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This is very interesting. Shallow breathing has always been my problem but no-one connected it to thyroid or adrenal...
Shallow Breathing Common in Thyroid/Adrenal Dys... - Thyroid UK
Shallow Breathing Common in Thyroid/Adrenal Dysfunction
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greygoose
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I have this problem and it annoys me immensely. I end up hyperventilating a lot, and once it gets triggered it takes me ages to get my breathing back to a sensible rhythm again. I do breathing exercises when things go wrong, lying on my bed with a small bag of rice balanced on my tummy, just below my waistline. I aim to move the bag when I breathe in, but not the upper half of my chest. I find it very difficult to keep it up for more than a minute or two.
Well, the rib cage is supposed to move too, to expand. When I was a kid, I used to try and take a deep breath and my shoulders would rise! My drama teacher called that 'clavicular breathing', but it didn't interest any doctor I saw.
Yes, clavicular breathing is what I do - my shoulders lift up my lungs to help make a space for air, rather than my diaphragm creating a vacuum at the bottom of my lungs and pulling in air like it is supposed to. It is a hugely inefficient way of breathing and uses up more energy than doing it properly.
One of the things I do when I realise I am hyperventilating is to sit or stand up straight, relax and drop my shoulders as much as possible, then slowly breathe out almost to the maximum amount I can, then I slowly breathe in. It helps.
What they didn't mention is that when T3 is in short supply, and the body has to pick and choose where it sends what there is, the diaphragm is one of the 'organs' (if it is an organ) that is dispensible, so shuts off supply.
Somehow I can't say I'm surprised about that - just another hypo symptom that gets ignored then!
Yup sounds about right greygoose mine just came back at 3.3 doctor said as Endo did tests looks alright. What!!!!! Please try and read my post. I am now on Nature throid have completely given up on NHS doctors or Endos and going it alone is no different than the lonely feeling I have had for the last 20 years.
Hi grey, Is there more info about how the body is picking and choosing where it sends its t3? Also can the lack of air affect the brain along with the lack of oxygen? Thx 😊 j
I'm afraid not. I can't even remember where I read it - but it might have been on Mary Shomon's site. It was a long time ago. It just stuck with me because of my lack of diaphragm action.
I don't understand your question about air and oxygen. It's oxygen the brain needs, which is found in air.
Oxygen and air 😂😂
Sorry, is that a joke?
Sorry jeepers I meant to write thyroid hormone. Lack of air/oxygen plus lack of thyroid. I must be really spaced out not to have noticed 🙁🧠 j
The bag of rice on the tummy is much like the pschycoprophylaxis exercises we did in the 60's at ante-natal classes. Laying on floor with hands on abdomen and fingers just touching, breathe and try and move fingers as far apart as you can. Think it was the thinking about it that made it work, as translated in means pschycological relaxation. Got to have a lovely short nap afterwards too. That was in the days when NHS was really good and caring. They could learn a lot by going backwards!
We did the same sort of exercise in drama classes - except that we put a heavy book on our chests! Not our stomachs. Don't know why. But when I say that drama classes can help people in so many ways, I'm not joking! I think everyone should have them, they're essential for life!
Yoga breathing is good too. Marz should give us a video lesson!
Great idea! Marz!?!?
GG, a work colleague was advised to have singing lessons to help his breathing technique to control asthma. He found it enormously helpful.
Yes, but was he hypo??? Did he have enough T3?
GG, No idea. I posted as an example of singing/drama lessons helping breathing techniques.
A chest x-ray showed I had over expanded lungs, probably due to years of smoking. FT3 was below range. 4 months later (having been self medicating on T3 and off T4) I was no longer having breathing problems and the long awaited spirometry test showed good lung function and ruled out COPD suggested by the endo.
Ah, I see! Sorry, didn't look back at the preceeding posts! lol
The spirometry test? Is that the one where you have to breath in a substance that sets off an asthma attack if you have asthma? That test nearly killed me. Honestly, I thought I was going to die! I couldn't get any air in my lungs for what seemed like an hour! And they diagnosed me with asthma. Story of my life! I'm diagnosed with asthma, then told I Don't have it, then diagnosed again! Do I have it or Don't I? I have no idea! lol
GG, I had to breath into a machine half a dozen times after taking a very deep breath. Test was repeated 20 minutes later after using the useless inhaler I had been prescribed for a few months. I've never had asthma and spirometry lung function test ruled out COPD so low FT3 and the side effects I had on T4 only when I had the chest x-ray were probably why I had difficulty breathing.
Well, I hadn't been diagnosed at the time - in fact, I was about 20 years off diagnosis! And nobody mentioned T3 or anything else. One slight wiff of whatever was in that machine and I was out for the count! The doctor just said, you have asthma. But he didn't prescribe anything accept desensitising shots for an acarian allergy. I Don't know any more than that.
GG, Sounds like a different test. The machine didn't puff anything into me, I puffed into it.
J bee, I also remember those antenatal classes. I was very good at the breathing exercises as I was/am a trained opera singer and good breathing is at the heart of singing. We were taught that there are three parts to breathing, deep (abdominal) breathing, mid lung and clavicular.
I was told that we should use deep breathing to keep the lungs clear. My late husband used to do clavicular breathing when his asthma was bad. He said it helped him control his use of steroids. I don't know if this was true but it seemed to help him. (Sorry went a bit off subject) oops. 
No, that's very interesting, Barb. I get the deep breathing and the clavicular breathing, but how do you do the mid-lung? That sounds difficult. And surely you have to do the deep breathing in order to sing, Don't you?
Hi Grey, Actually the mid lung bit is easy really, you begin with the really deep, abdominal part of the lung, then go on to the middle abdominal part of the lung then to the clavicular which is the smallest part of the lung. The middle and lower parts get further expanded with lots of practice and exercises, this is why most opera singers have well developed rib cages. And yes you really do need deep breathing to sing. This is where the long, extended notes comes from with breath control. It's hard work to begin with but with lots of practice it becomes much easier and second nature. I still practice deep breathing but it can be difficult sometimes as I have a sliding hiatus hernia which gets in the way. Still, with the rest of our problems this is a drop in the ocean! 
Barb
Yes, well, sounds complicated! lol I wish I had a singing teacher - I know singing is good for the lungs! And I've been looking for one, but can't find one that teaches adults, they all seem to be only interested in children. But I'll keep trying! I think I might be quite good - well, good enough to sing in the shower! - if I had a teacher. Have you given up singing now?
I was singing in a local choir a couple of years ago but had to give up. My vocal chords have been scarred by acid reflux and I now find it difficult to hold a note. Plus I have lost all my top notes and can now only manage mezzo soprano parts, of which there are not so many, and I am not low enough to sing most alto parts. I still practise at home an I hope to get enough use of my chords to allow me to go back to singing. There is a local choir with mostly older ladies and gents who don't expect perfection, I might have to try and get in their choir.
I hope you do find someone to teach you, you really will find it makes a difference to your breathing and your voice. It'll probably end up a lot better than mine 
My Mum had asthma from the age of three and I fully support what greygoose says that asthmatics just cannot get enough air in at all, not that they overbreathe. You husbands clavicle breathing sounds a bit like the shallow breathing and panting when you are in labour! So probably back to psychoprophylaxis. Thank you for your information about the type of breathing needed for singing. I have heard that singing helps breathing.
Another really good post grey. It mentions breathing exercises and a chap my Mum worked with said he was absolutely amazed at what good results he got from such exercises after a heart attack way back in the 60's. All such knowledge seems to be lost with doctors nowadays.
Well, they Don't teach that sort of thing in med school anymore! Thank you, Big Pharma!
They could learn a lot more on the internet, like we do! They might also get wise to Big Pharma then too.
Trouble is, once they've been to med school, they think they know everything!
Look up Buteyko breathing on Google.Claims to help folk with many illnesses including asthma and ME.
Hyperventilation? Are you kidding me? People with asthma Don't hyperventilate. In a crisis they can't get any air in at all. Been there, done that. And hyperventilation has nothing to do with the shallow breathing we're talking about here. Here it's caused by lack of T3, and no form of exercise can alter that.
Eh? Who mentioned hyperventilating?
That's what it said in the article when I googled Buteyko breathing. According to the article, his theory is that asthma and many other diseases are caused by hyperventilation. Just seems crazy to me.
Exercises work, though.
Dépends what sort of exercises.
Came across it in a book in a holistic dentist practise ,chap who removes Mercury although I was there for a snoring device before the real cause was diagnosed .
Seems I should have googled it myself ,Wikipedia says is much dispute on his theories.But practitioners out there selling the technique.
I have been getting this a lot thank you for sharing greygoose. I know I am not right especially after last bloods I posted on here yesterday entitled Disappointing blood results. It's like you cannot get enough air into your lungs. Noticed this especially whilst singing.
Yes, you can't fill the bottom of your lungs. The air seems to stay at the top. But, once again, the patient is blamed for having bad breathing habits! Makes me so cross.
If the air seems to stay at the top of your lungs, have you ever tried breathing out as much as you can first (in a slow and controlled fashion - nothing dramatic, not taken to extremes, and not intended to make you feel awful or struggling for breath), then tried breathing in slowly again by relaxing the shoulders completely, and pushing your belly out to draw the air in to the lower part of your lungs?
This is how I deal with the problem of the air going in the top of my lungs. I practice breathing the way I described while lying on my bed or before I fall asleep. Some nights I find it a useful meditation-type practice.
I'm not asthmatic though, so whether this is even feasible for an asthma-sufferer, I simply don't know.
Oh, gosh, yes! Tried all sorts of things. Did yoga for a while and those breathing exercises. Then we did lots of breathing exercises in drama classes. But I'm only truly asthmatic from time to time. The rest of the time, I'm just short of breath. Sometimes, I just stop breathing altogether - I know that's a hypo symptom. But if I Don't think about my breathing, it's very, very shallow.
Just to throw the cat among the pigeons, the Russian breathing exercises I did to help my asthma (which has now mostly gone) teach that most asthmatics overbreathe and you have to basically breathe less - definitely no deep breathing.
Well, I can't really talk about asthma, I only really know it second-hand because my brother has had it all his life - although I really wouldn't have thought he over-breathed! He's Lucky if he can breath at all.
For myself, if I do have it, it's only sporadic. Had it when I was pregnant, although one arrogant soandso said that wasn't possible! If you have it, you have it, if you Don't, you Don't. (So why was I struggling to breath??? No matter...). And one or two nasty incidences since. So, I wouldn't call myself an expert by any means!
But this article isn't actually about asthma. It's about breathing - or not breathing - when you're hypo. Which is totally different.
Indeed. The non-asthma breathlessness I had (which was probably low B12 and/or iron) was quite different and inhaler made it worse, if anything.
Or low T3...
Probaly all three as it went when I upped my B12 and T3.
Wow! I've had this for decades. I seem to do it under stress and if it goes on for too long my Crohn's flares up. This is before I developed Hashi's.
About 15 years ago a gastro told me that smokers had fewer flare-ups of bowel disease - but not to restart smoking, as that was far worse than the relief to be gained from bowel disease. He said they hasn't figured out what it was in cigarettes that had this beneficial effect... wondering if, in fact, it's down to the deep breaths smokers take when they inhale rather than anything in the ciggies?
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