Curing Patients Is Bad for Business. Mi... - Cure Parkinson's

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Curing Patients Is Bad for Business. Milton Packer describes the end result of profit-dominated drug development. (We're f*cked.)

MBAnderson profile image
58 Replies

"The potential to deliver 'one shot cures' is one of the most attractive aspects of gene therapy, genetically-engineered cell therapy and gene editing. However, such treatments offer a very different outlook with regard to recurring revenue versus chronic therapies.... While this proposition carries tremendous value for patients and society, it could represent a challenge for genome medicine developers looking for sustained cash flow."

The translation: if you develop a new drug that cures people rapidly, then patients will not need to take the drug on an ongoing basis, and that limits the amount of money a company can make.

The analyst asks: "Is curing patients a sustainable business model?"

medpagetoday.com/blogs/revo...

(the opinions expressed here are those of the author only and do not reflect the views of this station or its management.)

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58 Replies
Blackfeather profile image
Blackfeather

Long term disease management is where the money is at. Profit over people. Its the prevailing business model of the medical industry.

alexask profile image
alexask in reply to Blackfeather

Exactly this. Just imagine if they actually found a cure for Parkinson's or Type 1 diabetes - all those specialized doctors would have nothing to do. The US medical system is the most disgraceful racket in the world.

KERRINGTON profile image
KERRINGTON in reply to Blackfeather

I agree..other than the polio vaccine from the 50's, name 1 other major disease which has found a cure since then.

parkie13 profile image
parkie13

Thank you for posting. Everybody should read this article not just a us Parky's. The comments at the end of the article are interesting too.

GymBag profile image
GymBag

Sorry but I can not support this hypothesis. Collusion to keep people sick for profit. Delusional paranoia based on the belief that somebody else must be responsible for my disease, all we have to do is find him and make him stop.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to GymBag

Have you ever heard of big corporations colluding to allow toxins into the environment - making people sick? Examples of that would fill the Library of Congress. How about colluding to distort the housing market to cause an economic collapse? The amount of harm and devastation that occurred during the financial collapse to families didn't seem to stop them. The examples of corporations colluding to increase their profits is their central business.

Bolero profile image
Bolero in reply to GymBag

The article was attempting to illustrate that drug companies are not highly motivated to research and produce "one shot cures". I didn't, however, gain the impression from it that any blame for society's illnesses individually or collectively rested on them. Rather that it suited them not to have one shot cures for obvious profit margin reasons.

Buffricho profile image
Buffricho in reply to GymBag

O Know

GymBag profile image
GymBag

No I have not , please give concrete examples, not general unsubstantiated statements.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to GymBag

Pesticides such as Roundup probably cause Parkinson's. I got my Parkinson's from the 2, 4 D in Agent Orange, i.e., a defoliant, i.e., environmental toxin. This defoliant, 2, 4D, was sold and used in America.

Taxpayers have spent billions on the Superfund sites cleaning up toxic dumps. Why do you suppose we passed the clean air and Clean Water Act? The Environmental Protection Agency was created precisely because of big corporations putting toxic chemicals in the environment. I'm actually stunned that you you challenge the premise of big corporations knowingly allow toxins into the environment.

GymBag profile image
GymBag

Would you please point me towards the study that showed "Pesticides such as Roundup cause Parkinson's" are you just making this up as you go along?

Ajssister profile image
Ajssister in reply to GymBag

FLINT, MICHIGAN

C’mon, everybody knows about the water in Flint... That’s about as concrete as it gets.

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to Ajssister

everyone knows about Flint assumes that if what happens in the US is known world wide ....

GymBag profile image
GymBag

This is all BS supported by lies and more BS

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to GymBag

The Veterans Administration was sued to recognize Agent Orange as a cause of Parkinson's and after years of scientific evidence, they lost that lawsuit. They now spend tens of billions of dollars a year treating veterans who Parkinson's from a wide variety of toxins in the environment. Every major Parkinson's organization like the Michael J Fox and the national Parkinson's foundation all agree a likely trigger Parkinson's is from environmental toxins. The number of studies is overwhelming.

You're not serious? You must be pulling my leg? Are you actually saying it's a lie that big corporations knowingly put neurological damaging toxins in the environment?

GymBag profile image
GymBag

Agent orange caused a type of PD just as Welders get a type of PD and non of that puts any more light on your statement that Roundup causes Parkinsons or that companies are conspiring to keep them that way. Lots of statements sound very reasonable and are easy believable fitting into what people want to believe but that does not make them true. You state something and then make a wild disconnected conclusion and then say therefore and we are led down another path of crap. You make me so angry at your irresponsibility.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to GymBag

I fully acknowledge that scientists must still say they do not know exactly what causes parking, but saying there is no proof the corporations intentionally put toxins in the environment for the sake of profits is like looking down the barrel of the smoking gun and saying, "I didn't actually see the bullet come out, so I can't really prove that one did."

To be clear, I believe, big corporations knowingly, intentionally, and willfully sell products that are carcinogenic and cause cancer, neurodegenerative disease, and all kind of illness.

I can't believe it. I can't believe I actually got sucked into debating whether not big corporations are perfectly willing to harm people for the sake of their profits. Maybe I'm asleep and this is just a bad dream. This Parkinson's must be doing more damage to my brain than I thought.

park_bear profile image
park_bear in reply to GymBag

I have read through both sides of this argument. GymBag, I have to give you a point on technicalities - actual collusion between corporations remains unproven. However, there is plenty of bad behavior by Big Pharmas to conceal both serious adverse effects and lack of efficacy of medications. For example, Fosamax has been shown in large epidemiological studies to actually increase hip fracture risk rather than decrease it. I documented this and other misbehavior at length in When Good Doctors Prescribe Bad Medicine at tinyurl.com/zvgcu79. I can also point you to a propaganda piece, disguised as impartial medical information, for dopamine agonists.

In addition, exposure to the household pesticide permethrin trebles the risk of Parkinson's. I documented this in Parkinson's and Pesticides, here: tinyurl.com/y8tckmx4

So there is more than enough bad corporate behavior to go round. The whole collusion argument seems to me to be beside the point.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to park_bear

I agree with you and I agree with Bolero, i.e., I didn't see the article as being about collusion, but instead making the point that a pharmaceutical company stands to gain more revenue from a drug that has to be taken for 20 years, than from a drug that will cure an illness -- which may inform the direction of their research and development. It doesn't endear big Pharma to us, but they are actually entitled to pursue a business model that's profitable.

I was disagreeing with the position that big corporations don't lie for profit. Of course they do and everybody knows it.

For what it's worth, GymBag, I don't single out the corporations. The Catholic Church lies, politicians lie, the government lies, the police lie, the president lies, the media lie, bankers lie, lawyers lie, etc. The only people who don't lie are teachers and nurses.

GymBag profile image
GymBag in reply to park_bear

As soon as he said that he "believed" than the whole discussion changed , once it comes down to belief and is a semi religion all fact, rational scientific method , and truth go out the door and there is no sense discussing it further as nothing will sway his belief and others of the faith will now join him. This is exactly how Global warming came about. Just say whatever it takes until people believe you.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to GymBag

GymBag, really?

Okay, I'll change that. It's not that I believe big corporations lie, I'll assert as an unequivocal fact that they lie-vociferously, all the time, about everything.

You indicate some reverance for the rational scientific method. Climate change is the scientific method. It's numerical statistics. It's data. It's mathematical equations. It's like 2+2 = 4.

I've yet to understand what it is that the climate change deniers believe thousands of scientists all over the world are trying to accomplish by lying about global warming. Please explain. I've heard climate change deniers say that "climate change" is a hoax (ala Trump) just to raise taxes on Americans. Is that true?

Ajssister profile image
Ajssister in reply to park_bear

I think Gymbag is stuck on the word ”collusion”....

KERRINGTON profile image
KERRINGTON in reply to GymBag

Sorry, but all the info MBAnderson has given you has been documented hundreds of times. Just google what he has said and you will see. Tons of environmental studies..look at the simple plight of the honey bee due to pesticides.

GymBag profile image
GymBag

It would seem to be

You believe what you want

Ajssister profile image
Ajssister in reply to GymBag

Yes it would seem that YOU do.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson

"SUMMARY

Environmental influences have long been suspected to play a role in neurodegenerative diseases. This is particularly true with PD, where there is a wealth of epidemiological studies linking environmental exposures to the disease. Additionally, multiple relevant environmentally linked neurotoxicants produce behavioral and pathological features of human PD."

academic.oup.com/toxsci/art...

"The known adverse effects of chemical substances on the human nervous system and special sense organs probably cover the waterfront of the combined disciplines of neurology, psychiatry, ophthalmology, and otorhinology, not to mention significant chunks of internal medicine."

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK2...

JohnPepper profile image
JohnPepper

I understand the Drug companies, who are all in business to make money. I do not understand the doctors who are happy to accept nice invitations to 'conferences' to be held in exotic places. I know doctors work hard and need a lot of R & R, but professionalism comes into play here.

I am convinced that if we were all to get rid of heavy metals from our bodies we might all feel a great deal better!

Greenday profile image
Greenday

Substances such as Lead in gasoline & paint, Mercury in dentals amalgams and harmful toxins, have been used worldwide for decades knowningly that are hazardous for human health. The makers of leaded gasoline systematically suppressed information about the severe health hazards of their product for decades.

* Association of cumulative lead exposure with Parkinson's disease.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/279...

These findings, using an objective biological marker of cumulative lead exposure among typical PD patients seen in our movement disorders clinics, strengthen the evidence that cumulative exposure to lead increases the risk of PD.

Association between History of Dental Amalgam Fillings and Risk of Parkinson's Disease:

* The patients exposed to dental amalgam fillings were 1.583 times more likely to have PD afterward compared to their non-exposed counterparts after adjusting for comorbidities and CCI scores.

hindawi.com/journals/omcl/2...

* Parkinson's disease and pesticides: A meta-analysis of disease connection and genetic alterations.

In conclusion, this meta-analysis provides evidence that pesticide exposure is significantly associated with the risk of PD and alterations in genes involved in PD pathogenesis.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/284...

* Occupational pesticide use and Parkinson's disease in the Parkinson Environment Gene (PEG) study.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/287...

Our findings provide additional evidence that occupational pesticide exposures increase PD risk. This was the case even after controlling for other sources of pesticide exposure. Specifically, risk increased with occupational use of carbamates, organophosphorus, and organochlorine, as well as of fungicides, herbicides, or insecticides. Interestingly, some types of Personal protective equipment use may not provide adequate protection during pesticide applications.

But no worries, big pharma is repurposing drugs to "cure" the disease such as Nilotinib which if it is proved to be effective, it may cost at least $3,000/month based on current prices.

Of course some may not care what might have caused their disease, but those with families, kids, grandchildren should care about their next generation well-being and healthy environment.

Motherfather profile image
Motherfather

well pk has always been here some day there will be a cure im sure of that .so no good getting up set about the whys and why nots.just take things a day at a time.no one knows what causes it so why worry.

Condor13 profile image
Condor13

The pharmaceutical industry is not perfect, but it has developed most of the drugs in use today, to the benefit of millions, including me. I would be immobile if not for the PD drugs.

Let’s give credit where it is due.

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to Condor13

I agree, but how many drugs treat the cause instead of symptoms? For the last 50 years PD patients depend mainly on synthetic levodopa drugs to treat symptoms but do nothing for the disease itself. Meanwhile hundreds of promising treatments have been ditched because of the lack of funding or depend on the goodwill of non profit foundations.

Ever wonder why Dr Costantini's Thiamine treatment showed such success in clinical trials but has never been published on big media and currently relatively unknown? The profit margin is small I guess.

I believe the real cure will come from a stem or gene therapy possibly by a scientific group rather than the big pharma. However most of those groups are underfunded which considerably slows down any research.

Condor13 profile image
Condor13 in reply to Greenday

If we only knew the cause, of course we could go for it. If we don’t now the cause, then better treat the symptoms than do nothing .

I am dismayed by the paranoia and ill-will shown towards the pharmaceutical industry.

Dr. Costantini is free to publish his results.

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to Condor13

I partially agree, but even more paranoia exist against supplements and alternative treatments. How many specialists know Mucuna pruriens (Zandopa) ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/150... and its ability to cause less dyskinesia or serious side effects compared to the conventional drugs. How many Specialist suggest B12, Folate, B6 to lower homocysteine levels which usually high in PD Patients ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/278...? How many Specialist advice Vitamin D supplementation which usually low in PD Patients ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/289...? How many specialist do advice that certain type of exercises can bring improvements in PD symptoms parkinson.org/Understanding... ? PD patients need to scour pubmed and scientific journal to obtain such info.

Dr Costantini Study was published in 2015 ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/265... . He successfully treated 50 PD patients with high doses of thiamine and with no side effects, however besides of few references, his study received minimum publicity; almost no-one bothered. And his successful study was just an example, many other studies with promising results have been ditched due to lack of interest and funding.

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to Greenday

Paranoia is the irrational and persistent feeling that people are 'out to get you'.

Honestly, are the medical profession now gripped by paranoia about supplements and alternatives? Why would they be paranoid? I just see a lack of interest in any treatment not evidenced based.

The references you give are not proof so much as preliminary findings, and medical practice is not based on this, one study of 50 people for example is not proof enough . Yes the studies certainly may turn out to be significant in time. And yes drug companies are profit driven. But we also have wonderful researches in Europe including UK that are not employed by big pharma. I think the answer will come from them.

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to Hikoi

What pharma and med community can tell to all those patients who develop terrible dyskinesia and complications, those that don’t respond to conventional drugs or those with MSA & PD syndromes who don’t respond to any levodopa treatment? What’s the alternative for them? Besides any wonder therapies, wherever those will come from, they won't be available until 10 years or more by now, when it will be too late for many, and possibly come at a high price tag, which most insurance companies won’t be able to cover anyway.

Part of the medical community conveniently avoid to think out of the box and to accept a Holistic approach against the diseases (medicines, nutrition, exercise, lifestyle), instead they resort to drug prescriptions which only deal with certain symptoms for 5-12 years before more serious symptoms appear.

The practice of just prescribing drugs and not advising for any lifestyle / nutritional changes, dismisses important facts about the disease, and ultimately the patients themselves.

The following is the holistic approach that will work for most patients:

- Request UPDRS examination after every visit (rarely see that happens)

- Thorough Physical, Motor, Cognitive Examination

- Request blood exams for any deficient / insufficient or excessive levels of Vitamins (D, B12, B6, Folate) (magnesium, zinc, calcium, iron), Electrolytes and certain Amino-acids (glutathione, homocysteine) that more likely to exist in PD patients based on current findings.

- Correct any deficient / insufficient or excessive levels of nutrients through nutrition or supplementation. It is common sense that high homocysteine and deficient levels of Vitamin minerals, electrolytes and amino-acids are detrimental to human health and don’t need any evidence based medicine to correct any imbalances that may exacerbate the disease.

- Request a heart examination as heart is one of the richest organ in mitochondria. PD is associated to mitochondria disfunction and it's likely to affect other organs as well.

- Request Liver enzymes blood exams, as drugs and disease may affect the liver function.

- Measure Blood Pressure (high/low Blood pressure is an issue for many PD patients that complain for nausea, tachycardia and other symptoms)

- Discuss with specialist any alternative medicines to deal with persisting symptoms. For example some Patients benefit from Gabapentin for neuropathic pain caused by PD, even though it is not approved for this purpose.

- Discuss with specialist life-style changed such as certain exercises that may improve balance, rigidity and quality of life, nutritional habits, socializing practices

- Discuss with your specialist other experimental treatments (i.e Vielight Therapy)

- Discuss with specialist any natural alternative treatment as prevention, delaying strategy or to treat persisting symptoms, when conventional medicines fail or not adequate (i.e. thiamine, mucuna treatment). They may be effective or not but rarely come with serious side effects and the patients have nothing to lose, only to gain if proved effective.

- Discuss with your specialist other complication of the disease which cannot be solved by PD drugs alone i.e constipation. Certain probiotic strains or nutritional changes may be beneficial for healthier bowel movement.

Regarding Dr Costantini’s Thiamine treatment is one of the many examples of how alternative treatments are highly undervalued and underfunded compared to the experimental medicines. I really doubt if any larger clinical trial will ever take place to verify his findings. His study received almost no publicity which is a big shame considering such impressive findings. Therefore I'm questioning the faireness behind such practices, as patients will only benefit from having more treatments to choose whether from conventional drugs or alternative treatments.

The few references I provided act as an example. There are hundreds of more studies and met-analysis of multiple studies with strong evidence that low levels of certain Vitamins, Minerals and amino-acids and high homocysteine levels are present in many health conditions including PD, but it is out of scope of this thread to analyze all those, which anyone can search on and retrieve from pubmed and other scientific journals. There is undeniable evidence that the lack of nutrients is detrimental to human health, it can develop health conditions and can exacerbate existing ones.

There are many other human studies providing strong evidence that certain exercises or a combination of those can improve balance and quality of life. Doing nothing is a personal option, but advising otherwise serves no-one.

in reply to Greenday

Ditto: "Dr Costantini’s Thiamine treatment is one of the many examples of how alternative treatments are highly undervalued..."

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to Greenday

Heavens Greenday

I have no intention of asking my doctor to advise on nutrition and alternative therapies just as I wont ask nutitionists and alternative therapist to advise on drug treatment. Each has their area of expertise.

Aactually one of the neuros in the team I see has just completed research on differing diets in pd (no published results yet) as he believes it is significant but there is very little research to back this up.

And yes I’ve read widely on non motor symptoms you mention, and have had most if not all the tests you recommend.

I have not yet met anyone who has reversed or cured their pd through alternative therapy.

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to Hikoi

If the doctor can communicate with the nutritionist and vice versa then you may replace "doctor" with "specialist". PD is a very serious disease, to be treated as a just as a dietary disorder: meds can interact with supplements and supplements with meds, it is of paramount importance that all parts involved in treatment should communicate to each other, this way can only benefit the patient and avoid any possible adverse reactions. I personally met doctors who are more informed about PD, mucuna and nutrition than the nutritionists themselves.

I don't know which country you talking about, but in my country only licensed doctors can request blood check-up for nutrients. No one talked about cure with current alternative means (or medicines), these are your own words which you keep repeating to possibly degrade the importance of many alternative treatments.

The discussion is not whether to ditch medicines over alternative treatments but to complement each other, basically to better control the symptoms and possibly delay the progression of the disease. Increasing the pool of option it will only benefit the patients.

I physically know people, and mainly from my family circle, who successfully managed their symptoms via exercise, nutrition & less by medicines and am talking about more serious diseases such as MSA where levodopa meds turn out almost useless. You may also find multiple such examples on this forum such as Silvestrov healthunlocked.com/user/sil... managed to almost halt the progression of PD for many years with supplementation. John Pepper healthunlocked.com/user/joh... managed to control his symptoms with certain exercises and techniques and many others in this forum reversed certain symptoms with thiamine, mucuna and other treatments

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to Greenday

Excellent point, i.e., this is not a prescription drug versus non-drug regimen question. The question is whether not you should/need to add prescription drugs to your non-drug regimen.

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to Greenday

There needs to be agreement on PD diagnosis, to discuss the success of interventions and self diagnosis doesnt cut it with me.

I dont believe Silverstrom has ever been diagnosed with PD.

Despite his claims John Pepper does not have PD he has essential tremor. He had a mid life crisis and he was depressed. What helps lift depression, exercise, getting rid of stress, antidepressents and time. What cured JP walking, giving up work, time and selegiline - a med usd for PD but actually an antidepressant which metabolises to amphetamine. Not one neurologist has publicly supported his claims. No one else has had success with his regime in the long term.

Though you mention many on this forum have reversed some symptoms I have been reading this forum since it started about 8 yrs ago. I cant think of anyone. Just recently some subjective anecdotes maybe, they would need to be sustained in the longer term to be valid.

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to Hikoi

Hikoi, I may be wrong about this, but I believe Silvestrov/Rich says he is symptom-free. No?

Regrettably, I can't remember who, but someone who does serious, aerobic exercise, often twice a day, said they were symptom-free. (That doesn't count, I know, until or unless I can find the post.) How about if we asked that question in a new thread?

Another participant in this forum said he is healthier now than he was when he was diagnosed, which I know is not exactly symptom-free, but not bad. sunvox says he is symptom-free, but that may not count because he has SCA1. Same for John Pepper.

I do believe a person who could do a solid hour or 2 of serious aerobic, exercise 7 days a week would likely be symptom-free. I'm a long way away from that, but I'm working towards it.

PS. Whoops. I wrote this post before I read Greenday's post above.

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to MBAnderson

I agree MBA this thread is not about prescrption meds v alternatives. Nor do I think it is really about whether one needs to add drugs to ones non drug regime. it is about the evil big pharma and what appears to be a conspiracy to keep us unwell. Though I’m sure we would agree on some things, like GymBag It is the unsubstantiated claims and inflated rhetoric that I object to.

.... big corporations colluding to allow toxins into the environment - making people sick? ...

Really, they actually are deliberately making us unwell? i presume so they can make profits on medicine to treat us!

..... How about colluding to distort the housing market to cause an economic collapse ....

Well in my country recently, it is government legislation that has allowed the housing market to be drastically distorted - so that is the democratic process. Companies just saw opportunities, we like go getters and we reward entrepeneurs.

Yes drug companies are profit driven, but isnt that the Friedman economic model followed in the US and elswhere. So we should be as critical of economics and the hands off free market approach that has allowed multinationals so much power and so little responsibility.

In some places and circumstances i believe the developed world has lost its ethical compass.

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to Greenday

GreenDay

I have re read this post begining

“What pharma and med community can tell to all those patients who develop terrible dyskinesia and complications, those that don’t respond to conventional drugs or those with MSA & PD syndromes who don’t respond to any levodopa treatment?”

and I find i do agree in general with much of what you have written. I think health is about wellbeing, to quote WHO 1948 definition “Health is a state of complete physical, mental and social well-being and not merely the absence of disease or infirmity.“

I think a wholistic approach to our wellbeing is the right way but I dont lay the blame for that not happening just at medics door. Nor do I expect them to be expert in or promote alternatives they believe are unproven.

It is all more complex than the apparent idea that pharma and the medical industry are working against us.

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to Hikoi

There are great initiatives from some medical institutions to introduce alternative therapies for PD patients in combination with their conventional treatments. A great example a hospital in Florida introduced Tai-Chi and Qi-Gong classes for their PD Patients. We should praise all those efforts instead of condemning as useless or unapproved, patients have the last say after all. More hospitals should take similar initiatives as they don't need any pharma approval to do so.

youtu.be/BWAWSXZpr5c

youtu.be/aO7RjzbxFHA

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to Greenday

Yes, presuming one lives in an affluent country where the health care system has resources for this.

GymBag profile image
GymBag

Is Dr Costantini under attack by the conspiracy too? So the Big Media is involved in collusion also . My god where will it end, what will save us ? Next the Big Church will be involved I bet. Where does the skull and bones club fit into this or the Illuminati ,I bet they are involved . One world government , Big Government selling drugs through Big Pharmaceutical to everyone . Global warming and now this.

President Trump, will fix it, he can do it , we all need to write him and explain what is happening , OR do you think he already knows . HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Have it your way, I give up HAAHAHAHAAH

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to GymBag

Nilotinib treated 8 patients in an uncontrolled with no placebo group study and it was all over media and finally received a big funding and exposure. Dr Costantini treated 50 patients with Thiamine and with no reported side effects and except for few references, no-one bothered. That's the fact!

There is no real conspiracy, just the need for more profits, that's the purpose of sustaining a profitable business after all, right? What makes one business more profitable, one time customers or returning customers? Why do you think you have been breathing lead for 50 years while the industry successfully tried to suppress any information against its use? Soil, air and waters have been contaminated with lead, cadmium, mercury and many other harmful substances for many years to come and many generations to pay the consequences. By the way, L-Dopa, which currently used for the treatment of PD was invented by an Austrian biochemist, not any big pharma. Supporting independent scientific groups and scientists will finally bring the cure.

GymBag profile image
GymBag in reply to Greenday

Finding a substance ( Carbadopa) that would carry the Ldopa into the brain past the membrane was done in The United States of America . Up to that point the Ldopa was useless. I will find his name for you.

Building on Hornykeiwicz's work, a few years later neurologist George Cotzias, at the Brookhaven National Laboratory on Long Island, New York, began trials of an oral form of L-DOPA. His 1968 New England Journal of Medicine paper, reporting a successful two-year study on 28 patients, made the pages of Time magazine. The US Food and Drug Administration approved the drug in 1970.

danfitz profile image
danfitz in reply to GymBag

Do you think the tobacco companies were innocents too?

GymBag profile image
GymBag

vimeopro.com/user60766261/r...

At one time tobacco was considered medication and was supported by government and health care but is now much like the coffee and tea and bacon and cane sugar and chocolate and venison and everything else you find so terrible that must be banned or regulated in the imaginary world that you are building. Conspiracy, collusion, and fear thats all you need to gather a group around you and take action against people and companies that in the end are the only ones that gave you any hope, American Pharma , they have the researchers paid real money. The capitalist system works but how many shares in these Big Pharma companies do you own , how rich are they, because if I thought any of this was true I would be buying shares but you know what , they are just not a good money making investment and they carry a lot of risk. and the amount of time before a competitors knock off of your drug is legal to ruin your patent and all your investment is very short. Try giving them another 10 years of patent rights and see how motivated they become and then I will invest in them and you will also.

It is so easy to pick a target and make this shit up all the time portraying yourself as being the victims . Your socialist, elite , blame someone else anti-everything system produces what ? CRAP

GymBag profile image
GymBag

I copied this from the discussion section of the Link you provided on the very first page:

"

04.18.2018— Milton Packer

The response to today's post has been unusually robust and rapid, and I thank very sincerely all who have commented.

I truly hope that everyone realizes that my posts have an intentional sarcastic writing style. They are intended to convey a message, but my hypotheticals are not to be taken literally.

In my post, I have identified a problem, and I would like to propose a solution. Innovation should be rewarded, but greed should not be. Asking the government to directly oversee drug development and research is NOT the answer.

Let me pose a simple idea.

Allow everyone including the government to negotiate the price of new drugs and devices directly with those that develop them, and in addition, please eliminate the "benefits managers" who act as intermediaries and make huge profits without any transparency.

Now the US pays exorbitant prices for new drugs that are available in other countries at 1-10% of the cost. And because of this, we are receiving suboptimal care in therapeutic areas outside of cancer and rare diseases.

This simple solution would dramatically change the current financial equation.

All comments are most welcome.

Milton

"my hypotheticals are not to be taken literally:

Hikoi profile image
Hikoi in reply to GymBag

GymBag

fortune.com/2017/01/21/mall...

Trump says it so it must be true! 😁

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to Hikoi

An 85,000% price increase for a vial of medicine for child epileptics at $34,000 apiece!!

Anyone who continues to defend the big Pharma obviously can't be bothered by reading any of these links.

Greenday profile image
Greenday

GlaxoSmithKline fined nearly $500 million in China bribery case

fortune.com/2014/09/19/glax...

Individual NHS doctors receiving £100,000 per year from drugs firms

telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/0...

Medication Keeps Getting More Expensive—And Big Pharma Won't Explain Why

newsweek.com/medication-kee...

The $100 Million Settlement That Shows Why Pharma Isn't Afraid to Behave Badly

fortune.com/2017/01/21/mall...

GlaxoSmithKline fined $3bn after bribing doctors to increase drugs sales

theguardian.com/business/20...

Greece rocked by claims drug giant bribed former leaders

theguardian.com/world/2018/...

Pfizer settles foreign bribery case with U.S. government

reuters.com/article/us-pfiz...

Novartis: Bribery allegations against 10 former Greek ministers

bbc.com/news/world-europe-4...

Drug company founder charged with bribing doctors to prescribe opioid spray

money.cnn.com/2017/10/27/ne...

Big Pharma and governments are 'turning a blind eye to corruption', report claims

independent.co.uk/news/worl...

Ouch! The Chinese Bribery Scandal Is Hurting Big Pharma

forbes.com/#62f256802254

6 ex-pharma executives arrested in U.S. in fentanyl bribe case

cbc.ca/news/health/fentanyl...

California Senate votes to limit gifts to doctors from pharma companies rt.com/usa/389012-californi...

Teva to Pay $519 Million in U.S. Probe Over Foreign Bribes

bloomberg.com/news/articles...

Big Pharma's Offshore Fraud Strategy

forbes.com/sites/erikakelto...

Medicines Australia releases big pharma data: Did your doctor get a share of $8.5 million?

smh.com.au/healthcare/medic...

Database highlights German doctors' relations with pharma industry

dw.com/en/database-highligh...

Questionable marketing tactics are a major problem with pharma

pharmaceutical-journal.com/...

GSK used travel agencies for China bribes: police

reuters.com/article/us-gsk-...

UK pharma firms accused of illegal deals to hike price of life-saving drug

theguardian.com/business/20...

Novartis says South Korea employees gave kickbacks, confirms indictment

reuters.com/article/us-nova...

MBAnderson profile image
MBAnderson in reply to Greenday

Wow! It's truly unbelievable -- and I've only read your first 3 links.

This illustrates why so, so many life-saving drugs cost several hundred thousand dollars per year (like Nilotinib retails for $13,000 per month. ) To be clear, no one begrudges the legitimate expense of research and development and everyone agrees drug companies are entitled to recover all their costs and make a good profit. That's not the complaint. The complaint is the substance of the links above.

I think what confuses the issue is that we appreciate life-saving drugs and feel thankful for them and that causes us to believe we should thank the people who make him, but the hard, ugly truth is they're not making drugs because they care about you, they're making drugs to make money.

Greenday profile image
Greenday in reply to MBAnderson

This is just the 1% of what I digged out from major media such as Forbes, BBC, Reuters, Bloomberg, Fortune... and it seems to be a worldwide phenomenon

Trusam2913 profile image
Trusam2913

I share your thoughts entirely. Have always believed that the drug companies don't want us cured cos no profit in that.

jacksmar profile image
jacksmar

No expert here. I’m thinking you’re wrong. The real trouble here is built-in taboos and preconceived stereotypes about outcomes. This doesn’t have much to do with process or strategy. It’s a given that whichever pharmaceutical company, foundation, private research lab, or university study finds a cure for Parkinson’s disease will want to stick their name on it to charge a bunch of shaky people good deal of hard-earned cash to apply their cure.

Accordingly, we find neurologists and other field specialists resistant to simple common sense applications. For example, you have to beg steal or borrow or send your money off to Turkey to receive steroids that are absolutely perfectly capable of providing another way of stopping the destruction of brain cells. This is systemic within the medical community. The word “steroids “evokes instant conjured bodybuilders and wrestlers bulging from top to bottom with testosterone. This flies in the face of common sense as steroids were developed to make a man a little better. Try getting a prescription.

So when we see stories like these: mirror.co.uk/lifestyle/heal... or youtube.com/watch?v=DnYsLyU... it’s obvious to me that the major politics being played, is being played on the patient. The medical community itself is more afraid of a cure than the pharmaceuticals or it would not take so long to provide a path to a cure.

I would love response from Dr. Packer on this subject. I have many questions starting with: is the medical community aware of what they created with regard to stem cell intrathecal injections? This didn’t happen overnight. When a few DO’s found out that they can legally use this procedure which has absolutely no chance of providing a cure, why didn’t the medical community adamantly condemn this procedure for assistance with Parkinson’s disease?

My biggest question is: Research labs have been testing gene editing since 1983 and they’re either really bad at it or they’re really, really bad at it. Still have my faculties about me so I’m curious as to why after 35 years of testing no one’s been able to a perfect a gene editing process for a desired outcome. It appears to be very simple. Right now, we have the common criminal mind advancing the cause of medicine in the gene editing field faster than the FDA. Today, through products that are available online we now find criminals using gene editing trying to change their DNA to avoid incrimination. DIY gene editing for the purposes of evading DNA forensics.

It’s way past time for somebody to step up and forgo the billions of dollars in reward for attaching the company name to a Parkinson’s cure.

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