Is the Oxford vaccine live?. I’ve just been listening to Professor David Salisbury on the BBC corona virus special broadcast, 7th January 4.30 pm and he has just said, contrary to everything I’ve read, that the Oxford vaccine IS live and probably best not given to people who are immune suppressed. I’m astounded.
Oxford Vaccine Is Live....: Is the Oxford vaccine live... - NRAS
He is the only one saying that... honestly what can I say 🙄
Just watched again He was former director of public health for immunization
Meaning he isn’t in the know anymore
I would say he knows his stuff ☹
Professor David salisbury
Been reading about him the now
In his field im sure you cannot get much bigger certainly knows his stuff
He deffenetly would not say the pfizer is more suitable without good reason
Ill take wots giveing but if any choice or anyway i could i would now take the pfizer 1st
I think Ginnny misunderstood what she heard
He did say it is a live vaccine but not a human viris ,he also did say the pfiser would be more appropriate and suitable, am not clued up on all that but he did know his stuff
allanah knows more how it works or wot he means
I have just posted again the explanation of why the Oxford vaccine is not live.The only person who can decide which vaccine is suitable for each individual.....is their own Rheumatologist......& if you have any doubts that is who you should rely on for advice .
Nobody on this site has the qualifications to give advice on this.
The recent NRAS Zoom first senior rheumy was very helpful and very qualified with his comments, though,
I spoke to my rheumy way back & he explained both vaccines & suggested which he thought I would be offered. However......Delivery of these vaccines seems to be beyond the capability of politicians, scientists and now the poor old army are getting involved .....but it seems no one can find the actual product for them to deliver to the appointed locations...........but the reason seems a deep mystery.
To add to the problems there seems a lot of snow this morning!
Im sure nobody on the site was giveing advice ,And was highlighting very important information from a former director and well respected professor and one of the leading in immunizations and also helps WHO
im pretty sure members would be interested in his views as a debate and a good post from
But only if what he said was understandable to those not familiar with vaccine procedure......which most people are not.This seems not to have been the case because the questioner got the wrong impression.
At the end of the day his opinion is the pfiser is more suitable and it is highlighted Members can look ,read ,or debate ,discussion, ask questions ,ask rumatologist, or try get the pfiser ,etc, it is a post for all to read
I can only repeats ......the only person who 100% can advise which vaccine would be preferable for you is your own Rheumatologist.However I would imagine if one is not suitable for you .....you would have been advised by now.
Agree, get advice from your own Rheumy team, . I emailed mine & was told to wait until they had more info on the Pfizer/Biontech as it’s a bio vaccine. My worry with the above is are we safe having that if we are already on a biologic? From what I have read, the Oxford one shouldn’t affect us anymore than a flu or pneumonia vaccine as it’s derived from those..
I think I didn’t. As I said in my original post, I have read a lot about the vaccines, and understood why the Oxford vaccine was deemed to be not live. What the Professor stated on tv contradicted everything I’d read previously. He said, quite clearly, that immune suppressed people would be better with the Pfizer vaccine. That’s why I posted. I would have thought it obvious to all that we will have to trust the advice of our individual medics. I wasn’t intending to tell anyone what they should do but pointing out how varied the information can be and confusing.
Well as you have seen from the replies you’ve got everybody has their own opinion and everybody has to make up their own mind what they believe.After all .....when we are offered a vaccine I doubt if we will be given a choice of A or B .......or even if there is a C.
Your own Rheumatologist is the only person who can give you definitive advice according to your own condition.
I’m not sure it’s about opinions, more about expressing confusion and concern. And yes, we will have to trust our own medics, let’s hope they have definitive advice .
Believe me...it’s about opinions.....as I said everybody has their own opinion from their preconceived beliefs.....which of course are all different.....so as we all set off from a different starting point....we 95% are not going to reach the same or even a similar conclusion.
No doubt we will all make up our minds....& we will all think we are right!
We will have to disagree. I don’t think people on this forum are expressing opinions but adding information for debate.
Couldn't agree more GinnyE, and, again, I thank you for this! 🙂
I've just been reading everyone's post on this. Some people, experts too, are not too good at making themselves clear. I can't say I have heard any doctors, or those involved closely with producing and testing these vaccines, declare that the Oxford vaccine is live. I have heard, and this morning on Radio 4, that researchers have found the Pfizer is effective against the variants of the virus - but this hasn't yet been acknowledged by their peers. It may well be that the Pfizer is better for the immunosuppressed, but that doesn't mean that the Oxford is, therefore, live.
And it would surprise me if the Oxford were live - as it is produced in the same way as the flu vaccine. But as others have said, seek the advice of your rheumatology team.
I had the Pfizer on 21st December and am having the second dose on Monday 11th January. I am relieved it hasn't been cancelled.
Now the Moderna has been licensed so that’s another one to debate!
Indeed! Thinking about this later, it does make one realise how the choice of words can really throw a spanner into the works. "Live" is perhaps not very helpful. The Pfizer is unusual in that it is synthetic; whereas the Oxford (and most others) use live tissue (that in itself is rather emotive, of course). This tissue is rendered inactive by "killing" it. But that too, is not very helpful.
The " poster" who first mentioned hearing someone describe the Oxford vaccine as "live" was probably correct. This word would be used by a scientist, perhaps. But he should have explained that it didn't mean "alive and kicking"! The tissue from the animal (mice or others) has been treated. It is possible to be allergic to any vaccines. A couple of patients have proved allergic to Pfizer - and that's synthetic,
I have mentioned before that I now take a biologic - Remsima (Infliximab). In the literature about this medicine is the warning that it should not be used by those allergic to mice! Well, how to know that? I remember, at the time, sharing jokes with my daughter about this.
I also take Methotrexate - a medication that should not be "mixed" with some vaccines - eg the Yellow Fever vaccine, and the Shingles vaccine. I am not sure why this is the case - true the vaccines are labelled "live", but it may be that one negates the other. Or, perhaps some vaccines only work if untreated.
All food for thought. As for the Moderna, I haven't any comments on that one, But when it starts rolling out, no doubt there will be plenty.
Happy New Year!
Thats great you have the vaccines hopefully it works for you Are you sheilding?
Oh no another debate 😊
Not sure if people will still shield that is not clear at all and mixed messages after vaccine
Glad your vaccine went quick and no issuies
Where you sore with the vaccine know a few who where for 24 hours
Yes, I'm certainly still shielding even after the two shots of the pfizer vaccine. I was much more tired after the second dose (Monday 11th Jan) - in fact yesterday I was whacked all day; strange, because after the first dose (Monday 21st December) I was only slightly weary in the afternoon, and slept well that night.
I am very wary still about contacts, and intend to spend at least a couple of weeks at home - not venturing out at all. That was advised by the nurse at the Centre where I had the vaccine.
Thats great about vaccine and hopefully the effects are away Hopefully full protection for you and good you still being carfull
I heard the shielding may have to wait a little longer even after vaccine
You have the vaccine thats wot matters hopefully a bit of normality for you soon
Lucky you to have had 2 vaccines ,when most people like me with COPD,Asthma and arthritis and 82,still waiting for 1st vaccination.
Yes, I do think I'm lucky - although I haven't had the second dose yet; that's tomorrow 11th January. I had the first on 21st December and the appointment for the second had already been booked by the GP. I'm 85 with RD and am taking the biologic Remsima (Infliximab), and Methotrexate.
I don't think all GPs are giving the second dose - although the BMA has said they would support GPs who did as it was part of the original agreement and should be honoured. But apart from honouring an agreement, the BMA agree with Pfizer that the trials were based on two shots 21 days apart, so the effectiveness of the drug depended on that.
My vaccine doses take place in a large medical centre which can handle many patients; my GP's surgery is not suitable for the Pfizer, but will probably be handling the Oxford vaccine.
If you are taking immunosuppressant drugs, you should be near the top of the priority list; you also tick the "age" box, so I'm sorry to hear you are still waiting.
I contacted my rheumatology nurse and she assured me that both vaccines were ok to have, check out the info here.versusarthritis.org/covid-1...
This is exactly my point. This info you sent is exactly what I thought too. But not what the Professor was saying on national tv yesterday... I have actually written to BBC News about the interview...
I just heard that too I thought the Oxford vaccine was best for us , but I do remember them saying if you are being treated for cancer then you cannot have Oxford vaccine , we only take a mild dosage of mtx , I maybe wrong and misheard it
NO . It was made originally from a live vaccine but it has been killed so immuno suppressed can gave it
Well that's what we thought but maybe this is new info? Hope not! Off to read my first ever shielding letter and have tea, but will be checking this out for sure!
Gosh I hope not too. Just got to wait and see what rheumatology tells me
Well I'd like to know soon as they say we will all be offered one before mid February.
Go to news Search bbc news special
Then coronaviris special with johnston
Then go to the start it will be 16.35
What??? Surely not!
Me too trying to find out more ☹
I've just read it is a live vaccine and is not recommended for those on biological drugs . I'm on Tocsilizumab so can I or can't I.
I think if you refer to the NRAS site. But I’m sure we can have either vaccine if taking a biological.
I just don’t get why we just don’t get a straight & prescisive answer 😡
NRAS LOL !!!???? HELP
Yeh watched it Listening to him,yeh he did say you can have it but uncertain with outcome he was quetioned out of context and pfiser is the best one for immunosuppressants etc he said ,he did not say not to take it but the other one is better ,the 2 are to be giveing and to be cautious about the oxford to protect
Im switching to
Pfizer flio /flop now if i can choose
I heard that too, this really is confusing. I understood that it isn’t a live vaccine & is safe for us on immunosuppressants to have !?
I can’t imagine that we will be given a choice of which vaccine we will be offered
Me neither Pea, but I always thought if the Pfizer allegedly has more percentage of efficacy and we don’t know as immuno- suppressed people how well we will produce antibodies and mount our immune response to the vaccines, I think it would make more sense for the immuno-suppressed to have the Pfizer which has shown higher success percentage in trial? It’s all uncharted waters though isn’t it?! If the Oxford is what is offered and as time draws close for our turn, then we may hear more info as more people ask more questions. Would be good to know now though!
Anybody want to watch it and give views bbc i player bbc news special
Go to time
16,35 he is only on for 5 mins
It's derived from a weak cold virus, but they do something to it so it doesn't replicate in your body. My consultant told me that's what I have to have. I've screen shot something I'll start a new thread to post it beings I can't put it here.
It's not on iplayer yet. I wonder if he meant cancer patients, the very very immunosuppressed people?
It's a shame they can't be clearer isn't it? When some of us are hanging on their every word.
Definitely, if the evidence is that all immunosuppresed should gave the pfizer vaccine they have very little time to address this.
Hurry up it is still on bbc i player
As time goes by it goes off air Scroll to bbc new special
And go to start and now it is when he talks about it
He was clear the pfizer would be better
Well I hope the medics get this sorted before we are offered our Jabs if that is true
I heard a while ago that the Oxford AZ was a originated from a live Monkey cold virus and was disabled from being live in the process of producing it. It's then used as a Trojan to carry the vaccine inside it.
So you can see why some say it's live and others not. It's way confusing though, which is best for us on Biologic, and then today's news that 2 Biologics are saving a quarter of ppl lives with covid comes to light. What to believe, who knows! I also don't see us being given a choice on the ground, maybe in theory not reality.
Yes, I had read that about the vaccine. I’ve just this minute received my letter as on the CV person list, saying I should get the vaccine by mid February. Thank you Mr Hancock, but WHICH ONE...
Ye I just got my shielding email
Not holding out hope of a Gov letter! 🙄 Taken ten months to prize a letter from the GP and rheumatology.
Ok word for word Prof Salisbury on bbc news special tonight ...
" the only group that I would worry about using the Oxford vaccine for are the people whose immunity is suppressed or compromised, because it is a live vaccine, although not a human virus. And I think for individuals who are immunocompromised we clearly want to protect them and the Pfizer vaccine would be more appropriate for them ."
Now two points on that for me, only my ideas for what they are worth lol!!!!
: at delivery the vaccine is not live
: I personally then suspect the government scientists know this and when they get to level 4 and start injecting immunocompromised we may automatically get the pfizer vaccine if this is the case .
That's my ideas!!But yes we will need to check with our own health advisers????
MMM INTERESTING... I suffer anaphylaxis so Pfizer not one my gp wants me to have .. Oxford not ideal for immune compromised .. so ???? Where does that leave so many ?
All of us talking to gps or rheumies on our own circumstances ....... I'm only guessing though as I say. We will need clarification of course!!
Better having some protection than none?
Yep I agree .. it’s so difficult and disappointing.. just within grasp then a bloody hurdle x
Not sure what “on delivery not live” means. Would you mind explaining your thinking. (Pity the Professor couldn’t)?
And your second point makes much sense to me, let’s hope it does to those in control.
It was live when the were developing the vaccine but ( in lots of vaccines this happens) it get " attenuated" basically that means killed so it diesnt have the side effects of live vaccines . So yes it has been well documented at point of delivery ie into someone's arm its not a live vaccine is how its described , not like yellow fever x
Why the heck did this Professor have to say otherwise! It’s not just a question of semantics after all. How you explain it was my understanding as well allanah. I’m very cross with him.
Hope you're right, as I've definitely, rightly or wrongly, been put off, or, at the least, become a lot more wary! Gee, one step forward, two steps back!
Hope so we will see and look out for it certainly causing a debate
I looked this guy up and he does know his stuff does work for (who) as well or used too
I’m hoping and have been thinking the very same as you, Allanah. Thank you for posting the prof’s response. x
Well done Allanah, makes total sense & yes I will take the Oxford once I’ve had a chat with Rheumy for green light, (Pfizer & epi pen I understand is advised against) like you say, some protection is better than none. Good to have you back xx
Dont know which one they suggest now. But I'll take whatever one they do !,
Well done, I would to if it wasn’t for the epi pen advise, so thankfully jersey is working with the Oxford as a majority!
Well I would like clear guidelines?? And you need advise from your health care about which vaccine you will be offered
Absolutely to both!! I lost my dad to a hay fever injection when I was 18, since then I’m petrified truthfully, what with a nut allergy that’s developed in the past 4yrs also. We all need to seek the advise we individually need, but I trying to remain positive & focused, I’ll feel a lot happier once I’ve spoken with Rheumy next week. A dear friend of mine (elderly) is having his next week, he has suffered with cancer for many years but extremely positive to be having the vaccine. Let’s hope we all get our own answers with our care providers, take care!!
I'm so sorry to hear that Durrell. I totally understand you being petrified ! I really hope you get some definitive answers and the correct vaccine very soon. Xxx
Bless you Niao, I remember when the specialist asked me on my first biologic if I was ok with injections?? I directly said yes, baring in mind how our life & pain are affected by RA,?? (petrified) I trusted & got on with it, though it never goes away, but all’s been good, I’m back on another biologic (Abatacept, all going good). We have had immunization from small pox etc and all been good. Thank you for your kind words, appreciated.
And this too will all be good! But it is inevitable you will always have that little scared voice inside your head each time and I wish you didn't have too! I am so glad the Abatacept is working well for you. Xxx
Thanks GinnyE for telling us about this. That's a big issue if who gets what for the medics to solve if correct !!
Watching brief then .....
Hi thanks for info. Still a little bit concerned bout it but I will try to talk to Gp when invited for vacation.take care.
I spoke to my rheumatoid who said have whatever you are offered znd its not LIVE.....
Do you have a link for this broadcast? I have been looking for it to no avail
I found it. Yeah he says immune suppressed should use Pfizer. I am confused now as I thought it was Oxford us immune suppressed bunch should use but David Salsbury says Pfizer?
I am thinking more of the fact that I have had anaphylactic shocks to.infliximab in the past and I heard oxford was better for those who have had such reactions
I’m in the same position
I was surprised to hear him say that too as I thought both vaccines to date were NOT live.
Whilst I am pro vaccinations, the rollout of the vaccines concerns me slightly as I will have to travel a 22 mile round trip to the allocated vaccination centre (twice eventually) and it is highly likely none of the staff will know me or my medical history, or are they going to read my notes online before administering the vaccine?
You have misunderstood.....the AZ vaccine is NOT LIVE.If you scroll back you will find a table describing how it starts off live...but it is not live when injected......if you can’t find that look on the NRAS Site...I’m sure it will be explained there.
What a lot of posts this subject has created. Quite right that it should, of course. AC, you did mention in one of your posts that, as yet, we don't know how well we immunocompromised patients will be protected by any of the vaccines (that's also my understanding, but if there is more information please post).
I'm still looking for information. I have now had 2 shots of the Pfizer and while I was at the Clinic I asked the nurse if she had any idea. She "thought" we would be well protected with 2 shots but not sure about just one - although she understood the rationale behind the government's decision to offer one only. That is, with a gap of 12 weeks instead of Pfizer's recommendation of 3 weeks.
Naturally, I'm relieved to have had both shots with an interval of 3 weeks between them. I also think many GP's are insisting on 2 doses for their immunosuppressed patients.
I was offered the Pfizer because at that time nothing else was available - even so I wouldn't have refused any other vaccine that might have been offered. Also, there's the important point that the Pfizer is difficult to transport and needs sophisticated venues that can provide the equipment to store and prepare it for use.
I do hope you all get this vaccine as soon as possible - the more people who get it, the better protected we shall all be.
I didn’t start this post bienassis...I just posted the table explaining why the AZOxford vaccine is not live.....but it seems some still doubted....hence the long,long series of opinions.
As far as im aware non of the vaccines are live i could be wrong but i received a video from one of my hospitals at the start of the pandemic explaining what risk it is to us and i got another one a few weeks ago about the vaccines and if we can take it and it says when you get called up you are to take it it says they aint a live vaccine and no matter what meds you are on you can take if obvs ask your consultant they will be best person to ask but on the info i got we was allowed to take any of the vaccines
Ginny, my Rheumatologist told me on Tuesday categorically that neither of the vaccines being used are live ones. Hope that puts your mind at rest.
I heard on the radio that the carrier used for it is live....................
My Rhuemy Team told me that in September. They said I cant have either of the vaccines avaiable now.
Well this is extremely interesting for all of us, I carry an epi pen for nut allergy & been told the Pfizer is not suitable. I speak with my Rheumy next Wednesday & obviously this is going to be top of my woes!! Every rheumy knows his patient & hence like most say it’s talking direct with them that’s important for each of us.. our vaccines are rolling out quite fast here in jersey which is great but time is of the essence as it is for you all too!! I hope you all manage to get your answers to continue with the vaccine.. I’m sure I read way back even in the trials they had RA patients on biologic’s as they needed a variety of ages, health issues etc!!
I heard this interview and he did suggest that immunosuppressed people should be given the Pfizer vaccine. However, I assumed this was because there has been a suggestion that the vaccines might not work as well with this group of people and the first dose of the Pfizer vaccine is predicted to give 20% more protection than the first dose of the Oxford Astra Zeneca vaccine. I might have misunderstood the whole thing as I am putting information from several interviews together and have probably got the wrong end of the stick.
More information seems to be coming out almost every day and I plan to have a chat with my Rheumy team when I am invited to have the vaccine to clarify things at that time.
Well the Professor has certainly managed to put a 'fly in the ointment' so to speak! All I can say is I hope all of us are able to get a vaccine, be it one or thother, very soon! I will be keeping an eye on things of course, just in case any new questions arise, and will check in with the Rheumatologist before going ahead. Thank you GinnyE for a very interesting post.🙂 x
Hi GinnyE,Not more confusion, we need to know the facts but who can we ask.
Take care, Stay safe.
I did look into this for the reasons you mention. Here are a couple of links to Beeb sites about the vaccines.
scroll down shows groups to get Pfizer
Hope they assist in your research on the matter
My brother in Law was told by the hospital that he couldn't have the vaccine as he gets anaphylactic shock from bee & wasp stings, so the allergy problems with the 1st Physer vaccine apply. He also has Non Hodgkin's Lymphoma & has had Chemo but has been in remission for 4yrs now, so fingers crossed he lives through this pandemic!? I am also on biologic injections (Adalimumab) & Methotrexate for my RA & am allergic to Penicillin & most antibiotics. My daughter read somewhere that people with Penicillin allergies couldn't have the jab either. I'm hoping that only applies to the Physer one & not the Oxford one!? Am a bit worried if it is live though, as surely that discounts it for us? I rang my GP, as I hadn't had a letter @1st lockdown, to ask about it this time, as it means getting vaccine earlier. He checked my records & apologised profusely as I had been missed off the list 1st time around! So I'm on the list now. So please, everyone who didn't get a letter & thinks they should have, check with you're GP! Its heal thyself now folks!!
I've been told I have to have the "live" vaccine...confused
I've just found this question in an article from crohnsandcolitis.org.uk website;
I've heard that immunosuppressed people cannot have the vaccine?People with Crohn's and Colitis who take medicines that weaken their immune systems should not have vaccines that are 'live' vaccines. None of the COVID-19 vaccines ordered by the UK government are live vaccines. This means that you can have whichever vaccine you are offered.
The Oxford vaccine is originally based off of a live vaccine, but has been made safe enough for people on immunosuppressants to take. The vaccine is made by taking a common cold virus that normally infects chimpanzees, and altering it so that it looks a lot more like coronavirus. The virus has been changed so that it cannot multiply inside humans. This means that you can't get COVID-19 from taking it. So even though the Oxford vaccine is originally based on a live virus, it has been altered to make it safe enough for people on immunosuppressant medicines to take.
We understand that you may have seen conflicting messages elsewhere about whether you can have the Oxford vaccine. We recommend that you refer your healthcare professional to Page 14 of the Green Book on the official gov.uk website, which states that "Although [Oxford] AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine contains a live adenovirus vector, this virus is not replicating and is considered safe in immunosuppressed people." The Green Book has the latest information on vaccines and vaccination procedures for vaccine preventable infectious diseases in the UK.
Here's the link to the page; crohnsandcolitis.org.uk/new...
Hi.Hope you are all well
A friend of mine was at Freeman hosp. today having infusion ... This is what she just told me, word of mouth from our specialist nurses..
Yes there was vaccine chat today.
You can't have your vaccine 4 weeks either side of your infusion.
Also I'm not sure if you watched the medical professional on TV yesterday say immune suppressed can't have the Oxford vaccine. That is completely wrong, we can have any vaccine and are being urged to take whatever is offered as soon as it is offered. The man on TV didnt fact check with the main medical people, got his facts completely wrong and announced it to the nation.
The consultants and nurses were inundated with this today and were pulling their hair out lol xxx
Just shows. We have to be so careful with mis information. .thats going to be our biggest issue..ongoing.
Keep safe everyone, let's hope roll out keeps on track . Xx
Hi Ginny , I saw the interview as it was broadcast on the BBC. I have since found several websites stating the Oxford virus is not live, however the professor SHOULD know his stuff. I have searched for a contact for the Professor in vain.
Yes, I’ve been sent many explanations about how it’s not live, I was aware of them already. I’ve posted exactly what was said now. I know he didn’t say don’t have the Oxford jab but he spoke of “protecting” the immune suppressed and being cautious about giving them the Oxford one. Hence my original post.
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