posts. I just think often some of the more basics are often missed and if you can make as much of the little things as optimal as possible or corrected, you can find much improvements or remove enough of the blood test abnormalities or symptoms which can then help identify any problems remaining (if remaining) as less to take into account and more specific. It was impossible when I had so many health problems trying to work out what the heck was wrong with me as where do you start and what is causing what. So I started trying to find any links and anything minor that popped up as a possible cause that I was doing or not doing, I double checked and made sure it was not the case or corrected. Slowly but surely, symptoms improved and became easier to figure the rest out.
This is no where near a definitive list neither and maybe you've already struck some of these off your list already as only had a quick google to see any relationships between some of your issues.
also just to check, have you done a vit d result, I can see you've been supplementing some of the other things but didn't see this one lol? Also do keep an eye on your thyroid because of the antibodies.
My cortisol issues are improving as I could have easily gone to bed a couple of hours ago lol!!!
Anyway, I do hope you get to the bottom of it soon
in reply to Saggyuk
Hi
Yes, the reason I tested my GH in 2015 was part of a full pituitary check up 3 months after a suspected concussion because I was had become well aware of head trauma and pituitary damage. Everything came back normal/good apart from a low GH, but it could well be a normal result because of the fact that GH is fast pulsatile release, usually in the first few hours of REM sleep and optimum production falls off around 1-2am. It does get released at other times, but outside of the pulses, GH often dwindles to low levels - so basically my low GH could have been normal due to the fact it was spot sample and not a GH stimulation test - which is usually done at hospital.
I never went back to martial arts and my life returned to normal, able to train hard with weights, 10k runs before or after work, hard mountain walks and then my fitness regime begin to stall around 12 mths later. I was getting ill (was working in an office of sick people at the time too). Add into that a forced house move, death of a parent, being unfairly fired from a new job and by June 2017 I was a fatigued mess, could no longer sustain any sort of gym routine.
This is why I started thinking gradual GH decline and/or adrenal fatigue due to pituitary failure - apparently GH is the first to go, then LH/FSH, followed by cortisol and thyroid function. However, my LH/FSH are still fine, which indicates my overall pituitary function is ok, which still leaves isolated GH deficiency as a possible risk along with cortisol/adrenal issues. In terms of stress/mental health, thats been an issue I have a constant battle with, I leave no stone unturned when it comes to persistent, long-term clinical therapy/meditation.Its helped massively, however, its not a magic wand and sometimes unforeseen life events tip us over, regardless
I flagged up SHBG with my stubborn NHS GP and gave further bloods last week, she also agreed to test for GH - again single blood draw, which if it shows GH in range, then I'm in the clear and can forget about it. If it shows up low, it could be a false positive due to reasons I mentioned above and would require further testing/endrocrinology involvement. I find out my results next week.
Worst case scenario is I have to self treat with a new drug called MK-677 for GH and I already have supplements that lower SHBG, which I've yet to start.
Regarding calorie restriction, in 2011, I had gained 6 stone to 19 stone - I lost this over 3 years with calorie deficit (at one point 1800 cals per day) and martial arts/weights - very fit for my age. I've been back down to my normal weight since 2014, however, apart from the occasional binge, I made the mistake of generally staying below maintenance (1900-2000 cals per day) up until Spring 2017. Thinking back, I performed better in the first few years of my weight loss - when I was still eating around 2300 cals.
So yes, long-term calorie restriction, intense physical exercise - coupled with the nightmare 2017 would defintely be considered long-term overtraining and I may well have buggered myself up hormonally that way. I still need to rule out GH deficiency and/or adrenal insufficiencies as the unknown possible additional factors.
Saggyuk in reply to
Hi Ady
Yes sounds like you had a couple of horrible years. Well if you did bugger yourself up, you are most likely able to undo it too with a bit of effort - often just takes a while. Do everything you can in the meantime to reduce stress to your adrenals.
Couple of things I forgot, adrenal issues such as addisons generally present with high potassium and low sodium so it's another thing you can check - although again can be other causes but is another clue anyway. When I had suspected addisons mine were like this. And do check your blood sugar levels, not just because they are related to cortisol but also because low growth hormone issues can be associated with insulin resistance. The one off blood test the docs do are not always very informative as they test the average over a period of time so not as good at picking up major swings which is why I often suggest the glucose monitoring kits over a couple of days
Also check your selenium, zinc and magnesium levels as these are very important in regards to enzyme production in the growth hormone and associated areas so a deficiency in these can cause low growth hormone etc.
I'm sure you'll get there
in reply to Saggyuk
Blood sugar in Nov was middle of normal range at 5.3 n/mol.
I've started taking selenium again recently (l selenomethionine) and I've been taking 1000-1500mg Magnesium Bisglycinate daily for a while. Mag Oxide is a waste of money.
Reduce stress to my adrenals ? Not a chance at the moment because of current life circumstances which I hope will resolve in the next month or so.
Went to get my results this morning, no GH or SHBG labs done - these are what I was pushing more the most with my GP who agreed to check them. I asked at the time if the GH would be an (L Arginine) stimulation test (4 hours hospital visit)? she didn't know! I asked if she had been able to authorise SHBG? she said she couldnt see it listed on her screen but that it was part of the Testosterone sample (sounded suspect - its never come back with my previous NHS Testosterone levels).
One last chance in a weeks time to see if my GP is willing to rectify the situation and pursue the investigation they agreed to the other week, otherwise I'm sacking my GP and changing surgery. If I had the means, I would have gone private years ago.
Worst case scenario: I go my own way and buy a GH secretagogue called MK677-Ibutamoren and I've already stockpiled supplements that reduce SHBG/Estrogen.
Saggyuk in reply to
Hi Ady
Yes, I've been let down by docs often in the past too and it's so frustrating especially considering how much they get paid - I've come to the conclusion that some of them are possibly just not as intelligent as assumed and clearly have little interest in their jobs?? That's why I've taken it upon myself to understand the entire body so I never have to rely on them again should other things become a problem - still got some way to go though!
Some tests take longer than others so may still come back? I normally test first - I found magnesium made me feel awful immediately and turns out i had too much already so is always a risk. I've just started zinc as the only thing to explain two issues remaining - folate won't budge and low uric acid. There are worse causes of this but I'm going to assume the easiest explanation first lol!
Apologies, I didn't mean remove any psychological causes if not possible, I meant reduce the stress on the adrenals by anything physical that you can - such as no stimulants like caffeine/energy drinks, testing and resolving any blood sugar level swings and making these as stable and optimal as possible, eating more regularly, avoiding high crap carbs but still getting enough of better ones like new potatos, basmati rice and pseudograins like quinoa and more sleep if possible or resting more, no sugar binges. As mentioned there's loads of physical things that stress adrenals so just have a google and see what you can do that comes up as issues within your lifestyle even finding some funny videos on youtube to laugh at once a day can help even if at others unfortunate accidents
draxe.com/3-steps-to-heal-a...
Good luck with your next appointment!
Sorry to barge in here - I have only taken T3 since 1995 & know that my FT4 level is infintesimal. I had no idea you can't live without T4. What function does T4 have if T4 is meant to be converted into T3. It gets more & more complicated. I have learnt lately though that high TSH causes high cortisol.
Hi marigold22
Yes, I have a research paper in my posts that found that a tsh over 2 and certainly over 2.5 causes high cortisol.
I was fine when my t4 was still around 5+ but I had results like this for three years and had some very bad issues:
TSH 2.11 T4 <0.1 T3 - 8.6 (3.8-6)
I wrote about it here:
healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...
My tsh was not stable at all and ranged from this to 15 no matter what my T3 results were and I had tried literally everything else.
I suppose it depends on how low your t4 is maybe?
I can dig out the links a little later to some of the new research I found in regards to there being more uses for T4 than originally thought rather than just purely conversion to T3 if you would like them so just let me know. It appears especially the brain as this seems to have a preference for T4. Also on a simple level, you can't produce Rt3 if you don't have any t4 and this goes onto make other things in your system so you're missing a whole step in the process and everything that branches off from it.
I felt better when my T4 is now around 7 or 8
Thank you so much Saggyuk . I think just maybe you have found the answer to my 35 year problem. TSH, FT3, FT4 all been up & down like a yo-yo.
I thought ReverseT3 was bad - that we were meant to check for it & avoid it. You have mega interested me here - my brain is the last thing in my body to behave itself. I will need to either beg my GP or Endo for some T4 or buy from abroad to experiment.
Is this new research? Or have I missed a whole swathe of info over the years? I would love to read anything you have on this subject. x
Hiya marigold22
I think it's only just coming to light to be honest, most of it is in the last couple of years. I will dig it out the links for you but might not have time until tomorrow eve.
I think for the most part, after everything I've read about bodies, I now go along the lines that whatever your body makes is for a reason and it's probably wise to trust our bodies that know more than us lol? Everything has it's needs and uses. Rt3 is only bad when over range.
It's definitely worth a try. took a while to feel better but did feel a little more stable quite quickly. I'm sure they won't mind giving you come T4 considering the cost of T3 lol. Mine were more than happy if not surprised. I ended up adding 50mcg T4. I didn't need to lower my T3 meds but they were already on the low side as couldn't handle them.
I've just amused myself by the thought of the reactions from people on here if someone on T3 only asked how they can source T4 lol 
Hi, thanks - any time is fine for links. I'm already panicking about asking an endo for T4 - she will no doubt want to lower my T3 (to save money primarily) is I ask to add some T4. I may just get it myself to save the hassle x
I suppose it depends on endo - mine was fine to just add it rather than swap. The 50mcg I added made very little difference to my T3 levels so my body just accepted the additional hormones and put them to use. I was lucky that my endo wanted me to stay on T3 only and wasn't particularly supportive of my decision to try T4 - he's now changed his mind a little mind you lol!
I do understand that panic though so do what makes you feel comfortable
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