How much Fat intake a day on low carb diet? - PMRGCAuk

PMRGCAuk

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How much Fat intake a day on low carb diet?

Jackrowe666
Jackrowe666

Hi as you have probably seen from my other posts, I have started a low carb diet.

I was wondering if anyone else on here who is following a low carb/keto diet can advise what should be an average daily intake of fat and saturated fat? I'm worried in case I might be having far too much. Yesterday I consumed 93.1g fat and 49.3g saturated fat. I managed to stay at 20g of carbs, salt 6.11g, protein 114.8g.

I am not feeling any hunger at all and definitely staying full for longer.

I'm really determined to get this diet right from the beginning so any tips and advice would be welcome. I'm currently on 30mg of Prednisolone and I also take 5mg Amlodipine for and 2.5g Bendroflumethiazide for high blood pressure.

38 Replies
PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador

Not being familiar with your app. I'm assuming your TOTAL fat was 93.1g, of which 49g was saturated which is how it would be reported on the nutritional panel on a food package.

Just had a look - a healthy fat intake is usually taken as up to about 80g which doesn't relate to a keto diet, and that isn't so much less than your total fat intake there. That is the bottom of the range for a low carb keto diet

healthline.com/nutrition/ho...

Maybe work on reducing the saturated fat and replacing it with plant-derived fat like olive oil rather than butter? But remember, because you are eating a lot less carbohydrate, your fat and protein for a 1500 calories intake will look higher.

Jackrowe666
Jackrowe666 in reply to PMRpro

Thanks the app is Nutracheck, and the fat and saturated fat are listed separately, so total fat combined equals 142.7 g😮

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to Jackrowe666

Then you probably do need to plan your meals more carefully in advance so you know what to reduce and what to increase.

Bear in mind that YOU may not need to be as low as 20g fat - Snazzy and I do but many lose weight at a higher carb content, without being in the keto level. I think I would have started at maybe 50g and worked down if necessary. I suspect most of us don't do things quite as scientifically, I know what is carbohydrate and is best avoided and although I use a lot of olive oil, I probably don't eat a tremendous amount of other fat.

tangocharlie
tangocharlie in reply to PMRpro

On keto you need to have carbs below 15 or 20g, moderate protein, around 100g generally depending on your needs, weight etc and plenty of fats.

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to tangocharlie

I know - but the question is does she need to use keto - low carb works well too and that is what we usually suggest. It is next to impossible to get into ketosis when on pred.

Jackrowe666
Jackrowe666 in reply to PMRpro

Well hopefully i will be off pred in a weeks time and i wont have the hunger cravings and revert back to a normal diet with exercise.

Siral
Siral in reply to PMRpro

I eat low carb and am in & out of nutritional ketosis. It’s much less strict than keto but can be just as affective for weight loss & reducing hunger. Being a type 1 diabetic, it also helps me keep blood sugar levels where they should be - even with prednisolone creating a lot of unpredictability.

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to Siral

Exactly - not that I ever check if I'm in ketosis or not.

I need a low salt diet, as well, to stop water retention I.e. less than 1.8g per day, usually work to less than 1 g from fish, cheese etc. If I have a lot of salt i.e. around the 1.5g mark, weight spikes ( 2 + lbs in a day) and ankles swell.

GertG
GertG in reply to RoadTrip

Only on a high carb diet (above the 20 gr per day). Than you have high insuline levels that are causing issues with salt. On keto low carb increased salt intake is needed to avoid dehydraten.

RoadTrip
RoadTrip in reply to GertG

Didn’t know that. I’m very sensitive to salt and whilst cut out main sources of carbs. Still have some fruits (apples and pears ) and sparing choice root vegetables (carrots and swede) so above 20g per day.

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to GertG

Above 20g carbs a day is hardly a "high carb" diet! It is also unlikely to create high insulin levels until you get way above that. High carb is usually classified at above about 225g/day.

GertG
GertG in reply to PMRpro

Should have called it “to high”In modern days we are used to such extreme levels that we find 225 g/d normal. I bed that even when you are healthy your fastening insuline is to high on this level, which is the reason for insuline resistance and a burned out of the pancreas over a long period. Our carb consumption is 10 times higher than 100 years ago. If you are diabetic or afraid to become one due to the prednisone ,20-50 gram (carbs) depending on the person) should be the max, as you are or become carb intolerant. The minimum needed intake of carbs is zero, as it is a not essential nutrient that your body can make when needed. The so called good carbs (fiber) are only needed when you eat a lot of processed foods or eat a lot carbs, as it flattens the insuline spikes a bit. Also when you are vegan, because than you need the microbes in your stomach to make the essential fatty acids. Not needed on a zero carb diet like Carnivore. For the need of fiber look at youtube Paul Mason who did a small clinical trial on it, as there was until than no rigorous research done on this subject.

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to GertG

Mine diet isn't carb heavy - and hasn't been for 10 years, I didn't eat that much carbohydrate even before that.

If you Google keto macros calculator you will find plenty of apps and calculators. The fat is the most important part and you need to eat up to your TDEE (Total Daiy Energy Expenditure), it's important not to cut calories. Most people stick butter in things - even bullet proof coffee. I have dabbled in keto from time to time but not doing it at the moment, just general low-carbs. dietdoctor is a useful website, and ditch the carbs. Let me know how you get on as I want to do keto again soon, but I need to reduce my steroids first.

Thanks for update, out of interest what is your daily carb in take at the moment? I was thinking slightly upping my carbs to 25mg so i can include an apple in my diet, feeling a bit tingly in my hands this morning so not sure if its diet or reducing Pred by 10mg.

I don't measure strictly, I just generally avoid sugar and all processed food, never have pasta as there is no nutrition in it at all so what's the point, very occasionally the odd slice of rye bread or sweet potato, and porridge oats maybe once a week. Apples, pears and berries in moderation - say 2 or 3 times a week - all lower carb than other fruit. I will go back to keto in a few weeks, might try two weeks on and two weeks off as read in Michael Mosley's books that is also effective, I think it's called the Matador study medicalxpress.com/news/2019...

I have read so many books on what to eat and it's still so confusing and often contradictory- currently reading Tim Spector's The diet myth which is a bit technical for me. I joined various keto groups on Facebook and some of the stories are really inspiring. I have to eat low histamine food for allergies, low carbs to keep blood sugars low on Pred, and the rest to try and build a diverse gut biome, masses of varied veg and a bit of fruit. Also probiotics. I think it's working but at this stage it's a matter of trusting the process. All the best

Thank you thats really useful will take a look at alternating weeks 👍

I find it easier, rather than think about what I'm cutting out, to base meals on low carb <20g , moderate protein eg a bit of meat or fish, and good fats, like olive oil, butter, nuts, avocado, MCT oil, flaxseed oil, good quality cheese. If you cook new potatoes and eat them cold or reheat them the starch turns into a long chain fatty acid which is low carb and high pre-biotic so I might have a few of them once a fortnight, eg a salad of new potatoes, a dab of mayo, tuna, mixed veg like green beans and carrot. I'm maintianing my weight despite high steroids but not yet losing, I don't think that will happen until I am back below 10 Pred. Blood sugar levels are good though, so are other blood tests so I'm happy with that for now. Keep me posted on your progress.

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to tangocharlie

"never have pasta as there is no nutrition in it at all"

I think that is a bit sweeping! Fresh pasta has a fair level of protein and fibre.

tangocharlie
tangocharlie in reply to PMRpro

Maybe the fresh stuff from Italy does, but not the bags of dried white stuff that comes from supermarkets, it's just durum wheat and semolina with a shelf life of about 3 years, which doesn't class as food in my book

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to tangocharlie

Italians seem to live a long time eating pasta asciutta ... ;)

tangocharlie
tangocharlie in reply to PMRpro

Maybe it's more the wine and lifestyle? :) LOL

Paperroses
Paperroses in reply to PMRpro

Im with you....grew up on pasta. still eat it. My grandparents came from Sicily.

Hello fellow PMR and Keto dieters!

I am one of you too! And the latest is that My PMR has pushed me over the limit snd I am now a Type 2 diabetic!! What more can go wrong?

I began Keto in November, got PMR in January, diabetes in February. So I managed to lose about 9lbs early on, but now, although I am sticking rigidly to the diet, I have plateaued and do not seem to be losing any more weight. I suppose it is the steroids that is stopping it as well as all the other drugs I am on.

This is so frustrating and debilitating. Am I having too much fat, I ask myself? Not good for one’s heart – also have AF. The diabetes people are recommending I have a low carb diet but once I have any more carbs – on goes the weights again. I am even now walking up to 2 miles a day but nothing seems to make any difference.

Can anyone help with this conundrum we dieters face who also have a lot of drugs please?

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to Silver-Babe

You aren't Type 2 diabetic in the usual sense - you have steroid induced diabetes which has a different underlying cause: pred makes your liver release random spikes of glucose from muscle stores and it pushes up the average level of blood glucose and so the Hba1c increases to pre- or even diabetic levels. There is still plenty of insulin - and it turns excess carbs into fat. All you can do is cut the carbs that you can control and be patient - as the pred dose falls, it should improve again.

Silver-Babe
Silver-Babe in reply to PMRpro

Well Ambassador, how right you are! Because I am pleased to tell you that today, on receiving my latest blood test result, my ESR is down from 40 to 12! I just can't believe it and my doctor says it is because of the 15mg of Pred, which I've been taking for two months. It does seem to have gone down a huge amount. Is this usual so soon?

So, I have been told to reduce it to 12 1/2 mg from tomorrow and hope it's the beginning of the end.

Also as you so rightly say, my Hba1c is also down to 46 from 49 (48 being the critical point) so it really is good news today!

I will now be patient but thank you for the reassurance!

PMRpro
PMRproAmbassador in reply to Silver-Babe

The ESR can fall within days - everyone is different. And well done on the Hba1c! Good luck with the drop - but it might be worth having a look at the slowed tapers in the Pinned Posts.

GertG
GertG in reply to Silver-Babe

I don't use any drugs yet, as I believe that finding my cause of PMR should be priority. Meanwhile taking the pain for granted. Our bodies are beautifull designed but can not handle all the changes it encounters in the last decade at the same time. Envirement, newly introduced foods, eating all the foods during the year etc. PMR is a signal from your body that something is of. Knocking with a big hammer on your immuunsystem (pred) whitout trying to understand and correct what is wrong can lead to a cascade of issues. If you have a good doctor he will try to figure out with you what the cause it. One member on this blog pointed to statins. Are you using them? Also it takes a long time for your body to undo all the bad things we did with our bodies. I am more than 4 years in my search and solved already 24 health issues without medication. But six months ago I got PMR and still didn't cured it, altough I have an idea what caused it, but will take much more time to cure. Try to live healthy, eleminate all possible causes, do your own research , give your self time to heal, stay positive and never give up.

On Facebook forums for keto diet many people who complain they plateau are advised to INCREASE their fats. We have all been brought up to believe (falsely) that fat is the enemy whereas it was sugar all along, and the meat industry took the rap while the sugar and processed food industry and manufacturers of diabetes and anti-cholesterol meds laughed all the way to the bank

Thank you Tangocharlie. If you look at my reply above to Ambassador,you will see I have had some good news today.

As you say, we have all been brought up on years of 'low-fat' diets and it is encouraging that high fat diets actually helps us lose weight..... somehow it doesn't make sense!

Do not worry about saturated fat as long you are on low carb.. There is no rigorous science to put an upper limit on it. The recommendations are even bases on fraudulent research from Ancel Keys that die out slowly. But avoid vegetable oils. Look on youtube Chris Knobbe Diseases of civilization and David Diamond Demonizing and deceptions in cholesterol research.

On Keto at least 70 % should come from fat. On Carnivore even 80 %. If you eat to much fat you might loose less fast weight. Be moderate with protein. If you eat to much on a day or to much during one meal you might convert it to carbs, get out of ketosis, gain wait and get cravings again. Was for 4 years on Keto and 5 months now on Carnivore. Now mainly fatty beef, tallow and butter. I got my daily max. and meal max. for protein from dietdoctor.com (on the free part of their website). Was on Keto on 2 meals a day. On Carnivore this got me in problems as I eat to much protein at once with 2 meals. I now spread my meat consumption in 3 meals with 4 hours in between and got salvation.

Fat should be your energy source and see protein as building blocs for your body not as fuel.

Jackrowe666
Jackrowe666 in reply to GertG

Very informative, thank you.

Dr. Aseem Malhotra, cardiologist and member of the Public Health Collaboration, o

Association of Physicians states that recommendations that promote a diet

"low fat" is perhaps the biggest mistake in medical history

modern, with devastating consequences for public health ".

"Eat fat to be lean. Don't be afraid of fat. Fat is your friend..

I’m afraid I would struggle with the scientific approach & am relying in the Fast 800 recipes which use olive oil on the whole. Have lost 5kg in 6 weeks which is fine with me. Cholesterol has been reduced & bmi.

I highly recommend The Fast 800 programme. They work everything out for you, provide a meal plan for the week plus a shopping list. I don't have to think of how much fat/protein.

I have lost 14k since October and am now off my Diabetes Type 2 drugs and have a normal HBa1c.

Pollyanna16
Pollyanna16 in reply to IdasMum

That’s great IdasMum,so glad to hear of another person using the Fast800. I’m now getting a bit more adventurous & using the recipe book to swop things around a bit after 6 weeks. Looks like you are losing weight at a similar rate to me.

For anyone interested I have just found this brilliant group. Lots of advice and support on their Facebook group too.

ketofitnessclub.com

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