Mental Health Support
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I'm 23, unemployed, still living at home and very, very lonely.

Basically I feel like I have nothing. All I want is employment to move out from my parents so I won't be f-ing burden. I'll shovel s**t for 8 hours a day if that is what it takes. I'm fat and have a very unattractive face and "scare" a lot of potential employers. I understand them though, I wouldn't want someone like me in my company.

When I wake up I feel the day is ruined. I'm not suicidal, I've thought about it many times but I will never do it because my parents would get very sad. And I'm scared. There is nothing in my life that brings me joy, I feel like a empty husk. I've thought about therapy but that is expensive and if I asked for money from my parents I would feel even more worthless and they would blame themselves.

I'm every single. Not a single woman has ever shown interest in me ever which I understand completely. But I still want someone. I don't "deserve" it but I still want it, if that makes sense.

I've never had a girl friend and I'm still a virgin. Big surprise, huh?

I don't think I'll ever get to feel love that isn't family. I want someone that wants me. But that'll never happen.

My penis is very small. I feel that if by some weird chance I would get to have sex with someone she would laugh at me. I got teased for it in school. Bullied by everyone in class.

I don't have any friends. I had a few before but they all moved on and I'm still here. I have no one to talk with. The most social thing I've done this year is commenting on reddit.

I'm not looking for sympathy, I know I'm a lost cause. Worthless piece of garbage.

If anyone read this thanks for taking your time.

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I think the first thing you need to do is ask admin to change your username. You do not deserve to be thought of as 'big fat al' Nobody here cares whether you're ten stone or fifty stone. On this forum we are your friends.

I think you have lots of work to do on the way you perceive yourself. You don't need a pretty face or a large penis to get a job. I agree that the way you present yourself at interview is very important, but that comes from deep within. Employers are looking for personality, and if you feel bad about how you look, that will ooze out.

'I'm not suicidal but I've thought about it many times' is a bit of a contradiction. If you're even thinking about suicide, you need to see your doctor. You don't have to spend your days feeling like this.

Are you not living in the UK, because therapy is free here if you're prepared to wait for it?

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Morning. It sounds like you are very low on yourself indeed and it must have taken a lot of courage and/or desperation to post, but it is my feeling that it is always good to express how you feel as it does seem to release the stress of it a little.

It sounds like you have massive confidence issues. Why do you think you have got so big and "fat" by the way? I'm wondering it you used food as a way of coping with difficult feelings in which case as you start to work on these feelings your weight could come down so it may not always have be a permanent state of affairs for you and it sounds like this would increase your confidence. Regarding your small penis some men do have a small penis of course and there is a lot of teasing and shaming goes on but I think women are less bothered about this than what you would think. Women want to be cared for and communicated with; and a considerate and sensitive lover who knows what to do with what he has got to please someone is more important than the size of it I would have thought!

It sounds like you are frustrated all round. Perhaps try and work slowly on each issue. I wonder why you are not getting the jobs ; if you think you "scare" a lot of employers look at "toning yourself down". The sort of thing that scares me is seeing people walk around with tatoos on their faces; if your own face is "scary" perhaps you could look at ways of "softening it", maybe be clean shaven and have your hair neatly trimmed, wear very conventional clothes. Don't know what sort of employment you are looking for but the sort of thing that could put employers off in certain jobs would be things like people who are "goths" and have a lot of piercings in the face. Maybe if this is you just tone down the clothing and take out the piercings for the interview. Maybe some of it is just how you are feeling about yourself right now and it sounds like you are very anxious about yourself and low too.

I know in my area there are job clubs and stuff like this that can help you both with your presentation at the interview and with CV's and I think maybe you need to look into this.They can also help with confidence issues.

As Lucy says if you're in the UK and consult a doctor often they can put you in touch with some short term counselling therapy to help with this sort of thing.

Gemma X

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Hi

You sound like things are getting on top of you, Ive had depression for twenty years and I have been really low at times and good at others.I have not had suicidal thoughts and I think it may be useful to see your GP and talk about how you are feeling and see if you can get some support, I did and it has proved to be really helpful. Initially I thought I was quite weak and didnt want to admit I might need help, but as I hit difficulty every certain time of year and other times, I know the signs and seek help. Ive had counselling, and been to groups through Health in Mind which is a support group, refered to by my GP.and it was really useful and lots of people from all backgrounds and in different situations use this support service. It is not what you look like or what you dont think you can do that is important, I have been hung up on my physical image and unability to do certain things due to issues with health, but I decided to focus on what I can do and acceptance of who I am and what I can do has been really helpful! I agree with Gemma in that presentation for job interviews are important and also tell them positive things about you, it sounds like you need building up and Im sure there are many postive things about you, you cant see. I know this isnt easy for some and I have struggled but try writing down positive things about yourself and ask others, what you have done at school maybe. Confidence attracts employers and will be a benefit, I have been to places refered by Jobcentre on interview skills and have been given help in that area which has boasted me and given me a lot more motivation.

It can be difficult to socialise for many people, but take small steps to perhaps speak to people even if just in shop to cashier to boast confidence so that if opportunities come up to socialise you will feel better confident and prepared.

I hope you will find the support you need, and best wishes.

Remember dont give up!

:)

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Hi there and welcome to this Forum. You do seem to be very hard on yourself,

But at least you have written this here, which is a freeing and brave thing to do.

You write a good post so when you go for interview you wont have any

Problems with literacy or spelling and so many young people now cannot

Write a paragraph with all this text speak.

Don't worry about being a virgin, it will happen and once you begin to care and

Value yourself .

Take all the advice about going to Jobcentre and get the ball rolling . I think

That the fact that you want to spread your wings and move out is very healthy,

So you know Al you have lots of good qualities.

The NHS site has a great diet site and a big support Forum so maybe joining

That too would be a good thing. There are lots of us here who have different

Issues with stuff , so keep posting and let us know how your getting on.

Yes Lucy is right change that Name as calling yourself that is not good for you

At all.

Big hug

Hannah x

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Hi al SERIOUSLY.

Your beating up on yourself a bit there fella !

Listen I was 24 by the time I lost my virginity and since then ive had a few partners but not many.

I am now 56 and un married .

But I still feel theres someone out there somewhere ,and one day I will find them .

All this im fat and ugly talk will only continue to drag you down, and the peer pressure you had at school etc, etc, .

is the reason you lost confidence ( I know ! ) I was the opposite too thin !.

but I eventually came to terms with it all.

you definitely need to find yourself a job and get socialising !.

why not try some further educational courses ?.

Hey and if anyone says you've got a small penis ! , just tell em you've got 18 stone to push it in with ,and that,ll get a laugh.

seriously though al , if you speak to your doctor ,he can put you in contact with dietitions, therapists , etc ,etc.

I don't know if you are English or American , but if you are American , your mum and dad may have health insurances in your name, so just ask about it .

they will understand and want to help you.

if you are English theres lots of places you can go for some help .

Finally al every one of us in this forum is here to help, we may not be experts, but we are all here for reasons of our own and to be able to let feelings out on a site like this helps us too.

I myself am suffering post traumatic stress , after a head on car crash !

Ihave three broken vertibra and a foot full of titanium, !

But you know what ?, im getting there, and if a guy of 56 can mend and change, then a young guy of 23 can do the same !

Small Steps al Small Steps.

You have started by joining us in the forum !.

So you can now start to move on.

hope to hear from ( slim al ) pretty soon.

regards

pete.

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Well al, we have been there, comfort eating, and eating crap because we feel like crap;.a cake feels nice for a while then makes us feel worse coz we have got fatter. Dont ask me to run and burn it off, because I have eat crap I have no energy. It makes your thoughts different.

Action plan.

Only you can change things!

01865325777 or talkingspaceoxfordshire.org. At least contact them then start the ball rolling. Counselling, CBT ect. It might help, push yourself to go. make a commitment to yourself to change your life.

Then contact your local college looking at something you would like to do, but ask about retraining. National Careers Service adviser 01865551810, tell them what area you are in then, ask for whats in your area.,, the college I was at, had a back to work program. with a Employment Agency attached to the college, then you could have your hair done, (make you feel groomed) nails, pedicure all sorts. Then the training was great, honestly it made you feel you were worth something. Even doing a little job voluntary even just to mix with people who might value you more than you do yourself, right now.

Go see your gp you might well feel a bit depressed because of your situation, or just in general weight gain ect. Might give you those fat busting tablets to help your health. You will have to get extra tiolet paper, if you get my meaning lol.

This is what I did, the first steps are the hardest, but its only you who can make your life worthwhile, so go do somethings you used to enjoy doing as a child, that you no longer do. Find some happiness from within.

Hugs and more hugs. Let us know how you get on!!

kind regards

Linda

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hiya. i have a job, husband and 2 kids and am still depressesd, my heart goes out to you ! you sound like a nice person. if your weight is bothering you why dont you join a weight loss club, this way you might feel better about yorself and you will also meet new people. you shouldnt let yor size overtake yor life though. go and apply for a job you want to do because employers employ people for who they are not for their size. i bet you have alot to offer, this will give you sum self asteem back. what av you got to loose ! bite the bullet and go 4 it GOOD LUK

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Hi Al, I agree with everyone here, you're being way too hard on yourself.

If your weight and size is a problem, see your GP, they have a massive pool of resources to help you, you just need to ask.

I work with colleagues who have "robust" figures, and they are an absolute joy to be with; I'm sure beyond doubt you're one of these types of people. You'll discover this yourself, wait and see!

As for your self-esteem - don't believe the LIE. Thats what depression is. It'll envelope you in a fog and feed you lies.

It'll do everything to suit itself and nothing to help you; it's a bully, but you know this and thats why you're suffering - because deep down you know your brain is telling you rubbish.

You're a young man with much to live for and much to give.

Give yourself a chance.

Contact old friends, I think you'll find they'll be delighted to hear from you.

You have the courage to do it; if you didn't, you wouldn't have posted here.

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Hey everyone. Thanks for the support. I'm neither American or British. I'm Swedish.

EDIT: Also, my name is from South Park where a character is named Big Gay Al but I'm not gay, just fat. Thought it was funny.

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Hi al my question is, how can you be fat in Sweden? It is very expensive for everything in Sweden. I am just trying to cheer you up, but seriously I have been in the same place you are right now and I hope you get the help you need soon and don't let how you are feeling rule your life as it did mine for so many years! Please seek any and all help available to you, and remember it's not all about size there are other ways to give pleasure to a partner!

Rubyx

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Reminds me of Wallander and his dry sense of humour which is often hard to grasp but is there. x

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You had us foxed there then didn't you! Hope you feel a bit better than you did when you posted before. Take good care. X

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Hi,

I haven't read other people's responses to your post as I wanted to respond to having read it myself.

Firstly what a sad name to call yourself! It could be humorous but from the remainder of what you write it doesn't sound like it. Why are you viewing yourself in such a negative way. It is really sad. I wonder who began thinking of you in that way, whether it was just your response to other people's taunts or whether such a negative view of yourself was what led you to become overweight in the first place?

You say you have a very unattractive place and is true that some people are prettier naturally than others but most people can be attractive if they are happy. From what you write it is clear you are not happy so your face may be less attractive for that reason - you may find it hard to ever want to smile. That is sad too.

You say you scare a lot of potential employers but if you are so unhappy perhaps trying to get employment is the wrong first move - it may be better to focus - with help - upon the things that can be changed first then you will be in a better position to perhaps get a job. You might firstly get help with weight loss - your GP can refer you to a dietician who can give you 1:1 individualised help with losing weight. You may also need CBT to help you with that and also help you with your body image - your GP can refer you to the primary care team who should be able to assess you for CBT. When your weight begins to go down a little and you begin to have some control over the way you think about your body then you may be able to be referred for further therapy to look at your feelings about what has happened to you to give you such a negative self-image. Our negative self-concept is not always easy to shift - I know that from personal experience - but you can be helped to move forward in the way you think about yourself so that you are able to form happier relationships with people outside your immediate family.

I presume you still live with your Mum & Dad because there is no option - it sounds as though you are perhaps still quite young. It is good you are not suicidal and are able to feel concern about how your parents would feel it you did harm yourself - that shows you have the capacity to love despite all the hurt you have experienced whilst growing up. Also the way you have written here demonstrates your capacity to begin to trust others despite what has happened.

About the size of your penis and not having ever had a relationship - I think there is no connection between those two things. Having a satisfying relationship necessitates our being able to feel reasonably ok about ourselves so that we can begin to expect others to like us and perhaps even love us if they are a person whose love we would want. You are not ready for that yet as you feel too badly about yourself. When you feel better about yourself and can begin to imagine other people might also feel differently about you then you can begin to think about making FRIENDS with females and then if you still feel concern about the size of your penis you can ask to be referred to a gynaecologist who can examine you and check your functioning - if everything works ok and is within the normal range then you will have to trust enough at that point to talk with a person you feel some love towards about your fears and see how it goes. If there does prove to be a physical problem then you can talk again with the gynae specialist and see how they can help. Do not assume they cannot because often they can.

Suex

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I'm 23 so I'm a grown man. A grown man that can't get a job and still lives with his parents is sad. The only time that I leave the house is to go down to my work counselor to tell her that I still haven't found a job and I'm still worthless basically.

I know I throw around the word worthless about myself but it's true. To be completely honest I don't see any way that I affect peoples life positively. I'm only dragging people down.

I'm not fat because I'm depressed, I'm fat because I have no self control. Eating is the only thing that I'm good at. I have a negative self-image because I've never been told otherwise. I don't see a single positive side of me.

Today I played a computer game online. I was horrible and people in the chat all told me so. I freaking cried because of it. I'm tired of being me.

If I wasn't such a burden for my parents I would be happy. They would never say that I'm a burden but I know it's true.

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Where on earth have you got the idea from that because you are 23 you are meant to be a grown man and because you can't get a job and still live with your parents you are worthless?!!

You say you do not see any way you affect people positively and that may be so or may not be so but even if it is that does not mean you are worthless. It does however mean you have little sense of your own self-worth. It may be that others see you in that way too, I do not know, but I do know that it does not mean that you cannot affect people's lives in a positive way because you are a person who is alive and has the capacity to interact.

You say you are not fat because you are depressed and that may be so, but why do you think you are overweight - or FAT if you prefer it? You say it is because you have no self-control. WHY do you think you have no self-control? I would suggest it may be because you have a negative self-image and do not value yourself enough to take care of yourself end ensure you do not get fat.

I think you are absolutely right in saying you have a negative self-image because you have never been told otherwise. That is sad because it suggests your parents have been unable to enable you to feel loved - for if you felt loved you would feel loveable. I wonder what has happened during your life between you and your parents that has made you grow up feeling so badly about yourself. You may be a burden to them now, or may not be, I do not know, but if you have always felt you were a burden to them then that is very sad - but is not your fault, it is due to their inability to love.

You say your parents would never say you are a burden but you know it is true, and it may be that you accurately pick up how difficult they find it to give love, or it may be that it is your perception that is wrong. What do they do or say that makes you think you are a burden to them?

I hear you say you were horrible in the online game and given how badly you feel about yourself I can imagine you are right and that you were horrible - that does not make you a horrible person but it does mean that you have a need to be horrible because of how badly you feel about yourself.

When all the other kids teased you and called you names how did you feel? Did you feel angry and if so then were you able to express your anger towards them? I imagine you were not, or that if you did get angry you were then treated even worse. I think that either way you were bullied and kids that are bullied grow up feeling badly about themselves - I know I did.

You have told me all the reasons that you are no good but have not said anything about the things I and perhaps other people have suggested you do about your problems. Perhaps you want to remain stuck for the moment so that we know how bad you are feeling, for if you got help to lose weight, alter your self-image, make friends and get a job then you would have to let go of the anger you must surely feel about having not been enabled to feel loved - by your parents, friends, teachers, and everyone else you have come across in your life.

Sue

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They don't make me feel like a burden. They love me very much. But I'm just a parasite living of them.

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So - it isn't them who are putting you down, you are doing it to yourself.

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23 and living with your parents is not sad at all. I remember a news article a while ago where they were saying that children were staying with their parents well into their 30's for various reasons.

I have been really bad with the negative self-talk in the past few years and I've used various techniques to change that.

The more I read of your responses the more I see you want to get help but don't know where to start. Start thinking about what you can do to change you.

Talk to your work counsellor and see what programs, course are in your area to help you get work.

Rather than sitting around the house, see what you can do to help out with the housework, you'll need to learn for when you have your own place anyway. :-D

Get out when you can, even if it is just for a 10 - 20 minute walk. There is exercise programs that you can do in the house with no equipment to help you get fit.

Look for programs on the internet with regards to self-confidence and goal setting. There are various free course out there which are good. I like future learn.com which I found recently as I can't get a job at the moment since cause I gave up work when I was really bad with depression, so I now finding it tough to get back into work.

Take care and remember small steps. :-D

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You seem really stuck and yes no doubt you are being horrible but at least you realise you are doing it and because you hate yourself and because you feel frustrated. You are beating yourself up because you feel you can't cope but that is not going to make you cope any better; try to be a bit kinder to yourself; there will be reasons why you are eating; compensation for not getting other emotions and so on. I have been there, hating myself yes believe me but you have to understand you are hurting and that is why you are doing this to yourself. Have a look at some of the suggestions on here. Believe me thinking that people would be better off without you or that you are a burden is the depression speaking. Yes maybe you are a miserable and irritable pain at the moment and they would rather you were happier and maybe even easier to be with, but you are suffering and this is your way of showing it

Try and climb out of that chasm and make a step towards solving some of these things one by one.

Gemmalouise X

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I agree absolutely with you Gemma. x

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What Iam about to say might seem harsh I'm 30, unemployed, still living at home but i wount let it defeat me iam sarting my own business and soon you understand like me the ounly people who think having a girlfriend or kids is the best thing ever are the miss able people who all ready have them.

I give you the best addvice i ever had, "Give up F**k off and be like the rest of the world or get up and do something and stop feeling sorry for your self and put all the energy your wasteing in to some thing uesfull."

If Iam still single by the time iam 40 i get a mail order bride simple.

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It sounds as though you have more self confidence than Al...

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Yes but i got it from having a swift kick in the arse a sink or swim type thing, You can ounly ever count on your self unless you have a major psychological problem then medication probaly your best bet.

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We disagree then, on both those points. I think we CAN count on other people - for adult needs but not leftover child needs - and if we have a major psychological problem meds are not generally effective in the long term because the dose usually has to be increased whereas therapy can enable healthier and happier relationships. Less severe psychological problems (anxiety, grief - and the surface symptoms of depression - can be helped by meds as can psychosis but that deeper symptoms often remain without talking therapies. Seems we have learned different things from life! Suex

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Hi Al, I do not know what you are going through no one does. Each of us have our own unique individual journeys and stories. That said I can tell you that I am in my 40's and have been overweight all my life and have had many issues resulting from this. Additionally I believe weight issues effect each gender differently particularly the way society reflects acceptable weight 'norms' back to those same genders. I will not presume to tell you what is good for you or what you need to do because I do not know. Throughout my life I have tried talking therapies and have found these have helped I have also come to understand that weight problems for me is self esteem linked. If you would like to know more about the importance of self esteem concerning weight problems(if you don't already) and the implications you may or may not think has relevance to your life then I can recommend a good book which is called Overcoming Low Self Esteem by Melanie Fennell . Don't worry It isn't a gooey self help hug myself love myself type of read. Good luck.

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I wish I was 23 and still living at home ... I wish I could say something to make you feel better life is hard and depression is a stealer of happiness and confidence ... I wish you well x

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Ok, straight away I feel I need to tell you this.

I am 23, still living at home, I lost my life-long dream of becoming a teacher just recently when I realised I was no good at it and my ex boyfriend was stealing from me. I fell for him completely, I loved him and gave him everything I had to offer (by this I mean trust and faith). And when I think about him I feel like I just wasn't enough for him. I am starting a job in retail tomorrow, FAR CRY from being a teacher of course!

But you know what? It's not the end of the world!

Let me tell you - I am pretty, attractive, have a nice figure and have a good head on my shoulders. I am not confident around men but they do find me attractive. And guess what? I lost my virginity at 22. To the guy who just broke my heart. It's rubbish, it really is. Although I don't regret losing my virginity to him because I did the right thing by waiting until I fell in love, I still wish it hadn't happened the way it did. He didn't care about me in the end and I feel like an idiot for not seeing it. Love makes you BLIND and that is not a good thing, it is if you can trust the person but it turns out I couldn't...

I have a friend who is 23 and still a virgin by choice. She was asked out by someone recently and she turned him down because he wasn't a nice guy and she knows she deserves more.

Al, meeting someone isn't everything. I met someone and fell in love and sometimes I wish I hadn't, because technically you can't miss what you never had. They say better to have loved and lost but I think that's a load of s***. I've had my heart broken by two guys now and I'd be stupid to let it happen a third time so now I am quite guarded with the new man in my life. I feel I can't trust him.

As far as small "things" go, as an attractive woman I wouldn't care. I don't care. I am sleeping with someone now who is quite big and it really isn't any better than the guy I fell in love with who was average sized.

I dated someone who was in the army and although I didn't sleep with him I have never been more attracted to a guy in my life. He was small. I'd prefer to sleep with him now than the man I'm currently dating which I know sounds terrible but I'm a flight risk with this guy and he knows it. I have emotional problems after getting my heart broken.

It takes a lot to have sex, Al. It's a really hard thing to do when you have low self-esteem and if you tried having sex now you may only feel worse about yourself after because you will be worrying about how well you performed etc. I know men get performance anxiety and I really don't understand it. My ex couldn't get an erection one time in the beginning because he was worried about something and he got incredibly embarrassed and asked me not to leave him. I couldn't believe my ears! I said of course I wouldn't and held him close to reassure him.

Only a cruel woman would ever make fun of that, Al. Men have all sorts of issues and self-esteem problems so trust me, you're not the only one! Even my ex had issues and I did nothing but tell him he was sexy, he just didn't believe it himself.

Chin up, okay? You will meet someone. Don't be in a rush to sleep with someone. Being a virgin makes you special to the person you fall in love with and the good people in life will respect it. Trust me on that one, that's my own experience right there and I don't mind sharing that with you!

Be good to yourself and keep looking forward. You are still young and have the future to live for :) xx

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Hi that's a great post. You sound happy and doing well. I think

Your very strong. Your ex hurt you I know, but I'm sure you will

Meet someone who appreciates you and is great to you.

Hugs

Hannah x

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Hi WantToChange, great post and good advise for Al. I understand your trust and faith issues. I am getting divorced after 9 years of marriage and 16 years of being together with my soon to be ex-husband because when I became ill I lost faith and trust in him. He was my soulmate the only person I wanted to spend the rest of my life with. We've done some really great and awesome things together, but he started keeping secrets and refusing to have general conversations about his day was when he was at work or on his days off.

When I needed him the most he wasn't there for me. So in the end the lack of trust got too much, so I told him to go. I miss him, but know it was the right thing to do you have to trust the person you are with.

You say you have lack of confidence, but your post shows me that it is there as you sound really confident in your response. I know it's easier on a computer to be confident, but when you are with people remind yourself that you are confident and that you trust your instincts about people and you'll do great. :-D

Great post. :-D

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Hi Al,

I suspected that you choose this particular name to be funny. (It reminds me of one of the characters in a film called Pitch Perfect). I understand the reason why people were bringing up your username though - because they're concerned and thought you were serious. Only keep your name for the RIGHT reasons, otherwise don't. The wrong reason to keep it: if you don't like it but don't want to change because you don't believe you deserve any other name. I haven't had a chance to read all the comments so I may be a bit behind, if so I apologise.

So you have a good sense of humour - and from what I've read, you sound like an intelligent guy too. :) That's 2 things you can start on with thinking about the positives. You also have a good work ethic and desire to better yourself. So we have a great base to work from. What do you want to life, Al? What's your long term goal, dream, if you could not fail? Just have a think about it. My advice is then try and follow that path, even if you never reach the very top you'll be happier following your dream than not following it. You can still make a better life for yourself. But you have to believe you are worth if you want to make the first step. Your parents care for you and love you, that must count for something - and I've detected a bit of self love too, so it's definitely there. Some would argue you have already taken the first step by writing on here which further suggests the desire to better yourself.

You sound like a great guy who's just never had a chance to show it. It sounds like to me like a mixture of knock backs and bad luck that have caused you to lose your confidence. And perhaps you've - and understand I'm not saying this as a criticism - got yourself into a spiral of unhelpful habits or behavioural patterns. It's ok to acknowledge that, but don't be hard on yourself either, humans are not perfect. The combination has resulted in the place you are currently, not where you want to be.

I think one of the things we need to think about is understanding yourself better , how you got into the situation you are now - and you can do that by talking therapy. I don't know how the health services work in Sweden but I think if you can have access counselling this will help.

Secondly, I agree with the others, you've got to stop being so hard on yourself. We all have things we don't like about ourselves, whether we admit it or not. So even, if you think these things about yourself, stop saying them out loud. Think about it, by saying them aloud, not only are you reinforcing your negative views about yourself via sharing them, but you're publicly drawing attention to your weaknesses, making yourself vulnerable, and giving less kind individuals a reason to attack you - which if you they do (and it will be because of their own self esteem issues) this will further reinforce your low sense of self worth. So it becomes a spiral. So even if you still believe all of these things, keep them to yourself in from now on - I know we all do it occasionally, but just adopt what I'm saying as a principle - and this will begin to break the pattern. And focus on the good things we've come across instead, drawing attention to them (both your own attention, and that of others). And this will get a more positive ball rolling. I understand we do need to talk through our insecurities and doubts sometimes, but make sure it's with someone you trust.

I would also advise getting back in touch with 1 or 2 of your old friends, no harm can be done just from dropping an email or a text asking how they are.

Last of all, I've attached the link to a community which you may find helpful regarding your insecurities around body image:

healthunlocked.com/nhsweigh...

It's up to whether you join (if you do, just click the yellow button that says 'join' when you reach the webpage, you don't need to do anything else as you're already a HU member), but at the very least you may find people who you can relate to for support and understanding. No one is there to judge you, as no one is here.

Hope this helps and makes sense. Had to edit a few times as half asleep!

Kind regards

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I think this is a really helpful response. x

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Hello, dear boy (I won't call you the name you give yourself)

I have been very moved by your post, perhaps because I have got a son who is your age and unemployed too. What you say about yourself makes me sad (ecuse my English is not perfect, I am French).

One thing I want to say : you should get some help.

Your says you don't want to burden your parents with the price of a therapy, but there is love between you and them. I am sure they are very sad to see you like this.

So, if I were your parents, I would gladly do anything to see you get better. So go ahead, find a therapist who will listen to you.

Friendily,

Françoise

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Do you know what I see in your post Al?

I see a loving, caring son;

someone with a great work ethic;

a good linguist;

intelligent, thoughtful, with a fun sense of humour.

I also see someone who has been hurt by past events which, naturally, have still had repercussions on you now.

BUT, you have stepped away from the person you were - How?

by joining this wonderful group and sharing.

You have reached out and, no matter how you feel today, or how long it may take; you have created a different path than you were on before.

the replies you have are there for you to consider, not hard written laws or rules.

Everyone writes from their own personal experiences. sometimes we cannot act on these things, or take it all in, or they might not be what we are looking for, but we do seem to absorb a lot of it and it can help in the future.

When we lack confidence in our looks and personality, we can almost put up a wall between us and others - employers or potential partners. this wall also stops us seeing, or looking, for interested looks from others. We don't want to hope and be disappointed, so don't look for, or expect any.

You would be amazed at how many people put on a front, who bluff being confident - I have a friend who is naturally film-star gorgeous who has to "psyche herself up" to enter a room or meet new people.

As to relationships, 23 is ok, when you find the right person and you are ready, you will know, don't feel rushed or pressured - and "size" is a myth, as you will find out.

Many people are still at home in their twenties, and as to "grown men" you can have a more mature attitude at 23 than many men twice your age.

I want to thank you for writing this post. You have written a post that many could not, or don't feel they can.

There will be people who use this site who share many of your concerns and will benefit from the replies you have received - or unsure about posting something else, but may now take the chance to write.

I think you can always have your own unique name Big Friendly Al! :)

regards,

hamble :)

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Hey Al. I think many people here have given you great advice already, but I just want to add one thing. It's about your worries concerning your penis. My current boyfriend has a small penis (even when he has an erection it's not big), and he is also very insecure about it. Now, you should know, with him I now have the best sex I have ever had in my LIFE. Even though my ex-boyfriends' penises were bigger than his. He knows where to touch me exactly (because he asks me and I tell him where it feels good), and he has much more patience than my exes used to have. He isn't only interested in having an orgasm himself, he also wants ME to feel good, and as a result I do. Maybe you know, or maybe you don't, but most women only come when the clitoris is stimulated, not through penetration. So keep in mind what fingers can be used for ;) I just want you to know that pleasing a woman is an acquired skill - and the one way to learn how to please her is to ask her what feels good, and to try out together what makes both of you feel good. Good sex is not about having 'a big one': it's about sharing the pleasure. Take it from me ;)

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One thing that may help is to do some volunteering. My son couldn't get a job for a long time and spent days at home with no social life. He volunteered for a local charity shop and now is working. We love him and I am sure your parents love you and don't find you a burden. Small steps. X

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Hello Al...you've had some great advice from some truly lovely caring people. This site is amazing and has helped me with my thyroid problems, thankfully I've never suffered with depression.

You have some very lovely qualities, it shines through in your posts and as someone else said...just one small step at a time, just get out there and make some changes. Nice your parents are there for you. When you wake up each morning, do just one thing outside of your comfort zone.

Wish you all the best Al...you can do it. Xx

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I don't even know you but was quite upset to read what you're saying about yourself. I've never seen a face that has scared me ... most people/employers you will find do not employ people on how they look! It's what an employee can do, what they're willing to do and if they are trustworthy.

Don't know what led you to this stage but you sound like you're in a dire situation. I don't want to be nosey but wonder where you are? I think you need to take steps to help this situation because it's sounding unbearable. It's a shame if you have to pay for counselling, as I saw others point out in the UK it's free although a long wait.

You are not a lost cause. Look there really is nobody on this planet who is worthless. We are all loveable, not because it's something that is earned but because we exist.

EDIT: Sorry Sweden. Great country! Nice people - well liked in this part of the world! Also I want to say that the whole penis thing, this probably won't help, but the truth is that you are what you are and a penis is a penis, they come in all different types and really if anyone would reject you based on one single part of your anatomy, then she wasn't worth knowing in the first place. I've heard it said that men are more concerned about penis than women. And people have different tastes. It is what you have, therefore worrying about it will keep bringing you down. Any woman who likes you will not care about your penis size. As said, it's only one part of you. She will be dealing with you the whole package 99% of the time not even notice your penis. Relationships are about more than sex. It's the male version of breast size really is damaging how the media and guys in general go on about cock size - many prefer smaller. You are as worthy as any man.

Can I also mention I am 26 and also living at home and it is hard especially comparing yourself to others of your age - what they've achieved and what you've not yet achieved. But comparing ourselves is poison ... we are all plodding away on our own paths - there can be no comparison because each person's experience is so different from the next. And I'm sure your parents would like to see you happy. At any cost. That is what parents do, it's what parental love is.

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Hi Al,

Let me first start off, with a skinny body and large genitalia do not a relationship make! My boyfriend is overweight, and has what the general public would call a small penis, but I love him, he's my best friend. Our relationship is not without flaws, and having him hasn't fixed my issues, but I couldn't imagine life without him. Whether he balloons up to 70+stone, or shrinks down to below 10 stone, he's still the same person inside. You need to hold out for that special someone who doesn't rely on appearances to choose a partner, who will get to know you, and see your wonderful personality instead of what you perceive to be physical flaws. It can be a long and lonely wait, but when they arrive, it will be worth it.

Before you can find that person - you need to learn what's positive about yourself, and remember it. I have a very negative self image too, but I know that I'm a good cook, I'm very diplomatic, I'm sensitive, and I'm intelligent. Now, make a list of your own, and remember them. Maybe you're good with technology? Maybe you're very funny? Maybe you're a great listener? Whatever it is, remember it, and treasure it, so as you can give it all to the right person when they arrive.

As for your weight - this is a sensitive issue. If you loose weight - do it for yourself, because that's the best motivation. Start slow, walk around the block at your own pace until it doesn't feel strenuous. Then upgrade to a power walk, then a jog, then maybe even a run if you can handle it. But, don't do it because you hate the way you look now. You have to do it because you love yourself enough to take care of yourself. You deserve to feel good in your own skin, everyone does.

I agree with whichever user recommended that you do volunteer work to get your CV built up and looking better for interviews. I was unemployed for a while, and currently am now, due to health issues, but before this, having volunteer work on my CV got me a great job.

Hoping you're feeling much better,

Sarah x

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Dear Al, How are you today? I hope that you have had a good sleep and feel refreshed. It's a new day and it holds all kinds of possibilities! Sounds like you have gotten yourself in a rut- get up! Get up now. Say that to yourself if you have to as many times as it takes. When I feel dissatisfied with things I change them. I find that even just taking the direction of changing things and working on making them better for myself gives me a boost. I have some suggestions that will help you change things and you will enjoy it! And people will see that smile on your face and want to talk to you and be your friend :)

First There is something that you can do about your low self esteem and appearances. Stop thinking yourself as a loser. There are a lot of people struggling in this day to find employment. Whilst pursuing employment take up a hobby, a sport or walking will help you tremendously to get out of your rut. Not only will you gain confidence with losing weight (not that this is necessary for confidence but I think it might help you) you will also release feel good endorphins and you will most likely meet other people while at it and feel less lonely. This can get you on a good 'spiral'. I recommend getting yourself signed up on myfittnesspall on line which is free, where you can track your activity and calorie intake and network with others for a boost.

I have learned that the world tends to reflect back to people what is on their face, if you are angry, sad, worried or grimaced people reflect what they see back at you. If you smile it will also be returned unless you live in the places where they will think you are out of your mind if you are smiling.. lol.

On the male anatomy.. Not all women are so fussed with size.. a large penis can be pretty scary. And women are not all so shallow when it comes to physical appearances/size etc. A man with good humour, self respect, who isn't completely full of himself and who can make us feel good about ourselves and treats us right are our main criteria! Work on loving yourself more, be kind to yourself as then others will feel they too have permission around you to be happy as they are too- and then they will enjoy more being around you. It's fine to be tall or short, thin or heavy built. EVERYONE is different! Most of us have something about ourselves we'd change, but we are ourselves and there's only one of us so we should be it well! Enjoy life and be open to what it is bringing to you and not what is slipping away, you can reverse that flow starting with loving yourself more. Never give up, always have hope and with some work you will see things happen in your life. Have fun! love

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If you carry on putting yourself down you will always feel useless,Everyone has some purpose in life ,you are here for a reason and only you can fill that space.you are very young yet,if you manage to get through this stage it gets better as you age,there is not a lot in life for young people,hope you get on with your mum as she needs your help as much as you need her,lucky to have a home.cheer up it gets better.

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I'm so sorry you had to go through this.

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Hi Al,

I think you have depression which is making you feel like this. Please see a doctor and get anti depressants and counselling - they can really helps. It also helps depression to take a good multi vitamin and EPA Fish Oils and regular exercise.

I am sure you are not ugly. Try a good hair cut, tanning and going to the gym - it has made me feel better.

Try internet dating and Meetup.com and evening classes to make new friends, and go to see your old friends. Remember that relationships are overrated and a lot of people aren't happy in them !

Also, try looking on the internet for jobs or try new course, volunteer work or training in something you are interested in.

Try asking your parents for money for therapy but don't worry if they say no - they obviously love you because you are living with them ! Also, try buying some self help books on depression, motivation and happiness. They have really helped me.

It will be ok. I would love to hear from you on how you are doing x

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As for the small penis, if you do have one so do plenty of men ! Also, the new weight loss tablets Orlistat / Xenical are great. You can get them from a doctor or online x

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Hello Al

I wonder could we dispense with the 'big fat' Al, I don't think Superman or better still Batman started out with names that did them no favours.

So your over weight, it's not perfect, but weight can be lost may not be easy but really would you really rather be thin and stupid? You are blatantly a smart person.

Your 23 that means you are officially young, if you believe that you are going to spend the next 60 years unemployed, good luck with that, its not going to happen. So can we agree logic dictates at some point you will get a job because sods law, want it or not its going to come your way.

So yes you can be a grave digger, wasn't Rod Stewart a grave digger?! Can't stand Rod Stewart, sorry...lol.

Okay to my mind two things need to happen you need to see things as they really are in this world, would you call a millionaire like Johnny Vegas beautiful? one of the richest men in the world wears a wig for heavens sake. Come on only in the media and men's magazines are fat ugly men unsuccessful. I don't believe you are ugly but it doesn't matter what I think, it matters what you think.

Look up ugly fat men, look up men with small cocks, you will find lots and lots of rich successful men with model girlfriends and wives, if you dont believe me, check the internet....all well documented.

Okay now that's out of the way, this is about finding your place in life, your play ground, room for you to explore and have fun. When the fun comes the weight may well drop off. So can we forget weight for now. You need to find what inspires you.

Now be honest if not with me with yourself, what do you love what could you do 24/7 and lose yourself in for hours, gaming, fishing, reading books, driving. What are you truly interested in and then go to college, go back find a way and learn, educate yourself and keep moving, don't let ANYONE stop you and watch the luck and confidence and friends come to you.

Men are good at one invaluable thing, they can focus, they can think about one thing and one thing only!

You have so much talent and you aren't using any of it and you have the one thing money cannot buy, you have time.

Al you are believe it or not you are a very lucky man you can shape your life, baby steps, but move towards what you want.

If you are not earning what do you have to lose, find a way into what you love you have NOTHING to lose, working with animals, working with children, writing books, becoming and entertainer....Nothing is sexier to a woman than a man with passion.

You don't see Johnny Vegas married to an ugly bird (not that believe they exist but you get my point). Do just one thing a day towards your goal. And don't try and get a job, don't try and lose weight, don't try and please anyone, please yourself. Invest in you and all the other stuff will come towards you...You don't believe me, prove me wrong :-)

This is your life for you, your being alive is a carrot gold miracle, dont believe me look at the mathematics. You have a right to life , love and happiness, you are smart and resourceful enough to swing it.

All you have to do it decide deep down what is your passion and follow that, you wont fail, by your account your at rock bottom now, only way is up!

Go on show me and everyone, be selfish and then when you are a huge success, I can say I told you so....LOVE THAT...TOLD YOU...lol. No do it because it is your right, because you can and not cos Simon (or Velma from Scooby Doo in this case said so).

Exciting times my friend exciting times, you have greatness inside you, just got to fish out, find the right inspiration, a little support, some learning and BINGO watch out world cos here you come :-)

I have complete faith!

XX

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Hello there pal. I totally understand your problem, I am in the same scenario as you..I'm tall and overweight and a bit podgy. Im 23 and a virgin and never had a girlfriend. I have kissed a couple though. Employers should not discriminate you because you are fat, they would be breaking some kind of law. My penis isn't very big but believe it or not, I have had one blowjob. There are girls out there who are angels and will care for you. Don't give up pal, keep your chin up. If you are really concerned about your weight, try your best to lose it maybe join a club the lose weight and maybe there might some ladies there with the same problem.....

I believe in you pal....Try your best that is what anyone can ask of you...

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Hi!

I have a friend who was in your position, funnily enough from Sweden. She is overweight, but it just seems to be part of who she is. She has left her mothers flat in Gothenburg and is now working in Stockholm and living with a boyfriend. I'm 23, slim-ish, studying instead of working, and have not had a boyfriend for 2 and a half years, still very much doubt my abilities in that department and my attractiveness for that matter. All of us wants someone, and you've still got time to do something about it.

Everyone is different and has issues, and I'm told in Sweden it's common to pretend you and everything around you is perfect when it's not. I'm sure that's not true for everyone though.

How you perceive yourself is very negative, and sounds like you're digging your heels in about it. But writing on here signals you want something to change.

When I was overweight exercise really did help. Zumba specifically. I punished myself for laziness but also pretended I was a fabulous dancer ( was not).

Looking for a job is never easy, think everyone understands that. Relating what you do, or what you have done to some career skill, like time management, work-life balance, team work etc seems to be what employers want these days. But also what you'd actually like to do, is most important.

I don't know what mental healthcare is like in Sweden, but maybe you can look into local support groups, weight loss classes etc. I'm sure your parents would support you financially if you explain what it's for and you can owe them at a later date.

No idea if the above is useful, hope it is, unless you've made progress already

You're going to be alright :)

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Hello. I don't normally go on sites like these but I myself am going through a particularly rough time at the moment and thought it would help to focus on problems that are not my own.

In many ways I have lived what some would call a "charmed" life. I have always had a good metabolism and my parents drilled a fitness routine into my head since I was 7. I have had plenty of girl friends, one night stands , friends always around and a great support network.

A part of me feels bad for stating all of his when I know you are probably reading this now and thinking " what the hell has this guy got to complain about!?" Well let me tell you now, it ain't all as good as it seems and that thing about the grass being greener really does apply here. The relationships I have had have left big holes in my life ( when they have ended) , the one night stands I have had are empty ( and alot of the time very awkward) , I'm obsessed with fitness to the point where I end up over doing it, and the friends I do have around me all the time are so different to me and really have no clue of who I really am.

Trust me Im not trying to make light of your particular set of problems but I feel you may benefit from hearing from someone ( who is very different from yourself) who has pretty much the exact feelings you have, just for different reasons.

Unfortunately I can't give you an amazing piece of advise that will make you feel better, but I can give you advise which might really helped take the edge off these feelings you are dealing with.

Try this, it's not for everyone but it may have just saved my life at one or two points.

Get up out of your bed at the time you set your alarm, I recommend as early as you feel comfortable with. ( this can be the most difficult stage when suffering from feelings of depression ) do it like ripping off a plaster. Don't think, you hear your alarm, and just stand up away from your bed.

The next step ( although you may want to do this the evening before ) get a beast of a music play list on your ipod, portable cd player or whatever you have ( if you don't have one invest asap). Blast that music into your ears until you think you are at the front row of a Metallica concert. Obviously don't damage your hearing, but tun it up just enough so that you cannot hear your own thought.

Next, open your front door ( wind or rain) and walk. It sounds stupid, but I can guarantee that 95 percent of the time, after your music sesh and walk, you will get back to your house and feel a very strange sense of accomplishment. This feeling is he one you need to crave. As humans are nature is to enjoy and move on, like parasites. Nothing is every good enough and you will always want more. This doesn't have to be a bad thing though, you just need to train your mind to crave that "feel good" feeling.

As I said I don't have much advise, but that one I really think will make a difference to your life. I get up and do this every morning and it helps so much.

As for your parents, bro , it doesn't sound like you are living much at the moment anyway. Your parents would be 100 times more upset that you didn't feel you could talk to them about this stuff, rather than you dying. Obviously they would be mortified if anything happened to you, but just because death is physical doesn't mean that your emotional problems ( while you are alive) is any less important. Talk to them dude, once yoy have your family backing you, and you are completely honest about everything you are feeling , there is very litte you won't be able to accomplish.

All the best my friend, and remember no matter how bad things seem, it really could be alot worse, and it really WILL be alot better.

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BigFatAl, the practice of forming and pursuing ideals in our so-called "advanced" society, especially unrealistically, destroys a lot of us.

Be married

Have children

Have an important job

Make lots of money

Look like a model

Own status symbols (BMW's, a gorgeous home, Calvin Klein clothes, etc.)

Have a big d*ck (I'm being facetious!)

And so the self-hate and "clinical" depression kicks in. You have to make the best with what you've got—and support laws that make life easier for all of us. We all do. For added value, try and develop your knowledge, skills and abilities (for example, I do Lynda.com classes on my computer at home). Accept that there are opportunities out there... You're obviously a good writer, you've expressed yourself very candidly in this post. View the world as supportive and resourceful. Make sure you have your basic human needs met: Food, shelter, warmth, security, a sense of belonging. Most people hate applying for jobs—so if you make a below-average to average effort—it should give you some leads... I hope this helps. :)

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Why don't you do some volunteering? Say- a charity shop? Dial-a-ride? Hospital shop/help, etc. That would help you meet new people / and potential employers.

Penis size is of no consequence so don't fret over it. perhaps it seems smaller because you're a big lad.

Stop putting yourself down - you're no lost cause or worthless. You are a vital and vibrant lad and you just need to find your niche to fulfil all that potential.

Sue

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Hi Al, You can see by the number of responses that people on this forum care.

You are 23 and have your whole life a head of you, there are things that you can do to help yourself. Find your local help group and go talk to them. It may be scary at first , but well worth doing. Also go talk to your GP if your GP is as helpful as mine they will be able to suggest and sign you up for various programs and not just give you pills. Through my GP I got signed up to a CBT program that helped with stress and anxiety. This program also covered various topics including goal setting and how to get out and about more. Look in at your library and health centre they usually have leaflets for various groups or numbers that you can contact.

Not sure why you think employers are scared of you, but if you go into an interview acting nervous and afraid it will have an affect on the employer. Speak to your local job centre and see if this can provide you with any details of programs to help with interviewing skills.

If you feel you are over weight there is a lot you can do about it, but it would be good for you to know why you are over weight. Is it lack of exercise, comfort eating or a health issue. Your GP may be able to suggest local groups to help. You don't need money or a gym membership to help you get fit. There are a lot of exercise you can do at home on your own, but if you are up for it I would suggest getting out and meeting new people would be good for you. You could start off by walking and going to a local park or walking route.

You can help with the feeling of being a burden to your parents by doing odd jobs around the house and helping your parents with the housework and gardening if you have a garden. If you don't know how to already you could even start learning to cook and ensure meals are ready for your parents when they come home from work. This way you can learn about healthy meals. You don't have to take pills to loose weight.

I'd also suggest looking at futurelearn.com and see if there is any free courses that take your interest. This way you can put them on your CV and this will show future employers that you are still learning and taking an interest in keeping your skills up to date. Check and see if there are any course you can do at your local college, school, uni that will help you gain employment.

I know you've had a lot of information from everyone and it may be mind blowing all the options.

I'd suggest making a list of everything, rate each on as to what you could do now, what you'd like to do in the future and score out the ones that are not for you. Then you should learn about goal setting and use that to set up plans and goals for the next 5 years. (I'm an archery coach and good at helping archers through goal setting for both their sport and no archery related problems, but when I got depression I couldn't seemed to do this for myself. It took getting help and guidance for me to use what I already know. I know goal setting and stress control works and as a shy person I know that you can be confident with time and practise and pushing your comfort zone and limits. :-) )

As for getting a girlfriend it will happen, but first you need to take care of you and I know it may be hard to hear, but looks are only skin deep it is the inner you that matters. How you see the world and treat people is more important at the end of the day.

Look after you first, get out and join social or sports clubs and enjoy making new friends. Think about making friends firsts and I am sure you will soon have a girlfriend.

There is a lot of help out there.

Good luck and if you want to talk you can pm me any time. Or post your questions on this forum, you will get varied answers as everyone has different experiences and that is good as it lets you see all the possibilities and ways to resolve problems.

Take care and don't give up. Small steps and have a plan. :-D

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How about getting an allotment. That way you can dig all day which is great exercise and gets you out of the house, and help provide for the family as you say you would like to. If you have a plot even 3 foot square you can grow a fair bit, but for a decent crop you might want something more like 20 by 20 foot. An allotment might also be more fun than using your parents garden as it would be your own space. You can talk to the other gardeners, but if you do not feel up to talking you can always just do your own thing.

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You have to love yourself, know who you are and not worry what people say about it. If you love yourself you will feel better and other people will see it. Look at yourself in the mirror morning and say i am wonderful, i am Beautifull, i love myself, i am serious what do you have to lose. We only live once and we have to live our life to the fullest.

Please try it, and feel good about yourself and others will see you as such.

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I am going through this right now. Well except the penis thing, because I don't have one. Al, have you overcome these feelings? Right now I feel like I'm a walking shadow. I just want to know if there is any chance of a happy ending.

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Same! I am going through the same thing as a girl though. But I'm more of lost in life as to what I am passionate about. Like Al, I don't want to be a burden to my parents. They've worked so hard to provide for me and my siblings but I still haven't given back much to them. I feel even worse when I compare myself to my colleagues and see them succeeding in life. I feel like I'm stupid and just wasting my parents resources. I'm not suicidal though, I would never think of doing such but I do get anxiety attacks and sleepless nights thinking about how I feel worthless and stupid.

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I am going through the same thing as you. I am a 24 year old without a job; all I have is a dream of becoming a designer. The only difference is that I live with unsupportive adopted parents as it relates to my dreams for my life. I spend my whole life pleasing them to win their love and affection but all I got was the opposite. I think about suicide all the time. I feel so unaccomplished and a black sheep in the family.

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I know it's been a few years but you're not alone. If you need someone totalk to I'm here for you, always. No matter the time or day, we all need someone we can talk to

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If you have health insurance, use it and find doctors to help you physically and mentally. A job at a call center may interest you

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Al, I just read this post. It seems you wrote this 4 years ago. If you're out there, I hope things have changed for you. I almost need them to have changed for you.This is selfish I know. Some part of me wants to believe there is hope.

I am 20 years old and I live with my mother. I've been unemployed for 5 months now and I dropped out of college. I have never really had any long lasting friendships. My brother and sister excel in almost everything and work hard for everything they have.

My social anxiety and lack of confidence makes it feel like its impossible to do anything. Its a vicious cycle of do nothing - be nothing. But honestly I know its just me because I haven't made a strong continuous effort to change. Its sad and I'm burden to my family.

I know how you feel about being ugly. I'm ugly too.

on the inside and the outside. It makes it hard to try to do things when you are constantly aware of how ugly you are.

Anyway I hope life is treating you better now Al.

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Hey Al, How you doing nowadays buddy?

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