Opiod withdrawal advice please

[Jumpey]

I'm currently rotating codeine and tramadol approximately every 4 or 5 months without any withdrawal symptoms. However I only ever use them for 5 days a week. I am considering using them every night but I'm concerned about possible withdrawal symptoms when I need to change drug.Has anyone experienced withdrawal symptoms on opiates after about 4-5 months of daily use?If so was this severe a d how long did the symptoms last?

[Madlegs1]

You are unlikely to get withdrawal symptoms from rotating codeine and tramadol-- they are both opiates.

If you don't get mild withdrawals from the 5 day regime, it sounds like you are on quite a low dose.

What drug regime are you considering if you leave the opiates behind? I would consider them to be at the end of the road. The only options are even stronger opiates, such as methadone, oxycodones and finally fentanyl.

I'll be interested in your reply and the reasoning behind your proposals. 😊

Cheers.

[Jumpey in reply to Madlegs1]

Thanks for your very swift reply. I wondered if I would get withdrawal symptoms because I know that tramadol works slighlty differently than codeine which is why I can maintain their efficacy by rotating them.At least for the time being.

I do take low doses-45mg of codeine and 50mg of tramadol.I would prefer to have some breakthrough symptoms than up the dose with the potential for worse side effects.

I have no plans to change medications at the moment. Ropinerole caused severe insomnia and I couldn't tolerate gabapentin at all. Kratom worked for a while but I had to stop when it triggered gastritis. If I could get hold of cannabis oil with thc I would take it despite it's illegality.

Have you experienced opiod withdrawal and if so how bad was it?x

[Madlegs1 in reply to Jumpey]

You seem to have your strategy well thought out. 👍

I had to come off Fentanyl after a spinal reconstruction. No help from anyone. Took me 18 months. Not a good experience!

" Character making" I think is a term that could be applied!

Good luck.

[Jumpey in reply to Madlegs1]

That sounds horrendous.Glad that's behind you.x

[Hidden]

If you can't tolerate gabapentin and have been using opiates for RLS and want to use one regularly, I have no personal experience, but I have read others that use low dose Methadone and have done for years.

Targinact also is licensed for RLS in the UK.

Tramadol I read can cause augmentation. Codeine's not ideal for RLS.

I do wonder what your rationale for switching between codeine and tramadol is, since as Madlegs says, they're both opiates, you won't get withdrawals through switching.

If you don' switch at all, then again, you won't get withdrawals.

[Jumpey in reply to Hidden]

Cheers very much for the advice.

So what you're saying is you don't think I'll get withdrawals even using them 7 days a week for 5 months?

My reason for switching is that after a while each drug becomes inaffective.If I switch for a few months the medication works again.

I think augmentation is less likely because of rotation.

Are methadone and targinact a lot stronger than tramadol and codeine?If so I would be concerned about possible side effects.x

[Hidden in reply to Jumpey]

You should only get opiate withdrawals if you stop taking them. - both, that is, at the same time.

It's not really my experience, but I believe Targinact and Methadone are more "potent" than Tramadol or Codeine. You may want to check this, but I believe it means they have less side effects for the same effect.

There is probably a good reason for licensing Targinact for RLS rather than T or C.

Unfortunately not particularly good ones..

nice.org.uk/advice/esnm67/c...

Methadone sounds better, but it's not licensed for RLS in the UK.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/155...

I recently read the International RLS Study Group's recommendations which (underwhelmingly) supports the use of M or T for "long term " use.

[Jumpey in reply to Hidden]

I'm very grateful for your help Manerva

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[Phil3819 in reply to Jumpey]

I'm in the UK and as well as having RLS I also have a broken back, I did it many, many years ago. For my back I take 30mg Zomorph, another opioid, twice a day, and for my RLS I take Pregabalin. I take them 7 days a week and have taken them so long that just missing one dose gives me stomach pains, sweats, shivers and a general feeling of unwellness. The pain isn't appreciably worse, but the side effects are not pleasant.

It does sound as though you are maybe on a lower dose if you can go two days without your meds, so in your case, the side effects may not be as severe.

If what you're doing works for you I'd suggest you keep doing it.

All the very best.

Phil.

[Jumpey in reply to Phil3819]

Thanks so much Phil. That's very helpful information. Go well.x

[sweetiepye in reply to Jumpey]

Tramadol is a synthetic opiate so is not as addictive as others and easier to quit. Going back and forth between tramadol and codeine stops addiction from taking place, both will continue to work.I know opiates are a hot mess right now but if you have a knowledgeable physician, you should be fine. It is important to take as directed. Pam

[Jumpey in reply to sweetiepye]

I appreciate your advice.x

[sweetiepye in reply to Jumpey]

Oh , I am not advising you . I can barely manage myself. I'm just passing on information. You should do as I do , which is to verify all information I get online. I cross check what I google also. People have excellent intentions here but, we have to be responsible for ourselves. Having said that , I would still be in the dark if not for lovely knowledgeable people here. I hope that makes sense. Pam

[Jumpey in reply to sweetiepye]

Don't worry I research too and make up my own mind..

[victoriablue]

I was on Tramadol for 10 years coming of them was awful. Took 7 months to wean myself of them.

Hope you find peace.

[Jumpey in reply to victoriablue]

I'm so grateful for your response.It's helped me make a decision not to take opioids full time. Take care.x

[tmshepard35]

Hello Jumpey. I was only on Tramadol, so I cannot say for any other medications, but I was on 50 mg tablets x2 each night for relief from RLS. I never experienced any withdrawal, as I had to stop my RX (was looking to step down originally) due to a change in medical coverage left me unable to refill or get a new RX. I had started looking into kratom and tried it a few times before that incident, but once I could not refill I decided why go back? It's been about 2 months and i feel so much better now that I dont take tramadol. I have been taking it RELIGIOUSLY EVERY NIGHT for about 9 years. Again I can only speak to my experiences. I notice that I dont sweat at night anymore. I take a small glass before bed and if it starts again, I just get up and take another small glass. I take the powder, so I mix it with water. So simple but so effective. I'm so grateful for this group!

[Jumpey in reply to tmshepard35]

Ta for your feedback.Takecare.x

[GuitarAngel]

I was on Tramadol for pain for about four years. I came off them because I was getting hot sweats. I gradually cut my dosage down from five a day to one daily over a month or so. I now take one to two daily to help control pain.

[Jumpey in reply to GuitarAngel]

Hi.Did you experience withdrawal symptoms dping that?x

[Graham3196]

Have you found the intravenous iron infusion that you were looking for a few months ago?

Have you tried the FODMAP diet?

Either or both of these may allow you to eliminate or reduce the drugs. My understanding is that if you reduce the drugs the withdrawal may cause RLS so it might be best to maintain your present level of drugs while trying alternative cures and then reduce the drugs. Can't hurt to give it a try.

[Jumpey in reply to Graham3196]

Cheers for your advice.x

[CORFUORBUST in reply to Graham3196]

How strange...I just weaned off Tramadol with no side effects (see my post below) and I have been on Low FODMAP for many years, maybe that is why I had none...

[Tinabugsu]

Yes it sounds like the reason you're not having withdrawals is because tramadol is an opioid. The only difference is that sometimes people augment on tramadol an opioid other than tramadol. Withdrawal is different for everyone and it depends upon how long you've been taking the medication the dose of your medication what your taper regiment is and your own body chemistry. There's no way to predict exactly what your withdrawal symptoms would be or how long they would go but when it comes to RLS generally opioids are the end of the road and there's no reason to come off of them

[Jumpey in reply to Tinabugsu]

Thanks so much for your respnse. Go well.x

[Tinabugsu]

Also my understanding is that although medical marijuana in certain strains help restless legs I'm not sure that would be the case for someone who is taking opioids and I've never found anyone that it found complete releaf with the medical marijuana so opioids are definitely Superior and way cheaper as medical marijuana is not covered by insurance

[Shumbah in reply to Tinabugsu]

Hi Tinabugsu

I take oxycodone for the dreaded legs 15 mg at night however I have horrendous pain which oxy does not help

The medical marijuana is a life savour for me when it comes to pain

Thank god for this group it is so helpful what works for one does not work for another it gives us options and HOPE 🙂

[Tinabugsu in reply to Shumbah]

Yeah. The methadone doesn't touch my pain either. I think it's too low a dose. But I get trigger point injections and I do Theraband exercises. That keeps my pain manageable. Some days dare I say, it's not there at all!

[CORFUORBUST]

Hi

I have been on Tramadol 50mg for neuro pain for over 5 years. I used to take 2 to 4 a day but now I take 6 a day. They also kept me on this for the RLS as none of the other drugs were suitable for me and I had bad reactions to the ones I did try. So I only take Tramadol and they did prescribe me Melatonin which worked wonderfully for about 6 months and then the morning migraines started so I have given up on those.

I have recently had sugery and was on 8 tramadol a day for 3 months and I started getting these major hot flushes (pouring sweat like a waterfall) and I could not take it any longer as I was permanently 50 degrees hot all the time. Alongside this I had a very disturbing itch, I wanted to get a knife and cut it out of my body as the itching was so severe. I spoke to the GP and she said wean them down slowly and gradually. I am impatient and could not cope so I just removed 1 pill at each point, each week until now I am on nothing. This has taken me only 6 weeks as the 2 extras I was taking for the surgery I didn't count in the process as I was not normally taking 8 .

I have not had one side effect!!

I am now waiting for a GP appointment to get an alternative opiod. I was just going to google what opiods are available in ENGLAND and read the side effects. I have put England in capitals as one cannot now say the UK as Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland all have their own national health services and they are totally different to ours. In Scotland you can get Low Dose Naltrexone, which my friend got and said it's fantastic. It is only available on the Scottish National Health but, the doctor will give it to you, if you live in England, after answering a medical on the phone and then obviously one has to pay ££ for it. I am sorry I cannot remember the exact price as this was a couple of years ago and I cannot even remember what I had for breakfast!!

I am now smoking mary J and using the legal CBD. I am struggling most days and nights but, I just had to get off the Tramadol. If only I could sleep and wake up at 8;30 so I can book a doctor app, but, by the time I am alive it's often gone 10 and they have all gone. I will try again tmr as I need the pain relief so bad now.

I hope some of this helps and good luck with your treatment.

[Jumpey]

Wow that's brilliant that you didn't get withdrawals.Thanks for your response and m7ch good luck.xx

[Sara_2611]

apologies I've never used that drug, but I wish you luck for a complete withdrawal

[BeachGolfer]

I’m not sure why you want to stop taking those medications if they are working. I’m happily on Oxycodone 5mg or slightly less nightly for the restlessness and a benzodiazepine for the insomnia. I augmented on Mirapex and had severe insomnia from Neurontin. I have no plans to withdraw from an opioid that’s working and is a small dose. Also the THC in marijuana keeps me awake though I can take a high dose ( 4x the “recommended starting dose” ) of a high quality full spectrum CBD oil from either hemp or cannabis instead of a benzodiazepine for sleep. I wish you well.

[Jumpey in reply to BeachGolfer]

I don't want to come off.I'm considering taking them 7 days a week.Because I rotate I wondered whether I would experience withdrawal if I took them every day.Go well.x

[involuntarydancer]

Can't comment about Tramadol or Codeine but I did withdraw from oxycontin after taking it at a dose of 30mg per day (which I think is at or near the max daily dose) for a period of several months. I did experience awful withdrawals for about 5 weeks, such that I would be cautious (although not completely averse) to becoming dependent on opioids again. I would still take them if I had no other option.

The main reason I am posting is that another poster (I think her user name was flowergirl) withdrew from opioids on here with the help of micro doses of ldn. She found the ldn (important to do the research - the doses are tiny when used to assist with opioid withdrawal - there is a lot about it online) helped a lot with the withdrawals.

[Jumpey]

Thanks so much ID. Your feedback confirms my decision to stick with my current regime of taking the meds only 5 days a week. Take care

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