Kind of a weird and dark question but here goes. I've invested heavily in my 401K for many years. I'm 52 and if I'm lucky I'll be around to enjoy it. Do I keep packing that money away and hope and pray that I'll need it? Or do I reduce my contribution, or stop it, and enjoy the money now? Just a side note that hubby and I have a very healthy retirement savings. I will not be destitute either way.
Retirement planning with MBC - SHARE Metastatic ...
Retirement planning with MBC
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Shelly1009
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Keep packing it away. If one treatment doesn’t help there is another and another. Who is to say by the time you retire there will be even better medicines developed. It’s good to save and will make you feel more positive.
Take care
Shelly1009 in reply to
I love your optimism. I'm still reeling from the diagnosis and haven't gotten to that stage yet. Thank you ❤️
in reply to Shelly1009
It takes time but will become easier for you. Take care.
FYI if you retire early — If you’re in the US, Social Security will fast track MBC patients and grant SSDI. The amount is not discounted. I started receiving the full amount even though I’m less than the full SSI rate age of 67. It’s another income source even though you’re only 52.
Shelly1009 in reply to
Definitely good to know. I'm still feeling really well and working full time. I have two teenagers to put through college and I'm hoping and praying for enough good years to accomplish that. So much uncertainty with this disease. I'm still fairly new at this and I'm having such a hard time wrapping my head around the unknown. Does it ever get easier?
I know women who are stage iv and continued their professions, teaching elementary school children and one a nurse. Even though, they could get SSDI and stop working, they chose not to. They enjoy their jobs, fell well enough to continue and it takes their mind off their illness. I never thought of it as terminal even when diagnosed and my cancer center calls it a chronic illness. I have read of too many women that are still 5 year to many more years of being here after being diagnosed with MBC.
I got a call the other night. My friend (who I grew up next door to) had five years ago breast cancer, stage i. but then she had a heart attack and they had to wait a year. Then she did the chemo, mastectomy, radiation, etc. She comes from a large family and has the youngest of two identical twin brothers. We used to call them Peter/Paul bc nobody on our street could tell them apart.
She was originally one of 7. Her sister died when we were younger (we were about 22). Her sister had just given birth (unmarried to a baby girl born with numerous medical problems). Before the baby ever came home, my friend's sister who always had asthma suffered a asthma attack and as her mother and my neighbor was in the car driving her to hospital she died. Her daughter has severe cerebral palsy and is in a wheelchair and is now 30 years old. It was tragic.
Some on the board talk about worrying that that they will die early. Well the same friend (Joann who had her own bout with cancer) lost her mother in 2017. Then her 64 year old brother unexpectedly died from a brain anuerism in 2017. In 2018 one of her younger twin brothers had been battling pancreatic cancer, he died in 2019 and it has not even been a year yet when my other friend called me to tell me that her other brother who was 62 and perfectly healthy had a massive heart attack and passed away. Joann had spoke to him the night before he died.
So in a matter of four years, she lost her mother, and three brothers and her sister when younger. And so here are two of her brothers, perfectly healthy, who died before me and I am stage iv.
I never think about it as terminal nor does my cancer cancer. It is a chronic illness. I choose to go on SSDI because I live in NYC and that commute was a horror.
There will be good days and days when you may feel depressed. I am a bit more tired and find somethings harder to do but all in all, I don't put my mind there and I go on with my life and it is interrupted once a month to go to cancer center (tomorrow). I don't want to give it any more time than I have to . My friends will ask how I am feeling and that is it. I don't look sick. So if you feel well enough to continue working I think that helps alot and if you stop feeling well enough, then you know you can get on SSDI.
CincinnatiExperience in reply to
Hello Vineyard---you have to be truly disabled, correct? In other words, you cannot be working.
Anne
MBC is considered a disability and covered under the compassion act so its fast tracked and you don't have to wait as mentioned above for retirement age. You have to wait 5 months from the time you are approved to receive your first check. After two years on SSDI you will automatically get medicare. I just got my first check on August 1.
Hope you do not mind that I am responding. But yes, you have to be disabled. "Truly disabled?" Stage iv is automatic approval but you cannot be working and apply for SSDI. You have to not be working in order to even apply for it. Plus remember the first five months after you apply are UNPAID, even if stage iv.
I tried working twice before even applying for SSDI but I left both jobs after three months. When I finally filed for SSDI and by then I had stopped working and was going through my savings, SSDI moved my Effective date of disability to the first day I was diagnosed. They did not count the two jobs I had worked at because they considered them "Failed attempts." If I had lasted at one of the jobs for six months or more, they would have started from the date of that last job. But I wound up getting, to my surprise, $25,000 in back pay after the docked the first five months.
Once you are on SSDI (and if you have a ss account, you can see how much you would get in SSDI before you even apply), you are allowed to make I believe it is $1,100 a month without getting penalized, BUT NO MORE. They realize some people are disabled for ss purposes, but can still do extra work on the side like typing or tutoring. So they do allow it but you have to be careful not to go over the limit.
Admittedly I have 20 years on you but that does give a different perspective. I would encourage you to use resources to enjoy life as you go along this journey called life. Take that big trip, buy that new car, whatever gives you pleasure. No one, even healthy people, knows the future. I encourage you to treat yourself and husband to good times along the way. Knowing you have the healthy retirement savings gives you the security to splurge occasionally on fun.
Yep I'm 71, and that's my attitude, not keeping any back for for the retirement home!
My vote is do both and enjoy life while you can as long as you know you are secure. Have fun, you have earned it.
Blessings Hannah
Hi Shelly,
That is a question that only you can answer. You say that you have a healthy amount of money in your savings account, so if you did decide to stop contributing to your 401K you would still have an income. Do you have plans that you might be able to put into action if you cash in? Is there something in particular you are saving for?
My husband and I are thinking along the lines of whether we should sell our other house. We moved back to the UK in 2012 but we kept the house we had bought in California in 2007. We didn't have much choice, as the mortgage was underwater due to the recession that hit not long after we bought the house, and if we had sold it we would still have owed a lot. Repossession was not an option for us either. So we hired a property manager and she has kept our house rented for us for the past eight years. But since we paid off the mortgage a few years ago we have been seriously considering selling the house. We are never going to move back, so it's something we need to think about some more.
Sophie
Shelly1009 in reply to
I'm still working full time too so I have a steady income. I'll work as long as I feel up to it. I want to travel. I want to see more of the world while I'm feeling well and up to doing all of the things. I want to take trips with friends, with family. I want to make memories with my children.
As far as selling your CA house, the market is so incredibly hot in the US right now. Interest rates are ridiculously low, inventory is low, houses are selling quick for far above listing with multiple offers. It's definitely a seller's market right now.
in reply to Shelly1009
Hi Shelly,
It sounds like you have lots of great plans. I hope you can achieve your dreams and travel just as you want, and make memories with your family.
Thanks for your insight into the American housing market. I've been out of touch with it for more than eight years, so it's good to hear that the market is looking good right now. There's nothing to tie us there anymore. We will never return to live in America. It was going to be our plan to retire back in America at some point in the future, but then this disease happened and now my husband is content to stay in the UK. I couldn't ask for a better, more selfless husband.
Sophie
kearnan in reply to
Sell it. I am seeing now on TV that CA (poor state) is now having wildfires again on top of now being a hot spot (I think no. 3) for Covid. More money for you and your husband and one less thing to worry about. With this pandemic, not many will be traveling. Not sure how well the real estate market is doing right now bc of pandemic.
in reply to kearnan
I'm saddened to see the devastating wildfires in California. I remember what it was like living there during summertime when huge parts of the state would burn. The air quality would be quite bad at times. We probably won't keep the house long-term.
Sophie
kearnan in reply to
It is like the pandemic is not enough. It seems like CA is constantly have these wild fires that are extremely hard to put out and it also seems from what I read that it is mostly started by careless adults and not to mention the wildlife that is destroyed.
in reply to kearnan
Unfortunately, wildfires are a regular occurrence in California in the summer months. It’s so dry for a long time. I lived in Northern California for over five years. The dry season is from around March to November, so there is very little rain during that time and it’s very hot. I just hope they get some rain soon. I hate to think of the loss of human and animal life.
Sophie
kearnan in reply to
I remember seeing a poor little koala bear that had been burnt and was yelping in pain as some people tried to give it water. It seems like there are always some wildfires going on in CA and how the heck can the firemen fight them. I read the recent on they had some volunteers from Australia.
in reply to kearnan
Yes, I remember that precious little koala bear too. He was rescued alive from the fire but he sadly died shortly afterwards. I hope the firefighters can soon get those fires under control. We have had a lot of rain here lately. I wish we could send it to California, Colorado and other locations in desperate need of rain.
Sophie
Hi, Shelly. The only problem with tapping in to your retirement account is that you would also incur a 10% penalty on top of the taxes they would take because of your age. My husband’s job had an option to contribute to a Roth 401k a few years back, so we started putting our money in the same funds but just the Roth. It was a great idea because we are able to tap into it now, since my husband is 59.5 and don’t pay taxes on the growth. It’s sort of like an emergency fund if we needed it, but I wouldn’t do that if I had savings. It’s just a cushion.
If I were in your shoes, I would go ahead and slow down how much I put in the 401k and take the extra money to enjoy life.
Exactly what I was thinking. I'm going to cut back on my contribution for now. See what the future decides my fate is. I'd only cash out my 401K if I knew things were going very poorly. I've already decided on a winter getaway somewhere tropical with my sisters as the first of my "life is short, take the trip" series.
I love that idea.
in reply to Shelly1009
Just FYI, if at any time you go on SSDI and are "officially" disabled, you do not incur the 10% penalty for 401k withdrawal.
Dancer1000 in reply to
Crap... I had to gut my 401K in 2018 due to some financial issues and had to pay that 10% penalty. Wish that happened now that I have MBC and had the 10% waived though. Good to know to tell others if necessary.
in reply to Dancer1000
Oh, what a shame!! But over the years I've told several people not to feel bad about that....The pre-tax appreciation you likely received on it prior, still puts you ahead vs. if you had not saved it in your 401K. *I tell this to people who are concerned about putting too much into their 401k, i.e. if they'll need it for expenses down the road. 
Sunny2020 in reply to
Does that include when your on short or long term disability from work?
in reply to Sunny2020
Hi Jo,
I'm not sure if you're asking about the exemption from the 10% withdrawal penalty, but in case you are, the answer is "no".
During short term disability, the presumption (not always true, obvi) is that you'll be able to go back to work...but when you are on SSDI, that pretty much says that you're unable to work long term or maybe ever.
I honestly don't know what exactly qualifies for/substantiates the exemption, but during the first year after I was dx, I was sorting things out, e.g. moving my 401k to an IRA, etc. I took a portion of that 401k and rather than move it, I made a different investment because I knew/thought I'd pay no penalty. I guess my accountant forgot that I was disabled (!!) because I paid taxes on it (I didn't notice this at the time) but then the IRS made the correction and sent me that money back (with a letter explaining)...so somehow THEY knew I was disabled and exempt from that...I assume this was because of the SSDI income I receive.
I hope that helps, and I apologize if this was not the question you were asking!
kearnan in reply to
Yes, the funds will still count as taxable income when you file your tax return.
Sounds great.
Hi Shelly1009,
I really appreciate this question.
When I was first dx, I scoured the web for good info related to financial decisions (including how to predict if you'd qualify/continue to qualify for private/employer provided disability...). We share and scrutinize all of the medical aspects, side-effects, etc., but there's so little re: financial implications...so thank you!
Since I'm inclined this way, from the beginning I forecasted my longevity, with a range on either side, especially upward, and "spreadsheeted" my assets, income, and expenses, including the kids' college under, different scenarios. This helped me feel some sense of control and greatly helped me make decisions.
Like you, at the beginning, I felt strongly about taking some great trips, having some experiences, spending extra time with loved ones near and far. So I splurged a bit, but after a year or so that "need" died down. I don't regret any of it for a second.
After I got a feeling for the "pace of my disease", I adjusted my projections. I sort of keep it all updated so that I can be confident that I'll still meet my goals, e.g. (modest) inheritance for my heirs.
So I'd encourage you to splurge, take those trips, etc. but of course don't break the bank (sounds like that's not a real concern...).
Let me give a general note here that I think might be important to some members:
***If anyone has a pension, please check to see if there is a lump sum payout option. The monthly benefit is cacl'd based on actuarial mortality tables, and so unless you think you'll outlast the average person your age, it would likely benefit you greatly to take the lump sum and transfer it to a IRA, since the lump sum is calculated using those same tables/longevity assumptions...**. (Sorry, guys, but I just worry that someone might just unwittingly glide into normal monthly pension payouts without looking into this....).
Wishing you the best with your decisions (and great fun on your trips! ).
Lynn
Kdst777 in reply to
Great feedback
kearnan in reply to
Wow, I am impressed. But I never married and have no children or other family, siblings, nieces, nephews, cousins, etc. I have never ever balanced a checkbook. My boss once said to me how can you live like that never using a checkbook? I said unlike you, I dont make in the millions so basically it is rather easy.
Plus, when I was younger and used credit cards (way to get in big trouble) I would always, even if I could afford to pay what I owed in full, the minimum amount. My boss (an attorney) was flabbergasted and said do you realize how much interest you would be paying and tried to convince me NOT to just pay the minimum every month. But I told him, I could go outside and get hit by a truck and I would hate to think that I paid the full amount on my credit card instead of going to a nice expensive NY restaurant or a get away weekend.
I was never good with money. I don't have a love for it or desire. I was never into designer clothes, jewelry, etc. I never wanted to own. I never wanted the responsibility so I have always been a renter. Twice I took off a year from work and used my 401-K and of course had to pay the tax man huge for penalty but I always thought life is short so have as much fun as I can now.
Now, I live just on my SSDI and you would be surprised at how much one can live on once you get used to it. My problem has always been (or really to me it is not a problem) that I live in the moment and don't think too much of the future. If I had been a little better, now that I am not working I would have some money to travel more but I didn't so I am okay with that bc I did alot of traveling in my 40s.
I agree with Flowerfairies2.
Go and enjoy your life now why wait for tomorrow or the next day! Go have fun and use what you have worked hard for all your life! My opinion anyway I would! Take care x
As long as there is enough for Disney money is what I say...I’ve gone 2 times since diagnosis and am planning a larger family trip next summer...Yes I said I’m planning for next summer...So put some away but definitely allow yourself to spend some now...😀
Where is your cancer. I have Mets to my bone so travel would be hard for me. I started a store to raise my for foster care reform. So I took 25 percent of my savings for my MBC fund.that is my play money.
It's in my abdomen. I was very sick before diagnosis but feel great since starting ibrance.
That is great to hear the Ibrance is working so well for you. I know many women who have been on it for years.
I say enjoy yourself! None of us knows how long we will be here... regardless of our dx!
Travel while you feel good and can get travel insurance . Once this pandemic has settled if I was you I would take a year off work ( if possible ) and travel & enjoy life.
Save for the future but enjoy yourself and your family & friends.
I semi retired when I was 55 and have re done our home , landscaping & went on a few trips . I was a little heartbroken to find out I could NOT get travel insurance with a MBC diagnosis so travel out of the country ( Canada ) is too risky for my comfort level now.
I decided I wanted to enjoy my $ and wasn’t going to leave it for my husbands next wife to enjoy lol ( joking but not really ) 😉
Very hard decisions to make .
Luann
I'm new to this site, and this is my first comment. I wondered why you still feel the need for travel insurance? Although I'm a Canadian, I avoid buying insurance whenever I can. (For example, my husband and I stopped paying large house insurance premiums a couple of years ago as we realized our lot was worth much more than our house to prospective buyers who might just tear the house down.) Senior Discovery Tours (it's a Canadian firm) seem to cover most illness-related costs quite well so we did not buy extra insurance when we travelled with it. Once Covid quarantines are mostly over, I intend to resume travelling as long as I'm well enough. I'll go between appointments at the local cancer clinic. If you want to travel somewhere, I say go while you can. What's the worse that can happen?
For me personally I would really hate to get sick in another country require medical help and be faced with large medical expenses that we have to pay out of pocket . I don’t want my family / myself to have to deal with financial burdens . Unfortunately having a pre existing condition I can not get coverage . I have tried several insurance companies with no luck .
I understand your concern. I guess it depends on how long you wish to be away, and how suddenly you might get sick. I figure I can tolerate most sicknesses (medication-related, or otherwise) for the two or three weeks most of our overseas trips take. Since we're not away for months at a time, the chances of my having a serious heart attack or some sort of accident, in the span of a few weeks are rather small. Do check out Senior Discovery Tours which includes medical insurance in its tour costs. I am a bit of a "Why worry, be happy" sort. I hope you find a way to do what you most want to do! Good Luck!
When I went abroad a couple of years ago before the MBC dx, someone in the tour group had a massive heart attack. If he and his wife didn't have travel insurance they would have paid 5 figures for medical care as opposed the the $400 they ended up paying out of pocket. Waaaay worth it. Sadly though as I just found out on this thread, we can't get travel insurance. That is really really a bummer to me as I plan on traveling as much as possible once this Covid thing cools out. Ugghh!
Hi Dancer, anything can happen, of course, but fortunately, it usually doesn't! I simply don't intend to let fears about possibilities limit further (than MBC already does) what the rest of my life will be about. Please do find a way to make your plans happen. Best of Wishes!
I have seen shows on TV (real life documentaries) about people who traveled overseas (and were basically healthy) and did not buy travel insurance. They were horror stories. One family went to Bahamas I believe. They were walking on the beach at night about 100 feet from their hotel when two guys came up to them with masks to rob the mother father, daughter and son who was 17. The son got scared and ran and they shot him. (Thank God he lived). But they would not even treat him bc they did not accept his father's work insurance. They wanted $5,000 in cash upfront. They would not even accept his credit card. He had to run to bank to get the money off his card. They treated him and then told him to give him pain medication and continue to keep him in hospital they needed another $10,000 in cash. He was desperate and they refused to even give his son any pain medication. He had to call his family and friends. He said it was a horror.
Once you are overseas and if you do something as simple as slip and break a leg or a finger, it could wind up costing you thousands of dollars. Until I seen those documentaries, I never did travel insurance. But most countries ONLY accept the travel insurance you pay for when you book a trip.
Google getting sick abroad or something like that. It is a big mistake not to think about travel insurance ESPECIALLY since you already have an illness.
in reply to Thatflowerlady
Not an invalid way of thinking really Luann. True to say spend some and save some. Hubbys telling me she should take the money......he would. 😃🌝. As far as travel insurance goes there are some UK companies that will insure youmbut at a premium. If you are permanent check ups is usually a no go but if the Cancer is stable they will let you take it out but only very near travelling date.
Nowadays it’s hard to spend anything, can’t travel abroad to Europe, long haul is out of the question and really don’t need materialistic things, all we need is good manageable health.
Take care ladies. It’s great reading different advice and opinions even though I’m in the UK.
Enjoy it. You've worked hard so that you can. I was diagnosed metastatic at the age of 51 and have been carefully spending. Not on private jets, mind you, but on things I love that I normally wouldn't buy. I'm 58 now, and don't regret a single thing I've bought!
I'm buying a new couch and sink next week and created a beautiful organic veggie garden in my backyard. I'm splurging a little extra because you can't take it with you and I have been wanting these things for a while now. Making sure I live to enjoy more now because none of us know when our time is up. If it weren't for Covid I would be in the Caribbean right now.
PERFECT!!! I love it.
in reply to Dancer1000
Way to do it 🍒💐🌱🍎🍇🍓🌶🍆🛁. I love our allotmentment. Outdoors, fresh air and the satisfaction of good produce. Well done.
Dancer1000 in reply to
In addition to being great for my health, gardening is also therapeutic. So far I have grown and eaten red kale, collard greens, cucumbers, cilantro, parsley, basil, scallions. I have beets, celery, carrots, cabbage, brussel sprouts, tomatoes, spinach, summer squash and watermelon growing and can't wait till they are ready to harvest.
Also, if you have retired, you can apply for disability. That will enable you to start collecting your social security now and you will qualify for Medicare in 2 years. You've also paid into the Social Security system and have earned the right to benefit from it.
Hi, y’all. I feel sometimes the financial piece of all this overshadows everything. I’m fairly new to this and have found all your postings so very helpful.
I’m 61, still working full time (remote for now) in a high pressure job with long hours. Have the 401K and a nice size life insurance through the firm. Putting through my two wonderful kids through college which is why I’m working so hard. Honestly glad am working from home right now because of the side effects from Ibrance. Sometimes get so fatigued and wonder how long I can do this. Then I will have two good normal weeks. This information is so helpful to know when I can no longer do this. Heartfelt thanks to you all.
I had a very active and tiring job and felt that I had to retire post diagnosis (I was 60)...luckily I was financially able to do so(partly because of my 401K) and I have to say that it has greatly increased my quality of life! I’m able to read for hours, go on long walks, work in my yard....so, if you can be safe financially I would do it. Best of luck, whatever you decide!
Enjoy the money! I was never a saver. I always believed in living in the moment so I never saved much for retirement (so that kind of worked out in a weird way:). Unfortunately, though now I have the time BUT NOT THE MONEY to do more of what I want to do.
But when I was in my 40s, I started traveling. I went alone to Africa, Amazon Rain Forest, Peru, Machu Picchu and then with a coworker did the Europe thing, Italy, France, England, Austria and Switzerland (my favorite). So I was glad I did it them bc physically I could not handle those kind of trips now.
Make a list of things you always wanted to do or maybe go but for one reason or another, you could not. SPEND AWAY....this is the rainy day you were saving it for. But that is me. I kind of wish now I would have saved more but I am doing okay with what I have now and like I said physically I probably could not do some of those trips now. I mean I guess save some, but heck enjoy it , you worked for it.
Kind of ironic. For some "dark" reason now, when I have to renew something like my computer security software, I always now choose one year even though it's cheaper to renew for two. Not that I am scared of it happening, but I would hate to think I paid extra and never got to use it. LOL...
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