Weight Loss NHS
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I despair

Have been tracking on my fitness pal for two weeks and weight not shifting In fact had a slight gain. They recommend 1200 cals and I know from experience I don’t lose on that so try to stay a bit below. I also go to Slimming World and follow the plan. I have increased exercise and don’t know what else to do

My breakfast is usually a thin smoothie with berries, veg and almond milk

Lunch is home made veg soup

and a little salad

Dinner is a veg and chicken stir fry

I have snack of toast and bananas or light cheese spread or Finn crackers

And usually a treat of around 120 cals

I tend to be heavier in the morning which is a recent development

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MFP is not where you should be getting your calorie allowance from - you can edit the amount on there to what you need to eat (go to home then goals and you can put the mid range of the BMI calorie amount in there ;) )

You are actually eating too few calories so your body is going into starvation mode and storing it all

You need to do the NHS BMI calculator to get your personal calorie allowance - here's the link

nhs.uk/Tools/Pages/Healthyw...

I ate at the lower end to start with and didn't lose weight but after advice on here I ate mid to high range and started to lose

Wishing you all the best on your journey :)

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I’m sorry you are feeling so despondent Smiffyliz, it seems so unfair after all your effort 😕

On the surface, it looks as if your aren’t eating enough, see this for a better explanation healthunlocked.com/nhsweigh...

MFP sets the target very low as you can ‘earn’ more by exercising. I trust the NHS BMI checker for target calories, which is generally more generous too

I don’t know much about Slimming World, but the thing to watch in general is the correct balance of fat/carbohydrates/protein, I know I need to keep my carbohydrates on the low side (under 200g per day) to lose weight.

Finally, I have never lost weight quickLy, and can easily go two weeks without losing, and then have what is known as a ‘whoosh’ effect and lose 2 pounds. Depending upon your size, 1-2 lbs a week is a perfect rate of fat loss, anymore and it isnt fat.

Hope you find this helpful

Anna 😊

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Love your "whoosh" description Anna😊. Unfortunately I've just had a 3 lb "whoosh" but upwards! Two days with stepson involving cream tea, birthday drinks and an Indian meal. I now have to tackle that before our next maintainers weigh in 😁

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You’ll soon knock that off Ellie 😊. As long as you had a good time

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Oh Smiffyliz , it's very dispiriting isn't it, when you're trying to do your best :(

I suggest you check your BMI with the NHS calculator, and see what calorie range that gives you. I don't use mfp but from what I've seen from others on here, the NHS range is a fair bit higher. You may well be eating less than your body needs and it is responding to "starvation" by hanging on to fat. Aiming below 1200 cals sounds way too low.

I'm sure you'll get other replies along these lines. If you're doubtful, give it a proper go for 4 weeks and see what happens :)

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Hi Smiffyliz,

Cracker10 is right you're probably not eating enough calories. I also use MFP but only to log my food and track my daily intake.

It's great for storing recipes, searching calories in food and logging previous meals to use again.

BUT the calorie goals are way too low! The way I use it is to make sure my MINIMUM calories are MFP's, then my own MAXIMUM allowed is about 200 to 250 calories above that.

It works for me, I just ignore the red minus numbers! (Unless I've had a really naughty day😂)

It's just another tool to help you keep track. 😊😊

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you can change the calorie goal in MFP go to home then goals and you can put the calorie range there that you want to aim for ;)

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Oops.. didn't see that you also said the same thing, sorry to duplicate our responses😉

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Not sure if you know that on MFP you can customize your calorie allowance manually .

Just go to:

Goals > Nutrition goals >Calorie&Macro Goals and just overtype the number with the amount you want it to be. I tweak mine every time my weight goes up or down!

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So, could you potentially put 45g protein, 120g low Gi carbohydrate, set the target kcalorie intake, with natural fat to make up the difference?

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From memory, yes you can personalise macros but I think you have to adjust by percentage. However I'm not totally sure now which of these functions are on the basic Mfp as I have upgraded to premium a few months ago.

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Percentages aren't the same as absolutes (grammes or kcalories) of course. There tends to be a big percentage difference between losing and maintenance for instance, whereas the absolute amount of protein and low Gi carbs won't tend to be significantly different.

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It's worth you taking a closer look then, as I may be wrong on that. I'm not using all the functions of the Mfp site .

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It wants me to consent to transfer of personal data to the USA, from which I can withdraw at anytime, but I can't progress without checking the box?

Erm, not at this time.

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That sounds like a new clause ... not aware I ever did that.

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Not sure what you are using Concerned on MFP I “fiddle” with my percentages to get the grams of carbs etc that I want - I find it then gives me the data I want. 🙂

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That's before I can sign up/log in, and I like your idea, that's probably what I would do too.

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I don’t remember having to do that, but I understand your concern, Concerned 😀

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Lol

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Thank you both for support but I do know from experience that if I eat 1200 I put on. That’s how I got in this mess in the first place. I certainly don’t starve and have plenty of nutrition. The only way I could up calories is to add in a lot of high fat and sugars. However next week I will try to replace breakfast fruit with cereal and that will up calories a bit and add in a bit more potatoes

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Please do your BMI calculator to get the range and see what it says for your personal calorie range as you are putting your body in starvation mode which is why you are not losing weight

I suggest you speak to your GP regarding the amount of calories you are eating and the fact that you are not losing weight and see what they have to say

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If you aren’t hungry and are feeling well, then stick with it 😊 if you’ve already been losing weight, your current plan is working, it just takes time, especially as you get closer to goal

If you are concerned about lack of weight loss, I agree with Cracker and suggest you see a qualified professional

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As you've proved to yourself, calories really has nothing to do with weight loss. Your body is trying desperately to keep you alive on what is basically a starvation diet.

Some people can actually lose weight this way, but there's a lot of variation in response. Only a very small minority are successful with calorie-restricted diets; most lose little or nothing, and some (like you) actually gain weight.

Go for low-carb, high-fat. It's completely painless, and it works for EVERYONE, not just a lucky few. As I've suggested to others, read books by Phinney and Volek. They are medical researchers with a large body of published literature behind them, and their books tell you clearly what to eat, what not to eat, and why.

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If only. When I cut out carbs I get really ill. Balanced diet must be better for us

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To be honest, you're probably doing it wrong. You can't just "cut out carbs", you have to replace them with other things. Get the book, understand the science, and give it another try. It works for everyone else, and there's absolutely no reason it shouldn't work for you.

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Believe me I absolutely understand all the science of all theories. Unfortunately with all my digestive problems, Barrett’s etc it is not as simple as replacing with other things as have to stick to things that don’t upset. All my medications have a lot to do with slow weight loss. My food is all home cooked and doesn’t include rubbish so maybe should just be content. Don’t know where you get idea I am starving myself. Nowhere near.

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<1200kcal is a starvation diet, as several others have mentioned. For comparison, I eat something like 2500kcal/day, although I exercise three hours a week. I weigh 68-69kg, 12.7% bodyfat. You really only have two choices here: continue with something that clearly doesn't work, or try something different.

There is absolutely no reason why low-carb should make you feel ill. If your medications make you feel worse, you have to ask yourself why you're taking them in the first place?

I've advised several clients who almost always react as you do before the fat switchover kicks in: "OMG I'm going to die I'm going to die". A week later, they're running around in circles, deliriously happy, telling me that this or that mystery illness has cleared up ... AND they're losing weight. The last client, for example, started off with "digestive problems" much like yours. She told me a couple of weeks ago that not only had a nagging skin problem resolved itself, she didn't feel gassy and bloated anymore after meals. Not saying low-carb is a miracle cure for everything, but idiopathic chronic illnesses like yours are often diet-related.

You could perhaps start with a low-carb breakfast and then phase in the other meals over time (rather than go 'cold turkey' as in the typical LCHF plan). That would be something like sausages, eggs, bacon, tomatoes, and mushrooms fried in butter; a LARGE side salad or stir-fried vegetables; and a bowl of natural yoghurt (a dash of honey or jam is fine). No breakfast cereals, no toast, no fruit smoothies; it's those items that are maintaining your weight. Have a banana now and then if you like. Most importantly, take all those "light" products and throw them in the trash - they are making you fat. Then buy some proper food, e.g., cream cheese instead of low-fat spread. Ultra-low-fat, low-calorie diets are disastrously deficient in all kinds of important nutrients, which is almost certainly the reason for the funk you're in.

Give it another try. You have nothing to lose but your flab!

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Thank you, TheAwfulToad. I could not agree more. Why is there not more discussion on how calorie in/calorie out is pure fallacy? No sugars no grain or low carb high fat are the proven long team weight loss solution.

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It's not discussed, I think, because it's disparaged by TPTB. I have a background in the hard sciences, and the calories-in/calories-out thing makes me facepalm every time I hear it repeated. I facepalm twice if someone mentions the word 'thermodynamics'.

The basic problem is that a lot of nutritionists don't actually have any scientific training. They pick up a few sciency buzzwords but don't really grok what they mean. Worst of all, they don't get the fundamental concept of science, as neatly summed up by Richard Feynman: "It doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn't matter how smart you are. If it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong."

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Thank you for the response. I'm not familiar with Feynman so I will look him up and read his book. I'm relatively new to this way of eating (2 years) and have been following the works of Vinnie Tortorich, Nina Teicholz, and Gary Taubes.

I feel so sad reading some of these innocent people's health struggles and the terrible advice that is. given. The time suck that is calorie counting. Yet another failed diet.

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Yes, it makes me feel so sad to read these heartbreaking posts from people who are "doing everything right" and yet aren't shifting any weight. Not just sad, though: angry. I've been doing LCHF for about ten years and have never felt better. I can't understand why people who should know better - no, people who DO know better - should continue to flog misinformation to people who are suffering. It's completely unconscionable.

Feynman was a physicist, but he was a very entertaining teacher and his memoirs are worth reading. He fought an uphill struggle against 'bad science', especially in the humanities. He would probably be appalled at the state of the nutrition establishment if he were alive today.

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You sound a lot like Vinnie. You should do his podcast.

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Thanks for the tip, I will. I had to google him; it turns out he looks a lot like me too :)

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I'll listen for you. I follow all of his podcasts. He's the lone voice that got thru to me when I was looking to change my eating habits. He also has a free pdf explaining his NSNG lifestyle.

Ok I'm done for the night.

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Does Vinnie Tortorich say that calories in/calories out is a pure fallacy? I have read his book and listened to the audio book and the podcast and don't recall that bit.

I also follow LCHF and cycle keto when i want to lose fat, but I don't think it is the only way. It is the way that works for me. When I was a distance runner I ate very high carb and that worked for me then.

Different people have different tolerances and different energy demands (OMG - calories out?!?) and purely and simply different tastes so will find it easier to follow different macro approaches, and the diet (or dietary apporoach if you want to get picky) that you can stick with is always the one that works.

Calories in/calories out is not the whole story, but it is enough of the story to use as a starting principle. To suggest that you can lose weight regardless of how many calories you stuff in is asinine. For a good explanation of the whole calories issue, with sufficient 'Hard Science' to satisfy the academically inclined and enough cartoons and swearwords to keep the puerile minds (me) entertained, have a look at this:

physiqonomics.com/calories/

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Excellent reply Rignold thank you 😊

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The linked article is wrong (I can almost guarantee that any article on diet with the word 'thermodynamics' in it is wrong). It is true that there must be an energy balance, ie., energy in = energy out, but this has absolutely no relevance to weight gain. To illustrate why, consider this:

You have a hybrid car with a 30L fuel tank and a 20kWh battery pack. You drive for an hour and expend 10kWh at the wheels. At the end of your drive, how much fuel is left in the tank, and how much electrical energy is left in the battery?

The answer is: you have absolutely no way of knowing. The car's computer might have decided to burn gasoline, electricity, or some combination of both, depending on conditions. Humans are like that, except complexity times fifty.

Keeping it simple, your fat storage is under closed-loop control just like the battery and fuel tank in the hybrid car. There are explicit hormonal triggers for fat storage and fat burning, and both processes operate in parallel. The crucial point here is that blood sugar MUST be maintained in a very narrow range; when you eat a carb-heavy meal, there is usually nowhere for that sugar to go except into fat storage (the article is very, very wrong on this point - the average overweight human has little or no spare glycogen capacity). If you eat another carb-heavy meal four hours later, then another, and another ... that fat is never used. It just accumulates forever. This has been definitively demonstrated by analyzing blood samples for specific types of fatty acids, making use of the fact that your body can only synthesize a limited range of fatty acids from glucose.

It's true that fat will be preferentially stored rather than burned ... IF the subject is consuming a lot of carbohydrate that keeps insulin levels high (insulin prevents fat cells releasing fat for energy). That's the rationale behind low-fat diets, and as far as it goes, it's correct. The alternative answer is to keep insulin levels low, by keeping carb intake low. That way fat is burned preferentially. The experience of millions of people doing LCHF supports the theory. Virtually nobody has reported that it doesn't work.

The more important point about LCHF is that it fixes your appetite. Nobody on the planet has ever needed to compute calories in vs. calories out before, so why should we need to do it now? On LCHF you eat when you're hungry and stop when you're done. There are two theories regarding appetite error on high-carb diets: one is that processed carbs are so energy dense your appetite gets confused (your satiety sensors basically work on volume, not calories); the other is that modern foods are so nutrient-deficient that your body keeps calling for more, in the hope that it'll get what it needs. Either way, LCHF works around this problem.

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Good morning to both TheAwfulToad and NSNG-am

I see you have both been on the LCHF way of eating for 10 and 2 years respectively, may I ask have you joined the Weight Loss community to lose weight and be encouraged on your journey? Or to highlight the LCHF way of life?

I see you are also a member on the Healthy eating forum and the LCHF forum. We would be happy to welcome you as a weight loser, but if you are at your chosen weight, are you here purely to promote your preferred weight loss route?

All members have the choice to explore and choose their best way to lose weight and as many have health issues not known to us, we do not promote any weight loss routes directly, as this could be detrimental.

The 12 week plan is highlighted and many are on LCHF, Keto, Paleo, WW, SW and many other weight loss routes. There is no 1 size fits all solution.

Please advise your status. Thank you.

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I'm here to answer specific questions from people who find that their chosen low-calorie diet isn't working. And I'm doing that because I once received good advice from others and I'd like to pay it forward.

I realise I might be coming across as a bit over-enthusiastic, but I'm not trying to bully people into a specific course of action. I'm just trying to redress the balance away from the overwhelming support for low-calorie, low-fat.

Incidentally, I'm not just touting my experience here: I do this professionally, and unlike NHS desk jockeys handing out advice that doesn't work, I have to earn my fees by getting results for my clients. I work purely on recommendations. If my advice doesn't work I don't get paid, simple as that. So far I've not had anyone ask for a refund.

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All admin are unpaid volunteers on here, we do not work for the NHS nor are we directed by the NHS.

We accept that each person has different reason's for losing weight and their journies will be according to their preference and research done and knowledge gained to make informed personal choices.

Every form of diet plan chosen by each individual is a personal choice.

However it is not for any member to endorse their favoured plan, especially if they are offering their services for profit if/when results are met.

This forum is free to use and has to remain free to choose and discuss without pressure or endorsements from other members.

Many members have lost many stones/kg's in weight and are successfully maintaining their goal weights with or without doing the LCHF method.

I trust this will explain how this forum works, it is to be supportive without judgement and encouraging each member to reach their goals the way they choose, without charge.

I asked if you needed to lose weight - as that is the primary reason for members joining, I would then have welcomed you, but your response as you suggested was confrontational and admins response you are aware of.

We do have people join to offer their services but this is not permitted on this forum.

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Thank you for that.

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Bar rats oesophagus is a pre cancer conditions. It is genetic. I was brought up on a farm so my mother only ever had full fat everything. I often do have eggs and bacon for Breakfast and always homemade lentil soup for lunch. Dinner is meat chicken or fish. I am 5ft tall and at the moment am more sedentary than usual due to leg injury. 1200 calories is recommended nhs guideline for my height.

Thank you for your diet advice. Not so different to what I eat but I don’t have huge portions. I do eat some berries but feel I need the vitamins as get a lot of chest infections

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Sounds like you have a lot to cope with Smiffyliz

I like the sound of your food choices.. I was told I would grow up to marry a farmer due to my love of dairy and my rosie cheeks!

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I have had a blood test and get results next week. My BMI is high at 29 which puts me in obese category. I don’t feel obese as only size 12 trousers but am 16 on top half

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Technically, you are at the upper end of the overweight range, not quite obese. However, from your description you may be at risk of carrying more visceral fat with an increased risk to health.

Try lowering the insulin/glycaemic load of what you eat.

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Does that mean less fruit and more protein

Apart from occasional treat and occasional white rice and potatoes most of my food is low GI

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Unlikely to mean that. 45g protein per day, 120g low Gi carbs, the balance natural fat?

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Unless you are very petite, very sedentary or very advanced in years (or all three) then I can't see that 1200 is basically your maintenance level. What does the NHS Bmi calculator say?

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Overweight, definitely not obese Smiffyliz 🙂 I am losing weight on 1,300 calories a day, and am not very tall. I definitely think if you are not losing weight at a lower calorie intake, you are right to be having blood tests at your Doctors. I hope you find out an easy reason why you are not losing weight. 🙂

The other thing to remember is that it is about finding a weight that feels healthy for YOU. There are people here who have decided to Maintain at a technically “Overweight” BMI. It is about what works for each individual as far as the reading on the scales goes.

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Probably taking them as I would die if I got oesophageal cancer. I joined the nhs help line and don’t think these comments are in line with that

And also if you don’t have a problem why are you on here at all

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The person I think you are responding to has been banned Smiffyliz, they were causing a lot of aggravation, I do hope they didn’t upset you 😕

You have a lot on your plate, please try to eat sensibly and not reduce too low. I agree with Concerned about the importance of food quality as much as quantity.

Wishing you well, and weight loss success very soon

Anna 😊

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Thank you for that. There is nothing worse than holier than thou experts criticising what they know nothing about. I am losing weight again just had a blip I think. As you say a balanced diet with home cooked food can’t be far wrong. I could up my calories but increasing portions but there are some days I go way over so I am sure it balances out

And yes I did find the comments upsetting. How do you know they are banned

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Most members on here are supportive, non-judgmental and totally encouraging.

Sadly but occasionally a member may be over enthusiastic and think their way is the best and only way, especially if they have gained good results. I think that this is were theawfultoad fits in. Yours was not the only post they made comments on, but the Comments were of the same nature.

We all have the right to choose our journey and do not have to explain our reasons, be they health issues or personal preferences. I truly hope you enjoy the forum Smiffyliz

Cheering you on to your goals 🎉🎉🎉

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Thank you

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Big virtual hugs you to you...

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I am always amazed at how smug some people can be. Ill health often has a way of smacking us in the face no matter our life style

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I’ve sent you a Pm Smiffyliz I hope you see it 😊

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Just been reading all this. From what I have seen here on the Forum everyone is so encouraging and helpful and takes time to listen and explain stuff - then one person comes and says there is only one way and it is MINE. Stuff ‘em

Love your attitude Smiffyliz You’re right to say no one way is best. With strength of mind and a positive attitude like that, you are going to weigh less and be healthy.

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